Port Said Red Posted June 9, 2019 Report Share Posted June 9, 2019 23 hours ago, BS4 on Tour... said: Ince started at Swindon as player-coach, then went to MK Dons after leaving Macc - he wasn’t shit at MK - got them promoted and won FL Trophy in his first season there ... I feel like Sol Campbell doing a good job and keeping Macclesfield up, pissed a lot of people off that were waiting for him to fall flat on his arse. The biggest issue top players have starting at the bottom is rarely to do with their ability, colour or anything other than the players they are working with. Bobby Charlton tried to get into management when he retired and when he resigned his first job he said, he couldn’t handle the fact that the players were happy to be “just good enough”. The thing that the top players have that separates them, is the desire to improve and maintain their ability. People like Campbell and Ince had only worked with those sort of players, sometimes it can be hard to accept that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnderMB Posted June 10, 2019 Report Share Posted June 10, 2019 I'm all for it. Literally the only change that has been introduced is to ensure that people from BAME origins are interviewed for the rule, not offered the job. For the record, there aren't many black managers in football right now, but there are a handful of talented black coaches, and this rule change might be enough to force some teams in interviewing them. It's definitely a good thing, and although I don't think it will change much in the short-term, it should provide additional opportunities Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lorenzos Only Goal Posted June 10, 2019 Report Share Posted June 10, 2019 The only positive I can see in this is that it will make no difference until people start doing the training and coaching badges, which has always been the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riaz Posted June 10, 2019 Report Share Posted June 10, 2019 Postive Discrimination, is still discrimination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Peacock Posted June 10, 2019 Report Share Posted June 10, 2019 On 08/06/2019 at 00:46, Bar BS3 said: Depends on the job. Certain roles, an attractive young woman is best. Others a smart middle aged man might be. Others may be more suited to a gay/camp man, others a more butch lady. What job suits a butch lady? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bar BS3 Posted June 10, 2019 Report Share Posted June 10, 2019 8 minutes ago, Drew Peacock said: What job suits a butch lady? Door staff..? Labouring..? I don’t know. There must be plenty of things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Hitler Posted June 10, 2019 Report Share Posted June 10, 2019 Stupid rule. How would you feel attending interview after interview for jobs you aren't going to get whilst knowing that the only reason you are even there is because there is a rule saying that you must be? I had one supplier refuse to tender last time as they thought they were wasting their time; they were quite correct (though I couldn't say that) and were only being invited to tender because we have a rule saying that we have to go through this process even if you know the existing supplier is the best. I felt a bit bad in having wasted their time at the previous tender because I knew that they weren't going to get that either for the same reason. I guarantee that in a couple of years time there will be stories about "I went for interview for forty league manager jobs and never got any of them" from useless managers. For the simple reason that without the rule they wouldn't have been shortlisted in the first place. If Sol Campbell makes a success of Macclesfield (just staying up does not equal success) then he will be offered a bigger job and so on. That is how it works. Unless you're Frank Lampard of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckeyed Posted June 10, 2019 Report Share Posted June 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Eddie Hitler said: I guarantee that in a couple of years time there will be stories about "I went for interview for forty league manager jobs and never got any of them" from useless managers. For the simple reason that without the rule they wouldn't have been shortlisted in the first place. There probably will, but I imagine the counter to that will be plenty of very good BAME coaches/managers coming to the forefront as there is a clear pathway in an industry that has an under proportion. The point of this rule is not to force clubs into hiring BAME staff but to make it the norm and show other potential coaches and managers that it is an option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Hitler Posted June 10, 2019 Report Share Posted June 10, 2019 46 minutes ago, Buckeyed said: There probably will, but I imagine the counter to that will be plenty of very good BAME coaches/managers coming to the forefront as there is a clear pathway in an industry that has an under proportion. The point of this rule is not to force clubs into hiring BAME staff but to make it the norm and show other potential coaches and managers that it is an option. I disagree. I think it's blatant tokenism and if I were a black coach finding out time after time that I had "just been pipped" I would be seriously depressed and jack it in. There already is a clear pathway. People hire coaches upon track record; or sometimes based upon who their father is. I do not believe that a black coach with all the UEFA qualifications can not get a first job somewhere in the league pyramid and push on from there. Look at Martin O'Neill's early managerial career. I would not think for one instant that clubs of the level of Grantham Town or Shepshed Charterhouse would turn down an ex-premiership or championship player for a managerial position because they were black (Nile Rogers and Marlon King excepted). 