Rudolf Hucker Posted May 15, 2019 Report Share Posted May 15, 2019 It’s probably just me, but I wasn’t comfortable watching Mike Dean’s celebrations during the FGR v Tranmere play off match. I know that referees are only human and will likely, perhaps privately, support a team. To do so is certainly not wrong however, the way that Dean reacted - as a true fan would - reminded me that he will be prone to as much irrational bias as the rest of us. I’ve supported City all my life and thus I have a long list of teams, in all divisions, I dislike for a wide variety of reasons - some geographic eg 15ers, Cardiff, Swindon; some as a result of experiences playing them over time eg Leeds, Villa, Forest, Brentford, Millwall; others for no rhyme or reason - just because I don’t like them eg Swansea, West Ham, Stoke. All over the country, there are football fans who have similar irrational lists of teams to which they have a bias against. FGR don’t like Tranmere; Swindon don’t like Gillingham; 15ers don’t like Wycombe (although, of course are loved by most). I don't know what traditional rivalries Tranmere fans have - other than FGR - but they will have some. In everyday life, I give the teams on my list no thought whatsoever (15ers excepted) however if one of these teams is covered on TV I invariably watch with that bias evident (a match is more enjoyable to watch if you want one team to win - or lose). Mike Dean is one of our leading referees; he has now evidenced himself to be a passionate supporter of Tranmere and a regular football fan. One of us. Thus, try as he might, he’ll have in his head an unwritten list of teams he ‘hates’ probably as long and irrational as mine. If he’s refereeing one of the teams on his list, is he prone to turning down a marginal penalty decision because of his hidden bias, or awarding one to their opposition? Maybe, just maybe. I suggest that the Top Six Premier League clubs plus the 'bigger' teams, such as Villa will be on a lot of people’s lists - some for positive, others negative reasons. They’ll certainly feature on more people’s lists than li'l ole Bristol City. We know that football is about fine margins. If a referee’s decision making can be clouded by preference, perhaps it could explain why Villa are awarded highly controversial penalties such as the one given against us a few weeks ago? I’ve never thought of this before I watched Mike Dean’s antics at FGR. I think that the referee’s association won’t be best pleased with him for revealing himself to be a true fan, rather than the inscrutable football official they'd prefer him to portray. But you can't put the genie back in the bottle. Just my thoughts. Am I wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmissionImpossible Posted May 15, 2019 Report Share Posted May 15, 2019 I don’t think you can call his professionalism into account. Good referee and he’s quite right to support his team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cidercity1987 Posted May 15, 2019 Report Share Posted May 15, 2019 There are teams I don't like but professionalism and the desire to be the best I can would surely outweigh that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cidered abroad Posted May 15, 2019 Report Share Posted May 15, 2019 Kevin Friend is also a Prem referee who I understand is a City fan who attends our games whenever possible. I worked with a referee years ago, who did a Glos Cup Final at Ashton Gate. He gave all the 50/50 decisions to the Gas and even booked a couple of City players. He was a lifelong City fan! I believe that they can separate their work from their support of a club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOTBLUE Posted May 15, 2019 Report Share Posted May 15, 2019 I thought it was great to see him supporting his team and even singing along with the songs,although singing ‘whose the ******* in the black’ was a bit much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olé Posted May 15, 2019 Report Share Posted May 15, 2019 Well said @Rudolf Hucker, the love in on social media with Mike Dean's antics did my head in. He has become a cult hero thanks to his extravagant gestures and affability as a Premier League referee, and this has just elevated his cult status - but for me it just adds to my annoyance at a bloke who turned in the most one-sided refereeing performance at Ashton Gate. I've never liked the bloke personally so have no interest in how "genuine" he looks now, and I debated about raising this sooner after these Forest Green clips circulated, but didn't want to come across all tin foil hat. However, as some of you will recall, under Benny Lennartson 20 years ago we finally started to put some results together in our bid to avoid relegation. Birmingham City came to Ashton Gate in the play offs and I'm sure some of you won't have forgotten the game - we gave them a really good go, but Akinbiyi had a perfectly good goal ruled out because the Brum keeper and defender ran into each other, then Ndlovu got a nothing penalty for a comical slip - a two goal swing that ended our escape and relegated us. Throughout the game the referee was continually against us, bizarrely so. I've certainly never forgotten it. The man in question was Mike Dean. I'm sure you can search for posts by me on OTIB going back years where I have referenced it as to this day the most one sided refereeing performance I've seen. It's never been surpassed (a few this season have ran it close!) Refused to halt play and insisted on playing on with Shaun Taylor down with a head injury - eventually requiring the club doctor Disallowed Ade Akinbiyi's deserved opener for a dominant City because the Birmingham keeper and centre back ran into