AshtonPark Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 28 minutes ago, thatcham red said: Yes, compensation for those involved, plus having spoken with them, the complete vindication that they had done nothing wrong. For the record, WMP will not formally admit liability and, therefore, apologise. They didn't fancy a court case, which would have been public, risky and expensive. This was not without financial risk for the claimants either, even with the Club & Trust backing, so the same applies to them. Having been made an offer, there is no guarantee they would have secured a ruling had they pressed ahead with a court case. The reason the Supporters Club & Trust got involved was to help right the wrong for the claimants, but also try to bring about a change in the way police forces (especially WMP) use these powers in the future. From speaking with Avon & Somerset Police and the FSA, our view is that policing and the use of these powers is changing for the better. To quote Amanda Jacks: "It should also be acknowledged that WMP have totally shifted their approach to football policing in recent years and were the first police force in the country to have a Football Policing Independent Advisory Group comprised of supporter reps from clubs across their region." It may not be down to just this incident, however, we believe it played a part. Stu Thanks Stu, do you know what ball park figures have been mentioned for compenstation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 36 minutes ago, thatcham red said: Yes, compensation for those involved, plus having spoken with them, the complete vindication that they had done nothing wrong. For the record, WMP will not formally admit liability and, therefore, apologise. They didn't fancy a court case, which would have been public, risky and expensive. This was not without financial risk for the claimants either, even with the Club & Trust backing, so the same applies to them. Having been made an offer, there is no guarantee they would have secured a ruling had they pressed ahead with a court case. The reason the Supporters Club & Trust got involved was to help right the wrong for the claimants, but also try to bring about a change in the way police forces (especially WMP) use these powers in the future. From speaking with Avon & Somerset Police and the FSA, our view is that policing and the use of these powers is changing for the better. To quote Amanda Jacks: "It should also be acknowledged that WMP have totally shifted their approach to football policing in recent years and were the first police force in the country to have a Football Policing Independent Advisory Group comprised of supporter reps from clubs across their region." It may not be down to just this incident, however, we believe it played a part. Stu Well done Stu and all makes sense By offering an out of court settlement it is quite clear who was wrong Have any of those involved actually made a formal complaint to WMP about the actions of the officers involved , (False Imprisonment as a starter , and a criminal offence) i assume they have ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 53 minutes ago, JulieH said: Yes compensation for the 10 that we’re taking them to court in an out of court settlement. Stu may be able to add more as to any comment offered Can I ask you Julie 1 Were you on duty For this game ? and did you have any direct knowledge of these matters ? ie were you a witness to any degree ? 2 if so , Did you make a statement ? 3 Were you the officer who provided evidence supporting the fans ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulieH Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 5 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said: Can I ask you Julie 1 Were you on duty For this game ? and did you have any direct knowledge of these matters ? ie were you a witness to any degree ? 2 if so , Did you make a statement ? 3 Were you the officer who provided evidence supporting the fans ? Yes, yes and yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 46 minutes ago, JulieH said: It’s what happens with things that aren’t referred to Iopc, they tend to deal with the more serious stuff, assaults/ criminal offences etc and leave the rest to the local force to deal . Was a bit surprised that this wasn't tbh- not least owing to all of the obfuscation, stalling etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 5 minutes ago, JulieH said: Yes, yes and yes Thankyou In that case Good on you As much as that’s the way it should be, it still takes some b**** And it should still be recognised , and You have gone up in my personal estimation Well done Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulieH Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 2 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said: Thankyou In that case Good on you As much as that’s the way it should be , it should still be recognised , and You have gone up in my personal estimation Well done Not sure if that’s a compliment or not, but thank u anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 3 minutes ago, JulieH said: Not sure if that’s a compliment or not, but thank u anyway I understand what you say ! It wasn’t starting from any damning stance , But in terms of trust I’d suggest you’ve done yourself , personally , and A&S , a big professional service Integrity ....nice one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thatcham red Posted September 23, 2019 Author Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 I personally cannot comment on amounts of compensation, as this is confidential. I have not even told the Supporters Club & Trust board. It would be up to the claimants to disclose if they so wished. These were individual claims grouped together to form a civil action, given that they all had a common issue to pursue. I am not aware of any criminal action being brought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galway Red Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 13 minutes ago, JulieH said: Yes, yes and yes Fair play to you, takes a lot of guts to do what you did Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZiderEyed Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 18 minutes ago, JulieH said: Yes, yes and yes Fair play Julie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 22 minutes ago, JulieH said: Yes, yes and yes Fair play for that Julie! