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England v. USA Matchday Thread


CyderInACan

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12 minutes ago, swampy said:

serious question ..... if the England women played at a competitive level ... would they compete in the Championship?  National League?

They would lose to the local team city are playing this weekend. Not even joking. Wasn’t is the Australian womens team who played an u16 boys team this year and lost like 10-0? 

Obviously I was pro USA but told the misses we were like the Brazilian mens team. They are experts in s***housery anyway. 

Should have been 2-2. How can you have offside with no camera angle in line with the defenders? Goal should have stood. 

Was never a pen though and should have corrected the offside. England were unlucky and the english population should be proud. 

USA been a powerhouse for years but everyone else catching up. The US women(and men) need to start going abroad a bit more of they will end up falling behind 

Edit- The Australian women lost 7-0 to an U15 boys team and the USA women lost to FC Dallas u15 5-2 after the Shebelieves Cup

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1 hour ago, JoeAman08 said:

 

Edit- The Australian women lost 7-0 to an U15 boys team 

And the boys team wasn't even their 1st XI as 3 were on holiday! ?

It was all over the news here at the time, with much embarassment all round from all parties, especially the Boys Teams manager who tried to talk up how good the Australian Womens Team were......

Give it 10 yrs for coaching and sports science to catch up and then it will be much better, but putting garbage like the womens league (W-League) on live TV 3pm Saturday afternoon is just cringeworthy as it is utterly abysmal.

It does the game more harm than good.

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1 hour ago, SX227 said:

And the boys team wasn't even their 1st XI as 3 were on holiday! ?

It was all over the news here at the time, with much embarassment all round from all parties, especially the Boys Teams manager who tried to talk up how good the Australian Womens Team were......

Give it 10 yrs for coaching and sports science to catch up and then it will be much better, but putting garbage like the womens league (W-League) on live TV 3pm Saturday afternoon is just cringeworthy as it is utterly abysmal.

It does the game more harm than good.

They will never do it but think they should make the pitch and goals smaller. I fully expect the game to get better but when that happens what happens with the keepers? They aren’t saving many from 25 yards as it is when there is any kind of force. 

Think they should do this in a lot of women sports. Basketball for example they play on the same size goals as men. You get a handful who can dunk(usually 6’4 or taller) and everyone else fall way short. Lower it to 9 foot and see a bit more action. Not trying to sound misogynistic but physically women usually well short of men. So level the playing field a bit. 

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9 hours ago, keflav said:

Really hope the USA don't win it they are the worst example of cheating, diving, throwing themselves around I've seen in the whole tournament (some will call it gamesmanship, I call it F88king cheating). no doubt a talented team but some of the worst sportsmanship, Morgan a great player but no need to for all her antics...

and as for VAR gonna be 20mins added on to every prem game next season gonna become a yawn fest waiting for every decision to be checked needs to be refined as gonna take the soul out of the game as it is... 

Really? Playing devils advocate but in my eyes England were the worst. The play acting against Scotland in the opening game was laughable. Last night both teams were as bad as each other when it came to going down easily.

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8 hours ago, swampy said:

serious question ..... if the England women played at a competitive level ... would they compete in the Championship?  National League?

Funnily enough, had the same discussion with a mate. Conference, maybe? But the men's game is faster and more physical. It's relatively early days for the women's game at a professional level. Give it ten years... didn't they say that in the USA, there are more female footballers at college?

1 hour ago, RedDave said:

Is it relevant? 

It's a bit "apples and oranges"

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10 hours ago, keflav said:

Really hope the USA don't win it they are the worst example of cheating, diving, throwing themselves around I've seen in the whole tournament (some will call it gamesmanship, I call it F88king cheating). no doubt a talented team but some of the worst sportsmanship, Morgan a great player but no need to for all her antics...

and as for VAR gonna be 20mins added on to every prem game next season gonna become a yawn fest waiting for every decision to be checked needs to be refined as gonna take the soul out of the game as it is... 

