Prestons Midfield best in Championship?

[maxjak]

According to Gregor Mcgregorface in his Post match report of Saturday's game,  he is of the opinion that Preston have the best midfield in the Championship?   What is the general view on here?.........I would have thought West Brom personally.  Thoughts?

[redsince1994]

Could be. Gotta be a reason they're doing so well and it certainly isn't their keeper or defence.

[archie andrews]

Fulham all day long.... 

[And Its Smith]

2 minutes ago, maxjak said:

According to Gregor Mcgregorface in his Post match report of Saturday's game,  he is of the opinion that Preston have the best midfield in the Championship?   What is the general view on here?.........I would have thought West Brom personally.  Thoughts?

I wouldn’t say West Brom as it contains Jake Livermore

If we are judging midfields as a three then I would say

1 Fulham - Arter, Cairney, Jacobsen

2. Leeds - Phillips, Shackleton, Klich 

3. Bristol City - Nagy, Brownhill, Massengo 

4. Preston - Pearson, Browne, Johnson 

[old_eastender]

4 minutes ago, maxjak said:

According to Gregor Mcgregorface in his Post match report of Saturday's game,  he is of the opinion that Preston have the best midfield in the Championship?   What is the general view on here?.........I would have thought West Brom personally.  Thoughts?

I'd agree with him, they have a great mix and play really well together:

• Pearson is very combative (too much so at times I know), breaks up play, wins possession and rarely wastes it.
• Gallagher is a cool head, great passer, keeps possession and good dead ball specialist
• Johnson has flair but also gets stuck in (good diver too!)

I'd say Preston's midfield is one of the key reasons why they keep pushing as a top half team, despite meagre financial support. Believe their record signing is something like £1.5m. 

 

[Mr Popodopolous]

1 hour ago, RedDave said:

I wouldn’t say West Brom as it contains Jake Livermore

If we are judging midfields as a three then I would say

1 Fulham - Arter, Cairney, Jacobsen

2. Leeds - Phillips, Shackleton, Klich 

3. Bristol City - Nagy, Brownhill, Massengo 

4. Preston - Pearson, Browne, Johnson 

Gotta be the best- you also have Harrison Reed, McDonald and even Bobby Reid who can all play CM.

Leeds seems up there too- Forshaw for Shackleton.

Preston's is pretty good though- as is ours. Shame they indulge in such gamesmanship.

If it clicks, I also like the look of Blackburn's- a 4-2-3-1/4-3-3 hybrid of Johnson-Holtby-Dack could do impressive things! Evans, Rothwell and Travis all offer some good depth/alternatives too.

[Eastside Moonwalker]

DJ is a great player who I am surprised isn't playing at a better championship team, Pearson is also pretty good, Bayliss was way too good for Cov last year and as far as I know Brad Potts has warranted moving up the leagues to play in the championship. 

 

Can't say too much about the other players but those are definetely solid players at this level

[Rudolf Hucker]

1 hour ago, archie andrews said:

Fulham all day long.... 

Cairney was imo, in Fulham’s promotion season, the best player in the Championship however he was an infrequent starter in their Prem team. I couldn’t understand the reasoning. Now they’re back in the Championship he’s again showing his considerable abilities. 

The Fulham Prem team should have been built around Cairney imo 

[Davefevs]

58 minutes ago, Rudolf Hucker said:

Cairney was imo, in Fulham’s promotion season, the best player in the Championship however he was an infrequent starter in their Prem team. I couldn’t understand the reasoning. Now they’re back in the Championship he’s again showing his considerable abilities. 

The Fulham Prem team should have been built around Cairney imo 

In the past couple of weeks, Cairney has scored a few identical goals, left foot from just around the “D”.  Stroked into the top right corner (keeper’s left).

[AshtonGreat]

2 hours ago, RedDave said:

I wouldn’t say West Brom as it contains Jake Livermore

If we are judging midfields as a three then I would say

1 Fulham - Arter, Cairney, Jacobsen

2. Leeds - Phillips, Shackleton, Klich 

3. Bristol City - Nagy, Brownhill, Massengo 

4. Preston - Pearson, Browne, Johnson 

Nagy? Who's he? 

[Rudolf Hucker]

16 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

In the past couple of weeks, Cairney has scored a few identical goals, left foot from just around the “D”.  Stroked into the top right corner (keeper’s left).

Fulham spent so much upon their promotion to the Prem that the guys who got them there were overlooked. I rate Cairney very highly; I think that he’s the best footballer in the Championship. I think he’ll get  Fulham promoted again this season. 

[Guest]

Hard to say best. We have improved hugely by selling Pack and bringing in Massengo and Nagy. 

