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SStandUp

Josh Brownhill

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Games seem to pass him by. Never really has an impact. Not sure exactly what his role is? 

Compare that to Massengo who made late runs into the box and nearly scored twice off the back of them. 

Are we playing to Brownhills strengths by playing him in that deep CM role? I'm unsure. Either way, he's not offering enough for me, despite being a good player.

Happy for someone enlighten me. 

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He's a very solid central midfield player. Good all rounder, who at just 23, has played almost 200 games at Championship level. That says a lot as the level is fast paced and unforgiving. 

He's a different style to Pack, Nagy or Massengo so difficult to compare them like for like. I would like to see him score more goals though and pop up inside the box.

I too think he's a bit better as a more advanced midfielder - but he's not quite as creative as Palmer so in the current setup probably won't get to play there regularly. I think he might play a bit better if deeper alongside Nagy who will move the ball quicker than Pack. 

Johnson making him captain in games shows that he wants him to take more responsibility this season. 

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I'm sure with the tech now being used to monitor players if this was the case he wouldn't be playing.

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He's a more than decent footballer who was reportedly attracting some PL interest a year or so ago, but perhaps his main value to the team currently is simply that he's a high-energy, box-to-box grafter who gets through a lot of work in a game. 

Somebody has to put a shift in. Palmer, on last season's evidence, could be a luxury player whose presence would require balancing out with a Brownhill (rather like having JET in the side back in the day). The point is perhaps less valid now, as Palmer, I'm delighted to say, has started to look fitter and has pulled his weight more in the early games this season, but nevertheless you do sometimes need a mix of different types in there.

How the arrival on the scene of Massengo ad Nagy alters that remains to be seen...

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Thought v Brum he benefitted from Nagy moving it quickly to him. Good game.

On Saturday I thought he had a tough first half as Cameron outmuscled him every time he tried to break the lines. With the sub at h-t I think he took on responsibility for sitting in and gave a mature performance. 

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18 minutes ago, Bullbag said:

Aah here we go, the new player to belittle now Diedhiou isn't playing.

No not at all. I think he's a good player.. but sometimes struggles to impose himself in games.

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8 minutes ago, RedDave said:

Brownhill’s work goes unnoticed. That’s all. 

I think this is probably the case. But with Korey Smith you would notice his work, with Pack you'd notice his work, with Palmer and Nagy you see how they are having an impact on the game. 

With Browngill i often leave games going, yeh he was solid, but what did he actually do? 

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He was excellent on the right side of midfield in 17/18 I thought.

He's not quite hit those heights in the middle I wouldn't say, but he's still in our first XI when playing three in central midfield for me.

Once all fit and settled, I'd imagine we'll see Nagy, Brownhill and Massengo starting. Smith will challenge for Brownhill's place, as well as being the first reserve for Nagy's. Palmer could play in Massengo's place, but will also compete with Weimann to play further forward. Szmodics/Walsh probably won't get too much game time if all those are fit. One of them could probably go out on loan in Jan if we're in a good place with injuries.

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3 minutes ago, Coxy27 said:

He was excellent on the right side of midfield in 17/18 I thought.

He's not quite hit those heights in the middle I wouldn't say, but he's still in our first XI when playing three in central midfield for me.

Once all fit and settled, I'd imagine we'll see Nagy, Brownhill and Massengo starting. Smith will challenge for Brownhill's place, as well as being the first reserve for Nagy's. Palmer could play in Massengo's place, but will also compete with Weimann to play further forward. Szmodics/Walsh probably won't get too much game time if all those are fit. One of them could probably go out on loan in Jan if we're in a good place with injuries.

Wouldn't disagree with any of that 

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I do have some reservations about him being a jack of all trades and master of none but surely a lot of potential at only 23.

I hope the captaincy was just a token gesture though because surely there is someone more qualified in iur squad?! Why not Kalas?

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Possibly a reflection of a lot of us not yet understanding Lee’s pattern of play and the role players have been asked to deliver. Maybe that includes the players - particularly those in midfield.

I do get he’s a busy bee and closes space down but, like others, still not quite sure what else he brings to the party - although don’t doubt he has a decent skill set.

