The European Shop

[BobBobSuperBob]

Serious question for those with any understanding of potential implications of Brexit (And how they may effect football and any international transfers) (I have zero)

Please don’t turn this into a political thread / war

Ironically I’ve actually joked about the subject but

 Is there any possibility we are shopping in the European market , while we can ?

Any thoughts ?

[Busterrimes]

Any player that signs this window will be fine. I would suggest that if we have a no deal Brexit then Europeans may require work permits for the January window.

[Bristol Rob]

19 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Serious question for those with any understanding of potential implications of Brexit (And how they may effect football and any international transfers) (I have zero)

Please don’t turn this into a political thread / war

Ironically I’ve actually joked about the subject but

 Is there any possibility we are shopping in the European market , while we can ?

Any thoughts ?

Possibly.

Guess it depends on the rights of immigrant workers post deal/no deal.

Could be a case that for some players, the chance to play in the UK is a more interesting option now as for those who would need international clearance going forward, this might be their only opportunity.

[Busterrimes]

This is the current ruling for work permits for Non EU so I assume post Brexit it will count.

What are the criteria which will be used?

Until 2015, football players needed to have played in at least 75% of their country’s senior international matches over the previous two years to play in the UK. Eligibility for a GBE now depends on a national team’s FIFA ranking, as follows:

Official FIFA Ranking	Required % of international matches in past 2 yrs
FIFA 1-10	30% and above
FIFA 11-20	45% and above
FIFA 21-30	60% and above
FIFA 31-50	75% and above

In the case of players aged 21 or under at the time of application, the period is reduced to one year. The aim is to make it easier for young, outstanding talent to grow their game in the UK.

If a club’s application is rejected, there is an appeals process. The Exceptions Panel is the appeals body which will consider, on a points based system, the player’s experience and value before deciding whether the player can join the club, regardless of their failed application. A stricter assessment of relevant objective criteria will now be applied in an appeal.

[Mr Popodopolous]

You beat me to the punch @Busterrimes

Was about to speculate on work permit requirements but yeah that surely covers it. Guess EU countries if no deal would revert to Rest of Word status (RoI a possible exception).

[Redwhitepurple]

Not at all. It will all be exactley the same. Remember the millenium bug of 1999 2000

[fairweather]

3 minutes ago, Busterrimes said:

This is the current ruling for work permits for Non EU so I assume post Brexit it will count.

What are the criteria which will be used?

Until 2015, football players needed to have played in at least 75% of their country’s senior international matches over the previous two years to play in the UK. Eligibility for a GBE now depends on a national team’s FIFA ranking, as follows:

Official FIFA Ranking	Required % of international matches in past 2 yrs
FIFA 1-10	30% and above
FIFA 11-20	45% and above
FIFA 21-30	60% and above
FIFA 31-50	75% and above

In the case of players aged 21 or under at the time of application, the period is reduced to one year. The aim is to make it easier for young, outstanding talent to grow their game in the UK.

If a club’s application is rejected, there is an appeals process. The Exceptions Panel is the appeals body which will consider, on a points based system, the player’s experience and value before deciding whether the player can join the club, regardless of their failed application. A stricter assessment of relevant objective criteria will now be applied in an appeal.

That would pretty much turn the tap off imho. Fine for Slovenian stars who play regularly and might be of championship level but there are not that many places in the French side.

Is the OP implying that Massengo's value to a prem side, in future years, is now considerably more because he would have a right to remain?

There has always been some kind of notion of  wage level / quota system from those on the brexit side  - maybe that could apply here. Not necessarily a key industry though compared to our Life Science, Banking, Aviation and Automotive industries.  It is very hard not to get political isnt it. ill stop

I do think there might be something in the question though

[BobBobSuperBob]

12 minutes ago, fairweather said:

That would pretty much turn the tap off imho. Fine for Slovenian stars who play regularly and might be of championship level but there are not that many places in the French side.

Is the OP implying that Massengo's value to a prem side, in future years, is now considerably more because he would have a right to remain?

There has always been some kind of notion of  wage level / quota system from those on the brexit side  - maybe that could apply here. Not necessarily a key industry though compared to our Life Science, Banking, Aviation and Automotive industries.  It is very hard not to get political isnt it. ill stop

I do think there might be something in the question though

No Fairweathe

It was a genuine open question from someone with zero knowledge or interest in Brexit at present time 

I was curious and there will be some in here who can throw some light

i literally have no idea whether for any reason - financial / employment regs etc etc could effect the future market and thus is taking an opportunity to utilise the market now

[Busterrimes]

28 minutes ago, fairweather said:

That would pretty much turn the tap off imho. Fine for Slovenian stars who play regularly and might be of championship level but there are not that many places in the French side.

