Adam Webster - Update - Sold to Brighton

[SuperDziek]

As gutted as I’ll be when Webster leaves, this really is a great example of our business model and what it is trying to achieve. Bring in talent, develop that talent and then sell for a profit. 

Lets face it - £25m or however much it will be is ridiculous money for a championship centre back. That money can then be used to sign, at least, a replacement and hopefully a top drawer striker. Maybe throw in a midfielder as well. When you look at it like that, it would almost be silly to keep him (despite him being brilliant!). 

Pretty sure in the recent past, the club have warned against getting too close (in terms of hero worship) to players nowadays because of the business model - here’s a perfect example!

[Begley]

Visiting Villa fan back again 

It is interesting to see the view on here re Webster. Personally, I don't see selling him lacking any ambition. It would mainly be a business decision and there can also be footballing positives from it too. To realise such huge profit on a single player in the space of 12 months would be really good for BC. Also, and this is my personal opinion having watched the Championship very closely for the last 3 years, is that promotion is gained through having goal scorers as opposed to having Premier League quality defenders. BC failed to make the top 6 last season because you were too light up front. 59 goals scored all season. Top 5 were (93, 78, 73, 87, 82) and Derby in 6th at 69 goals scored. Stoke, who finished 16th conceded 52 goals, fewer goals conceded than Norwich, Baggies, Villa and Derby and only 2 more than Leeds but Sheff Utd had a great defence and only conceded 41 goals. 

If BC has the budget to buy or loan two top class Championship strikers then by all means keep Webster. However, if the budget isn't there to do this I believe it would show ambition to cash in on Webster and invest in some strikers that will move you up from the 59 goals scored into the 75+ goals scored. If you do this you WILL finish top 6.

The reported interest by Man U in McGinn could end our interest in Webster. If it is true then we could use this as leverage to get Tuanzebe from Utd in part exchange and I do expect that we will sign Migs so that would be our 2 1st choice CBs sorted and we have Hause and Chester as backup. The 50m fee sounds ridiculous though, we only paid less than 3m 12 months ago so I can't see that happening. Media click bait does like to quote figures that are way above the reality of what may actually happen. 

[cidercity1987]

Agree with the Villa fan, we were overblessed in budget terms at CB last season. Baker and Wright are more than adequate at this level and if we'd have used the Kalas loan money to instead get a striker in I think we would have finished higher.

Now that we are getting Kalas, if we sell Webster I still see a top striker as more of a need than a top CB.

[Red Army 75]

8 minutes ago, Begley said:

Visiting Villa fan back again 

It is interesting to see the view on here re Webster. Personally, I don't see selling him lacking any ambition. It would mainly be a business decision and there can also be footballing positives from it too. To realise such huge profit on a single player in the space of 12 months would be really good for BC. Also, and this is my personal opinion having watched the Championship very closely for the last 3 years, is that promotion is gained through having goal scorers as opposed to having Premier League quality defenders. BC failed to make the top 6 last season because you were too light up front. 59 goals scored all season. Top 5 were (93, 78, 73, 87, 82) and Derby in 6th at 69 goals scored. Stoke, who finished 16th conceded 52 goals, fewer goals conceded than Norwich, Baggies, Villa and Derby and only 2 more than Leeds but Sheff Utd had a great defence and only conceded 41 goals. 

If BC has the budget to buy or loan two top class Championship strikers then by all means keep Webster. However, if the budget isn't there to do this I believe it would show ambition to cash in on Webster and invest in some strikers that will move you up from the 59 goals scored into the 75+ goals scored. If you do this you WILL finish top 6.

The reported interest by Man U in McGinn could end our interest in Webster. If it is true then we could use this as leverage to get Tuanzebe from Utd in part exchange and I do expect that we will sign Migs so that would be our 2 1st choice CBs sorted and we have Hause and Chester as backup. The 50m fee sounds ridiculous though, we only paid less than 3m 12 months ago so I can't see that happening. Media click bait does like to quote figures that are way above the reality of what may actually happen. 

You sure you’re a villa fan. 

