Jump to content
IGNORED

City fans 1-0 West Midlands Police


thatcham red

Recommended Posts

11 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

That is a good point-  career-threatening I don't know- but I certainly wonder whether they would've been leant on to "miss" the actions etc...

Risk of career being stalled perhaps.

Avon and Somerset backed them because they were so strong in their views that what went on that day was wrong and they believed and supported them. A&S were happy for them to go all the way to court if needed because of the events that occurred. WMP not so much for obvious reasons. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well done to those that drove this :clap:

27 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

That is a good point-  career-threatening I don't know- but I certainly wonder whether they would've been leant on to "miss" the actions etc...

Risk of career being stalled perhaps.

What would have been the alternative of course Mr P, ie in telling lies , would have,  if exposed been at best Embarrassing and a serious question of integrity and at worse being convicted for perverting the course of justice

So Heroic for telling the truth -  uhmmmmmmm     No

 

14 minutes ago, Dollymarie said:

Avon and Somerset backed them because they were so strong in their views that what went on that day was wrong and they believed and supported them. A&S were happy for them to go all the way to court if needed because of the events that occurred. WMP not so much for obvious reasons. 

So you are stating Avon & Somerset Police , as an organisation , backed the supporters ?

Really ?

A link or some evidence of this would be great , and I’d be astounded if that was the case

The Force / Organisation ?

or one particular officer telling he truth as Blagdon & Co have suggested ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

So you are stating Avon & Somerset Police , as an organisation , backed the supporters ?

Really ?

A link or some evidence of this would be great , and I’d be astounded if that was the case

The Force / Organisation ?

or one particular officer telling he truth as Blagdon & Co have suggested ?

One officer who was in Birmingham on duty that day gave a statement backing the 10, they work for Avon and Somerset who supported the officers actions and were happy for the officer to go all the way to court if needed. I meant they supported their officer in their belief that WMP were wrong in what they did that day. Hope that clarifies what I meant. :) 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Dollymarie said:

One officer gave a statement backing the 10, they work for Avon and Somerset who supported the officers actions and were happy for the officer to go all the way to court if needed. I meant they supported their officer in their belief that WMP were wrong in what they did that day. Hope that clarifies what I meant. :) 

Yes , so one officer

Avon & Somerset have absolutely zero say in whether that officer or any officer appears in a court 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Yes , so one officer

Avon & Somerset have absolutely zero say in whether that officer or any officer appears in a court 

 

But they could, presumably, have shown solidarity with WMP and not supported their own officer. Be fair.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Yes , so one officer

Avon & Somerset have absolutely zero say in whether that officer or any officer appears in a court 

 

Yes, and that’s what I meant when I said what I said in the first post of mine that you quoted, “A&S backed them,” meaning the officer, not the 10 fans. Hope that clears things up. WMP would have preferred us not to have a serving officer on our side of the court case, and I actually feel that their evidence, given they were independent of any of the 10 fans, was pretty crucial in helping them win the court case. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Leveller said:

But they could, presumably, have shown solidarity with WMP and not supported their own officer. Be fair.

What do you mean ‘not supported’ ?

He or she are clearly a witness and as a Police Officer has made a statement which I assume to be the truth

Thats actually their job and requirement .........

This is actual Law and procedure , and integrity , nothing to do with taking sides or ‘support’ ?

How did they ‘support’ him ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Wonder what a certain poster thinks of it this morning given their stance for the last year or so about it...

Hi @1bristolcity:sub:

I’d say it was a bit more than a ‘stance’ Mr P

Some Of the posts on the subject were beauts 

 

 

@1bristolcity ?

:whistle2:

 

 

 

:laughcont:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

What do you mean ‘not supported’ ?

He or she are clearly a witness and as a Police Officer has made a statement which I assume to be the truth

Thats actually their job and requirement .........

This is actual Law and procedure , and integrity , nothing to do with taking sides or ‘support’ ?

How did they ‘support’ him ?

Are you naive? Usually coppers, stick by eachother. Even when they know they are in the wrong.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well done to all involved. 

Incredible to think that a number of these supporters were sat in a pub, engaging in friendly conversation with Birmingham fans whom they knew from England trips abroad, no trouble was likely, and yet the WMP accused them of being hooligans and a risk!! 

Truly unbelievable and I’m happy for those 10 that got a result. However, another 40 or so didn’t take the case forward due to potential costs if they lost, so a thought to those guys too. But massive well done for the perseverance of the 10 and the SCT support. Big win. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, Robin1988 said:

Funny how they always seem to do that.