Is there a better 4 than Brownhill, Massengo, Nagy and a fully fit Korey? It was our weakest position but now it's our strongest.

[Sturny]

9 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Hard to say best. We have improved hugely by selling Pack and bringing in Massengo and Nagy. 

Is there a better 4 than Brownhill, Massengo, Nagy and a fully fit Korey? It was our weakest position but now it's our strongest.

I sorta agree, I do feel like we still leave large gaps and can be slow at tracking back sometimes. Less frequently than when Pack was there tho.

This is strictly defensively speaking 

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Sturny said:

I sorta agree, I do feel like we still leave large gaps and can be slow at tracking back sometimes. Less frequently than when Pack was there tho.

This is strictly defensively speaking 

I said for about 2 years that we need better than Pack. People were not happy with my comments, but I always thought we needed mobile midfielders who get at players better than Pack. I also think we now have better technical players in Nagy and Massengo.

 

[Mr Popodopolous]

16 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Hard to say best. We have improved hugely by selling Pack and bringing in Massengo and Nagy. 

Is there a better 4 than Brownhill, Massengo, Nagy and a fully fit Korey? It was our weakest position but now it's our strongest.

Better than Fulham? Remember how good McDonald-Cairney-Johansen was in 2nd half of 2017/18? Now they have Arter too!

[Mr Popodopolous]

36 minutes ago, Rudolf Hucker said:

Fulham spent so much upon their promotion to the Prem that the guys who got them there were overlooked. I rate Cairney very highly; I think that he’s the best footballer in the Championship. I think he’ll get  Fulham promoted again this season. 

Kinda agree, but he did play as per WhoScored 24 as a starter.

Think on paper they certainly should've done better than they did- losing Fredericks and Targett was pretty important- out of their hands tbh! Bryan at LB in PL? Unsure!

Think they definitely tried to change too much too soon, run before they can walk etc. A good example of how not to manage a promotion- fair few players brought in quite late in window.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Better than Fulham? Remember how good McDonald-Cairney-Johansen was in 2nd half of 2017/18? Now they have Arter too!

Its maybe too early to say for sure. But for me Brownhill is one of the very best in the championship. Massengo already looks like he will be a prem player soon enough. Nagy not seen enough of, but clearly looks class. And Korey is still so underrated.

As a team I found Fulham were outstanding in that promotion season. Doesn't necessarily mean they have the best midfielders. It's a close one for sure, but we are up there imo.

[RedM]

3 hours ago, RedDave said:

I wouldn’t say West Brom as it contains Jake Livermore

If we are judging midfields as a three then I would say

1 Fulham - Arter, Cairney, Jacobsen.

2. Leeds - Phillips, Shackleton, Klich 

3. Bristol City - Nagy, Brownhill, Massengo 

4. Preston - Pearson, Browne, Johnson 

I had a little bit of time on my hands so I thought I would look at ages, assuming age equals experience on the whole.

Fulham: Ages 29 28 28. Making an average of 28.3 years

Leeds 23 19 29. Average age 23.6

Bristol City 24 23 18 Average age 21.6

Preston  24 24 26. Average age 24.6

 

We certainly haven’t been able to see our three play together as much as we would want, but in terms of age and experience we are certainly playing above ourselves compared to what other teams can call upon?

 

[BobBobSuperBob]

7 minutes ago, RedM said:

I had a little bit of time on my hands so I thought I would look at ages, assuming age equals experience on the whole.

Fulham: Ages 29 28 28. Making an average of 28.3 years

Leeds 23 19 29. Average age 23.6

Bristol City 24 23 18 Average age 21.6

Preston  24 24 26. Average age 24.6

 

We certainly haven’t been able to see our three play together as much as we would want, but in terms of age and experience we are certainly playing above ourselves compared to what other teams can call upon?

 

Let’s be honest , we’ve done remarkably well

Tbh if you’d pre listed our injuries to key players I would have feared us being bottom 8 at this point

[LondonBristolian]

2 hours ago, Rudolf Hucker said:

Cairney was imo, in Fulham’s promotion season, the best player in the Championship however he was an infrequent starter in their Prem team. I couldn’t understand the reasoning. Now they’re back in the Championship he’s again showing his considerable abilities. 

The Fulham Prem team should have been built around Cairney imo 

About three years ago - I think the season before they got promoted - I went to watch Fulham as a season ticket holding mate had a spare. They lost 2-1 to Brighton, who went on to win promotion, but Cairney put in what I thought was the best midfield performance I have ever witnessed in the Championship. Calm, creative, did not give the ball away and absolutely outstanding on a day that none of his teammates played well. I really, really rate the guy.