[Rudolf Hucker]

All we need is one other Prem club to be interested in signing Webster to secure for us, and him, the best deal. Two bidders will likely inch up the price. 

If I were MA, I’d be on the phone to my counterparts at Southampton, Leicester, Newcastle et all!

[chinapig]

3 minutes ago, Begley said:

Visiting Villa fan back again 

It is interesting to see the view on here re Webster. Personally, I don't see selling him lacking any ambition. It would mainly be a business decision and there can also be footballing positives from it too. To realise such huge profit on a single player in the space of 12 months would be really good for BC. Also, and this is my personal opinion having watched the Championship very closely for the last 3 years, is that promotion is gained through having goal scorers as opposed to having Premier League quality defenders. BC failed to make the top 6 last season because you were too light up front. 59 goals scored all season. Top 5 were (93, 78, 73, 87, 82) and Derby in 6th at 69 goals scored. Stoke, who finished 16th conceded 52 goals, fewer goals conceded than Norwich, Baggies, Villa and Derby and only 2 more than Leeds but Sheff Utd had a great defence and only conceded 41 goals. 

If BC has the budget to buy or loan two top class Championship strikers then by all means keep Webster. However, if the budget isn't there to do this I believe it would show ambition to cash in on Webster and invest in some strikers that will move you up from the 59 goals scored into the 75+ goals scored. If you do this you WILL finish top 6.

The reported interest by Man U in McGinn could end our interest in Webster. If it is true then we could use this as leverage to get Tuanzebe from Utd in part exchange and I do expect that we will sign Migs so that would be our 2 1st choice CBs sorted and we have Hause and Chester as backup. The 50m fee sounds ridiculous though, we only paid less than 3m 12 months ago so I can't see that happening. Media click bait does like to quote figures that are way above the reality of what may actually happen. 

Welcome back. I notice that Tuanzebe has been pressing to know what his future is at Utd. Given that they gave new contracts to Smalling and Jones I would think you have a good chance of getting him, if he is interested.

Clearly Dean Smith badly wants Webster for his footballing skills but if you get Mings as well surely somebody has to go?

I wouldn't entirely discount the McGinn figure either, given Utd's recent record of paying over the odds. I look forward to the response of your more moronic fans if it happens!

[Begley]

1 minute ago, Red Army 75 said:

You sure you’re a villa fan. 

Unfortunately you can't really choose who you support, if I could choose I think I would have taken Arsenal for their football over the last 20 years, imo it was by far the best in English football. Liverpool ain't looking too sloppy these days either. But yes, for my sins I am a Villa supporter. i have to admit I am a happy one at the moment. Yes we will struggle next year, it does appear we are going to spend big this summer so there will be lots of Fulham comparisons. Next May if we finish 17th on Goal Diff I will view that as a really successful season and something to build on. I genuinely believe BC could be in the PL next season but ONLY if you buy some goals. Building a team over time and developing players does not tend to get promotion, you just get a profitable, well managed club that flirts with play-offs every year. To get up you need to take a risk on a striker or get lucky like Norwich, I don't think they even expected Pukki to get the return he got

[Gazred]

12 minutes ago, Begley said:

Visiting Villa fan back again 

It is interesting to see the view on here re Webster. Personally, I don't see selling him lacking any ambition. It would mainly be a business decision and there can also be footballing positives from it too. To realise such huge profit on a single player in the space of 12 months would be really good for BC. Also, and this is my personal opinion having watched the Championship very closely for the last 3 years, is that promotion is gained through having goal scorers as opposed to having Premier League quality defenders. BC failed to make the top 6 last season because you were too light up front. 59 goals scored all season. Top 5 were (93, 78, 73, 87, 82) and Derby in 6th at 69 goals scored. Stoke, who finished 16th conceded 52 goals, fewer goals conceded than Norwich, Baggies, Villa and Derby and only 2 more than Leeds but Sheff Utd had a great defence and only conceded 41 goals. 

If BC has the budget to buy or loan two top class Championship strikers then by all means keep Webster. However, if the budget isn't there to do this I believe it would show ambition to cash in on Webster and invest in some strikers that will move you up from the 59 goals scored into the 75+ goals scored. If you do this you WILL finish top 6.

