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The absolute state of Italian football


redsince1994

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It's a long time ago now but which Italian pundit referred to Desailly as a 'lazy ******* thick racial term' in 2004?

Only I don't believe they were Italian. Lot closer to home tbh. France? Belgium?

Nah.

Anyone remember Big Ron Atkinson? Little clue, google "Desailly" "Atkinson". I'm not saying he was a racist, but that was pretty damning.

 

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I remember an interview with Sean Wright-Phillips or David James a few years ago when they said it wasn't 25 to 50 people making monkey chants, it's entire stands of people, to change that is very difficult. 

If Italy, Spain and Eastern European countries want to play in European competitions, they have to eradicate this by prosecuting individuals, as they're not doing anything apart from a fine and playing behind closed doors for one match.. 

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9 minutes ago, B1ackbird said:

I remember an interview with Sean Wright-Phillips or David James a few years ago when they said it wasn't 25 to 50 people making monkey chants, it's entire stands of people, to change that is very difficult. 

If Italy, Spain and Eastern European countries want to play in European competitions, they have to eradicate this by prosecuting individuals, as they're not doing anything apart from a fine and playing behind closed doors for one match.. 

What did our FA do for Millwall v Everton? £10,000 fine.

That said I'm sure there were banning orders/prosecutions- as a country we definitely do more but strict liability could have meant partially closure off of the offending section for Millwall say for their next FA Cup home game.

We're better than many and certainly places like this- but let's not pretend there is zero.

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No surprises

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/49734088

Turns out the fans weren't racist enough for sanctions.

:facepalm:

Cagliari have been cleared of racist chanting towards Inter Milan striker Romelu Lukaku in a Serie A match.

Chants were aimed at Lukaku as he was about to take a penalty in a 2-1 victory at the Sardegna Arena.

But according to a sports judge acting on behalf of the league, there was not enough evidence for any sanctions.

The report admitted that chants, shouts and whistles were directed at Lukaku by Cagliari fans, but they were not enough in "size and perception" to bring about any form of punishment against the club and its supporters.

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18 minutes ago, bristolmoose said:

No surprises

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/49734088

Turns out the fans weren't racist enough for sanctions.

:facepalm:

Cagliari have been cleared of racist chanting towards Inter Milan striker Romelu Lukaku in a Serie A match.

Chants were aimed at Lukaku as he was about to take a penalty in a 2-1 victory at the Sardegna Arena.

But according to a sports judge acting on behalf of the league, there was not enough evidence for any sanctions.

The report admitted that chants, shouts and whistles were directed at Lukaku by Cagliari fans, but they were not enough in "size and perception" to bring about any form of punishment against the club and its supporters.

Must be something about them, Cagliari. Mafia? ?

If you care to research, you'll note that Inter had a game behind closed doors for it this year abd a 2nd one in which ultras section shut- linked to Koulibaly.

Millwall were fined £10k for their Everton thing and had an action plan. It doesn't exist here of course.

Mind you Cagliari clearly a recurring theme.

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On 06/09/2019 at 09:51, Northern Red said:

Spain isn't far behind it.

My experience amongst people of my (younger) generation showed the Spanish to be one of the most tolerant and accepting countries in Europe. 

Far right parties such as Vox has seen an upswing in recent years but this follows a similar trend across the whole of Europe.

I would argue that Spain is not as racist as France, Italy or Great Britain. And where it might be prevalent it is certainly low across the younger generations, which is not the case in a lot of European countries. 

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9 hours ago, marcofisher said:

My experience amongst people of my (younger) generation showed the Spanish to be one of the most tolerant and accepting countries in Europe. 

Far right parties such as Vox has seen an upswing in recent years but this follows a similar trend across the whole of Europe.

I would argue that Spain is not as racist as France, Italy or Great Britain. And where it might be prevalent it is certainly low across the younger generations, which is not the case in a lot of European countries. 

Not sure Lewis Hamilton would agree with you.

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11 hours ago, bristolmoose said:

No surprises

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/49734088

Turns out the fans weren't racist enough for sanctions.

:facepalm:

Cagliari have been cleared of racist chanting towards Inter Milan striker Romelu Lukaku in a Serie A match.

Chants were aimed at Lukaku as he was about to take a penalty in a 2-1 victory at the Sardegna Arena.

But according to a sports judge acting on behalf of the league, there was not enough evidence for any sanctions.