[LondonBristolian]

45 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Its maybe too early to say for sure. But for me Brownhill is one of the very best in the championship. Massengo already looks like he will be a prem player soon enough. Nagy not seen enough of, but clearly looks class. And Korey is still so underrated.

As a team I found Fulham were outstanding in that promotion season. Doesn't necessarily mean they have the best midfielders. It's a close one for sure, but we are up there imo.

What really stands out to me is that the decision to sell Pack was a bit baffling at the time and, whilst he had his critics, he was one of key players for the last few years and you could make a very reasonable shout for him being our best midfielder last season. Yet two months on from transfer deadline day, in a team ravaged by injuries, we haven't missed him at all. 

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, JonDolman said:

Hard to say best. We have improved hugely by selling Pack and bringing in Massengo and Nagy. 

Is there a better 4 than Brownhill, Massengo, Nagy and a fully fit Korey? It was our weakest position but now it's our strongest.

When that midfield gets more goals that assists, you might have an argument, but at the present it misses one important dimension.

If we take Pack in 18/19

46 apps / 2 goals / 3 assists 

If we rake our current midfield (Nagy, Brownhill, Massengo, Palmer)

23+3 / 3 / 3

if you extrapolate that to 46 games you get

46 / 6 / 6 which is decent, but not a stellar Champ midfield.

Of course, all about opinion, but I would not rate us as highly as you do.  I hope Palmer can extrapolate his 6+2 / 1 / 2 if not improve on it.  He’s capable of double figure goals and assists.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, LondonBristolian said:

What really stands out to me is that the decision to sell Pack was a bit baffling at the time and, whilst he had his critics, he was one of key players for the last few years and you could make a very reasonable shout for him being our best midfielder last season. Yet two months on from transfer deadline day, in a team ravaged by injuries, we haven't missed him at all. 

To be honest I was delighted when I heard we sold Pack, and for 4 million. I don't think he suits our way of playing at all. Far too slow on the ball, slow at getting around the pitch. I thought Brownhill was our best midfielder last season, but would always be better with someone more mobile alongside him. So far that seems to be the case.

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

When that midfield gets more goals that assists, you might have an argument, but at the present it misses one important dimension.

If we take Pack in 18/19

46 apps / 2 goals / 3 assists 

If we rake our current midfield (Nagy, Brownhill, Massengo, Palmer)

23+3 / 3 / 3

if you extrapolate that to 46 games you get

46 / 6 / 6 which is decent, but not a stellar Champ midfield.

Of course, all about opinion, but I would not rate us as highly as you do.  I hope Palmer can extrapolate his 6+2 / 1 / 2 if not improve on it.  He’s capable of double figure goals and assists.

 I believe Palmer should and maybe will score plenty more in the future. He showed us in the Bolton cup game that he can certainly hit a ball, and isn't scared to.

He has the shooting technique and ability to create space with his skill and balance. But he has also shown glimpses of an excellent leap and ability to head the ball. If only his movement could improve so he can make runs into the box when balls comes in.

Palmer is the player i would expect to score and assist more being so much more attacking in his role. 

I think with Brownhill and Massengo, or Smith and Nagy, a midfield pair in today's game can be much more about protecting the defence and full backs. Linking defence with attack.

It would be interesting to see heat maps of how often each our midfield 2 get into the box.

If they have licence to get in there often, then maybe they should score more. But there are plenty of real quality midfielders who do not score many goals, as they're doing so much in other areas of the pitch.

Can't be bothered to look into other midfield partnerships stats, but a quality pair were Norwood and Fleck. They were a key part of Sheffield United's promotion, and played nearly every game I think last season. Don't think they scored many at all.

[Eastside Moonwalker]

3 hours ago, Sturny said:

I sorta agree, I do feel like we still leave large gaps and can be slow at tracking back sometimes. Less frequently than when Pack was there tho.

This is strictly defensively speaking 

Pack was just too slow to play the way we wanted to play, HNM and Nagy have been what we've needed for a couple of years

[Out of his pie crust]

3 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Let’s be honest , we’ve done remarkably well

Tbh if you’d pre listed our injuries to key players I would have feared us being bottom 8 at this point

I agree. Take 5 potential starters (including the spine of the team) out of many of the better sides in the champ and I question if they would be as close to the top.

[Davefevs]

17 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

To be honest I was delighted when I heard we sold Pack, and for 4 million. I don't think he suits our way of playing at all. Far too slow on the ball, slow at getting around the pitch. I thought Brownhill was our best midfielder last season, but would always be better with someone more mobile alongside him. So far that seems to be the case.