Don’t think he currently puts in many decisive, hard tackles, doesn’t win many headers, not many thrusting passes, and only has the occasional decent shot. Anyhow, the Captaincy may well be the making off him and may prove a masterstroke from Lee as Captain’s need to impose themselves on the game and lead by example. Needs to get consistent 7’s in the ratings soon.

 

 

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3 minutes ago, mozo said:

I do have some reservations about him being a jack of all trades and master of none but surely a lot of potential at only 23.

I hope the captaincy was just a token gesture though because surely there is someone more qualified in iur squad?! Why not Kalas?

I actually thinks he tries to take games by the scruff of the neck and plays all the roles, but that just means he doesn’t excel at them and just ends up being solid and not spectacular.

i think if he just focussed on one role, he would be far more effective and noticeable.

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12 minutes ago, mozo said:

I do have some reservations about him being a jack of all trades and master of none but surely a lot of potential at only 23.

I hope the captaincy was just a token gesture though because surely there is someone more qualified in iur squad?! Why not Kalas?

Some players don't want it, some feel they need to concentrate on their own game? Personally I like a midfield player to be captain as they can easily connect with all parts of the team. 

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12 minutes ago, mozo said:

I do have some reservations about him being a jack of all trades and master of none but surely a lot of potential at only 23.

I hope the captaincy was just a token gesture though because surely there is someone more qualified in iur squad?! Why not Kalas?

I don’t know anywhere near enough about Brownhill to know whether he should or should not be captain and ditto Kalas but I do share the concern over the jack of all trades aspect. He is a very reliable player who won’t let the team down with whatever he is asked to do. You could play him at DM, CM, box to box or attacking midfield, stick him on the right of midfield or even on the wing or right back and he would not let us down but I do worry that his versatility, particularly in terms of the type of central midfield role he can play, can stop him from focusing on a particular role and doing it really well. I am a big fan of him and think he can become an even more key figure for us than he is already but I’d like him to have a clear role in our system that gets the best of him whereas too often I think his role is tweaked to suit others.

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If we had JD back we could play a wicked diamond with all three of our lovely CMs.

 

Bentley

Pereira Kalas Baker JD

Nagy

Brownhill Massengo

Palmer

Afobe Weimann

 

Edited by Shtanley
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I'd like to see him play further forward.  He has the lungs to get forward and one hell of a shot on him.   I can see him and Massengo swapping in defence/attack with Nagy holding and Palmer No 10.  

The only issue is fitting in Eliasson who I love to see play.   Unless we have a flat back four and a front three of Palmer/Afobe/Eliasson.

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1 hour ago, Shtanley said:

If we had JD back we could play a wicked diamond with all three of our lovely CMs.

 

Bentley

Pereira Kalas Baker JD

Nagy

Brownhill Massengo

Palmer

Afobe Weimann

 

Like the look of that.  

I do like Weimann energy but I'd love to see Semenyo with Afobe up front.   They would absolutely terrorise defences.

On a different tact, would be interesting to see Eliasson in a front two.   He must be the quickest player we have and with Palmer having two up front to play in I'm sure he would get plenty of chances. 

Edited by RedSkin
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1 minute ago, JonDolman said:

I think he is outstanding, and very rarely performs less than a 7 out of 10. Very mature performance from him Saturday. 

Must be a dream to manage, as he'll play anywhere and always give his best - bit like James Miller.  Probably a bit underappreciated as a result.

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I don't think the OP is necessarily "scapegoating" Brownhill, just saying that deep in front of defence isn't particularly the position where we are best using his talents.

He's played far further back than he was at the start of last season. That may change when we get Korey back I suppose.

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Not particularly worried about his form, class is permanent, I think he will flourish with Pack gone and will become the main man  in the middle of the park for us which will eventually lead to a Premiership move for a few quid . He can lead by example  

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11 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

I think he is outstanding, and very rarely performs less than a 7 out of 10. Very mature performance from him Saturday. 

I think that’s the frustration with Josh though. He’s a decent box to box midfielder who you could say is 7/10 every week but he’s not shown that he can really influence games on a regular basis by either getting on the ball or by getting 8-10 goals. He’s good enough for us but if he’s looking to get to the next level he needs to keep improving. 