Is the OP implying that Massengo's value to a prem side, in future years, is now considerably more because he would have a right to remain?

There has always been some kind of notion of  wage level / quota system from those on the brexit side  - maybe that could apply here. Not necessarily a key industry though compared to our Life Science, Banking, Aviation and Automotive industries.  It is very hard not to get political isnt it. ill stop

I do think there might be something in the question though

It is possible that the Premier League or FA could request the Home Office relaxes the regulations for EU countries as a special dispensation to football. There is so much money in football I suspect this may happen

[fairweather]

Yeah  - your question is interesting though. I think your "buy now before the window closes" point could be right  - but why change the plan? It seemed like there was a value in Europe plan which LJ didn't like (or we didnt have the scouting for; Engval et al) and it got junked for young UK players and now we have gone back to the idea that value is in Europe. Odd. Maybe the Woodrow / Kent experience have made us pivot again. Then again maybe we are just trying to get the best players and i should go to bed. Does seem like our reach in Europe or budget or contacts are allowing us to go for proper prospects this time around. Some big plays going on

[Busterrimes]

2 minutes ago, fairweather said:

Yeah  - your question is interesting though. I think your "buy now before the window closes" point could be right  - but why change the plan? It seemed like there was a value in Europe plan which LJ didn't like (or we didnt have the scouting for; Engval et al) and it got junked for young UK players and now we have gone back to the idea that value is in Europe. Odd. Maybe the Woodrow / Kent experience have made us pivot again. Then again maybe we are just trying to get the best players and i should go to bed. Does seem like our reach in Europe or budget or contacts are allowing us to go for proper prospects this time around. Some big plays going on

I think it is purely that we can shop at the next level up now. We have proved that we can nurture players and get them to the Premier League so it interests youngsters. Also some the networking Mark Ashton and Lee Johnson are rumoured to have done opens up new avenues. Personally I think ‘the project’ has advanced and we can now get better talents.

Good debate by the way.

[fairweather]

1 minute ago, Busterrimes said:

It is possible that the Premier League or FA could request the Home Office relaxes the regulations for EU countries as a special dispensation to football. There is so much money in football I suspect this may happen

Same for Formula 1 maybe. Maybe academics for universities, or Creative arts...oncology research...Not sure why football would be different to many others

[BobBobSuperBob]

6 minutes ago, fairweather said:

Yeah  - your question is interesting though. I think your "buy now before the window closes" point could be right  - but why change the plan? It seemed like there was a value in Europe plan which LJ didn't like (or we didnt have the scouting for; Engval et al) and it got junked for young UK players and now we have gone back to the idea that value is in Europe. Odd. Maybe the Woodrow / Kent experience have made us pivot again. Then again maybe we are just trying to get the best players and i should go to bed. Does seem like our reach in Europe or budget or contacts are allowing us to go for proper prospects this time around. Some big plays going on

I’m pretty sure ‘value ‘ compared to the English market will be part of their reasoning but interested if we are looking ahead to any possible changes 

[Busterrimes]

2 minutes ago, fairweather said:

Same for Formula 1 maybe. Maybe academics for universities, or Creative arts...oncology research...Not sure why football would be different to many others

Personally I don’t think football should get an exemption I just feel the greed and perceived entitlement of the Premier League will ask for one.

Sciences and medical where we are short should get exemptions

[fairweather]

2 minutes ago, Busterrimes said:

I think it is purely that we can shop at the next level up now. We have proved that we can nurture players and get them to the Premier League so it interests youngsters. Also some the networking Mark Ashton and Lee Johnson are rumoured to have done opens up new avenues. Personally I think ‘the project’ has advanced and we can now get better talents.

Good debate by the way.

I think you are absolutely right. I think the networking helps for loans in terms of trust and also background on players. It allows us to be bolder. The project as the same  principle the tactics change. 

[And Its Smith]

52 minutes ago, Redwhitepurple said:

Not at all. It will all be exactley the same. Remember the millenium bug of 1999 2000

Don’t worry everyone, I will ask.

What about it?

