robin_unreliant Posted September 1, 2019 Report Share Posted September 1, 2019 I think TM could stay in the side if we bring Williams in and play three at the back. That seems a better way for us to play two strikers and keep some solidity than the 442 we tried yesterday. It looked like our lack of confidence at the back was more about the system than the players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted September 1, 2019 Report Share Posted September 1, 2019 Thinking ahead to Stoke away in a fortnight’s time, and assuming Kalas hasn’t made a miraculous recovery, could we see Williams come back in? Bentley Hunt or Pereira | Moore | Williams | Baker | Rowe Brownhill | Nagy | Massengo Palmer Weimann Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Up The City! Posted September 1, 2019 Report Share Posted September 1, 2019 Clearly has potential but if Kalas was playing Yesterday then we wouldn't have conceded them two goals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
georgebcfc Posted September 1, 2019 Report Share Posted September 1, 2019 9 hours ago, miketh2nd said: I think he isn't good enough to play in a CB pairing of a two yet.... but in a back three he is great and brings it out very well. He will get better with the more games he plays. Agree with this. Having watched him in a 2 vs Leeds and Boro I just don't think he has the experience yet to play in a 2. Too much responsibility in the crucial moments (I.e. The small mistakes in the build up to both goals) and smart strikers like Assombalonga will just sit on him instead of the more experienced Baker as happened yesterday. You have to be exceptional to just come straight in - thinking of Webster last year, and he even had a years experience with Ipswich under his belt. I think as a rookie championship cb he is doing really well but this is a tough league and we need to nurture him - if that means Williams comes in if we are playing 4 at the back then so be it. Otherwise happy for him to carry on gaining experience playing in a 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted September 1, 2019 Report Share Posted September 1, 2019 3 minutes ago, georgebcfc said: Agree with this. Having watched him in a 2 vs Leeds and Boro I just don't think he has the experience yet to play in a 2. Too much responsibility in the crucial moments (I.e. The small mistakes in the build up to both goals) and smart strikers like Assombalonga will just sit on him instead of the more experienced Baker as happened yesterday. You have to be exceptional to just come straight in - thinking of Webster last year, and he even had a years experience with Ipswich under his belt. I think as a rookie championship cb he is doing really well but this is a tough league and we need to nurture him - if that means Williams comes in if we are playing 4 at the back then so be it. Otherwise happy for him to carry on gaining experience playing in a 3. I get the sentiments of this, but.... ....I will reserve judgement on his ability to play in a 4 until I see a better structured 6 in front of him. Most of this season, we’ve forced teams wide, and although it’s left our full-backs / wing-backs exposed (or at least over-worked), it’s meant we’ve been more comfortable centrally. Some of that will of course be because we’ve played a back 3, so I get your point totally. Our midfield passed runners on centrally yesterday at times, and it meant Baker and Moore were stretched. Had we tracked runners or made Boro play wide, we might have been better. Half-time at 1-0, Woodgate said he made a couple of subtle changes....to me that was finding a way to get Clayton on the ball in acres. I’m not skilled enough to understand quite how he did that, but he became the influence, and it allowed their more attacking players to find pockets as Clayton drew out Massengo or Brownhill, it sucked in Palmer or Eliasson to create overloads wide. Had we had a back 3, I don’t think we’d have minded that, but in turn it increased pressure on Moore and Baker. I said last night, it’s no good Eliasson getting 8/10 individually if the team (which is more important) can’t function in a 442 needed to accommodate him. A couple of weeks ago when a few were moaning about Rowe and Hunt, I said that if putting pressure on them individually and them getting 5 or 6/10 means the team function better then that is good management. Its a really fine balance, and I’ve deviated away from Moore. Perhaps you are indeed right, but it’s more about the team functioning better with Moore in a 3, because of the way the whole team is set up. Moore also given a little more license to distribute the ball. Our passing total as a team was way down yesterday!! So, to summarise.....you’ve talked me round!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midred Posted September 1, 2019 Report Share Posted September 1, 2019 As well as Clayton finding acres of space he also became the midfield hitman - as Massengo found out! If only the ref had booked him - he seemed to forget about the offence while the injury/substitution was being dealt with! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 1, 2019 Report Share Posted September 1, 2019 @Davefevs it’s a very good point about Eliasson, and I think he and us are at a real cross roads. LJ went mad on getting wide forward options but actually the squad he has built cannot really accommodate them in a decent system. It’s okay to have wingers and the options for specific games, but the problem is Eliasson has already - probably for some time - outgrown being a squad player to be used in specific instances. I think with Eliasson, it’s going to go the way of Yannick Bolasie. We aren’t going to give him the platform he needs so we should look to sell him to a club who would. For us, selling price I think should be less important than a club which is a good fit for him and has the nerve in the transfer market to get a good deal. The sell on could be worth a lot more than a few quid extra upfront. