Opinions on Chelsea's current and former loanees

[FriendlyChels]

Hi all, I support Chelsea and have been tracking our young players for years, and ever since Tammy Abraham arrived you seem to the be the destination for a lot of our best young talent. So I wanted to ask your opinions on them:

 

Firstly, Tammy Abraham. Despite his outstanding goalscoring record, there's a lot of Chelsea fans who have been telling me that he's overrated, a "tap-in" merchant as you might call it. One comment said "Tammy isn’t prem standard. Too weak, zero dribbling ability, poor movement/game intelligence and can’t score outside the box. Yes he is good off the shoulder and is a poacher but that doesn’t make him prem standard." Do you agree with this? Apparently a lot of the goals he scores are tap-ins that anyone could score as in the 2016-17 season your club's attack was great and gave Tammy great service. Is this true and is Tammy overrated and a Championship player at best? Or is he destined for much greater things and can he significantly improve?

 

Secondly, Kasey Palmer. A few years ago he along with Lewis Baker, Dominic Solanke and Isaiah Brown seemed to be very talented young players. For me, given his loan to Huddersfield last season I was shocked we loaned him to Blackburn as it seemed a significant step down and a loan to Bristol City, an up and coming club made far more sense. Would you like to see him return? I seem to remember seeing somewhere he didn't play very many minutes, was this due to poor quality or managerial preference for a different system or player?

 

Thirdly, Jay DaSilva. I have been tracking this guy for years, I think he's outstanding. He's very small, but defensively and offensively he's rock solid, this is what I've seen. Has he performed well this season? I seem to remember seeing the fact that he's replaced Lloyd Kelly in the team, this seems quite remarkable given the fact (from what I know) Lloyd Kelly was (as he may be moving to Bournemouth, somehow for a significantly large fee) your best young player and DaSilva was only a loanee. Has he been outstanding, I remember Charlton manager Lee Bowyer when he was on loan there claiming that DaSilva is better than Ashley Cole was at his age. Is this true? I know he's got an option to buy for you, which is awful from Chelsea and makes no sense given how good this guy is, obvious it's not certain and unfortunately I do hope that he rejects you in order to allow the possibility for him to play for us in the future. If you do sign him though, you'll make a huge profit in a few seasons time if you sell him.

 

Thank you for your time.

[JBFC II]

Tammy- A good hold up player who has far more to his game than just being a decent finisher. In fact, I'd say his finishing was one of his weaker points, he had little composure when he was with us but his movement and sense of where the ball was going gave him so many goals. Will he become a top prem player? I'm not sure, but he is certainly someone who with work, could be a very good footballer. 

Palmer - Technically one of the best footballers we've had down here in a long time. Very good on the ball, can pick a pass from out of the blue and has a good shot on him. His problem is often his defensive side. Johnson likes his players to track back and work for the team, palmer doesn't always do that and sometimes goes missing for large spells. He has a lot of potential though but I can see him fading out too often to become a top player. 

DaSilva - An exciting young talent, excellent offensively and solid enough defensively when attacked one on one. Prone to mistakes which is to be expected of someone so young but he makes up for them through moments of quality. Maybe too small to be a left back but as a left wing back I think he'd be top class

[ScottishRed]

To add to this that Kalas bloke is rubbish.........best you let him leave on a free to us, good bench filler but not much more

[RedM]

Oddly you haven’t commented on the best loan we had from you this season, Kalas? For me he madecas much of an impact as Tammy did in our team. 

In order if I could pick them, Kalas/Tammy, DaSilva, Palmer.

Tammy is much, much better than Championship. I think the loan to Swansea wasn’t right for him after he left us and it took him last season to get back on track. Oozes class and we rarely get the chance to have players like him at our disposal. He was very young when we had him on loan, but everyone could tell he was destined for greater things, and I don’t mean Villa.

Kalas as I said has been immense, we had a new signing for his defensive partner and the pair of them just clicked. People would love Kalas back her but also realise that he will probably be out of our reach, infact you or someone might come in for Webster, his partner, as that will probably happen before Kalas returns, sadly

DaSilva took a little while to settle into the team, by that I mean playing regularly. He managed to oust Lloyd Kelly the youngster who we just sold for millions and made the spot his own. The LB slotvwas vacant after we sold Joe Bryan to Fulham at the start of the season. A hard worker and an obvious talent, again people would love to get him here permanently. Especially as with his return and Kelly sold for money we couldn’t turn down ( small change to Chelsea though) we have no one to play there!

