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harvey54

Wolves in Europe

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Yesterday's FA Cup result means that Wolves are in next season's UEFA cup

They gambled big and have got their reward. I'm sure that their recruitment policy will come under scrutiny and concerns may be raised but their fans have seen their team finish seventh and I'm not sure that the majority of them will care.

We appear to be happier to make profits on talented young players who could potentially help us to reach the Premier League. Bryan, Reid and now Kelly. Maybe they all wanted to leave to play at a higher level. Maybe they also considered that our club didn't match their ambition. Who knows? 

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15 minutes ago, harvey54 said:

Yesterday's FA Cup result means that Wolves are in next season's UEFA cup

They gambled big and have got their reward. I'm sure that their recruitment policy will come under scrutiny and concerns may be raised but their fans have seen their team finish seventh and I'm not sure that the majority of them will care.

We appear to be happier to make profits on talented young players who could potentially help us to reach the Premier League. Bryan, Reid and now Kelly. Maybe they all wanted to leave to play at a higher level. Maybe they also considered that our club didn't match their ambition. Who knows? 

Fine if we want to risk a £57m operating loss in one season and if we can persuade a shady super agent to effectively be our DoF so he funnels his clients in our direction.

Unlikely though.

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I'm very much aware of the potential outcome especially after watching Portsmouth fail to get promoted recently. I'm not suggesting that I approve of teams buying success. I'm just starting a conversation about Wolves. It wasn't that long ago we played them in a League game where we were competing with them for automatic promotion. 

I don't have a particular opinion on which course is correct.

Edited by harvey54
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35 minutes ago, harvey54 said:

Yesterday's FA Cup result means that Wolves are in next season's UEFA cup

They gambled big and have got their reward. I'm sure that their recruitment policy will come under scrutiny and concerns may be raised but their fans have seen their team finish seventh and I'm not sure that the majority of them will care.

We appear to be happier to make profits on talented young players who could potentially help us to reach the Premier League. Bryan, Reid and now Kelly. Maybe they all wanted to leave to play at a higher level. Maybe they also considered that our club didn't match their ambition. Who knows? 

I would say any fan wanting us to risk the clubs future just for top flight football is at best naive. At worst? I wouldn’t want to be rude...

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5 minutes ago, RedDave said:

I would say any fan wanting us to risk the clubs future just for top flight football is at best naive. At worst? I wouldn’t want to be rude...

So what's your solution to us getting promoted,  because constantly selling our best players and not buying a decent striker in the January window didn't work.

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1 minute ago, pillred said:

So what's your solution to us getting promoted,  because constantly selling our best players and not buying a decent striker in the January window didn't work.

So your solution is to spend £30-40-50m is it? Just like Norwich did, just like Sheffield United did, just like Cardiff did. Oh hang on....

We have improved every year for five years now. Can’t you be happy at that? 

Look at the money Boro and Leeds have thrown at it. Villa have spent shed loads and have to try through the play offs again and needed to change their manager. Stoke’s squad is ridiculous and they finished nowhere.

Be patient and for goodness sake try to enjoy it! 

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1 minute ago, RedDave said:

So your solution is to spend £30-40-50m is it? Just like Norwich did, just like Sheffield United did, just like Cardiff did. Oh hang on....

We have improved every year for five years now. Can’t you be happy at that? 

Look at the money Boro and Leeds have thrown at it. Villa have spent shed loads and have to try through the play offs again and needed to change their manager. Stoke’s squad is ridiculous and they finished nowhere.

Be patient and for goodness sake try to enjoy it! 

We will have to get very lucky to get promoted doing it the way we have been and fair enough it nearly came off, but you could see we were just a couple of players away surely it would have been worth it, we have to at least try to go for it at least once, not advocating throwing money at it but the present strategy while improving us year on year can only take you so far if you are constantly selling the players that could make a difference, if they were going to Liverpool Chelsea could maybe accept it but Bournemouth well you have to admit it's frustrating we can't compete with them.  