[Davefevs]

41 minutes ago, fairweather said:

Yeah  - your question is interesting though. I think your "buy now before the window closes" point could be right  - but why change the plan? It seemed like there was a value in Europe plan which LJ didn't like (or we didnt have the scouting for; Engval et al) and it got junked for young UK players and now we have gone back to the idea that value is in Europe. Odd. Maybe the Woodrow / Kent experience have made us pivot again. Then again maybe we are just trying to get the best players and i should go to bed. Does seem like our reach in Europe or budget or contacts are allowing us to go for proper prospects this time around. Some big plays going on

I think this window will make or break LJ.  Really pivotal moments leaving up to Thursday imho.

I do worry about giving him £20m.

[bristolcitysweden]

Better buy before Brexit and the introduction of the British Drachma

[city1983]

Would be a bit of a silly & counter intuitive risk IMO.   Once out of the EU there would then be nothing stopping the FA imposing a limit on the nr of foreign  players playing in a game including those from the EU.

[marcofisher]

10 minutes ago, city1983 said:

Would be a bit of a silly & counter intuitive risk IMO.   Once out of the EU there would then be nothing stopping the FA imposing a limit on the nr of foreign  players playing in a game including those from the EU.

Nothing stopping them but they aren't going to do it overnight.

For the record I cannot believe they will put that high restrictions on EU signings, it is in our interests to keep the PL as the highest grossing league in the world. 

[Bristol Rob]

24 minutes ago, marcofisher said:

Nothing stopping them but they aren't going to do it overnight.

For the record I cannot believe they will put that high restrictions on EU signings, it is in our interests to keep the PL as the highest grossing league in the world. 

Won't be our decision I would imagine.

If you let one trade in, but put restrictions on another there might be legal consequences.

[Sir Geoff]

No idea how it will work. You would have to research transfers to / from Norway for a definitive answer. At the moment no one knows the answer as there is no deal in place with Europe. Even if we leave with no deal we will still have to sort out a trade  / movement of migrant workers agreement at some stage in the future

[LondonBristolian]

The honest answer is we just don't know. My best guess is that new EU players will need to follow the work permit rules non-EU players currently do whilst existing EU players will probably be allowed to continue, admin ****-ups aside, but the rules may change if they move clubs. The reality is that "no deal" is an impossible scenario - by which I mean, even if we left without an agreement, there's loads of things we would still need to make deals on in the future. The impact of leaving with what is called "No Deal" in the short-term might be that there are literally no rules or agreements governing EU nationals working overseas (or a whole heap of other things) until actual laws were passed. I'd imagine it would be bad politics for anyone to tell a club they could not keep a particular player so a workaround were found. 

[LondonBristolian]

4 minutes ago, Sir Geoff said:

No idea how it will work. You would have to research transfers to / from Norway for a definitive answer. At the moment no one knows the answer as there is no deal in place with Europe. Even if we leave with no deal we will still have to sort out a trade  / movement of migrant workers agreement at some stage in the future

Even if someone researched transfers to and from Norway, they still would not know. Norway has a trade agreement with the EU that the government don't want to replicate. What, if anything, we agree is likely to be different. 

[LondonBristolian]

7 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

Won't be our decision I would imagine.

If you let one trade in, but put restrictions on another there might be legal consequences.

Indeed. I don't know how WTO Rules work but they are a lot more restrictive than the EU. You certainly can't offer one country a preferential deal over another without the potential of another country lodging an appeal. I don't know if specific industries have the right to appeal too, or if some countries would be motivated to appeal on an industry's behalf. 

[Atyeo's lift]

1 hour ago, bristolcitysweden said:

 

Better buy before Brexit and the introduction of the British Drachma

Edited 1 hour ago by bristolcitysweden

 

Fine remark from a Swede - how's the krona these days?

[bristolcitysweden]

8 minutes ago, Atyeo's lift said:

Fine remark from a Swede - how's the krona these days?

Waiting for company on the 31st of October. 

You are sitting with a golden hand and appoint Johnson...........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

[BS2 Red]

18 hours ago, Redwhitepurple said:

Not at all. It will all be exactley the same. Remember the millenium bug of 1999 2000

I remember it. It ended up not being the problem it could have been because people worked their arses off to fix the problems before they became serious. It wasn’t a non-issue, it was a serious issue that was fixed before it harmed anyone.

It’s pretty hard to link it to football and Brexit as they are completely different things. But if any lessons are to be learned from the Y2K bug then it’s you should listen to experts and take every step you can to mitigate problems before they kick you in the arse.