 I believe Palmer should and maybe will score plenty more in the future. He showed us in the Bolton cup game that he can certainly hit a ball, and isn't scared to.

He has the shooting technique and ability to create space with his skill and balance. But he has also shown glimpses of an excellent leap and ability to head the ball. If only his movement could improve so he can make runs into the box when balls comes in.

Palmer is the player i would expect to score and assist more being so much more attacking in his role. 

I think with Brownhill and Massengo, or Smith and Nagy, a midfield pair in today's game can be much more about protecting the defence and full backs. Linking defence with attack.

It would be interesting to see heat maps of how often each our midfield 2 get into the box.

If they have licence to get in there often, then maybe they should score more. But there are plenty of real quality midfielders who do not score many goals, as they're doing so much in other areas of the pitch.

Can't be bothered to look into other midfield partnerships stats, but a quality pair were Norwood and Fleck. They were a key part of Sheffield United's promotion, and played nearly every game I think last season. Don't think they scored many at all.

Agree, agree, agree.

But for context look at Norwood and Fleck....and then add Duffy, to make a comparable three (ignore Stevens, couldn’t sort them):

That’s a midfield!!!  

You’re right - two “holders” - 5 goals, but......19 assists!!!  “Fleck me”....that’s good!!  11 goals and 26 assists if you add Duffy.

Lets hope Palmer can fill the gap....but I also think from Nagy’s limited minutes don’t far, he’s not only scored (QPR), but his presence in Brum’s box twice showed willingness to not just sit at the base, but move forward with the team and break the lines.

This is a new midfield...it has great potential.  Don’t think it can be classed as the best, but it could be right up there when we get everyone back.  Very encouraging....when a lot of fans couldn’t imagine a midfield without Pack and Smith.

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Agree, agree, agree.

But for context look at Norwood and Fleck....and then add Duffy, to make a comparable three (ignore Stevens, couldn’t sort them):

That’s a midfield!!!  

You’re right - two “holders” - 5 goals, but......19 assists!!!  “Fleck me”....that’s good!!  11 goals and 26 assists if you add Duffy.

Lets hope Palmer can fill the gap....but I also think from Nagy’s limited minutes don’t far, he’s not only scored (QPR), but his presence in Brum’s box twice showed willingness to not just sit at the base, but move forward with the team and break the lines.

This is a new midfield...it has great potential.  Don’t think it can be classed as the best, but it could be right up there when we get everyone back.  Very encouraging....when a lot of fans couldn’t imagine a midfield without Pack and Smith.

Yep. For me Palmer is our Duffy in this system. I know they are quite different players, plus us and Sheffield united play quite differently. But Palmer has more of that free role and I think really should be looking to be getting double figures or close to it.

I think if we had Afobe fit then goals from midfield would not matter anywhere near as much. He had 3 in 5. I expect he'd have hit 20 and Weimann may have got his best number in a season by having a strike partner that suits him so well and with Palmer in behind. I would have fancied us for fighting for top 2.

[Sturny]

36 minutes ago, Eastside Moonwalker said:

Pack was just too slow to play the way we wanted to play, HNM and Nagy have been what we've needed for a couple of years

Hard to argue tbh 

[Davefevs]

3 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Yep. For me Palmer is our Duffy in this system. I know they are quite different players, plus us and Sheffield united play quite differently. But Palmer has more of that free role and I think really should be looking to be getting double figures or close to it.

I think if we had Afobe fit then goals from midfield would not matter anywhere near as much. He had 3 in 5. I expect he'd have hit 20 and Weimann may have got his best number in a season by having a strike partner that suits him so well and with Palmer in behind. I would have fancied us for fighting for top 2.

I think we would be a very good bet for top 6....and who knows whether top 2.

We are still a good side, especially when Nagy and Kalas return soon (please) and then Dasilva in new year (please please).  We are building system familiarity too.  That bodes well.  I like the way we are playing with a settled (ish) 5212 system.

[Mr Popodopolous]

18 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I think we would be a very good bet for top 6....and who knows whether top 2.

We are still a good side, especially when Nagy and Kalas return soon (please) and then Dasilva in new year (please please).  We are building system familiarity too.  That bodes well.  I like the way we are playing with a settled (ish) 5212 system.

I'm not so sure on the latter- the relative lack of possession and control and the higher than average conversion rate pre Preston could've become a problem but top 6 definitely.

Afobe fully fit and injuries clearing up, that top 2 may well have come into range- and it looks like there is no real outstanding side this season which helps.  Definitely should be pushing hard for the top 6 minimum.