The reported interest by Man U in McGinn could end our interest in Webster. If it is true then we could use this as leverage to get Tuanzebe from Utd in part exchange and I do expect that we will sign Migs so that would be our 2 1st choice CBs sorted and we have Hause and Chester as backup. The 50m fee sounds ridiculous though, we only paid less than 3m 12 months ago so I can't see that happening. Media click bait does like to quote figures that are way above the reality of what may actually happen. 

If you were to sign him, what price would you be comfortable with? Not necessarily what you think he's worth.

Given our strong selling position, i think he'll go for more than his market value.

Nice post btw.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Begley said:

Unfortunately you can't really choose who you support, if I could choose I think I would have taken Arsenal for their football over the last 20 years, imo it was by far the best in English football. Liverpool ain't looking too sloppy these days either. But yes, for my sins I am a Villa supporter. i have to admit I am a happy one at the moment. Yes we will struggle next year, it does appear we are going to spend big this summer so there will be lots of Fulham comparisons. Next May if we finish 17th on Goal Diff I will view that as a really successful season and something to build on. I genuinely believe BC could be in the PL next season but ONLY if you buy some goals. Building a team over time and developing players does not tend to get promotion, you just get a profitable, well managed club that flirts with play-offs every year. To get up you need to take a risk on a striker or get lucky like Norwich, I don't think they even expected Pukki to get the return he got

You can choose who you support...half of Bristol chose Liverpool

[Begley]

4 minutes ago, chinapig said:

I wouldn't entirely discount the McGinn figure either, given Utd's recent record of paying over the odds. I look forward to the response of your more moronic fans if it happens!

If Villa could get 10m / 15m plus Tuanzebe for McGinn I would bite their arm off. We need a CB more than we need McGinn and Tuanzebe has proven he can do it plus he knows Villa and the players etc. I think every player can be replaced and it is just about making sure you have the right positions filled with good players. Villa's objective next season will be to avoid relegation, so we need a strong defence, a good DM and a good GK. Our survival will come down to our ability to scrape a draw or defend a 1-0 lead against the teams in the lower half of the table. 

[Bristol Oil Services]

1 hour ago, Gazred said:

Be a real shame not to see him in a City shirt again.

 

You have not (yet) absorbed, learned or perfected the new, Bristol Sports principle of "non-attachment" that SL told us to practice, henceforth. Attachment to individual players leads to suffering, because all players will be sold one day, or leave, or lose form, some will even wind up, find themselves (and ask "how did I get here?") in Horfield poor wretches. 

Attachment = suffering. Remember this.

There is enough attachment in football (and therefore suffering) - attachment to clubs, attachment to outcomes/results, attachment to opinions and being right, attachment to "how the game works," attachment to what time second half subs should be introduced, attachment to which train stations we ought to be using before and after home games  - as it is, attachment we can do little about, without adding additional attachment (and so suffering) to players.

So, quit all this sentimentality about young, over-paid, over-sexed, males with no attachment to us - and if I can get over Flinty (sob) going, anyone can - because Webster goes and then in comes another young, over paid and over-sexed male driving a climate denying flash motor that will stop goals going in and bring the ball out from the back like Paolo Maldini even better than the last one (whatever his name was, Webber was it?)

This is the Bristol Sports way. This is the 21st century Bristol City way. You can let go now of your attachment to the old, familiar, pre-SL 20th century Bristol City where a fine player was sold for not quite as much as we could've got and his replacement - and his replacement (and the replacement's replacement's replacement etc etc) - was a bag of sh1te. 