Sorry, but that's rubbish. USA managed the game well, and one thing that everyone I know has commented on is the lack of play acting in the women's game. And, indeed, serious fouls.

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1 minute ago, SecretSam said:

Sorry, but that's rubbish. USA managed the game well, and one thing that everyone I know has commented on is the lack of play acting in the women's game. And, indeed, serious fouls.

The level of play acting overall has been very little but last night was taken up a notch, but hey that's just my opinion (still hope USA don't win though ? )  

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1 hour ago, SecretSam said:

Funnily enough, had the same discussion with a mate. Conference, maybe? But the men's game is faster and more physical. It's relatively early days for the women's game at a professional level. Give it ten years... didn't they say that in the USA, there are more female footballers at college?

It's a bit "apples and oranges"

Well respected womens national teams have been hammered by under 15's boys sides and I couldn't see that happening from Toolstation up.

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Honestly, don't understand why people feel the need to compare women's and men's football all the time. They are completely different games. 

Serena Williams is by far the greatest female tennis player of all time, but you don't hear people trying to lessen her achievements just because she'd lose to most professional male players. Because men's and women's tennis are also completely different games. 

Just enjoy both games for what they are. 

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11 million watched England on tv last night.

Hopefully more young females will want to emulate the likes of Lucy Bronze rather than the damaging role models of love Island.

Bristol female football is on the up, as it is nationally and at its peak … Something to celebrate and encourage.

 

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7 hours ago, JoeAman08 said:

 

Think they should do this in a lot of women sports. Basketball for example they play on the same size goals as men. You get a handful who can dunk(usually 6’4 or taller) and everyone else fall way short. Lower it to 9 foot and see a bit more action. Not trying to sound misogynistic but physically women usually well short of men. So level the playing field a bit. 

I wouldn't mind playing basketball

 

11 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

11 million watched England on tv last night.

Hopefully more young females will want to emulate the likes of Lucy Bronze rather than the damaging role models of love Island.

Bristol female football is on the up, as it is nationally and at its peak … Something to celebrate and encourage.

 

If they could emulate a bit of both

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30 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

11 million watched England on tv last night.

Hopefully more young females will want to emulate the likes of Lucy Bronze rather than the damaging role models of love Island.

Bristol female football is on the up, as it is nationally and at its peak … Something to celebrate and encourage.

 

Yes, I would've loved to have been able to play football at school. I did really enjoy hockey but football would've been my first choice if it was available 

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12 hours ago, swampy said:

serious question ..... if the England women played at a competitive level ... would they compete in the Championship?  National League?

The Gas would put double figures on England Women tbf.......probably due to more quality in the fional turd. You would have to go down to Southern League imo before they would be competitive.

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2 hours ago, elhombrecito said:

Honestly, don't understand why people feel the need to compare women's and men's football all the time. They are completely different games. 

Serena Williams is by far the greatest female tennis player of all time, but you don't hear people trying to lessen her achievements just because she'd lose to most professional male players. Because men's and women's tennis are also completely different games. 

Just enjoy both games for what they are. 

It’s nothing more than a discussion point on a football forum tbf.

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Interesting VAR discussions again, offside was technically right by the letter of the law again though it does just kill the celebrations and can understand why people are opposed.

Penalty was a penalty in my eyes. You can say the contact was "minimal" but in that moment at pace any slight contact especially to kicking leg would be enough to prevent you scoring. VAR worked, the ref wouldnt have given it but upon reflection you can see from one of the angles that actually knee against foot and it threw the striker off balance. Is it intentional? Probably not but it's clumsy and a foul doesn't have to be deliberate to be a foul. Also, it doesn't matter if it's only a foul from one camera angle - it means the others are deceptive not that it didnt happen.