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1 minute ago, pillred said:

We will have to get very lucky to get promoted doing it the way we have been and fair enough it nearly came off, but you could see we were just a couple of players away surely it would have been worth it, we have to at least try to go for it at least once, not advocating throwing money at it but the present strategy while improving us year on year can only take you so far if you are constantly selling the players that could make a difference, if they were going to Liverpool Chelsea could maybe accept it but Bournemouth well you have to admit it's frustrating we can't compete with them.  

I’m not completely desperate to get to the Premier League like some so am perfectly happy that we have the best team, long term plan and vision since I started supporting 30 odd years ago 

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35 minutes ago, sh1t_ref_again said:

The OP has conveniently not mentioned what happens if the gamble does not come off 

You sell Neves 😂

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26 minutes ago, RedDave said:

I’m not completely desperate to get to the Premier League like some so am perfectly happy that we have the best team, long term plan and vision since I started supporting 30 odd years ago 

Fair enough, not desperate to get there but having been lucky enough to see us in the old first division it would be nice to at least see top flight football again in my life time, hope the long term strategy pays off and by the time we do it I can still get up the steps!

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The locals up here are absolutely delighted as you could imagine. They also just released new plans for molineux this week. Looks better than what they planned a few years ago, but back to back relegations put hold to that. Now it's one new huge stand and 3 older ones built into the hill. 

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37 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

You sell Neves 😂

It is funny but true. We could probably gamble similarly this summer. We’d stay within FFP and if we did not go up we just sell and take a small loss on a couple players. Not advocating it but it wasn’t exactly like Wolves were in danger of going bust. They were loans from big European clubs probably on about average champ salaries. Plus Neves who was always going to net them more than they paid. 

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Serious questions were raised by other championship clubs about the unique/unusual relationship between Wolves, their manager and the agent, through which they amassed their squad.

Nothing came of those questions, which is hardly surprising in view of the EFL's impotence over this season's ffp issues, but I doubt any other club would be able to replicate what Wolves did due to the unique circumstances that existed for them.

As for fans never caring if they see success on the pitch. Many of us can remember seeing City in the top flight back in the 70s, but can also remember the club almost going out of business in the early 80s. Bolton fans are almost certainly thinking much the same just now, so thinking it can never happen again or that a club just has to sell one player to avoid financial disaster is just wishful thinking. 

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Wasn't it Forest at the start of the season were going to walk the league with the big spending and extravagant loans, remember many saying they are doing a Wolves, but hang on they finished below us.

As for selling Neves, that's fine if you end up with a Neves and not some waste of money on a huge salary

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1 hour ago, sh1t_ref_again said:

Wasn't it Forest at the start of the season were going to walk the league with the big spending and extravagant loans, remember many saying they are doing a Wolves, but hang on they finished below us.

As for selling Neves, that's fine if you end up with a Neves and not some waste of money on a huge salary

Yeah, Neves was a bit of a unique player.  It wasn’t a normal risky purchase...he should’ve gone to a much bigger club.  Wolves knew (because of Mendez) that he would sell for for than €13m!!  

 

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3 hours ago, Davefevs said:

You sell Neves 😂

Others have already covered it but their policy was a curious mix of clever, gambling, unique and ethically questionable- the agent thing ethically dicy, the FFP gambling.

Sell Neves, one of Costa and Cavaleiro- maybe both but definitely at least one. Ruddy and Bennett would both attract interest, both signed on frees but pure profit. Some loanees would also have left.

They could've met FFP and still had a solid side after sales and some lower cost Mendes clients- think their big problem would have been:

FOSUN- would they have wanted a couple of years of consolidation or at least one year of transition at this level before going again? Doubt it!

Mendes- some very high end clients would he have retained interest in the Championship this season?

Nuno- Valencia and Porto his prior 2 sides. La Liga and CL-would he have been happy to stick with it?

I think FFP would've been obtainable, retention of their structure, ownership less clear.