 

[Red Army 75]

1 minute ago, Begley said:

Unfortunately you can't really choose who you support, if I could choose I think I would have taken Arsenal for their football over the last 20 years, imo it was by far the best in English football. Liverpool ain't looking too sloppy these days either. But yes, for my sins I am a Villa supporter. i have to admit I am a happy one at the moment. Yes we will struggle next year, it does appear we are going to spend big this summer so there will be lots of Fulham comparisons. Next May if we finish 17th on Goal Diff I will view that as a really successful season and something to build on. I genuinely believe BC could be in the PL next season but ONLY if you buy some goals. Building a team over time and developing players does not tend to get promotion, you just get a profitable, well managed club that flirts with play-offs every year. To get up you need to take a risk on a striker or get lucky like Norwich, I don't think they even expected Pukki to get the return he got

It was a tongue in cheek comment . Just very refreshing to read some well constructed posts. IMO you will stay up next season . The bottom half of the premiership isn’t that strong. As for us I won’t get carried away . But we are certainly heading in the right direction. Hopefully with Webster still part of it . 

[Mr Popodopolous]

3 hours ago, Robbored said:

LJs record of recruiting  first team players is excellent based on last seasons evidence. Very few of us had heard of Dasilva, Kalas or Webdini for that matter. 

To think that a year ago some posters were panicking at the loss of Bryan, Flint and Reid..............

Kalas had been one of the premier centre backs this level the previous 4 seasons- would have thought most heard of him!

Webster though, what a revelation! Ipswich fan at work told me he was decent but what a breakout year!! Injury doubtless hindered him at Ipswich, perhaps too the more.pragmatic tactics of Mick McCarthy to an extent.

[Begley]

3 minutes ago, Gazred said:

If you were to sign him, what price would you be comfortable with? Not necessarily what you think he's worth.

I would love to sign Webster, I think he is real quality and exactly what Villa need. But considering he has 'only' played Championship level I think the price would be in or about 17m cash plus addons. I would be careful of addons from a BC perspective as these generally relate to winning things and European qualification and I can't see either of these in the next 4 or 5 years. best deal for BC would be a good sell on %

[chinapig]

3 minutes ago, Begley said:

Unfortunately you can't really choose who you support, if I could choose I think I would have taken Arsenal for their football over the last 20 years, imo it was by far the best in English football. Liverpool ain't looking too sloppy these days either. But yes, for my sins I am a Villa supporter. i have to admit I am a happy one at the moment. Yes we will struggle next year, it does appear we are going to spend big this summer so there will be lots of Fulham comparisons. Next May if we finish 17th on Goal Diff I will view that as a really successful season and something to build on. I genuinely believe BC could be in the PL next season but ONLY if you buy some goals. Building a team over time and developing players does not tend to get promotion, you just get a profitable, well managed club that flirts with play-offs every year. To get up you need to take a risk on a striker or get lucky like Norwich, I don't think they even expected Pukki to get the return he got

We certainly need more goals, though history shows that that does not necessarily equate to 20 goal strikers.

Naturally you are happy but are you at all concerned that your ground now belongs to a company that is not part of the Villa group? That is risky, especially if you spend big now but get relegated as that asset is now gone.

[Gillies Downs Leeds]

1 hour ago, Robbored said:

I’m very insular when it comes to City.i take very little in other Championship players unless they have an outstanding game against us.

Szmodics and Bannan - both ball winning and creative midfielders, both have goals in them. I’ve seen Bannan several times but not seen Szmodics on account of the later playing in lower leagues but based on what I’ve read he’s a talented midfielder as is Bannan.

Apart from the level they played at, in what way are they not similar? 

 

 

 

the difference?

Bannan 8 goals in the last 4 seasons, 160 games played in that time. Can't see any comparison at all with Szmodics.

[Begley]

3 minutes ago, Red Army 75 said:

IMO you will stay up next season .

Thanks!

My view next season is that we have to finish ahead of 3 clubs, that's the objective. I can't see anything but Sheff Utd finishing bottom, I suspect Norwich may be next to bottom as Villa appears to be the only promoted club actually giving it a go and trying to buy a team for survival. Newcastle could be in real trouble next season and there are a few weak clubs there so I am hopefully of 17th

[Gazred]

2 minutes ago, Begley said:

I would love to sign Webster, I think he is real quality and exactly what Villa need. But considering he has 'only' played Championship level I think the price would be in or about 17m cash plus addons. I would be careful of addons from a BC perspective as these generally relate to winning things and European qualification and I can't see either of these in the next 4 or 5 years. best deal for BC would be a good sell on %

That's certainly his market value but I'd like to think we could squeeze another 15-20% upfront.