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47 minutes ago, RedSkin said:

Must be a dream to manage, as he'll play anywhere and always give his best - bit like James Miller.  Probably a bit underappreciated as a result.

Yep. And I see him going on to be a prem player by next season. He should be better than he is now by then too. He works so hard and is comfortable anywhere on the pitch. Prem bosses would love someone like Brownhill in their squad.

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3 hours ago, LondonBristolian said:

I don’t know anywhere near enough about Brownhill to know whether he should or should not be captain and ditto Kalas but I do share the concern over the jack of all trades aspect. He is a very reliable player who won’t let the team down with whatever he is asked to do. You could play him at DM, CM, box to box or attacking midfield, stick him on the right of midfield or even on the wing or right back and he would not let us down but I do worry that his versatility, particularly in terms of the type of central midfield role he can play, can stop him from focusing on a particular role and doing it really well. I am a big fan of him and think he can become an even more key figure for us than he is already but I’d like him to have a clear role in our system that gets the best of him whereas too often I think his role is tweaked to suit others.

I've always rated him. But he doesn't pass as well as pack, or dribble like Palmer, or hassle like Korey, or read the game like Nagy, or move like Massengo.

Not especially strong or fast, nor slow or weak.

He's not outstanding in any area. Just a good standard at everything. His best attributes are work rate and endurance.

3 hours ago, RedEyez said:

Yeah, lets create a new scapegoat.

Lets do it to one of our better players too

Damn, why didn't I think of this?

Got to speak our minds though.

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8 hours ago, SStandUp said:

I think this is probably the case. But with Korey Smith you would notice his work, with Pack you'd notice his work, with Palmer and Nagy you see how they are having an impact on the game. 

With Browngill i often leave games going, yeh he was solid, but what did he actually do? 

Brownhill dose the hard dirty work in the middle that lets the likes of Palmer and Nagy get forward and create with out having to worry what's going on behind them, you are nothing what others are doing thanks to him, I would think he's the first name on the team sheet each game,

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I’ve just put 4 likes onto posters comments.

Josh Brownhill is mint- end of discussion!

We waited until the transfer window closed but both of my boys want his name on their shirts-even after Saturday and super Nagy’s performance.

LJ made him capt for a reason.He can play everywhere in the midfield and can do a job at right back.He takes a great free kick and is the 100 % player we allwant in any team.An even better plus is that it looks in Nagy we have another 100% player alongside him.👏

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That's what Brownhill does. Scores a cracking goal.

He is key in midfield,  in holding the ball  , making the runs and creates chances. 

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Bit of an enigma Brownhill given his game has too often reflected those in whose company he's been tasked to play. He's always been a Taintonesque space filler and that's no bad thing, somebody has to do the negative legwork in the midfield and he does that rather well, if a tad too lateral historically.  Shipping out Pack & Patterson has given him a tad more freedom to play and with the Silky Star Kid alongside he's able to exploit the more positive side to his game.

If the two of them work in cohort alongside KPs creativity and Nagger's nous that'll be one hell of a midfield rollercoaster ride this term. Tonight the midfield was superb and shows what benefit variety brings rather than the identikit troops we've had these past couple of seasons.

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4 minutes ago, BTRFTG said:

Bit of an enigma Brownhill given his game has too often reflected those in whose company he's been tasked to play. He's always been a Taintonesque space filler and that's no bad thing, somebody has to do the negative legwork in the midfield and he does that rather well, if a tad too lateral historically.  Shipping out Pack & Patterson has given him a tad more freedom to play and with the Silky Star Kid alongside he's able to exploit the more positive side to his game.

If the two of them work in cohort alongside KPs creativity and Nagger's nous that'll be one hell of a midfield rollercoaster ride this term. Tonight the midfield was superb and shows what benefit variety brings rather than the identikit troops we've had these past couple of seasons.

Wow.

I understand what you mean, but that is going back a bit.

I am sure most on here will not have a clue what you are talking about.

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Think it is testament to his ability that even though Nagy and Massengo look top-end players at this level Brownhill is seen as an equal to them, we must have one of the best midfields in the league now.

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He's played over 225 games at the age of 23 with around 120 of those in the Championship.