1987–1989 Grantham Town 1989 Shepshed Charterhouse 1990–1995 Wycombe Wanderers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiddenGem7 Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 The main issue I think is that currently selecting a manager is a confidential process conducted behind closed doors and for good reason - prospective managers don't want the world to know which jobs they haven't got. As an example, when LJ got the job who else was interviewed? We have no idea, and rightly so. Is this rule going to force clubs to reveal all the candidates they interview? And if not, how will it be enforced? how would anyone know if clubs are not interviewing BAME candidates? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 22 hours ago, Eddie Hitler said: I disagree. I think it's blatant tokenism and if I were a black coach finding out time after time that I had "just been pipped" I would be seriously depressed and jack it in. There already is a clear pathway. People hire coaches upon track record; or sometimes based upon who their father is. I do not believe that a black coach with all the UEFA qualifications can not get a first job somewhere in the league pyramid and push on from there. Look at Martin O'Neill's early managerial career. I would not think for one instant that clubs of the level of Grantham Town or Shepshed Charterhouse would turn down an ex-premiership or championship player for a managerial position because they were black (Nile Rogers and Marlon King excepted). 1987–1989 Grantham Town 1989 Shepshed Charterhouse 1990–1995 Wycombe Wanderers I bet he`d look pretty Chic at the interview though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Hitler Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 11 minutes ago, Red Right Hand said: I bet he`d look pretty Chic at the interview though. By the time I had realised the sheer horror of my mistake I rushed back to the thread only to find that the brief edit window had expired. Nile Ranger Not Nile Ranger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sodburyreds Posted June 13, 2019 Report Share Posted June 13, 2019 Some of the comments on here are incredibly short sighted. Comments such as ‘I’d be embarrassed if I was there because of my skin colour’ or ‘if your good enough you’ll get the job’. Completely uninformed comments from I’d imagine, white males who would never experience discrimination and wouldn’t know what it feels like in that situation. Despite vast improvements, There is institutional racism/ discrimination in pretty much every workplace and football is no different. Unfortunately as most of us on here don’t experience that it can be difficult to appreciate. Yes this system is far from perfect, but the important thing is it’s providing a platform, where clubs have to listen to and provide a chance to BAME applications who may previously of been disheartened from applying what harm can that do?. Surley In turn this can only lead to more ex players taking coaching badges and ultimately in time improving the quality of coaching and management in the game we love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 13, 2019 Report Share Posted June 13, 2019 1 hour ago, Sodburyreds said: Some of the comments on here are incredibly short sighted. Comments such as ‘I’d be embarrassed if I was there because of my skin colour’ or ‘if your good enough you’ll get the job’. Completely uninformed comments from I’d imagine, white males who would never experience discrimination and wouldn’t know what it feels like in that situation. Despite vast improvements, There is institutional racism/ discrimination in pretty much every workplace and football is no different. Unfortunately as most of us on here don’t experience that it can be difficult to appreciate. Yes this system is far from perfect, but the important thing is it’s providing a platform, where clubs have to listen to and provide a chance to BAME applications who may previously of been disheartened from applying what harm can that do?. Surley In turn this can only lead to more ex players taking coaching badges and ultimately in time improving the quality of coaching and management in the game we love. I wouldn't say there is racism in every workplace at all. I am against this Rooney Rule. It hasn't actually helped anything in the NFL and can't see what good it's going to do in English football either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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