I mentioned addons earlier, things like Prem survival, appearances or even an England call up would all be in our interests but any deal would certainly have to include the almost mandatory these days sell on %.

Nobody here wants to lose him. The only way it would be accepted ( considering it's your detestable lot as well!) is if we get maximum value for him.

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Kalas had been one of the premier centre backs this level the previous 4 seasons- would have thought most heard of him!

Webster though, what a revelation! Ipswich fan at work told hr was decent but what a breakout year!! Injury doubtless hindered him at Ipswich, perhaps too the more.pragmatic tactics of Mick McCarthy to an extent.

It's funny because I saw Webster a few times for Ipswich and I thought he looked phenomenal. Similar to the player we have now. I must have only seen him on a good day, but the quality was so clear to see.

[chinapig]

6 minutes ago, Begley said:

I would love to sign Webster, I think he is real quality and exactly what Villa need. But considering he has 'only' played Championship level I think the price would be in or about 17m cash plus addons. I would be careful of addons from a BC perspective as these generally relate to winning things and European qualification and I can't see either of these in the next 4 or 5 years. best deal for BC would be a good sell on %

You are right about add ons, though Mark Ashton is nobody's mug.

By the by, reportedly, Utd tried to put a clause in the deal for Wan-Bissaka based on them winning the Champions League. For some reason Palace were having none of it. Can't think why.

[Begley]

3 minutes ago, chinapig said:

Naturally you are happy but are you at all concerned that your ground now belongs to a company that is not part of the Villa group?

An interesting debate among Villa fans. At a high level I would prefer if we still owned Villa Park. However, there is no material change. NSWE still own AVFC and Villa Park, nothing has changed there. Also, they are pumping money into the club and have ridiculous levels of wealth so they are not trying to asset strip. They ground was sold for about 57m which is a fraction of what they have already invested and only loose change when u look at the owners individual wealth.

I look at it from the perspective that 12 months ago we were days away from administration, we had no cash and Xia had none to invest. We had just lost to Fulham in the play-offs and were looking like a Bolton or a Portsmouth. We even had to ask BC to change the payment terms of Baker as we needed a few hundred grand to cover expenses (Thank you!). So from where we were anything is better. Then if I look at Villa and see that we are in the PL, spending money and breaking our transfer record I can't really complain. This is probably why many Villa fans are tossers on Twitter. We basically won the Lotto and rather than been humble about it fans elect to rub it in the faces of other fans. No class!

[Kingswoodactor]

Would we take £15 million plus Scott Hogan?

[downendcity]

18 minutes ago, Cardy said:

If I was Kalas & saw us about to sell Webster I’d be having second thoughts. We don’t have to sell & it shows a lack of ambition from a club supposedly now looking to get promoted to the Prem. It’s similar to the Greslish situation - Villa didn’t sell, kept him & now he is worth even more.

If I was Webster & had genuine Prem League ambition then Villa would not be one of the clubs top of my list. They will struggle, likely get relegated & his reputation could be wrecked through no fault of his own.

However £25m+ is an incredible amount of money for a one season centre back with a dodgey injury history. If nothing else it pays for a significant part of the recent redevelopment. Plus I’m sure there is probably an agent behind the scenes pushing for a deal so he can take his greedy cut.

On that basis I think Webster is now a goner which would be a massive loss for us on the pitch. Clearly whether it becomes the right decision to sell him or not will come down to how, when & on who we reinvest the funds.

 

11 minutes ago, Loco Rojo said:

I dont think it would show a lack of ambition (it would if he came out and said he doesnt want to leave but we decided to cash in on him anyway). Face it, if he does leave it'll be because he wants guaranteed PL football and more money (which you cant begrudge him). Plus his agent will be influencing things too. If the club refuse to let him leave we quite possibly end up with an unhappy player and agent stiring up the squad and that could do a lot more damage. 