Kasey Palmer, for me he seemed to offer so much but it rarely fully clicked for him. He was often the sub who could change a game, the fans loved him and immediately gave him a song, they built him up and he could do no wrong, yet when he started a game instead of being sub it just didn’t happen for him. He seemed to be on a different wVelength from our other players, not vastly superior, just not reading eachers games right. Probably his future is with another team if i’m honest, and no where good enough for Chelsea, at the moment. 

[ScottishRed]

3 minutes ago, RedM said:

Oddly you haven’t commented on the best loan we had from you this season, Kalas? For me he madecas much of an impact as Tammy did in our team. 

In order if I could pick them, Kalas/Tammy, DaSilva, Palmer.

Tammy is much, much better than Championship. I think the loan to Swansea wasn’t right for him after he left us and it took him last season to get back on track. Oozes class and we rarely get the chance to have players like him at our disposal. He was very young when we had him on loan, but everyone could tell he was destined for greater things, and I don’t mean Villa.

Kalas as I said has been immense, we had a new signing for his defensive partner and the pair of them just clicked. People would love Kalas back her but also realise that he will probably be out of our reach, infact you or someone might come in for Webster, his partner, as that will probably happen before Kalas returns, sadly

DaSilva took a little while to settle into the team, by that I mean playing regularly. He managed to oust Lloyd Kelly the youngster who we just sold for millions and made the spot his own. The LB slotvwas vacant after we sold Joe Bryan to Fulham at the start of the season. A hard worker and an obvious talent, again people would love to get him here permanently. Especially as with his return and Kelly sold for money we couldn’t turn down ( small change to Chelsea though) we have no one to play there!

Kasey Palmer, for me he seemed to offer so much but it rarely fully clicked for him. He was often the sub who could change a game, the fans loved him and immediately gave him a song, they built him up and he could do no wrong, yet when he started a game instead of being sub it just didn’t happen for him. He seemed to be on a different wVelength from our other players, not vastly superior, just not reading eachers games right. Probably his future is with another team if i’m honest, and no where good enough for Chelsea, at the moment. 

For me Palmer is a real talent but needs a lot of work - surprising given his time at Chelsea, but if the numbers worked I would take him as he is a game changer.

[FriendlyChels]

Ah yes Kalas! I know he's been rock solid for you this season, but the reason I didn't mention him is because I think his time at Chelsea is coming to an end this summer. I'm friends with a City fan and she was telling me a lot of your fans love him but are worried you won't be able to afford him? Honestly no clue how people can come to that assumption, the club don't seem to value him too highly. I mean despite three great seasons in the Championship, the club keeps loaning him there. This is why I don't think the club values him highly, and I think if you were to sell Kelly, you'd probably be able to afford DaSilva and Kalas from my understanding. I mean didn't you just sell a benchwarmer for 7 figures? He's a fantastic player and was honestly was treated horribly by Mourinho and should have been given a chance in the 2014-15 season, especially after he played well away at Anfield. 

[Lanterne Rouge]

Re. Kalas, I think the OP is tracking the younger loan players and Tomas is 26(?)

[Davefevs]

Tammy - his biggest challenge if he gets minutes at Chelsea is showing (i) that has volume of goals is enough or (ii) if he doesn’t get a glut of goals, that he can contribute to the team.

That may seem a slightly contradictory statement, but his time here and Villa was about goals that takes away any critique of the rest of his game.  Having said that I saw hold up play (at times) that belied his 18/19 years of age.  His movement in the penalty area is pretty decent.  His time at Swansea showed the other side, that he doesn’t contribute so much if not getting goals.  But lets not forget Chelsea create many, many more chances, and better ones than Swansea.

We’ll just gonna have to wait and see.

Dasilva - love him, say no more.  Best touch in our squad bar none.  And he can defend, he might not win many aerial battles, but he positions his body to start his opponent getting a free header.  He uses his body well.  Really hope he signs.  

Palmer - interesting group...Baker, Brown, Solanke.  Ignoring Solanke’s fee, none of this quartet have hit the heights expected of them.  For him to do well, the system has to give him a lot of focus.  With a different striker (than Diedhiou) up top, Palmer in a 4411, could be ideal.  We saw enough evidence in paltry minutes to see how intelligent he is in spotting a pass.  If you extrapolate his minutes to Paterson, you get 13/14 goals and 6/7 assists....and that’s without giving him licence / focus.  I also thought his work rate was fine, and never bought the argument that Pato was a workhorse in comparison.  He’ll find his niche somewhere.