each other Awarded a penalty to Birmingham when Peter Ndlovu slipped over yards from anyone (Ndlovu even got up and apologised for diving) Ignored 2 Birmingham handballs in the box, ignored Birmingham player kicking out at Louis Carey off the ball, etc you get the picture Why is it significant now? Well, how about the fact Tranmere were in the same ****ing division as us that year for starters!! In fact both teams were at risk of relegation and although Tranmere had made a better fist of it and were just safe I think, it wasn't even the first game Dean had officiated in the division that season, for teams competing against Tranmere. What are we supposed to think - that Mike Dean suddenly became a rabid, stand-on-seat camera-chasing Tranmere diehard in the past few years? Or that he was one back then and shouldn't have been reffing matches affecting clubs who were competing directly against the team he so 'passionately' supports? So he's either fake or dodgy. Neither is mildly heroic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slartibartfast Posted May 15, 2019 Report Share Posted May 15, 2019 4 hours ago, cidercity1987 said: There are teams I don't like but professionalism and the desire to be the best I can would surely outweigh that. Not me.............give me a Cardiff or Sag game to ref, please ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chappers Posted May 15, 2019 Report Share Posted May 15, 2019 Big teams tent to get the rub of the green, every red has an occasional mare, every fan remembers the bad decisions and forgets the lucky ones, and you just have to live with it. The Premiership might discover that VAR is not all it’s cracked up to be, can see an awful lot of penalties being awarded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmissionImpossible Posted May 15, 2019 Report Share Posted May 15, 2019 1 hour ago, Olé said: Well said @Rudolf Hucker, the love in on social media with Mike Dean's antics did my head in. He has become a cult hero thanks to his extravagant gestures and affability as a Premier League referee, and this has just elevated his cult status - but for me it just adds to my annoyance at a bloke who turned in the most one-sided refereeing performance at Ashton Gate. I've never liked the bloke personally so have no interest in how "genuine" he looks now, and I debated about raising this sooner after these Forest Green clips circulated, but didn't want to come across all tin foil hat. However, as some of you will recall, under Benny Lennartson 20 years ago we finally started to put some results together in our bid to avoid relegation. Birmingham City came to Ashton Gate in the play offs and I'm sure some of you won't have forgotten the game - we gave them a really good go, but Akinbiyi had a perfectly good goal ruled out because the Brum keeper and defender ran into each other, then Ndlovu got a nothing penalty for a comical slip - a two goal swing that ended our escape and relegated us. Throughout the game the referee was continually against us, bizarrely so. I've certainly never forgotten it. The man in question was Mike Dean. I'm sure you can search for posts by me on OTIB going back years where I have referenced it as to this day the most one sided refereeing performance I've seen. It's never been surpassed (a few this season have ran it close!) Refused to halt play and insisted on playing on with Shaun Taylor down with a head injury - eventually requiring the club doctor Disallowed Ade Akinbiyi's deserved opener for a dominant City because the Birmingham keeper and centre back ran into each other Awarded a penalty to Birmingham when Peter Ndlovu slipped over yards from anyone (Ndlovu even got up and apologised for diving) Ignored 2 Birmingham handballs in the box, ignored Birmingham player kicking out at Louis Carey off the ball, etc you get the picture Why is it significant now? Well, how about the fact Tranmere were in the same ****ing division as us that year for starters!! In fact both teams were at risk of relegation and although Tranmere had made a better fist of it and were just safe I think, it wasn't even the first game Dean had officiated in the division that season, for teams competing against Tranmere. What are we supposed to think - that Mike Dean suddenly became a rabid, stand-on-seat camera-chasing Tranmere diehard in the past few years? Or that he was one back then and shouldn't have been reffing matches affecting clubs who were competing directly against the team he so 'passionately' supports? So he's either fake or dodgy. Neither is mildly heroic. Talk about holding a grudge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glen humphries Posted May 15, 2019 Report Share Posted May 15, 2019 6 hours ago, Rudolf Hucker said: It’s probably just me, but I wasn’t comfortable watching Mike Dean’s celebrations during the FGR v Tranmere play off match. I know that referees are only human and will likely, perhaps privately, support a team. To do so is certainly not wrong however, the way that Dean reacted - as a true fan would - reminded me that he will be prone to as much irrational bias as the rest of us. I’ve supported City all my life and thus I have a long list of teams, in all divisions, I dislike for a wide variety of reasons - some geographic eg 15ers, Cardiff, Swindon; some as a result of experiences playing them over time eg Leeds, Villa, Forest, Brentford, Millwall; others for no rhyme or reason - just because I don’t like them eg Swansea, West Ham, Stoke. All over the country, there are football fans who have similar irrational lists of teams to which they have a bias against. FGR don’t like Tranmere; Swindon don’t like Gillingham; 15ers don’t like Wycombe (although, of