Jump to content
IGNORED

Ball playing CB from abroad?

spudski

By spudski
in Football Chat

Recommended Posts

INCRED

INCRED

Posted
Posted

Surely as professional footballers the like of Wright, Baker & Kalas two of which play at international level and another who has played in the Prem with Villa are capable of being coached to pass and play to their midfield team mates?

If we now have a far higher calibre of midfielders technically capable of receiving the ball and able to play through from our final third then the coaches and LJ should now be dictating as such during training sessions 

You don’t necessarily need the CBs to bring the ball out, just be a point to pass to and from the midfield to create space and angles for them to pass to other team mates sideways and forwards

If that basic technical ability is not within their skill sets then they shouldn’t be playing at this level

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Davefevs

Davefevs

Posted
Posted
19 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said:

I hope we don't resort to a back 3 too often. It worked well for Cotterill's promotion side because he specifically recruited for the system (we're missing the player for the Ayling role in this current setup). The system works best when at least one defender is a comfortable ball carrier.

It also means if one of Baker/Wright/Kalas get injured or suspended we're very short at CB. A back 3 or 5 also means there's less place in the side for Eliasson who I think needs plenty of game time this season. 

Useful option to have, especially away from home, but unless you recruit specifically for the system - it can be a bit tricky to get right without the correct personnel. 

Agree

13 minutes ago, spudski said:

Only think we went back 3 because of DaSilvas injury and blooding so many new players. Needed 3 experienced heads there.

Agree

4 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Interesting. Gareth Barry? Started off as a CB at Villa. 38 though and obviously very slow. Quite strong though, would be very good on the ball for a CB and decent in the air.

Interesting.  He starred as a Left Sided CB in a 3 alongside Teale and Southgate.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Numero Uno

Numero Uno

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, RedDave said:

Vyner leaving on loan is the most baffling decision of the summer for me. 

You can only assume the lad did not cut the mustard (enough anyway) in pre-season? People call on the club and Manager in particular to be ruthless to get to the next level.......

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Guest

Guest

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Agree

Agree

Interesting.  He starred as a Left Sided CB in a 3 alongside Teale and Southgate.

Yep, and then I think Ehiogu was at some point in there as part of the 3 once Teale moved on. Is Barry's lack of pace a problem? Well he didn't even have pace when he was young did he? I guess playing in a back 3 is different, but maybe that is a plan LJ has.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Davefevs

Davefevs

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, INCRED said:

Surely as professional footballers the like of Wright, Baker & Kalas two of which play at international level and another who has played in the Prem with Villa are capable of being coached to pass and play to their midfield team mates?

If we now have a far higher calibre of midfielders technically capable of receiving the ball and able to play through from our final third then the coaches and LJ should now be dictating as such during training sessions 

You don’t necessarily need the CBs to bring the ball out, just be a point to pass to and from the midfield to create space and angles for them to pass to other team mates sideways and forwards

If that basic technical ability is not within their skill sets then they shouldn’t be playing at this level

They need to take the ball into positions where they have multiple options and passing lanes aren’t cut off.  Wright especially drifts too far toward the touchline, meaning his outball to Pereira / Hunt is easy to block off.  He can then only do 3 things.

1. Back inside to Kalas - momentum lost, but possession retained

2. Look inside to Nagy / Brownhill, but Brum will have squeezed our right side of the pitch

3. Chip a ball forward to Weimann / Afobe - high risk of losing possession 

A68E21D7-5B61-4F66-9407-4A958796AC19.thumb.jpeg.7473c3b37209572ddf68b0a8eb7eca10.jpeg

Baker;s isn’t quite as bad positionally, but similar issues:

7AC30A2D-BFB6-49CD-A0F4-F36EE25A0D51.thumb.jpeg.9460215e70e905176210e8b41a6a95e4.jpeg

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Davefevs

Davefevs

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Yep, and then I think Ehiogu was at some point in there as part of the 3 once Teale moved on. Is Barry's lack of pace a problem? Well he didn't even have pace when he was young did he? I guess playing in a back 3 is different, but maybe that is a plan LJ has.

Actually, yes, think Ehiogu was there before Southgate....my mistake.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
And Its Smith

And Its Smith

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

You can only assume the lad did not cut the mustard (enough anyway) in pre-season? People call on the club and Manager in particular to be ruthless to get to the next level.......

Barely played I believe. It’s a very weird situation. Everything pointed towards him being involved quite a lot this season 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Top Robin

Top Robin

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, The Original OTIB said:

Radio Bristol interview. Asked if he was still in the market for free agents: Coach: In the market for: "A Centre Half that can carry the ball out"

Also mentioned too many balls kicked long from the back.

Err arent they told and trained not to kick long balls from the back.....and if they start doing it during the game it cant be hard to get instructions to them to stop.

Seems strange to me.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
The Original OTIB

The Original OTIB

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Top Robin said:

Err arent they told and trained not to kick long balls from the back.....and if they start doing it during the game it cant be hard to get instructions to them to stop.

Seems strange to me.

That's what we saw & what he said:

Radio Bristol Interview from yesterday: 33' 16":

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p07j3kz2

35' 53" for Transfer Market question re: Free Agents.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
steviestevieneville

steviestevieneville

Posted
Posted
43 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I saw him too, the left sided CB who can play LB drew me to him....but he’s not ball-playing....bit like Baker is how i’d describe him.