Kalas - beast.  Hope he signs too.

[Yellow&Blue&Red]

Most of what I think has already been said but an extra point on each of Abraham and Dasilva.

Abraham was also brilliant at pressing. As he runs in to close players down he doesn't tend to take the shortest route but curves his run so that the angles of available passes for the defenders changes at the same time as the options narrow. 

Dasilva improves the players around him. He uses his movement to make space for his team mates and the weight and position of his passes give the receiving player extra time.

[1960maaan]

I'd just add, I started having doubts about Tammy mid season only for him to win me over again. Really had a noticeable improvement towards the middle/end of the season. Great record in the Championship, something like 52 in 88 , and for his first season in the Prem in a struggling side, I thought about one in four reasonable. I seem to remember reading Swansea changed their formation after he joined , which didn't suit his game. He needs to be given the chance to fail, with the service he could get at Chelsea , I see him being a success , but a lot will depend on service and what team Chelsea can put out. 

I'd love to keep Kalas and DaSilva , but fear we may miss out. I like Palmer, but the formation needs to suit him, there is a lot about him I like but it be another case of who else we could bring in to get the most out of him.

[Cider red]

Not much to add to the above, Da Silva is quality would love to sign him and Kalas. Palmer very good player but work rate isn't quite there, although could be coached and would be happy if he signed also! 

Tammy, vastly improved since time here, from having seen your striking options, would have scored far more than higuan or that useless Spaniard with hazard, Pedro and William behind him! Shame he probably won't get a fair crack as he is an Andy cole type striker imo. 

[Wade Wilson]

They’re all absolutely god awful and you should shift them out ASAFP for whatever money you can get. We’ll begrudgingly take them if needs be, in the spirit of friendship and all.

[Dastardly and Muttley]

As a return question, @FriendlyChels - any thoughts on possible loans we might get next year, if any? Who’s out there that would make sense for a club like ours?

[cidered abroad]

2 hours ago, FriendlyChels said:

Ah yes Kalas! I know he's been rock solid for you this season, but the reason I didn't mention him is because I think his time at Chelsea is coming to an end this summer. I'm friends with a City fan and she was telling me a lot of your fans love him but are worried you won't be able to afford him? Honestly no clue how people can come to that assumption, the club don't seem to value him too highly. I mean despite three great seasons in the Championship, the club keeps loaning him there. This is why I don't think the club values him highly, and I think if you were to sell Kelly, you'd probably be able to afford DaSilva and Kalas from my understanding. I mean didn't you just sell a benchwarmer for 7 figures? He's a fantastic player and was honestly was treated horribly by Mourinho and should have been given a chance in the 2014-15 season, especially after he played well away at Anfield. 

For Kalas it is not the transfer fee that would be the problem.

It's the weekly wage, salary call it what you will. Even at £25,000 per week, would be our highest. Don't forget that Championship clubs get peanuts from TV (I believe around £3 million per year but someone will correct me if I'm wrong). We average 21,000 (about 15,000 Season tickets) and have a good income from non football.

So assume 18 players first team squad at £25 K p/w. That's £24 million on first team wages alone which would mean big loss each season and the FFP rules allow us £39 million over three years.

You live in a totally different world with TV money around £100 million.

All City fans would drive to Chelsea to bring Tomas Kalas here but if he does sign for us, it will probably mean we economise with the midfield general and striker that we need to push us in to the play offs places.

[FriendlyChels]

``

1 hour ago, Dastardly and Muttley said:

As a return question, @FriendlyChels - any thoughts on possible loans we might get next year, if any? Who’s out there that would make sense for a club like ours?

What positions will you be looking at in the summer?

[FriendlyChels]

A couple of names: 

 

Defence: Trevoh Chalobah, Matt Miazga, Jake Clarke-Salter, Michael Hector, Ethan Ampadu

Midfield: Lewis Baker

Attack: Charly Musonda, Lucas Piazon,  

[The Nest Egg]

1 hour ago, FriendlyChels said:

A couple of names: 

 

Defence: Trevoh Chalobah, Matt Miazga, Jake Clarke-Salter, Michael Hector, Ethan Ampadu

Midfield: Lewis Baker

Attack: Charly Musonda, Lucas Piazon,  

Ethan Ampadu! My kingdom for Ethan Ampadu!