Without expanding the scope into policing in general, from what I've read a common occurrence when under IPCC investigation- well dunno if it was trick, loophole or the exact category but under IPCC investigation it would not be uncommon for a police officer to resign or retire. Think that has been tightened up now so an Investigation that is ongoing can continue regardless but doubtless @Fordy62 or @JulieH can clarify on this.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Without expanding the scope into policing in general, from what I've read a common trick when under IPCC investigation- well dunno if it was trick, loophole or the exact category but under IPCC investigation it would not be uncommon for a police officer to resign or retire. Think that has been tightened up now so an Investigation that is ongoing can continue regardless but doubtless @Fordy62 or @JulieH can clarify on this.

I am not completely aware of the exact ruling but I think that a rule has been brought in that if an officer was under ipcc investigation they would not be allowed to retire/ resign until the investigation was complete. I will need to check on that but I am sure that was going to be brought in if not already.

as I understand it there was no ipcc investigation into this incident . I stand to be corrected as I wouldn’t necessarily be told , but the ipcc normally publicise an investigation. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, JulieH said:

I am not completely aware of the exact ruling but I think that a rule has been brought in that if an officer was under ipcc investigation they would not be allowed to retire/ resign until the investigation was complete. I will need to check on that but I am sure that was going to be brought in if not already.

as I understand it there was no ipcc investigation into this incident . I stand to be corrected as I wouldn’t necessarily be told , but the ipcc normally publicise an investigation. 

IPCC I thought had been upgraded to/replaced by the IoPC- but that wasn't clear in my initial post so yeah.

That loophole is ridiculous or was in any case- retire fair enough makes sense but resign surely means they can rejoin again not so long after with a cleanish slate?

Think a referral may have been in order for this personally, but these things don't come cheap I guess. Or deemed to be insufficiently serious?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, JulieH said:

I am not completely aware of the exact ruling but I think that a rule has been brought in that if an officer was under ipcc investigation they would not be allowed to retire/ resign until the investigation was complete. I will need to check on that but I am sure that was going to be brought in if not already.

as I understand it there was no ipcc investigation into this incident . I stand to be corrected as I wouldn’t necessarily be told , but the ipcc normally publicise an investigation. 

As a witness I had two police inspectors interview me about the antics of the WMP. One had a scouse accent and the other a Yorkshire accent.  I assumed they were from IPCC ......was that the wrong assumption?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, Robbored said:

As a witness I had two police inspectors interview me about the antics of the WMP. One had a scouse accent and the other a Yorkshire accent.  I assumed they were from IPCC ......was that the wrong assumption?

My understanding is that the witness statements were taken by officers/ support staff from the wmp legal department . 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 minutes ago, AshtonPark said:

What does this mean though? Compo for the people that were going to go to court?

What have the police actually backed down from, what is the final outcome?

Yes compensation for the 10 that we’re taking them to court in an out of court settlement. 

Stu may be able to add more as to any comment offered 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, JulieH said:

My understanding is that the witness statements were taken by officers/ support staff from the wmp legal department . 

I’m surprised that the WMP (or any police force) are allowed to collect statements for for an investigation into themselves   - surely that’s open to a lack of transparency?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, Robbored said:

I’m surprised that the WMP (or any police force) are allowed to collect statements for for an investigation into themselves   - surely that’s open to a lack of transparency?

It’s what happens with things that aren’t referred to  Iopc, they tend to deal with the more serious stuff, assaults/ criminal offences etc and leave the rest to the local force to deal . 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, compensation for those involved, plus having spoken with them, the complete vindication that they had done nothing wrong.

For the record, WMP will not formally admit liability and, therefore, apologise. They didn't fancy a court case, which would have been public, risky and expensive. 

This was not without financial risk for the claimants either, even with the Club & Trust backing, so the same applies to them. Having been made an offer, there is no guarantee they would have secured a ruling had they pressed ahead with a court case.

The reason the Supporters Club & Trust got involved was to help right the wrong for the claimants, but also try to bring about a change in the way police forces (especially WMP) use these powers in the future. From speaking with Avon & Somerset Police and the FSA, our view is that policing and the use of these powers is changing for the better.

To quote Amanda Jacks:

"It should also be acknowledged that WMP have totally shifted their approach to football policing in recent years and were the first police force in the country to have a Football Policing Independent Advisory Group comprised of supporter reps from clubs across their region."
 
It may not be down to just this incident, however, we believe it played a part.
 
Stu

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...