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Bristol R*vers dustbin thread


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46 minutes ago, wendyredredrobin said:

Have they really gone a full day without doing something stupid?

Surely there must be some pictures of hordes of blue and white quartered idiots roaming the streets of Whorefield ignoring the lockdown or something.

If they didn't turn up for their open topped bus parade, they sure as hell won't be going out now!

Mystery still surrounds the departure of their fans director from the board however. Over on Gaschat they are speculating that they all know why he has gone, but none of them are saying, as it's quite clear they know nothing as Wally builds his little dictatorship.

Democracy is action over there, one president and one yes man.

Next step, will be sacking Mr Can't-buy-a-win from the first team manager role and Wally deciding he'll have a crack at managing the side himself. After all, he does have a Chelsea air freshener in his car, so he is sort of qualified by proxy.

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On 05/04/2020 at 21:01, Seneca the Younger said:

So Wael & co have increased debts at the Gas from 4m to 24m in the past 4 years, with nothing to show for it. I don't understand why. Could it be that they're making a profit in interest being paid to their other company, and will claim bankruptcy at the Gas, cutting all ties and legging it with a few million in interest? 

It's painful to see how they're throwing random figures around without bothering to look at the accounts.

As I'm waiting for it to warm up enough that I can sit out in my back garden I thought I'd take their accounts apart.  As it were.

Comparing position at 30 June 2015 (Higgs / Wonga Loans) and 30 June 2019 (last set of accounts):

 

Share Capital has barely moved, net other assets have barely moved.

Accumulated loss 2015:    £10.7m

Accumulated loss 2019:    £24.1m

Loss in the four years:        £13.4m

I'm assuming that this £24.1m (accumulated loss for the year dot) is what they're throwing around as debt.  It isn't.

 

In that same period:

Debt at 2015:                    £6.9m   (variously bonds, directors loans, wonga loan)

Debt at 2019:                    £16.2m   (Dwane Sports)

Increase in debt:              £9.3m

 

There is an odd movement in "other creditors" accounting for most of the balance; there is no analysis of this figure.

Other creditors at 2015:   £0.5m

Other creditors at 2019:   £4.5m

Increase in OC:                  £4.0m

 

Combined Debt / OC:    £13.3m

Other movements:        £0.1m

Per loss in four years:   £13.4m

 

The question the is what is "other creditors"; it's not trade creditors, directors loan, or VAT / PAYE.   Possibly another unrelated company (Jordanian Bank?) is incurring expenses on behalf of Rovers and rolling up the costs: for the London office / planning / stadium work maybe?  Don't know but £4.5m a huge figure to be stting under "other creditors".

On one interpretation their debt has only gone up by £9.3m since the Higgs era; on another £13.3m.  It's not £24m anyway.

 

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2 hours ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

Oh yes, we mustn’t forget the new canopy they added over their ‘hospitality entrance’ - they even crowed about it online! 

In keeping with their standing in world football would you please show some respect and refer to it by its correct name.

The Canopy Nou

Edited by Lanterne Rouge
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5 hours ago, wendyredredrobin said:

Have they really gone a full day without doing something stupid?

Surely there must be some pictures of hordes of blue and white quartered idiots roaming the streets of Whorefield ignoring the lockdown or something.

There's a group on Facebook called Bristol pubs and clubs of the 60's, 70's and 80's. I used to frequent a fine establishment called the Top Rank, in the early 70's, along with city centre pubs, which I still do. There has always been a higher proportion of reds within the city centre due to there being more of us and, the proximity of south Bristol to town. There used to be some blue pubs, such as the Bank or the Prince Rupert, with a smattering elsewhere and in truth, they did have some tasty geezers but, not that many. There were nowhere near as many blues that frequented or appeared to frequent the pubs and clubs of town as there were City fans.

Last night there was a post put on the site "Top Rank Tote Enders". It received a sum total of 5 comments from three girls, one bloke asking about Amen Corner and a gif of a robin from my wife. Where is and how long, has this secret society been running? There certainly wasn't any evidence of it when I frequented the place, in fact, we used to ask people who they supported and then acted accordingly. They are unbelievable in their delusions of where they stand or stood in life.

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5 hours ago, Eddie Hitler said:

It's painful to see how they're throwing random figures around without bothering to look at the accounts.

As I'm waiting for it to warm up enough that I can sit out in my back garden I thought I'd take their accounts apart.  As it were.

Comparing position at 30 June 2015 (Higgs / Wonga Loans) and 30 June 2019 (last set of accounts):

 

Share Capital has barely moved, net other assets have barely moved.

Accumulated loss 2015:    £10.7m

Accumulated loss 2019:    £24.1m

Loss in the four years:        £13.4m

I'm assuming that this £24.1m (accumulated loss for the year dot) is what they're throwing around as debt.  It isn't.

 

In that same period:

Debt at 2015:                    £6.9m   (variously bonds, directors loans, wonga loan)

Debt at 2019:                    £16.2m   (Dwane Sports)

Increase in debt:              £9.3m

 

There is an odd movement in "other creditors" accounting for most of the balance; there is no analysis of this figure.