Watched him come through at Exeter and even at 15 you could tell he was destined for great things

[Guest]

Tammy can be a top top striker. He's actually strong for his age. Remember he's only 21. For someone of his height he can run around a lot. Once he gets stronger he can become better in the air. So he can become a target man, as well as someone who can run the channels, drop back and link up with midfield. He is technically very good. Obviously his movement is outstanding, he's as much as a poacher you will get in the box. And his finishing has improved. He gets more power in his shots now, but that will only improve in years to come too. Also he works his socks off. He's potentially the total package.

Dasilva is no way better or even anywhere near as good as Ashley Cole was at that age. Cole was probably close to world class at that age. Was superb for arsenal even at 18. But by 20-21 he was one hell of a player. Jay is outstanding on the ball, is surprisingly strong in the challenge and can even get up well to head it. He's a very good player but is a bit poor defensively at times. To be expected. Also he has a bit of pace but really not close to Ashley Cole in that department either.

Palmer looks unbelievably good at times. What he can do on the ball alone is what makes me think we should get him permanently. His touch, skill and most of all his strength. He has the ability to take a player on without even touching the ball by rolling his man. He did that a couple of times. That's how strong he is and is only 22. Some serious potential there. His through passing is excellent, and really has not suited having Diedhiou ahead of him, or Graham for Blackburn. No wonder he did better with a runner in Wells up top at Huddersfield for him to thread those passes through.

But he is very poor at the defensive side of the game. Which kind of makes all the other stuff almost irrelevant in today's game. He needs to do more in trying to press the opposition, tracking midfielders runs and he needs more and better movement when searching for the ball. The game at this level has moved on from being able to have a lazy number 10. I say lazy, but it might not be that. It can come across as lazy but he does look to be trying but struggling to do what LJ wants off the ball. 

Also I would say Palmer needs to keep it simple more often. Too many tricks. Release the ball early. Choose the right time to keep hold of the ball and to do his tricks that can be effective when done in the right situation.

Kalas. Well at his age there's no way he's improving enough to ever be a Chelsea player. I think he can become a mid to lower prem player. For us he's been superb at this level.

 

[Guest]

8 hours ago, FriendlyChels said:

A couple of names: 

 

Defence: Trevoh Chalobah, Matt Miazga, Jake Clarke-Salter, Michael Hector, Ethan Ampadu

Midfield: Lewis Baker

Attack: Charly Musonda, Lucas Piazon,  

How about Castillo? Seen him play a couple of times left wing back and was absolutely superb. We need 2 left backs so maybe this guy on loan as well as Jay on a perm.

[cidered abroad]

@FriendlyChels

As a small and light hearted diversion to the transfer gossip and for our visitor from Chelsea only.

Which two current Premiership clubs have never won a League natch at Ashton Gate?

[RedRock]

My calls would be:-

Da Silva. Full backs with us have been an issue for sometime. Odd, as Danny Rose, Tavernier and Bryan have variously occupied slots recently. Small in size but big in stature, he’s been decent. Not outstanding, but decent.

Kalas. Not quick, nor a goal scorer. Would say he’s found his level in upper Championship. Solid, dependable, intelligent, consistent 7/10 type player.

Palmer. Cameo. Has the skill-set but application, energy, commitment seems questionable. 

Tammy.  Useful and good athlete. Wouldn’t say a truly natural scorer, but one of those who’d be a nightmare to mark, his positional play being excellent. Could cut it in Premier League, less certain on top 6 though.

 

We’d take both Kalas and Da Silva please and if you could chuck Tammy in that would be great. 

[WolfOfWestStreet]

I find it odd when a player is criticised for being a "tap in merchant", id say that is the highest compliment you could give a striker because it means they score lots of goals. 

As an observer of the prem a goal poacher is exactly what the Chelsea first team are crying out for. 

He's way too good for the championship.

[downendcity]

3 hours ago, cidered abroad said:

@FriendlyChels

As a small and light hearted diversion to the transfer gossip and for our visitor from Chelsea only.

Which two current Premiership clubs have never won a League natch at Ashton Gate?

That's one of the better predictive typos we've had on here.

 

[Mr Popodopolous]

In order of when signed.