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 £2k compensation I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 I see the troll @1bristolcity who was so loud mouthed and damning of our supporters has been sliding around but has lost his voice Maybe he’s looking for his dog , for instructions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CotswoldRed Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 Well done Julie. Imagine what the police could be if they were properly funded and all officers had the same degree of integrity as you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CotswoldRed Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 21 minutes ago, RedDave said: £2k compensation I believe. For what they went through. That barely scratches the surface of it. I don't know the ins and outs and certainly wouldn't criticise their decision, but if it were me, and with the peanuts settlement, I would have laughed at their offer and pressed on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 9 minutes ago, CotswoldRed said: For what they went through. That barely scratches the surface of it. I don't know the ins and outs and certainly wouldn't criticise their decision, but if it were me, and with the peanuts settlement, I would have laughed at their offer and pressed on. Would have been very interesting to see in court, additionally it could have brought about the possibility of setting a legal precedent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDOXO Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 The problem is an out of court settlement may make everyone feel a bit better but is in fact the last resort white wash. You actually need to get in to court to actually change something. Otherwise all this amounts to is a bit of cash that may just cover the expenses of the case! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid in the Riot Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 1 hour ago, AshtonPark said: Thanks Stu, do you know what ball park figures have been mentioned for compenstation? 49 minutes ago, RedDave said: £2k compensation I believe. I saw one of the 10 tweet they'd received £2k on twitter but I understand the amounts varied. All four figures though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 15 minutes ago, REDOXO said: The problem is an out of court settlement may make everyone feel a bit better but is in fact the last resort white wash. You actually need to get in to court to actually change something. Otherwise all this amounts to is a bit of cash that may just cover the expenses of the case! At the same time, I can see why they settled- 4 long years, the cost- the risk of significant costs if it reached court and the risk that it'd be held against if they refused a settlement. However yes, the ultimate way to force change would have been in court- yet there were very good reasons IMO to settle at this time. Also provides a blueprint for fans of other clubs similarly affected in the future. An encouraging Tweet on this note though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CyderInACan Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 20 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: Would have been very interesting to see in court, additionally it could have brought about the possibility of setting a legal precedent. Exactly the point i made earlier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlastonburyRed Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 33 minutes ago, CotswoldRed said: For what they went through. That barely scratches the surface of it. I don't know the ins and outs and certainly wouldn't criticise their decision, but if it were me, and with the peanuts settlement, I would have laughed at their offer and pressed on. Thing is, any court award might not be far in excess of what is offered by way of settlement, whilst the (legal) costs implications of potentially having to fund your side's lawyers and the others', in the event of a loss, can be eye-watering. More than likely that costs figure dwarfs damages, in any event. A lot of competing interests at stake, although having a serving police officer in support of the claim must have made it an incredibly difficult decision as to whether 'stick or twist'. Often though, the spectre of costs can be ruinous to a claim, so fairplay in extracting anything from WMP. Ultimately, if these Claimants have gone about securing, systemic lasting change, then who can put a price on that and that arguably is real-life recompense, in contrast to just (relatively insignificant) pounds in the bank. That's the kind of discussion I would be having with my clients. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted September 23, 2019 Admin Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 May sound odd, but would I be correct in saying all 10 would have to agreed to take the settlement? If say 1 didn't want to would the others had to go to court too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thatcham red Posted September 23, 2019 Author Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 It is definitely all about risk and reward. Some of the potential court costs quoted were eye watering and the individual is personally liable. Refusing an out of court settlement might work against you. A court settlement, if indeed you secure a win, might even be less, and you have all the risk still. The advise was to accept the settlement. In my view, these guys showed there mettle in getting this far. Stu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlastonburyRed Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 8 minutes ago, phantom said: May sound odd, but would I be correct in saying all 10 would have to agreed to take the settlement? If say 1 didn't want to would the others had to go to court too? Straying into the realms of speculation here, but any offer of settlement from WMP would, I imagine, include the caveat that it is in settlement of all the outstanding claims (those 10 supporters from what I have read on here). Nothing stopping a counteroffer, or back 'n' forth, from the supporters' side or, perhaps, individuals leaving the class and seeking to go it alone (quite possibly v risky). Additional reading, for all you diehards, is Part 36 of the Civil Procedure Rules - have fun with that Sounds like our lot got sound advice and acted sensibly upon it. Sadly, we don't live in a perfect world where legal costs are minimal/have the tab picked up from elsewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreedyHarry Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 1 hour ago, JulieH said: Yes, yes and yes Well done. That takes a lot of courage. I wasn't there but thank you for standing up for people. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOTBLUE Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 1 hour ago, JulieH said: Yes, yes and yes Sounds like Meg Ryan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miah Dennehy Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 Fantastic news, although you could easily change the thread title to Football Fans 1 West Midlands Police 0. Seriously well done Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolcitysweden Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 I guess the judgement can be appealed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedLionLad Posted September 23, 2019 Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 13 minutes ago, Miah Dennehy said: Fantastic news, although you could easily change the thread title to Football Fans 1 West Midlands Police 0. Seriously well done What would you know about football fans? You haven't got any Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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