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4 minutes ago, Lez said:

Well I think he has been more consistent and is a far better player than Pack. I dont think the number of years is relevant, I would argue the impact they have is more important. Pack has a role to play at the club, but not the undroppable player he seems to be. Excellent league 1 player maybe.

I don’t think number of years has anything to do with it, but you are the one who mentioned that JB had been more consistent over a number of years than MP, which is quite simply not true. 

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29 minutes ago, Harry said:

Pack made 1 major error today which led to a near goal - 1st half when he gave it away when we were on the attack. 

That aside, we didn’t see much of the ball so didn’t see much of Marlon. However, I’ll bet you find he attempted more forward passes than anyone else. 

I’d like to ask, for all those who give Pack a knock today, can you please tell me what contribution Brownhill gave to this game? 

The same contribution pack gave in the last ten games.... Nowt!!

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The problem today was neither Pack nor Brownhill but the tactics.

Both are gonna look like absolute shite playing in a 2 against one of the most intensive teams in the league. Especially Pack when he is not exactly blessed for pace.

Judge them on their performances throughout the season when used better tactically and not just in this match.

Hung out to dry really today.

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Need him in a '3' IMO.

I mean at this level, vs increasingly tactically sophisticated sides the 4-2-3-1 with Pack and Brownhill puts that bit too much strain on them IMO. Aware Palmer or last year Paterson plays as the central player in the '3' but it still leaves us vulnerable centrally, numerically- duels wise I feel.

Leaves us too open defensively, as a team, too- at the very least doesn't protect the defence so well!

In short, Pack may have his shortcomings but our general setup does him- actually a fair few players- no favours at times.

Edited by Mr Popodopolous
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5 minutes ago, Lez said:

Why are you so protective? It is evident in your posts.

Why are you so negative to a very solid and consistent servant for 6 years? 

I’m protective because he’s regularly the scapegoat and 95% of the time it’s unjustified. 

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Just now, Harry said:

Why are you so negative to a very solid and consistent servant for 6 years? 

I’m protective because he’s regularly the scapegoat and 95% of the time it’s unjustified. 

I dont think he is good enough for a side chasing promotion to the premier league.

I dont call that negative I call it realism. 

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38 minutes ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

I think Pack is a very intelligent footballer - at the start of last season, when Weimann was our striker, Pack was threading through superb passes to him as Weimann could read his thoughts (eg Weimann’s goal at Bolton) - when Fammy came back in that all stopped, Fammy just doesn’t have the awareness and movement that Weimann possesses. So with Fammy up front, Pack is looking ineffective because our striker just doesn’t read his intentions ...

Fammy wasn’t at fault for the countless times Pack gave the ball away today, the pass to hunt in the first half which nearly led to a Leeds goal was in particular embarrassing.

He’s been a great servant to the club over the past 6 years and given his all in some difficult times but I’m afraid we’ve moved on as a club. He's too slow for the high tempo nature of the championship and if we want to progress we need to upgrade big time

Edited by JBFC II
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38 minutes ago, Harry said:

Pack made 1 major error today which led to a near goal - 1st half when he gave it away when we were on the attack. 

That aside, we didn’t see much of the ball so didn’t see much of Marlon. However, I’ll bet you find he attempted more forward passes than anyone else. 

I’d like to ask, for all those who give Pack a knock today, can you please tell me what contribution Brownhill gave to this game? 

I think one of the reasons why Pack gets stick is because he’s usually the one that stands out who tries to make things happen, start from the back etc. If he then gets it wrong, it sticks in people’s minds if that makes sense.

Brownhill doesn’t get criticism because people often forget he’s on the pitch. I rate JB but he can go hiding sometimes.

Pack will usually make himself available 95% of the time and that can often be his downfall as he tries to do too much. 

I rate both players but I think we need fresh ideas and competition for places.

 

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8 minutes ago, Lez said:

I dont think he is good enough for a side chasing promotion to the premier league.

I dont call that negative I call it realism. 

Get a  grip.. there is no way we are chasing promotion this season  we need to just stay up.

This is the sort of season where it could seriously go tits up if we arent careful

Edited by AppyDAZE
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6 minutes ago, JBFC II said:

Fammy wasn’t at fault for the countless times Pack gave the ball away today ...