Tammy- Was our saviour, some decent contributions in his play goals aside and his goals meant he did great things for us...yet I question his all-round game and similar capabilities. Certainly the higher you go, the more it is needed! Having said that he has only played 3 professional seasons, he has ample time to work on this.

Kalas- Switch some letters around and it should read class. Him and Webster have brought the best out of each other IMO, compliment each other excellently. Really hope we sign him on a free- think he could play lower-middling PL in due course. Was he ever brought with first team contention in mind for yourselves @FriendlyChels because I seem to recall he did very well at Anfield for you the year Liverpool looked nailed on to win the League- should he have had more of a chance or was it a case of putting him in a shop window?

Da Silva- looks excellent. Good on the ball, good going forward- can be a bit weak defensively but he brings a fair bit to the side. Think he is maybe more of a LWB than LB at this stage.

Palmer- Seems impressive technically, like his direct running at people and seem to recall an excellent goal by him...and yet lacking something. Defensively? Think he would dovetail nicely with a more mobile, movement based forward than the one we have generally played as the lone striker. Seems better off the bench to date.

In terms of loanees- good full backs wouldn't go amiss? Reece James I assume wouldn't be available for a club in the Championship this year- is Ola Aina definitely off to Torino or might he be an option? Heard he has done very nicely there and I believe he can play either side, wing back or full back- good, young talented players with versatility are always worth a look.

[Offside]

My views echo lots of what has already been said. 

Tammy - superb for us, and his attitude was excellent as well. It would be interesting to see how he’d perform for a decent Premier league side  

Dasilva - I rate him highly. Quick feet, skilful, good turn of pace. His lack of height means opposing teams try to target him with the high diagonal ball, so sometimes requires cover. I do hope we sign him permanently. 

Kalas - Excellent. He’s been an absolute rock in our defence. I’d be delighted if we signed him. 

Palmer - technically accomplished and creative. Question marks about the defensive side of his game. 

[Davefevs]

7 hours ago, Moor2Sea said:

My calls would be:-

Da Silva. Full backs with us have been an issue for sometime. Odd, as Danny Rose, Tavernier and Bryan have variously occupied slots recently. Small in size but big in stature, he’s been decent. Not outstanding, but decent.

Kalas. Not quick, nor a goal scorer. Would say he’s found his level in upper Championship. Solid, dependable, intelligent, consistent 7/10 type player.

Palmer. Cameo. Has the skill-set but application, energy, commitment seems questionable. 

Tammy.  Useful and good athlete. Wouldn’t say a truly natural scorer, but one of those who’d be a nightmare to mark, his positional play being excellent. Could cut it in Premier League, less certain on top 6 though.

 

We’d take both Kalas and Da Silva please and if you could chuck Tammy in that would be great. 

Nope, not quick....very quick .  It’s because he’s effortless that you’ve not seen how much pace he has.  He’s a bit like VVD in that respect....he glides.

[RedRock]

7 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Nope, not quick....very quick .  It’s because he’s effortless that you’ve not seen how much pace he has.  He’s a bit like VVD in that respect....he glides.

Trust your judgement but I swear I saw get caught a couple of times against a pacy forward. Maybe the tow became unhitched on those two gliding experiences. 

Anyhows, no argument that he’s sound and complements Webster magnificently. 

[archie andrews]

8 hours ago, cidered abroad said:

@FriendlyChels

As a small and light hearted diversion to the transfer gossip and for our visitor from Chelsea only.

Which two current Premiership clubs have never won a League natch at Ashton Gate?

man city and Chelsea...……...

 

do I win a fiver

[cidered abroad]

7 minutes ago, archie andrews said:

man city and Chelsea...……...

 

do I win a fiver

Are you a Chelski Blue?

No, so how long did it take to find the answer and where?

Did you also know that we've never won a league game at Chelsea but about 3,000 years ago, we did beat Man City at Maine Road!

PS. Sorry folks, not trying to break up a good thread. I'm a Cidered not a Robbored.

[FriendlyChels]

On ‎03‎/‎06‎/‎2019 at 07:30, JonDolman said:

How about Castillo? Seen him play a couple of times left wing back and was absolutely superb. We need 2 left backs so maybe this guy on loan as well as Jay on a perm.

Great player, similar quality to Jay in my opinion. Forced himself out of his contract at Chelsea as wasn't happy so would also get him on a free, but worth noting clubs not only domestically but continentally will be looking at it, wouldn't be surprised to see a move to Ajax. But if you move quick could easily happen.