Other creditors at 2015:   £0.5m

Other creditors at 2019:   £4.5m

Increase in OC:                  £4.0m

 

Combined Debt / OC:    £13.3m

Other movements:        £0.1m

Per loss in four years:   £13.4m

 

The question the is what is "other creditors"; it's not trade creditors, directors loan, or VAT / PAYE.   Possibly another unrelated company (Jordanian Bank?) is incurring expenses on behalf of Rovers and rolling up the costs: for the London office / planning / stadium work maybe?  Don't know but £4.5m a huge figure to be stting under "other creditors".

On one interpretation their debt has only gone up by £9.3m since the Higgs era; on another £13.3m.  It's not £24m anyway.

 

Could the other creditors be, Dwayne sports for the repayment of the Wonga loan and, Dwayne sports for the purchase of the colony? Or repayment to NH the remainder of the purchase of shares?

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10 minutes ago, Rich said:

Could the other creditors be, Dwayne sports for the repayment of the Wonga loan and, Dwayne sports for the purchase of the colony? Or repayment to NH the remainder of the purchase of shares?

If it was due to Dwane Sports, for whatever reason, it would be in the main loan line.

I thought the Higgs transaction had been settled.

If it was another club then I'd be thinking deferred transfer payments due for players purchased but they haven't bought anyone for those sort of amounts with Tillson still their record.

It's an odd one.

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1 hour ago, myol'man said:

With not much going on we'll have to go back to old R*vers jokes.

Fan phones Eastville Stadium

"what time is kickoff?"

Bert Tann

"what time can you make it?"

?

Can't be true.

We'd had our phones cut off after Ian Stevens put all the gate money on a greyhound and it ran off. 

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20 minutes ago, Rich said:

There's a group on Facebook called Bristol pubs and clubs of the 60's, 70's and 80's. I used to frequent a fine establishment called the Top Rank, in the early 70's, along with city centre pubs, which I still do. There has always been a higher proportion of reds within the city centre due to there being more of us and, the proximity of south Bristol to town. There used to be some blue pubs, such as the Bank or the Prince Rupert, with a smattering elsewhere and in truth, they did have some tasty geezers but, not that many. There were nowhere near as many blues that frequented or appeared to frequent the pubs and clubs of town as there were City fans.

Last night there was a post put on the site "Top Rank Tote Enders". It received a sum total of 5 comments from three girls, one bloke asking about Amen Corner and a gif of a robin from my wife. Where is and how long, has this secret society been running? There certainly wasn't any evidence of it when I frequented the place, in fact, we used to ask people who they supported and then acted accordingly. They are unbelievable in their delusions of where they stand or stood in life.

Quite possible that the term "Top Rank Tote Enders" contained a typo.....

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2 hours ago, Bristol Rob said:

https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/efl-dismiss-complaint-against-dwane-4030396

My guess is that the supporters club will blame Sainsbury's next.

I think I`ll allow this news to be digested over at delusion central and pop over a bit later (maybe while I`m having my tea) to see their take on it. I doubt I`ll be disappointed.

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2 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

If it was due to Dwane Sports, for whatever reason, it would be in the main loan line.

I thought the Higgs transaction had been settled.

If it was another club then I'd be thinking deferred transfer payments due for players purchased but they haven't bought anyone for those sort of amounts with Tillson still their record.

It's an odd one.£

Could some of it be interest showed separately from the capital outstanding and included in the accounts as an accrual ?

That sum would have been about £ 1.6 million last June and could be up to £ 2.5 million by this June ?  Which would make the total owed to the Al Qadi family about £ 21.5 million but there is nothing to worry about  because their bank is going places and might soon be in a situation comparable to the West Bank.   

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5 hours ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

Oh yes, we mustn’t forget the new canopy they added over their ‘hospitality entrance’ - they even crowed about it online! 

That must have been done when they claimed they had done as many improvements as Tottenham over that summer.....

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8 minutes ago, wood_red said:

That must have been done when they claimed they had done as many improvements as Tottenham over that summer.....

They didn’t claim they’d made as many improvements as Tottenham. That would be ridiculous! 
 

No, I’m sure they said that they were just a similar sized club (bigger fanbase, obviously) than spurs. 
 

Bigger than Norwich, obviously, but only setting their sights on being level pegging Tottenham. 
 

The fact they weren’t in last seasons champions league final was purely down to a combination of Wycombe, Steve Lansdown and Matty Taylor. 

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27 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

If it was due to Dwane Sports, for whatever reason, it would be in the main loan line.

I thought the Higgs transaction had been settled.

If it was another club then I'd be thinking deferred transfer payments due for players purchased but they haven't bought anyone for those sort of amounts with Tillson still their record.

It's an odd one.

I was under the impression that NH was still owed some money from the original purchase.

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17 minutes ago, Rich said:

I was under the impression that NH was still owed some money from the original purchase.

I doubt it..! 
After he stitched them up, to bail out, with the “watertight” sainsburys deal - he’d never have expected to get any outstanding monies he’d left being owed. 

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5 minutes ago, Bar BS3 said:

I doubt it..! 
After he stitched them up, to bail out, with the “watertight” sainsburys deal - he’d never have expected to get any outstanding monies he’d left being owed. 