The men v women debate gets brought up a lot. It was like Men against boys (women against girls?) in spells, when USA put on the pressure ENG had no composure at all. It was like watching a Prem side against a non-league team in the FA Cup. However, having watched a few of the games, and one game live I would say a lot of the unforced errors of miss placed passes and poor crossing (as in no immediate pressure on the kicker) wouldn't even happen at Toolstation level. That said, watching live the game is played at a quicker pace than you might realise through the TV.

I think most mens teams would beat the women on physicality and athleticism alone, even if the women had better technique with less composure. I also think you see more contrast between the better and worse players within a womens team than you would a mens side.

 

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4 hours ago, keflav said:

The level of play acting overall has been very little but last night was taken up a notch, but hey that's just my opinion (still hope USA don't win though ? )  

I quite agree. I watched the USA v France and noticed the amount of "gamesmanship" going on with the USA team. This included dissent. Some would argue that's tournament football but I must admit that they are taking it to a new level.

I would hate it to become the norm with women's football.

Dissent in all shapes or form whether it be spoken or standing over the ball to prevent a quick free kick blights the men's game and I wish there was the type of "mic'd" refereeing as there is in Rugby and directives in place to clearly punish offenders.

 

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17 minutes ago, MarcusX said:

Interesting VAR discussions again, offside was technically right by the letter of the law again though it does just kill the celebrations and can understand why people are opposed.

Penalty was a penalty in my eyes. You can say the contact was "minimal" but in that moment at pace any slight contact especially to kicking leg would be enough to prevent you scoring. VAR worked, the ref wouldnt have given it but upon reflection you can see from one of the angles that actually knee against foot and it threw the striker off balance. Is it intentional? Probably not but it's clumsy and a foul doesn't have to be deliberate to be a foul. Also, it doesn't matter if it's only a foul from one camera angle - it means the others are deceptive not that it didnt happen.

The men v women debate gets brought up a lot. It was like Men against boys (women against girls?) in spells, when USA put on the pressure ENG had no composure at all. It was like watching a Prem side against a non-league team in the FA Cup. However, having watched a few of the games, and one game live I would say a lot of the unforced errors of miss placed passes and poor crossing (as in no immediate pressure on the kicker) wouldn't even happen at Toolstation level. That said, watching live the game is played at a quicker pace than you might realise through the TV.

I think most mens teams would beat the women on physicality and athleticism alone, even if the women had better technique with less composure. I also think you see more contrast between the better and worse players within a womens team than you would a mens side.

 

As you are mentioning a humble level I played at I would differ in opinion. Many Western league players would make exactly the same errors and worse as Bright and Houghton were. Many Western league players certainly do not possess the same technical skill level. The USA got compact, filled the centre of the pitch and screened passes into zones where they had deliberately created numerical advantage thus picking off the inevitable wayward passes. 

 

 

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19 hours ago, Alan Dicks' Barmy Army said:

Luckily those in charge know the rules, perhaps should educate yourself with the rules 

Perhaps you should learn to construct a sentence properly before being so condescending. I'm well aware of the rules but  i thought that the pen was subjectively soft even from an English perspective. I think that all decisions during the game ,other than goal line tech, should be in the hands of the officials full stop.

You may disagree but it doesn't mean that you have to be a dick or an Alan Dicks about it.

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4 hours ago, Cowshed said:

As you are mentioning a humble level I played at I would differ in opinion. Many Western league players would make exactly the same errors and worse as Bright and Houghton were. Many Western league players certainly do not possess the same technical skill level. The USA got compact, filled the centre of the pitch and screened passes into zones where they had deliberately created numerical advantage thus picking off the inevitable wayward passes. 

 

 

But how many of the women could play with someone in their face to the extent you get in the Toolstation? Not sure when you played or if you watch much of it, but the technical level of players in that league and the Hellenic is generally very good considering the amount of time they have on the ball and some of the pitches they must play upon, so whilst some are still "stoppers" I would argue that the vast majority have all the skills that women players at the WC have, and can use those skills at a faster pace on inferior playing surfaces.