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted September 1, 2019 Report Share Posted September 1, 2019 3 minutes ago, 29AR said: @Davefevs it’s a very good point about Eliasson, and I think he and us are at a real cross roads. LJ went mad on getting wide forward options but actually the squad he has built cannot really accommodate them in a decent system. It’s okay to have wingers and the options for specific games, but the problem is Eliasson has already - probably for some time - outgrown being a squad player to be used in specific instances. I think with Eliasson, it’s going to go the way of Yannick Bolasie. We aren’t going to give him the platform he needs so we should look to sell him to a club who would. For us, selling price I think should be less important than a club which is a good fit for him and has the nerve in the transfer market to get a good deal. The sell on could be worth a lot more than a few quid extra upfront. I’ve been saying similar all season (I know that’s only a few weeks). A combination of injuries and Webster going has changed our system....and I think it’s going to be really difficult to accommodate Eliasson (or O’Dowda for that matter) in their favoured positions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 1, 2019 Report Share Posted September 1, 2019 5 minutes ago, Davefevs said: I’ve been saying similar all season (I know that’s only a few weeks). A combination of injuries and Webster going has changed our system....and I think it’s going to be really difficult to accommodate Eliasson (or O’Dowda for that matter) in their favoured positions. Indeed. On the one hand it is a fair critique of the transfer window and those in charge of what we are framing that we were trying to build a squad for one system, then ripped it up last minute. On the other hand, the cash we got for Webster and his desire to move - if we take a moment, c£20m - maybe it was less than ideal but we had to. As it happens, I think we have a very good squad for the wingback system we seem to be going on; but I think we got that by luck - then bad luck with injuries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooko Posted September 2, 2019 Report Share Posted September 2, 2019 12 hours ago, Davefevs said: I’ve been saying similar all season (I know that’s only a few weeks). A combination of injuries and Webster going has changed our system....and I think it’s going to be really difficult to accommodate Eliasson (or O’Dowda for that matter) in their favoured positions. Davefevs is right. There will come a point that Eliasson will get fed up not being started more regularly - the lad has huge talent and needs game time. LJ’s current formation is less about wingers and more about strength through the middle using wing backs. This doesn’t bode well for Eliasson. COD has the same predicament. I heard on Saturday that the reason he ain’t signing is all about lack of game time under Johnson and nothing at all to do with money. In 3 full seasons with us, he has started less than a single seasons worth of games. I know he has had injuries, but that stat is quite telling? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted September 2, 2019 Report Share Posted September 2, 2019 7 minutes ago, Brooko said: Davefevs is right. There will come a point that Eliasson will get fed up not being started more regularly - the lad has huge talent and needs game time. LJ’s current formation is less about wingers and more about strength through the middle using wing backs. This doesn’t bode well for Eliasson. COD has the same predicament. I heard on Saturday that the reason he ain’t signing is all about lack of game time under Johnson and nothing at all to do with money. In 3 full seasons with us, he has started less than a single seasons worth of games. I know he has had injuries, but that stat is quite telling? Look at it from LJs perspective - it’s his job to create a team that’s capable of reaching the PL and after the last window he now has built a strong and deep squad. On paper it looks as strong as I can remember. With having a deep squad there will always be players that are unhappy about not getting game time and that may well apply to CoD and to a lesser degree Eliasson but one skill all managers should have is the ability to cope with disgruntled players.They are all club resources after all and LJ uses them in whatever way he feels is most appropriate. If CoD is refusing to sign because of lack game time he is essentially threatening LJ and there’ll only be one winner there. We all get that CoD wants to play regularly to keep his international career going and he may well have to move on to get consistent starts. Personally I’m not bothered whether CoD stays or goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted September 2, 2019 Report Share Posted September 2, 2019 1 hour ago, Robbored said: Look at it from LJs perspective - it’s his job to create a team that’s capable of reaching the PL and after the last window he now has built a strong and deep squad. On paper it looks as strong as I can remember. With having a deep squad there will always be players that are unhappy about not getting game time and that