That’s a matter of opinion .... perhaps if Fammy was able to read Pack’s intentions then Marlon wouldn’t have to check back and get into trouble so many times ... Pack didn’t give the ball away as much when Weimann was up front and Fammy was banned ...

Edited by BS4 on Tour...
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1 minute ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

That’s a matter of opinion .... perhaps if Fammy was able to read Pack’s intentions then Marlon wouldn’t have to check back and get into trouble... Pack didn’t give the ball away as much when Weimann was up front and Fammy was banned ...

No he didn’t because Weimann is a totally different type of striker. Fammy isn’t going to run the channels like weimann does and so it’s up to Pack to work out the best way of getting the ball forward successfully.

Sometimes that involves going backwards which is fine but our main playmaker shouldn’t be getting overrun and making as many appalling passes as he did today 

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4 minutes ago, joenaldo said:

Unfortunately continued the form from the back-end of last season.

Rumoured new lad might be the answer - might not!

Marlon has been great last 6 seasons but as many said on OTIB the club has progresses and maybe even beyond MP

One thing we would miss is Marlon's physicality.. For all his flaws he is a unit... we would miss that if he's out of the team

Edited by AppyDAZE
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2 minutes ago, JBFC II said:

No he didn’t because Weimann is a totally different type of striker. Fammy isn’t going to run the channels like weimann does and so it’s up to Pack to work out the best way of getting the ball forward successfully.

Sometimes that involves going backwards which is fine but our main playmaker shouldn’t be getting overrun and making as many appalling passes as he did today 

My mrs was with me today and she has no understanding of football.....that Pack pass straight to the oppo even got her attention and criticism.....some achievement actually.

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6 minutes ago, Lez said:

My mrs was with me today and she has no understanding of football.....that Pack pass straight to the oppo even got her attention and criticism.....some achievement actually.

Yeah, like no pass has ever gone astray in football   seriously

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6 minutes ago, AppyDAZE said:

I think all the Pack bashing is well harsh. it's not the players so much as the set up that's wrong  for me

I think pack has reached his peak, he is definitely trying but brownhill will continue to improve :)

Anyone bashing after today is daft so early on..... we lose next 4 with no sign of improvements tho then bash away

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13 minutes ago, JBFC II said:

No he didn’t because Weimann is a totally different type of striker. Fammy isn’t going to run the channels like weimann does and so it’s up to Pack to work out the best way of getting the ball forward successfully.

Sometimes that involves going backwards which is fine but our main playmaker shouldn’t be getting overrun and making as many appalling passes as he did today 

It's all very well saying it’s up to Pack to “work out the best way of getting the ball forward successfully” - but how does he do that when our main striker doesn’t make intelligent runs, doesn’t run across defenders, doesn’t look to run down the channels, doesn’t look to run off the shoulder of the last defender and can’t win an aerial duel when he is challenged by a defender?!

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1 minute ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

It's all very well saying it’s up to Pack to “work out the best way of getting the ball forward successfully” - but how does he do that when our main striker doesn’t make intelligent runs, doesn’t run across defenders, doesn’t look to run down the channels, doesn’t look to run off the shoulder of the last defender and can’t win an aerial duel when he is challenged by a defender?!

You obviously watched a different game then as fam won most of his aerial duels.

As I said his game isn’t to run off the shoulder of the defender, anybody can see that. He needs a partner alongside him who can make those sort of runs

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9 minutes ago, JBFC II said:

You obviously watched a different game then as fam won most of his aerial duels.

As I said his game isn’t to run off the shoulder of the defender, anybody can see that. He needs a partner alongside him who can make those sort of runs

He won most of his aerial duels? It’s cool that it’s a game of opinions ....

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Just now, BS4 on Tour... said:

He won most of his aerial duels? It’s cool that it’s a game of opinions ....

When he wasn’t being fouled by their centre backs then yes he did, in fact he made a couple of good flick ons making the most of weimanns movement 

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Pack was, as of most of last season shocking, how he is an outomatic pickis beyond me, and even when he is having such a poor game he still will not be substituted,I posted a month ago that we cannot afford to carry Pack for the season as we did last year but nothing seems to change, to see the way that Leeds passed and moved the ball with such accuracy and pace was way beyond what  Pack can do

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