Nothing to do with lack of ambition if he does go IMO (which I think he will now). The club will have other targets to bring i if he does plus if the reported fee range is true we could end up with c15-20m to reinvest.

Ambition has to be balanced by financial pragmatism for a club like ours and at this level. 

Webster will probably quadruple his salary with a transfer like this as well as picking up a sizeable cut of the transfer fee ( used to be 5% IIRC) and while Villa might not be top of his list of premier league clubs he would choose, in the absence of any other interested clubs they represent his best chance of playing in the prem,  For a young player this might just be too good a chance to turn down.

As @Loco Rojo says,  you also have to factor in the influence of his agent, who is looking at a much bigger pay day by his client moving to Villa, then he would get if Webster gets a new contract from City.

If, as is being suggested on here, the Kalas deal has already been concluded then there is no issue with Webster leaving. Even if Kalas did have second thoughts I would suspect the club would have indicated the player(s) they have lined up as replacements , and as Kalas will know that Webster came in as replacement for Flint he might just be reassured that he's not joining a sinking ship!

 

 

 

[cidercity1987]

1 minute ago, Kingswoodactor said:

Would we take £15 million plus Scott Hogan?

No I wouldnt accept Hogan on a free given his lack of goals lately, injury record and high salary

[Begley]

2 minutes ago, chinapig said:

You are right about add ons, though Mark Ashton is nobody's mug.

By the by, reportedly, Utd tried to put a clause in the deal for Wan-Bissaka based on them winning the Champions League. For some reason Palace were having none of it. Can't think why

Sky is reporting that Utd has a 25% sell on clause (on profit) on Zaha. Arsenal currently looking at him and the price is circa 80m. That would hurt Palace

[downendcity]

55 minutes ago, Rudolf Hucker said:

You’re ‘kin lucky, Dave. 

If all that's posted about you is true, then it's you that's 'kin lucky Rudolph!

[chinapig]

7 minutes ago, Begley said:

An interesting debate among Villa fans. At a high level I would prefer if we still owned Villa Park. However, there is no material change. NSWE still own AVFC and Villa Park, nothing has changed there. Also, they are pumping money into the club and have ridiculous levels of wealth so they are not trying to asset strip. They ground was sold for about 57m which is a fraction of what they have already invested and only loose change when u look at the owners individual wealth.

I look at it from the perspective that 12 months ago we were days away from administration, we had no cash and Xia had none to invest. We had just lost to Fulham in the play-offs and were looking like a Bolton or a Portsmouth. We even had to ask BC to change the payment terms of Baker as we needed a few hundred grand to cover expenses (Thank you!). So from where we were anything is better. Then if I look at Villa and see that we are in the PL, spending money and breaking our transfer record I can't really complain. This is probably why many Villa fans are tossers on Twitter. We basically won the Lotto and rather than been humble about it fans elect to rub it in the faces of other fans. No class!

Fair enough, it just seemed odd that the company is not part of the Villa group.

[Begley]

3 minutes ago, Kingswoodactor said:

Would we take £15 million plus Scott Hogan

If I were u I would prefer Hourihane. 8 goals and 11 assists. A really good pro, no record of injuries and only 28. He is constantly at the top of the assists table in the Championship. Okay, you guys may fell a little peeved off with the pen award but I am sure you could live to forget that if he was scoring goals for you. He has a great left foot and I genuinely believe he would be in the 1st 11 of any Championship.

As for Hogan, I love the type of player he is and he should do better. A good manage and a team that played to Hogan's strengths ie keeping the ball on the ground and playing through the channels and he could be great. Hogan is not going to score in a team that plays long balls. If you were to do a deal I would take Hourihane as a permanent and Hogan as a freebie loan with Villa paying half his wages so there wouldn't be too much risk.

[atyeoboy17]

If Webster does happen to leave, how about Harlee Dean as a replacement, wouldn’t cost the earth, only 27

[downendcity]

6 minutes ago, cidercity1987 said:

No I wouldnt accept Hogan on a free given his lack of goals lately, injury record and high salary

In the not too distant past these would have been the criteria for us signing a player