The report admitted that chants, shouts and whistles were directed at Lukaku by Cagliari fans, but they were not enough in "size and perception" to bring about any form of punishment against the club and its supporters.

They must try harder ?

 

:dunno:

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This week the Italian press is reporting the arrest of 12 Juventus "fans", many are the 'heads' of the various Ultra groups that follow the club. The arrests are for various offences, some not football related, but the headlines are around the football related ones, principally extortion of free tickets from the club (which they then re-sell - and Italy has even stricter rules on football tickets than we do). They expect these free tickets as a right. 

Amongst the ways they do this is by threatening the club with starting deliberate racist chants, which they and the club know will result in fines, and other penalties. And they can do it. They are incredibly powerful among the supporters groups and can shut down the whole Curva Sud if they want to. 

It's equally prevalent at other clubs: the Lazio ultras have had an ongoing battle with their Chairman for 2-3 years, and have been able to make sure that for whole seasons the Curva Nord is virtually empty. 

Whats making the headlines this week is that Juve are the first club to have actively cooperated with the police, secret filming, providing evidence and so on. And that's no small ask, these guys are dangerous and officials of the club are at risk. There is a guy who was acting as a link between the Ultras and the club who jumped off a bridge a while back, and that case is now being re opened because they think it might not have been suicide. 

It certainly puts our issues with flares, section eighty two, the SLO and so on into perspective!!, 

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The more you travel around Europe and the rest of the world, you soon realise we are the least racist country openly on the planet imo.

When spending time in Italy, it very much reminds me of how it used to be here in the 70s and 80s.

Both it's negatives and positives.

It's like a time warp in many ways.

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On 18/09/2019 at 12:06, spudski said:

The more you travel around Europe and the rest of the world, you soon realise we are the least racist country openly on the planet imo.

Possibly. But certainly no room for complacency. Hate crime has gone up significantly since 2016, and the BBC reporting today that football hate crime is up by 47%. We’ve got a prime minister who’s got a track record of overt racism. And I’m not sure Korey would be feeling quite so positive just now. I think you’re right, but we seem to have started heading back to the 70s ourselves. 

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This could be me adding 2+2 and making 5.

But I remember at the time this happened https://edition.cnn.com/2019/11/04/football/balotelli-racist-chants-football-serie-a-intl-spt/index.html

His own President was not exactly helpful in his comments made after the event

Now this comes up https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/european/mario-balotelli-brescia-racist-abuse-transfer-news-rumours-gossip-serie-a-a9230656.html

Am I seeing something that isn't here when looking at this, but it seems the President wants rid of him?

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On 05/09/2019 at 12:15, Red-Robbo said:

Culture isn't static. It invents itself as time goes on.

Take great British staple Fish & chips. Brought to Victorian London by Sephardic Jews. A mongrelised version of the Matzah fish that Jews have enjoyed for centuries.

More recently, curry has become something of a national cuisine. The stuff most "Indian" restaurants sell is an Anglicised version of Bangladeshi food. 

We've always been a melting pot - and been stronger for it.

Even the great British pub is something that spread nationwide with the 19th Century Irish diaspora. If you read about what taverns were like before then, they had little we would recognise as a modern 'pub'.

 

Of course it isn't static. But the rate of change in the UK is absolutely shocking, all under the guise that more change makes us stronger. Certainly doesn't make my community stronger. 

Nothing is sacred any more. Much is hardly remembered between generations. 

When very little is truly valued or protected, it disappears, never to be seen again.

This applies to language, architecture, food, and many other cultural things. 

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3 hours ago, CotswoldRed said:

When very little is truly valued or protected, it disappears, never to be seen again.

This applies to language, architecture, food, and many other cultural things. 

And morals. The lines between right and wrong are very blurred these days! 

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4 hours ago, CotswoldRed said:

Of course it isn't static. But the rate of change in the UK is absolutely shocking, all under the guise that more change makes us stronger. Certainly doesn't make my community stronger. 

Nothing is sacred any more. Much is hardly remembered between generations. 

When very little is truly valued or protected, it disappears, never to be seen again.

This applies to language, architecture, food, and many other cultural things. 

Who says "more change makes us stronger"?

Change happens, and has always happened. Thinking there was some "golden age" and everything is worse now is the worst type of rose-tinted nostalgia. It has a technical term "social atavism" .

And why did it take you three months to formulate a reply to that post on an old thread?

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