may well apply to CoD and to a lesser degree Eliasson but one skill all managers should have is the ability to cope with disgruntled players.They are all club resources after all and LJ uses them in whatever way he feels is most appropriate. I reckon that Famara will be another who’ll become unhappy (if he isn’t already) having lost his place to Afobe and it wouldn’t surprise me if Semenyo starts against Stoke with Afobe being ineligible for this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Nose Posted September 2, 2019 Report Share Posted September 2, 2019 On 01/09/2019 at 09:19, bcfcredandwhite said: It’s also important to point out that Boro are a good side despite their indifferent start to the season and Assombalonga is a seasoned pro at this level. Moore isn’t the first and won’t be the last who will be undone by them. Agree. And impressed. Very solid and experienced side, they will be there or thereabouts at the end of the season for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcfc01 Posted September 2, 2019 Report Share Posted September 2, 2019 As well as he's done, Moores place in the team will be under threat once Kalas is back and Williams is up to speed. A back three of Kalas, Williams, Baker looks very strong to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooko Posted September 3, 2019 Report Share Posted September 3, 2019 On 31/08/2019 at 14:49, MelksRed said: Hes a young player, learning all of the time....ok he knew nothing of the OG.....and misjudged the header.....he also made very good challenges all over the pitch.....please remain objective and not allow this to become a platform for which to attack him.... Hes learning, he will improve.....and everyone learns from the consequences of their mistakes......... #bepatient Chin up lad.... COYR Nice post Melks. Taylor is potentially another Webster in the making. He’s young and will make mistakes. I worry that LJ will drop him for Williams. I can’t remember the home game two years ago when Taylor lost his man down the left and they scored. He was dropped immediately and hardly featured until he was loaned out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILINFRANCE Posted September 3, 2019 Report Share Posted September 3, 2019 23 minutes ago, Brooko said: Nice post Melks. Taylor is potentially another Webster in the making. He’s young and will make mistakes. I worry that LJ will drop him for Williams. I can’t remember the home game two years ago when Taylor lost his man down the left and they scored. He was dropped immediately and hardly featured until he was loaned out Not only was he dropped, but he was openly criticised by his manager/head coach in subsequent interviews - that must have done his confidence the world of good, and might explain his sorrowful departure from the pitch on Saturday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted September 3, 2019 Admin Report Share Posted September 3, 2019 12 hours ago, bcfc01 said: As well as he's done, Moores place in the team will be under threat once Kalas is back and Williams is up to speed. A back three of Kalas, Williams, Baker looks very strong to me. Baker staying fit will be an achievement in itself, I wouldn't be surprised to see Kalas, Williams and Moore at the back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natchfever Posted September 3, 2019 Report Share Posted September 3, 2019 16 minutes ago, PHILINFRANCE said: Not only was he dropped, but he was openly criticised by his manager/head coach in subsequent interviews - that must have done his confidence the world of good, and might explain his sorrowful departure from the pitch on Saturday. I thought it was terrible at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozo Posted September 21, 2019 Report Share Posted September 21, 2019 So is Taylor Moore now a Championship standard defender? He seems to be playing like one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 21, 2019 Report Share Posted September 21, 2019 11 minutes ago, mozo said: So is Taylor Moore now a Championship standard defender? He seems to be playing like one. Yes he is but he's found his level! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted September 21, 2019 Report Share Posted September 21, 2019 He’s done ever so well since the Leeds game, where I thought he struggled against Bamford. One ever so harsh criticism today. When Ayew went through (Bentley saved), he didn’t get across towards Ayew but continued his run centrally, where he couldn’t make any impact. I’m so pleased he’s doing well. He may not be first choice when Kalas is back, but you’d like to think LJ has seen his improvement and suits our back 4/5 and playing style better than say Wright. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted September 21, 2019 Report Share Posted September 21, 2019 4 minutes ago, Davefevs said: He’s done ever so well since the Leeds game, where I thought he struggled against Bamford. One ever so harsh criticism today. When Ayew went through (Bentley saved), he didn’t get across towards Ayew but continued his run centrally, where he couldn’t make any impact. I’m so pleased he’s doing well. He may not be first choice when Kalas is back, but you’d like to think LJ has seen his improvement and suits our back 4/5 and playing style better than say Wright. Seeing that back on the highlights- see Ashley Williams hitting the accelerator ! He didn’t quite get there , but may have rushed Ayew, and showed a surprising burst of pace ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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