He must be doing something right :yes:

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6 minutes ago, PHILINFRANCE said:

Wow.

I understand what you mean, but that is going back a bit.

I am sure most on here will not have a clue what you are talking about.

I do.

Gow and Tainton could be under threat as the top two City midfield legends if Brownhill, Nagy and Messango continue at this level for the whole season.

Edited by cidered abroad
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Josh is a really good technical player. Someone mentioned his best form for us was on the right of a midfield 4 and I would agree with that, it's probably his best position but obviously doesn't fit into our formation currently. 

The only negative I have with him is his movement off the ball when we have possession is poor. A lot of the time he gives the impression of being busy but if you actually look at the positions he takes up, he's not actually available for a pass as he hides behind defenders. 

The thing that makes Massengo and Nagy look brilliant, and what really emphasises the brilliance of players like Mount coming through is the bravery they show to receive the ball under pressure near their own goal. I felt that a lot of the negative comments aimed at Marlon were actually the fault of players like Brownhill not being available for the pass quick enough if at all. Nagy looks like a significant upgrade on Pack, and Davefevs mentioned that he brought more out of Brownhill recently, so hopefully that's a sign of progress. But Nagy will only be a success for us if his midfield give him options to move the ball, otherwise we fall back into the trap of going long too early.

 

I think Josh could have been a fabulous full back or wingback in a 352, but that ship has sailed. 

 

Solid player though. 

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6 hours ago, Dolman_Stand said:

Think it is testament to his ability that even though Nagy and Massengo look top-end players at this level Brownhill is seen as an equal to them, we must have one of the best midfields in the league now.

I think you're right, and what age are they all? HNM 18, JB 23, KP 23, AN 24. Wowser! 

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9 hours ago, J-mat said:

Josh is a really good technical player. Someone mentioned his best form for us was on the right of a midfield 4 and I would agree with that, it's probably his best position but obviously doesn't fit into our formation currently. 

The only negative I have with him is his movement off the ball when we have possession is poor. A lot of the time he gives the impression of being busy but if you actually look at the positions he takes up, he's not actually available for a pass as he hides behind defenders. 

The thing that makes Massengo and Nagy look brilliant, and what really emphasises the brilliance of players like Mount coming through is the bravery they show to receive the ball under pressure near their own goal. I felt that a lot of the negative comments aimed at Marlon were actually the fault of players like Brownhill not being available for the pass quick enough if at all. Nagy looks like a significant upgrade on Pack, and Davefevs mentioned that he brought more out of Brownhill recently, so hopefully that's a sign of progress. But Nagy will only be a success for us if his midfield give him options to move the ball, otherwise we fall back into the trap of going long too early.

 

I think Josh could have been a fabulous full back or wingback in a 352, but that ship has sailed. 

 

Solid player though. 

Are you really saying Josh lacks bravery? I'm sorry but I don't think we are talking about the same players here.

If his movement off the ball is so poor, that would show in the copious amounts of data we have, yet he is still one of the 1st on the team sheet! 

We are not privy to the instructions he is being given.

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I think in a way Josh always gets overshadowed by O’Dowda. Yes I know they play different positions but they signed within days of eachother,  very similar age, good mates but all the attention is on Irish International CoD and his big move and contract stalling.

I think Brownhill has been advised better and is the more complete professional player, quietly getting on with playing and maturing and has earned the respect of the Captaincy. Brownhill will go on to better things whilst CoD’s options look like they are diminishing. 

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7 hours ago, Up The City! said:

Are you really saying Josh lacks bravery? I'm sorry but I don't think we are talking about the same players here.

If his movement off the ball is so poor, that would show in the copious amounts of data we have, yet he is still one of the 1st on the team sheet! 

We are not privy to the instructions he is being given.

It depends on your limited understanding of the term bravery. He's "brave" in a tackle, but so was Vinny Jones... Hardly the player we need Josh to be.

He's adequate in the championship, his movement is ok. But if we want to retain the ball in the middle of the pitch and play the patterns of play that Lee has talked about then adequate isn't enough.

Bravery in possession is different to bravery out of possession. He needs to make himself available to receive the ball under pressure in his own half more to be the player many on here make him out to be. He isn't anywhere near good enough for the prem currently.

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