Moore’s issue is his defensive abilities.  Ball-playing is tidy enough.

i woke up this morning thinking how could a back 3 work with TM (sad, eh?).

Yesterday, I think we missed our wide CBs being able to pass it.  TK is decent enough, but his central role in the 3 ensured we were never exposed down the middle, it constrained his ability to build attacks on the right side.  In hindsight, could we have gone:

1. Kalas | Wright | Baker

Jutkiewicz would’ve then had a decision on who to play up against, and I don’t think he’d have had much change out of Kalas, so would’ve played predominantly up against Baker, who would’ve liked the challenge.  However can Wright play as the the sweeping CB.  He likes to mark, and he wouldn’t cover Baker as well as Kalas did.  Brum really weren’t a threat down the middle.  That’s a good sign!

2. Kalas | Moore | Baker

Moore wouldn’t be able to come forward with it, but would allow Kalas as above.  The issue for me is Moore’s inexperience and discipline/ skill to cover Baker.

3. Wright | Kalas | Moore

A good option to allow us to progress the ball from our left side....but Jutkiewicz would've just attached himself to Moore...and had a field day.

So, ultimately LJ probably got it right.  I don’t think a back 3 is the long-term plan, but we might see it a bit more than I expected.

Don’t think he’ll go with a back 3 long term either . You have to have ball playing CB’s to play the wider roles. Wright and baker got on my nerves yesterday with poor distribution especially baker first half constantly limping it to afobe . 

I thought of Wilson because he can play left back as full backs  are generally decent on the ball. 

Agree about Taylor Moore , he’s ok on the ball but first and foremost you have to defend and he proved last week that he’s still pretty naive in that department . I’d rather he made his mistakes in league one on loan where they won’t punished as much . Doing it in the championship could destroy his confidence . 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Mad Cyril

Mad Cyril

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, spudski said:

Can anyone else think of a Webster type in the British market at a similar price we paid for him, or up to say £5 million?

 

....and if you can, please dont name him on here... otherwise he will end up at Leeds...

Link to comment
Share on other sites
JoeAman08

JoeAman08

Posted
Posted

Re Vyner, I know it is club first but at the same time got to find a balance. Taylor Moore maybe could not get a better loan than last season but Vyner got the Aberdeen move. So Taylor Moore to work on his game with the first team. Should be plenty of reps for him so up to him to take any chances he gets like possibly Tuesday. 

Vyner probably slightly ahead of Taylor Moore but imo too good a loan to pass up. He had a season of almost pure defending. Now he can link up with a side that will attack a lot more and can focus on that aspect assuming he is at RB. Also could see minutes up there at CB but we will see. So while we’d have slightly better cover if he had stayed, I think it would do his confidence a lot of good if he can thrive up there. 

As for Pack I suggested maybe LJ could be toying with the idea when we had signed  Massengo and heavily linked with Nagy. Got shut down quite a bit at the time and I think with that reaction while he was our player was probably correct. Any talk of that now is just hindsight and probably would not have worked out. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Simon79

Simon79

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, CliftonCliff said:

On the free list, or actually currently already at the club?

The point made about Hegeler in this context is a valid one. I will always feel it's a shame we could not have done more with  him. He'd have been a strong candidate for the job now if he was still around. Wrong place at the wrong time, I suppose.

This got me thinking about other players we've had in the past, who switched between defensive midfield and a cultured CB role - or arguably could have done if called upon. David Rennie and Rob Newman exemplified the type. Cole Skuse could almost certainly have done the job. (I think he may have started out as a CB when young.) 

Here's a thought to add to that, just for fun. Maybe, just maybe, until last Thursday we had someone who might have been able to make that adjustment, but we sold him to Cardiff. That would have been interesting. Had the attributes. Big, strong bloke, decent in the air, liked a tackle, very experienced, good football brain, could pick a pass... Might have given a new lease of life to the later stages of his career; less demanding on the legs, less responsibility resting on the shoulders, and easier to play when the game is laid out in front of you. Wonder if that was ever considered? Academic now, I know, but food for thought. 

But anyway, in the real, here and now world, it simply has to be a case of persevere with Taylor Moore. He's the obvious choice. Will need a lot of support and careful man management but the raw material is there. If not this season then when, ever?

I made the same comment on the Pack to Cardiff topic. Irrelevant now though, but would of been interesting. Cole Skuse would of also been a good shout. COYR 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
BobBobSuperBob

BobBobSuperBob

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Red Exile said:

Something that struck me watching Nagy yesterday was a repost to the oft-quoted repost to questions of how to improve scouting and transfers that 'it's not like Football Manager'.

Until yesterday I only knew Adam Nagy as a player on Football Manager, where he's a very good one, and his stats suggest that he might play exactly as he did yesterday. I've heard LJ talk about Eliason and his crossing in similar terms. Whilst I'm fully aware from experience that managing anything in real life is rather more complex than a game - offering few, if any, opportunities to tear it up and start again - there must be value in trawling the European leagues to find players with the necessary attributes...do we imagine that is currently under way?

That is exactly what we do

 

Potential Players identified by

Recommendation

Stats (Using numerous stats / scouting databases)

Own eyes 

 

If players are recommended or from initial sighting , performance stats will be looked at , and vice versa , if from stats will be looked at on video footage / live 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Go to topic listing

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...