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Silvio Dante

Walsh and Pack

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Whatever else came out of tonight, after the Reading game that settled for me that they can’t play at the same time.

In the first half I thought we were like my teenage crushes - pretty but no penetration. That was because both MP and LW essentially play the same sitting deep recycling game. I think LJ put them both in tonight as he was worried about how fit MP/JB were after Saturday - but if that was the case, just drop one.

With both LW and MP in the side we look pedestrian and non threatening. Can’t happen again.

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MP has been poor for the last 3 games.  Clearly not getting enough sleep other than the sleep he is getting on the pitch at the moment.

Hopefully he won't be getting so many sleepless nights next season, but I would be inclined to drop him for Saturday.

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15 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said:

 

In the first half I thought we were like my teenage crushes - pretty but no penetration. 

😁😂🤣

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9 minutes ago, wendyredredrobin said:

MP has been poor for the last 3 games.  Clearly not getting enough sleep other than the sleep he is getting on the pitch at the moment.

Hopefully he won't be getting so many sleepless nights next season, but I would be inclined to drop him for Saturday.

I thought he had a pretty decent game on Saturday.  But he has been 5/10, 6/10 a lot recently.

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How can Pack stay on but Walsh be subbed after that first half.  

Pack could not thread a pass for his life. How many times did he give the ball away tonight?

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3 minutes ago, wendyredredrobin said:

I have previously noted that Marlon does look a much better player with Korey alongside him.

Which hasn't happened much this season. A lot of below par performances lately, which has really affected our playoff push at just the wrong time.

3 minutes ago, Shtanley said:

How can Pack stay on but Walsh be subbed after that first half.  

Pack could not thread a pass for his life. How many times did he give the ball away tonight?

 

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1 minute ago, Shtanley said:

How can Pack stay on but Walsh be subbed after that first half.  

Pack could not thread a pass for his life. How many times did he give the ball away tonight?

 Maybe it was more about Walsh on a yellow then not taking Pack off...

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2 minutes ago, miketh2nd said:

 Maybe it was more about Walsh on a yellow then not taking Pack off...

Fair point!

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1 minute ago, Shtanley said:

Fair point!

 Didn't sound like he was having one of best games ,  but Johnson loves taking a player off on a yellow. 

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If you are that small you must have something to make up for winning nothing in the air

For instance, tigerish tackling, non stop running, killer pass ability. For all of these see Barry Bannon.

Cant see any in Walsh. Massively reminds me of LJ in his playing days. Lots of touches plus most sideways or backwards passing. Great for the stats little impact on the game

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13 minutes ago, Clutton Caveman said:

If you are that small you must have something to make up for winning nothing in the air

For instance, tigerish tackling, non stop running, killer pass ability. For all of these see Barry Bannon.

Cant see any in Walsh. Massively reminds me of LJ in his playing days. Lots of touches plus most sideways or backwards passing. Great for the stats little impact on the game

Sorry but Walsh is nothing like LJ was. 

First half last night, him and Paterson were the only two trying to make things happen, moving the ball forward quickly and playing some good stuff. 

The problem was, nobody else seemed up for it...

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The clever move in a must win game on Sunday would be to drop Pack for Palmer and play Brownhill in Packs position, it’s unbelievable that Pack starts every game considering his woeful form

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14 hours ago, wendyredredrobin said:

MP has been poor for the last 3 games.  Clearly not getting enough sleep other than the sleep he is getting on the pitch at the moment.

Hopefully he won't be getting so many sleepless nights next season, but I would be inclined to drop him for Saturday.

I am sure he won't be playing Saturday.

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Walshy has got a good bit of vision in him. I'd drop Marlon who looks a spent force, hardly his fault he must have played almost every minute this season!

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21 minutes ago, Clutton Caveman said:

If you are that small you must have something to make up for winning nothing in the air

For instance, tigerish tackling, non stop running, killer pass ability. For all of these see Barry Bannon.

Cant see any in Walsh. Massively reminds me of LJ in his playing days. Lots of touches plus most sideways or backwards passing. Great for the stats little impact on the game

I think Lee’s game changed over his time here. I only saw him live once but tv / highlights I thought his game changed from bright, buzzy midfielder trying to break lines to sit-in keep the ball moving midfielder. 