Edited by Mr Popodopolous
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i Really despair, we are making such good progress, and yet so many want to risk it all with one massive gamble. SL calls the shots, it ain’t going to happen. Once you have millions to spare, try it, either a quick route to promotion, or a painful descent to L1 for a few years.

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Forest tried to do exactly that. Not sure how they got on in the end, can't quite make them out clearly from where we are way up the table.

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18 hours ago, Moments of Pleasure said:

With any luck, they'll be struggling in the league then, like Burnley (but minus the recovery). Fingers crossed 

They will challenge top 6 again.

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There is a shady undercurrent which sits uneasy with me. There were similar mutterings a few years back with Watford's owners and their special "loan" system.

Playing in the top leagues and competing in European competition in Spain and Portugal has nothing on playing second tier football in Wolverhampton. It must be the beaches and/or the climate that does it. Perhaps its the lovely local dialect or the Brew Xl.

All I would say is that money talks.

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35 minutes ago, Swede said:

There is a shady undercurrent which sits uneasy with me. There were similar mutterings a few years back with Watford's owners and their special "loan" system.

Playing in the top leagues and competing in European competition in Spain and Portugal has nothing on playing second tier football in Wolverhampton. It must be the beaches and/or the climate that does it. Perhaps its the lovely local dialect or the Brew Xl.

All I would say is that money talks.

It was legal, and broke no rules.

I know what you mean, but is it clever and creative or is it slippery- albeit within the rules- that is the question.

Had they stayed down and faced a couple of years of stagnation or rebuilding, funny feeling that Neves- plus more importantly Mendes, Nuno and perhaps FOSUN wouldn't have stuck around. FFP or a mediocre season would have been the least of their worries had that occurred!

Mendes, Nuno- plus above all FOSUN- strike me as people in a hurry.

Edited by Mr Popodopolous

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On 19/05/2019 at 10:16, sh1t_ref_again said:

The OP has conveniently not mentioned what happens if the gamble does not come off 

What are you trying to say? There is no gamble. It always works 100% of the time!!! Stop being so negative. Typical OTIBer. This club is going nowhere! 

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On 19/05/2019 at 10:16, sh1t_ref_again said:

The OP has conveniently not mentioned what happens if the gamble does not come off 

You become Leeds United, and spend 16 seasons outside the top flight, before triumphantly returning via the play-offs in 2018/19. This is still a thing, right?

Edited by Curr Avon

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What isit with all those banging on about selling our best players??? I take it your on about Flint, Bryan, Reid, and Kelly? For the fee’s we received we’d of been mad to turn them down, we’ve improved on last season, apart from Reid’s goals I’d say we upgraded on Flint and Bryan with Webster and DaSilva, and as for whinging about Kelly give them a chance to replace him ffs.

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12 hours ago, Swede said:

There is a shady undercurrent which sits uneasy with me. There were similar mutterings a few years back with Watford's owners and their special "loan" system.

Playing in the top leagues and competing in European competition in Spain and Portugal has nothing on playing second tier football in Wolverhampton. It must be the beaches and/or the climate that does it. Perhaps its the lovely local dialect or the Brew Xl.

All I would say is that money talks.

It's flirting dangerously with the edges of a conflict of interest the influence of Jorge Mendes, but then you could probably say similar about the relationship between Lee and Gary Johnson and ours with Cheltenham and now Torquay in turn, so it's difficult.

Edited by bcfctim

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5 hours ago, BCFC11 said:

What isit with all those banging on about selling our best players??? I take it your on about Flint, Bryan, Reid, and Kelly? For the fee’s we received we’d of been mad to turn them down, we’ve improved on last season, apart from Reid’s goals I’d say we upgraded on Flint and Bryan with Webster and DaSilva, and as for whinging about Kelly give them a chance to replace him ffs.

Upgraded on Flint. Althopugh Webster may well cost more he has a higher market value and I think we will sell him this summer too.

Dasilva isn't an upgrade though because he isn't ours, and there's no guarantee he's coming back.

I fancy Bobby Reid was a one off season.

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