course are loved by most). I don't know what traditional rivalries Tranmere fans have - other than FGR - but they will have some. In everyday life, I give the teams on my list no thought whatsoever (15ers excepted) however if one of these teams is covered on TV I invariably watch with that bias evident (a match is more enjoyable to watch if you want one team to win - or lose). Mike Dean is one of our leading referees; he has now evidenced himself to be a passionate supporter of Tranmere and a regular football fan. One of us. Thus, try as he might, he’ll have in his head an unwritten list of teams he ‘hates’ probably as long and irrational as mine. If he’s refereeing one of the teams on his list, is he prone to turning down a marginal penalty decision because of his hidden bias, or awarding one to their opposition? Maybe, just maybe. I suggest that the Top Six Premier League clubs plus the 'bigger' teams, such as Villa will be on a lot of people’s lists - some for positive, others negative reasons. They’ll certainly feature on more people’s lists than li'l ole Bristol City. We know that football is about fine margins. If a referee’s decision making can be clouded by preference, perhaps it could explain why Villa are awarded highly controversial penalties such as the one given against us a few weeks ago? I’ve never thought of this before I watched Mike Dean’s antics at FGR. I think that the referee’s association won’t be best pleased with him for revealing himself to be a true fan, rather than the inscrutable football official they'd prefer him to portray. But you can't put the genie back in the bottle. Just my thoughts. Am I wrong? Him joining in with who’s the manual manipulator in the black chant was a bit ott. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AppyDAZE Posted May 15, 2019 Report Share Posted May 15, 2019 21 minutes ago, glen humphries said: Him joining in with who’s the manual manipulator in the black chant was a bit ott. I doubt they ever sang that. Both refs were crap to FGR and appeared to like Tranny R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Red Posted May 15, 2019 Report Share Posted May 15, 2019 6 hours ago, cidered abroad said: Kevin Friend is also a Prem referee who I understand is a City fan who attends our games whenever possible. I worked with a referee years ago, who did a Glos Cup Final at Ashton Gate. He gave all the 50/50 decisions to the Gas and even booked a couple of City players. He was a lifelong City fan! I believe that they can separate their work from their support of a club. Yeah Kevin Friend has been spotted at many an away game in the North/Midlands when it doesn't clash with his refereeing commitments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portland Bill Posted May 15, 2019 Report Share Posted May 15, 2019 9 hours ago, Rudolf Hucker said: It’s probably just me, but I wasn’t comfortable watching Mike Dean’s celebrations during the FGR v Tranmere play off match. I know that referees are only human and will likely, perhaps privately, support a team. To do so is certainly not wrong however, the way that Dean reacted - as a true fan would - reminded me that he will be prone to as much irrational bias as the rest of us. I’ve supported City all my life and thus I have a long list of teams, in all divisions, I dislike for a wide variety of reasons - some geographic eg 15ers, Cardiff, Swindon; some as a result of experiences playing them over time eg Leeds, Villa, Forest, Brentford, Millwall; others for no rhyme or reason - just because I don’t like them eg Swansea, West Ham, Stoke. All over the country, there are football fans who have similar irrational lists of teams to which they have a bias against. FGR don’t like Tranmere; Swindon don’t like Gillingham; 15ers don’t like Wycombe (although, of course are loved by most). I don't know what traditional rivalries Tranmere fans have - other than FGR - but they will have some. In everyday life, I give the teams on my list no thought whatsoever (15ers excepted) however if one of these teams is covered on TV I invariably watch with that bias evident (a match is more enjoyable to watch if you want one team to win - or lose). Mike Dean is one of our leading referees; he has now evidenced himself to be a passionate supporter of Tranmere and a regular football fan. One of us. Thus, try as he might, he’ll have in his head an unwritten list of teams he ‘hates’ probably as long and irrational as mine. If he’s refereeing one of the teams on his list, is he prone to turning down a marginal penalty decision because of his hidden bias, or awarding one to their opposition? Maybe, just maybe. I suggest that the Top Six Premier League clubs plus the 'bigger' teams, such as Villa will be on a lot of people’s lists - some for positive, others negative reasons. They’ll certainly feature on more people’s lists than li'l ole Bristol City. We know that football is about fine margins. If a referee’s decision making can be clouded by preference, perhaps it could explain why Villa are awarded highly controversial penalties such as the one given against us a few weeks ago? I’ve never thought of this before I watched Mike Dean’s antics at FGR. I think that the referee’s association won’t be best pleased with him for revealing himself to be a true fan, rather than the inscrutable football official they'd prefer him to portray. But you can't put the genie back in the bottle. Just my thoughts. Am I wrong? Yes you are wrong! My son is a referee, he’s youngish but is already refereeing at a decent semi pro level, he’s also a massive City fan. You think Mike Dean is celebrating! You should see my sons City celebrations!! He has refereed City under 21’s and been on the line for a City pre season game. I can tell you 100% fact that he didn’t and would not show any favour to City, it’s the players who cheat, not the officials. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 15, 2019 Report Share Posted May 15, 2019 Mike Dean is a **** who - a bit like Clattenberg - wants celebrity status. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin1988 Posted May 15, 2019 Report Share Posted May 15, 2019 5 hours ago, Olé said: Well said @Rudolf Hucker, the love in on social media with Mike Dean's antics did my head in. He has become a cult hero thanks to his extravagant gestures and affability as a Premier League referee, and this has just elevated his cult status - but for me it just adds to my annoyance at a bloke who turned in the most one-sided refereeing performance at Ashton Gate. I've never liked the bloke personally so have no interest in how "genuine" he looks now, and I debated about raising this sooner after these Forest Green clips circulated, but didn't want to come across all tin foil hat. However, as some of you will recall, under Benny Lennartson 20 years ago we finally started to put some results together in our bid to avoid relegation. Birmingham City came to Ashton Gate in the play offs and I'm sure some of you won't have forgotten the game - we gave them a really good go, but Akinbiyi had a perfectly good goal ruled out because the Brum keeper and defender ran into each other, then Ndlovu got a nothing penalty for a comical slip - a two goal swing that ended our escape and relegated us. Throughout the game the referee was continually against us, bizarrely so. I've certainly never forgotten it. The man in question was Mike Dean. I'm sure you can search for posts by me on OTIB going back years where I have referenced it as to this day the most one sided refereeing performance I've seen. It's never been surpassed (a few this season have ran it close!) Refused to halt play and insisted on playing on with Shaun Taylor down with a head injury - eventually requiring the club doctor Disallowed Ade Akinbiyi's deserved opener for a dominant City because the Birmingham keeper and centre back ran into each other Awarded a penalty to Birmingham when Peter Ndlovu slipped over yards from anyone (Ndlovu even got up and apologised for diving) Ignored 2 Birmingham handballs in the box, ignored Birmingham player kicking out at Louis Carey off the ball, etc you get the picture Why is it significant now? Well, how about the fact Tranmere were in the same ****ing division as us that year for starters!! In fact both teams were at risk of relegation and although Tranmere had made a better fist of it and were just safe I think, it wasn't even the first game Dean had officiated in the division that season, for teams competing against Tranmere. What are we supposed to think - that Mike Dean suddenly became a rabid, stand-on-seat camera-chasing Tranmere diehard in the past few years? Or that he was one back then and shouldn't have been reffing matches affecting clubs who were competing directly against the team he so 'passionately' supports? So he's either fake or dodgy. Neither is mildly heroic. Give it another 10 years and you'll be over it pal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwicolin Posted May 15, 2019 Report Share Posted May 15, 2019 I thought it was brilliant that he was supporting his club. Shows a different light to a referee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AppyDAZE Posted May 15, 2019 Report Share Posted May 15, 2019 1 hour ago, 29AR said: Mike Dean is a **** who - a bit like Clattenberg - wants celebrity status. This in a nutshell. Obviously the guy is a fan, but i think a lot of it was deliberately for show the other night. The guy is a cock and always likes the limelight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 15, 2019 Report Share Posted May 15, 2019 13 minutes ago, AppyDAZE said: This in a nutshell. Obviously the guy is a fan, but i think a lot of it was deliberately for show the other night. The guy is a cock and always likes the limelight. You can sniff it out in his refereeing. It’s almost like decisions are taken for the purpose of his book deal upon retirement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olé Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 5 hours ago, Lucan said: What a fool you have been to carry this around with you for 20 years and you aren’t even right Not right about what? I'm quite right about the game, it's really not hard to remember things. Just the same as remembering Lavin hitting Reading fans, Junior having his cheek broken at Oxford or Osman being booed scoring a goal for City against Southend. So if by "carry this around" you mean memory, you should try having some, it isn't hard. Just needs a trigger, like all this Tranmere news. He was a shit ref, troll all you want, I even remember him sending off Carey at Shrewsbury and giving them two penalties. So save me your trolling, the only fool I can see is the one sad enough to actually go and investigate how many points there were between the teams, must have taken you a while, did you have to reconstruct the table from that day? Now that's embarrassing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oh Louie louie Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 Was that the really foggy day when junior got his cheekbone broke ole? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin1988 Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 13 hours ago, Olé said: Not right about what? I'm quite right about the game, it's really not hard to remember things. Just the same as remembering Lavin hitting Reading fans, Junior having his cheek broken at Oxford or Osman being booed scoring a goal for City against Southend. So if by "carry this around" you mean memory, you should try having some, it isn't hard. Just needs a trigger, like all this Tranmere news. He was a shit ref, troll all you want, I even remember him sending off Carey at Shrewsbury and giving them two penalties. So save me your trolling, the only fool I can see is the one sad enough to actually go and investigate how many points there were between the teams, must have taken you a while, did you have to reconstruct the table from that day? Now that's embarrassing. To be fair, when you based a lot of your hatred around Dean's apparent bias helping Tranmere stay ahead of us, should @Lucan have thought better about pointing out that they were already guaranteed to finish above us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBCFC Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 21 minutes ago, Robin1988 said: To be fair, when you based a lot of your hatred around Dean's apparent bias helping Tranmere stay ahead of us, should @Lucan have thought better about pointing out that they were already guaranteed to finish above us? @Olé literally said he thinks Tranmere was already safe by that point. So Lucan added nothing other than toxicity by the manner in which he posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBCFC Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 2 minutes ago, Lucan said: Mwah X I've missed you Bore off you miserable git. All you do is either moan or try and shit stir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBCFC Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 11 minutes ago, Lucan said: I've missed you and your efforts to insert yourself into any thread I comment in. Hugs and kisses Uncle Lucan Well that's never been the case. You have a frankly weird obsession. I was reading the thread anyway and simply commented on how your comment on Ole's post was written in a toxic manner. And what you claimed Ole had got wrong he hadn't actually got wrong, so you were literally being toxic just for the sake of it, for a change... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBCFC Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 3 minutes ago, Lucan said: Weird obsession... yet you joined in this conversation and brought my name up It's okay to admit you love me, I wont think any the less of you little guy Bringing someone's name up is generally the done thing when referring to something someone has said. Going around someone's posts purely to add negative emojis as you do however, is a little peculiar at best. The fact you were in the conversation had nothing to do with it, had it been DaveFevs or anyone else who had made that comment I would still have pointed out that it was nothing more than being toxic for the sake of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spud55 Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 3 hours ago, Robin1988 said: To be fair, when you based a lot of your hatred around Dean's apparent bias helping Tranmere stay ahead of us, should @Lucan have thought better about pointing out that they were already guaranteed to finish above us? I think it's more the fact that that performance by Dean made Keith Stroud look like Pierre Luigi Collina by comparison. There are games where a ref has a bad game, there are games where you get a homer, there are just plain bad referees, that performance however was beyond anything I have ever seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolf Hucker Posted May 16, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 3 minutes ago, Spud55 said: I think it's more the fact that that performance by Dean made Keith Stroud look like Pierre Luigi Collina by comparison. I’d be happy to shave Stroud’s head if it’ll help? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin1988 Posted May 17, 2019 Report Share Posted May 17, 2019 7 hours ago, JamesBCFC said: @Olé literally said he thinks Tranmere was already safe by that point. So Lucan added nothing other than toxicity by the manner in which he posted. I had missed that bit amid the unbridled rage at him refereeing teams that aren’t Tranmere. And still looking for the connection that makes him different to any other referee officiating including a league containing their own team. 4 hours ago, Spud55 said: I think it's more the fact that that performance by Dean made Keith Stroud look like Pierre Luigi Collina by comparison. There are games where a ref has a bad game, there are games where you get a homer, there are just plain bad referees, that performance however was beyond anything I have ever seen. Fair enough, but it was nearly 22 years ago. Maybe time to let it go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wanderingred Posted May 17, 2019 Report Share Posted May 17, 2019 It's been years since I've thought about that Birmingham game, but I do remember feeling absolutely robbed. The only other time I can remember feeling like that was a live Sky game against Middlesbrough, where James Linington denied us an absolutely clear cut penalty, then minutes later gave them a joke free kick which they scored from. I also have vague memories of a night match against Brentford in about 2001 where we lost 2-1 and everyone was yelling at the ref. Can't remember what happened though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oh Louie louie Posted May 17, 2019 Report Share Posted May 17, 2019 Does anyone recall that when we lost 4 2 to oxford in the fog in the early 90s? Worst conditions ive ever saw at a football match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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