I don’t see Walsh like either of the two LJs I’ve described above really. I’m not truly convinced where he fits in, but I see him better equipped to be a normal CM midfielder than a DM.

For me I would play Morrell over Walsh. I didn’t see first half last night. 

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Sunday is all or nothing have to go all out for the win we have nothing to lose can’t see boro dropping points but can see Derby losing to West Brom and the Jacks

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Problem is that we have ran Pack, Diedhiou, and Brownhill into the ground as we have no over real options. If they could be subbed more often, or rested for a game or two every now and then we might see more consistent performances from them. We have a squad of 26 first team players but Pack, Brownhill, Diedhiouh and our RB position (Hunt/Pisano) have no real competition or options to bring others in. The solution might be giving Morrell, Walsh, Eisa, more time so they can fit in easier (as opposed to being nowhere (not even on the subs bench) then playing, vanishing again for months). 

 

And can we sort out RB this summer. We went a year with Wright having to cover it (doing a pretty decent job), and Pisano, Hunt but compared to out LB the position has always been ok/adequate would be nice to see the same quality at RB as LB (which might also enable us to attack more on the right as we seem to attack heavily/mostly down the Left.

 

Will be a interesting summer, if we can offload a few of the filler squad members and improve the team again with 2-3 quality players.

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I didn't manage to watch much of last nights game. I think Pack has had a very poor season. Not many good performances at all imo.

I have no problem with him as I will say when he plays well. But we need to upgrade massively in that position next season.

Walsh obviously does not offer the strength and height of Pack. But should that really be a reason for Pack to keep his place? Let's be brave and go with Walsh and Brownhill in our final game.

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For me the future of our midfield is Liam Walsh plus an athletic ball winner(Williams or Hayden examples). Liam Walsh has the vision and passing range and isn’t incapable of doing the defensive bits. He just needs minutes as is still a little raw positionally. 

These would be two deeper midfielders giving our fullbacks more license to provide width with a “front 4.” The only way this works is if we improve our attacking options. As it stands only Diedhiou, Eliasson and Paterson are good enough to compete for those spots. Need another striker, 10(I would buy Palmer if possible) and a couple wide players(assuming COD sold). 

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2 hours ago, JonDolman said:

I didn't manage to watch much of last nights game. I think Pack has had a very poor season. Not many good performances at all imo.

I have no problem with him as I will say when he plays well. But we need to upgrade massively in that position next season.

Walsh obviously does not offer the strength and height of Pack. But should that really be a reason for Pack to keep his place? Let's be brave and go with Walsh and Brownhill in our final game.

Pack has had an average season....which for me overall is disappointing, as LJ plays him as the most important player.  For the ball player he is, he has been more effective away from home playing as a shield.  At home, I think he’s rarely influenced a game much and that has contributed to our poor form at AG.  I thought he played decently v Derby, but there haven’t been many home games since early season where I came away from the ground thinking Marlon was up there for MOTM.  23 home games, you expect him to feature in the reckoning several times.

Imho, I think he’s hit his level and at 28, he’s plateaued.

If we want to kick on to the next level, we need to find a better player in CM.  It doesn’t need to be a Pack Mk2, I’d rather a more versatile box-to-box type.  Someone who might take it in turns to sit, but it’s pretty easy for the away side to not feel threatened that Marlon is gonna run beyond his marker.  That makes us a bit one dimensional.  A fit, free from injury Korey alongside Brownhill would be interesting to see.  I could imagine those 2 even in a 3 with O’Dowda (but he’s gonna go surely).

Re Walsh, I just can’t get over-excited about him.  And I don’t see him playing 30+ games and influencing us into a play-off place.  He’s got some nice stuff, but not enough imho.  With all these types I hope they prove me wrong.

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Liam Walsh looks a neat and tidy player but I prefer Joe Morrell who seems like he has the ability to effect the game more.  I've felt he should have had more opportunities even if only as a sub.