Different sport and I wish people would treat it as such. For as long as the BBC refer to the senior teams in the same sentence then the quality of the womens game will be compared, scrutinised and challenged.

 

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Well, here we are again. Bronze medals are becoming the glittering prize dangled in front of our faces.

A few points from the game: firstly we were beaten by the better side - better athleticism, better composure and better structure (Neville went 4-4-2 for a change). That's not a surprise as they are the top rated side, but we can certainly look to be more on terms with them now. We are not so far behind, and it's interesting to note how bad we feel in not winning, rather than thinking 'we gave it a good go for a lesser team'.

But I feel the big difference between the two nations last night was the pressure: when a side feels anxious the tendency (at any level or gender) is to attempt to hit longer passes that normal, and that normally leads to inaccurate balls, loss of possession and subsequently increased defending. We were guilty of that much more than the previous games; Steph Houghton had a miserable night passing, even before the penalty. Others were less than special too. Despite that, we were in the game right up to the end almost and it was (dare I say) Fine Margins.

So in the cold light of day (defeat) we have to admit we are not quite the best yet, but I am pleased to read on this forum how many people have mentioned how good the women are now, both technically and tactically, compared to the past. In years before, the gaps and deficiencies were easy to spot. They have been addressed, whilst noting there is more to do. The BBC have been trumpeting the huge viewing figures, although they are to be taken in perspective, but are signs that their game is improving. Would you have thought that men would have gathered in the bars to watch in the same spirit as Southgate's side? The girls are proving their mettle and are eminently watchable.

Diving and feigning? It does happen in the women's game but much less commonly. However, it perhaps seems to be increasing - at the top international level, at least. It is a thought that crosses my mind in that: 'Women's football will only be acknowledged fully when it replicates the men's game in all  important aspects - good and bad. Discuss.'

But the bottom line is that we are out in the semi-fnals once more. That star on the shirt will have to wait. Lionesses' Pride? Certainly. Worthy of the event? Yes, unquestionably. A legacy for others to take up? We will see. If you can remember the 2015 Finals in Canada, we have raised the bar. 2023 is on its way...

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13 hours ago, Loon plage said:

But how many of the women could play with someone in their face to the extent you get in the Toolstation?

It'll always be the Great Mills Western League for me! #OldSkool (whatever became of Great Mills - weren't they in what is now Wickes/soon to be the Basketball Arena!?) 

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19 hours ago, Loon plage said:

But how many of the women could play with someone in their face to the extent you get in the Toolstation? 

Some. When I completed my last coaching badge with ex and current pros one of Yeovil's ladies showed in drills and in deliberate stressed practice she could more than cope.

19 hours ago, Loon plage said:

 Not sure when you played or if you watch much of it, but the technical level of players in that league and the Hellenic is generally very good considering the amount of time they have on the ball and some of the pitches they must play upon, 

I still associate with players playing in the too station and higher levels. I would again disagree that the technical level of players at that level is very good. The technical level is relative to its level. The norm is technically very good players play at very good levels.

Not being rude but players at Toolstion level are shall we say frequently less than professional, because they aren't. Not going to out players at clubs but getting mortal is still Friday pre match preparation. Fit? Not really. 

19 hours ago, Loon plage said:

" I would argue that the vast majority have all the skills that women players at the WC have, and can use those skills at a faster pace on inferior playing surfaces.

Having played on the lovely Ironmould lane with its slope and bumps … You don't see wide displays of skill due to the technical level of players. A skill is something that can be performed on demand regardless of pace or surfaces. If you cannot do it, it is not a skill. Do I believe that some, note the use of some England players have the technical ability to turn that into skill on an Ironmould lane yes. 

20 hours ago, Loon plage said:

Different sport and I wish people would treat it as such. For as long as the BBC refer to the senior teams in the same sentence then the quality of the womens game will be compared, scrutinised and challenged.

I treat it as such. I challenge points about comparing it to Western league. 

 

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