I read it somewhere on here from a usually well informed source. I believe £2m was outstanding. Don't think my mind was playing tricks.  NH owned 54% of the shares. The club was originally bought for what £5m plus the Wonga loan paid off, other directors were paid off with a balance outstanding to NH. Of course, I could be completely wrong. The following was taken from Gas chat:

Jun 11, 2015 at 12:00pm Henbury Gas, gaseous, and 2 more like this
Quote
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Post by gasincider on Jun 11, 2015 at 12:00pm

NH loans £1,358,000
BB ' £ 719,000
CJ ' £ 218,000
EW ' £ 309,000
RK ' £ 186,000
GD ' £ 974,000
MSP Cap £2,600,000
Others £ 76,000

All currently outstanding as at last accounts.

Obviously they all bought shares, but these are not repayable, whilst they do confer ownership.

NH has 4.4 million shares out of a total of 8.5 million approx giving him a holding of 54.2%

CJ attended 11 games including Wembley.
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7 hours ago, wendyredredrobin said:

Have they really gone a full day without doing something stupid?

Surely there must be some pictures of hordes of blue and white quartered idiots roaming the streets of Whorefield ignoring the lockdown or something.

Here you go ?

 

 

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38 minutes ago, Rich said:

I read it somewhere on here from a usually well informed source. I believe £2m was outstanding. Don't think my mind was playing tricks.  NH owned 54% of the shares. The club was originally bought for what £5m plus the Wonga loan paid off, other directors were paid off with a balance outstanding to NH. Of course, I could be completely wrong. The following was taken from Gas chat:

Jun 11, 2015 at 12:00pm Henbury Gas, gaseous, and 2 more like this
Quote
Post Options
 

Post by gasincider on Jun 11, 2015 at 12:00pm

NH loans £1,358,000
BB ' £ 719,000
CJ ' £ 218,000
EW ' £ 309,000
RK ' £ 186,000
GD ' £ 974,000
MSP Cap £2,600,000
Others £ 76,000

All currently outstanding as at last accounts.

Obviously they all bought shares, but these are not repayable, whilst they do confer ownership.

NH has 4.4 million shares out of a total of 8.5 million approx giving him a holding of 54.2%

CJ attended 11 games including Wembley.

Who cares what the shares are worth if they don't issue share certificates when you buy them?

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1 hour ago, bert tann said:

Could some of it be interest showed separately from the capital outstanding and included in the accounts as an accrual ?

That sum would have been about £ 1.6 million last June and could be up to £ 2.5 million by this June ?  Which would make the total owed to the Al Qadi family about £ 21.5 million but there is nothing to worry about  because their bank is going places and might soon be in a situation comparable to the West Bank.   

The interest isn't being paid over so I assume it rolls up into the DS loan.  Some loans do work like this
 and there isn't much point in paying the money across only to pay it back.

From memory it's an RCF (revolving credit facility) so you can simply borrow more to pay the interest in the normal course of business.  A lot of start ups would operate in this way.

 

52 minutes ago, Rich said:

I read it somewhere on here from a usually well informed source. I believe £2m was outstanding. Don't think my mind was playing tricks.  NH owned 54% of the shares. The club was originally bought for what £5m plus the Wonga loan paid off, other directors were paid off with a balance outstanding to NH. Of course, I could be completely wrong. The following was taken from Gas chat:

Jun 11, 2015 at 12:00pm Henbury Gas, gaseous, and 2 more like this
Quote
Post Options
 

Post by gasincider on Jun 11, 2015 at 12:00pm

NH loans £1,358,000
BB ' £ 719,000
CJ ' £ 218,000
EW ' £ 309,000
RK ' £ 186,000
GD ' £ 974,000
MSP Cap £2,600,000
Others £ 76,000

All currently outstanding as at last accounts.

Obviously they all bought shares, but these are not repayable, whilst they do confer ownership.

NH has 4.4 million shares out of a total of 8.5 million approx giving him a holding of 54.2%

CJ attended 11 games including Wembley.

I think that absolutely was the case but it's now all settled.  These other creditors have gone up subesquent to this anyway, viz:

At 30 June:

2016  £1.3m

2017 £1.8m

2018 £3.7m

2019 £4.5m

Mulling over it I wonder if it's "at risk" consultancy work on the stadium and / or training ground which only becomes payable upon a successful outcome.

It's a while since I studied this but I think that means that it's a "contingent liability" which you would recognise as incurred even if it's possible that you may end up not paying it.

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22 minutes ago, wendyredredrobin said:

Who cares what the shares are worth if they don't issue share certificates when you buy them?

Shares aren’t worth anything if nobody wants to buy them. I decided to issue shares in by garden pergola at £1500 per share but, for some reason, there has been a distinct lack of interest 

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49 minutes ago, pongo88 said:

Shares aren’t worth anything if nobody wants to buy them. I decided to issue shares in by garden pergola at £1500 per share but, for some reason, there has been a distinct lack of interest 

I`ll take ten.

If you just  DM me your bank account details and PIN number I`ll deposit the cash straight away.

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