If someone has the time and inclination, they might want to look at the points per game when Liam Walsh has played. It's probably coincidental or indicative that LJ has adversely adapted our system to accommodate him, but I think the results have been poor when Liam has made an appearance.  The stats would get a boost from last night's win but, ironically or not, we were losing when he went off.  

 

 

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19 hours ago, Davefevs said:

I thought he had a pretty decent game on Saturday.  But he has been 5/10, 6/10 a lot recently.

As good as that?

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8 minutes ago, bcfcnick said:

Liam Walsh looks a neat and tidy player but I prefer Joe Morrell who seems like he has the ability to effect the game more.  I've felt he should have had more opportunities even if only as a sub.

If someone has the time and inclination, they might want to look at the points per game when Liam Walsh has played. It's probably coincidental or indicative that LJ has adversely adapted our system to accommodate him, but I think the results have been poor when Liam has made an appearance.  The stats would get a boost from last night's win but, ironically or not, we were losing when he went off.  

 

 

He has the worst ppg....apart from Semenyo! (League games only)

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/bristol-city/leistungsdaten/verein/698/plus/1?reldata=GB2%262018

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7 hours ago, Clutton Caveman said:

If you are that small you must have something to make up for winning nothing in the air

For instance, tigerish tackling, non stop running, killer pass ability. For all of these see Barry Bannon.

Cant see any in Walsh. Massively reminds me of LJ in his playing days. Lots of touches plus most sideways or backwards passing. Great for the stats little impact on the game

That’s a bit harsh on Walsh, his passing range and dead ball ability far exceeds anything LJ had in his locker

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3 hours ago, Davefevs said:

He has the worst ppg....apart from Semenyo! (League games only)

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/bristol-city/leistungsdaten/verein/698/plus/1?reldata=GB2%262018

 

2 hours ago, bcfcnick said:

Thanks Dave, had a hunch that was the case.

Probably nothing to do with him often coming on the pitch already on the losing side? 

I like Morrell but he is different from Walsh. Maybe comparison because they are both small but Walsh is more a Pack type(deeper playmaker) player while Morrell is more a Brownhill type(more energetic box to box).

Difference is Walsh is better than Pack at the playmaking side of the game whereas Morrell is not better than brownhill at anything. This is why, imo, Walsh has had more minutes than Morrell. 

We bang on about Barry Bannan well Walsh is Bannan 2.0. He needs more minutes and exposure to reach that level but he has all the tools. Imo he has a higher ceiling than Morrell who for me is at best a lower half champ player/good L1. 

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3 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

 

Probably nothing to do with him often coming on the pitch already on the losing side? 

Its a simple model that TM use based on end result.  One of these days I'm gonna do a spreadsheet to calculate the scores whilst a player is on the pitch, e.g. every player who starts a game starts at 0-0, and then plot scores when they go off / come on.  Next season’s little project.  For info, we score a goal every 51 minutes MT us on the pitch, but Fam and Andi are circa every 70 mins!  You can do lots with stats!

I like Morrell but he is different from Walsh.

Yes, very different.

Maybe comparison because they are both small but Walsh is more a Pack type(deeper playmaker) player while Morrell is more a Brownhill type(more energetic box to box).

Agree.

Difference is Walsh is better than Pack at the playmaking side of the game

Really?  I’ll give you Stoke at home for 45 minutes, and he did a few nice things away at Reading, but that’s a bloody small sample to state he’s a better playmaker than Pack....despite my recent critique of Marlon. 

whereas Morrell is not better than brownhill at anything.

Think Joe might have a little more composure on the ball, but need to see more of him in the hurly-burly of the Champ.  Josh is a bit 100mph in the final third, or under pressure.

This is why, imo, Walsh has had more minutes than Morrell. 

We bang on about Barry Bannan well Walsh is Bannan 2.0.

Bannan has a very sweet left foot, Walsh’s right foot is nowhere near as good.  Bannan had that as a young player breaking through.  I don’t see anyone saying Walsh have a lovely right foot.  Maybe I'm wrong?

 He needs more minutes and exposure to reach that level but he has all the tools. Imo he has a higher ceiling than Morrell who for me is at best a lower half champ player/good L1. 

For me I see Walsh at the similar level you have for Morrell.  Let’s hope they both come good.

 

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