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Massengo


Alan Dicks

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8 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Kante 

It is probably the hair but I see a lot of similarities with Guendouzi at Arsenal. Low maintenance and high work rate. They both get around the pitch tons and win back possession and both play relatively safe. Now you probably want to see a bit more freedom on the ball but I imagine that will come with time and confidence. 

Also think both of those are similar to Kante in that sense too just that Kante is probably one of a kind. 

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11 minutes ago, Simon bristol said:

Yes we got huge money for kelly and webster. Everyone on here must know that if the right deal is offered then we will sell our player, but in this case someone didnt accept that was the case. Hence my post

Sounded like you meant we would sell as soon as an offer comes in. We will only sell if it's huge money. I'm not sure a prem club would bid silly money in the summer for Massengo. More likely summer after imo.

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10 minutes ago, Simon bristol said:

Actually, we have a sensational young talent contracted to the club, and this thread has descended into arguments about whether it was a risky signing and how long hes going to stay! 

That’s quite normal for otib.

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1 hour ago, soultrader said:

OK .

 

Yes and their were people who posted he was a risk because he did not know the culture etc.

I'm not sure of the point being made?

Is what Ive said factually incorrect?

Have I offended you in some way?

Look at your post of August and of this week and their tone having a go / dig at posters , as far a  ‘jibe’ at them 

You even ‘quote’ ’Massive Risk’   in CAPITALS

(Its like posters in the match day thread , who when Famara scored , their first thought is to goad anyone who may have criticised Famara) - pathetic 

What I've posted is pretty clear about the lack of basis for any such claims -and surprised at your claims had a look and clarified this and pointed it out to you politely

Point scoring is one debate but when it has no basis ......
 
Offended me ?       not at all , but it does p*** me off that a positive thread about Massengo is turned into an attempt at point scoring , and worse without any basis 

 

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I’m really intrigued to see our annual accounts for 18/19.  They are usually out around this period.  That will tell me how much the club need to generate in transfer funds just to get on an even keel.  Finances will dictate the amount of transfer revenue we need to generate to provide a recruitment budget.

I think Massengo will see the benefits of playing time at this stage of career.  It’s a tough league, 5 or 6th hardest (?), and he will get gametime here that he won’t get in any / many Prem teams.  He would fit a footballing side commensurate with a top 6 club, but will they want 18 year old potential.  Someone like Norwich might be a good fit, but I don’t see them spending the sums needed to twist our arm.

Maybe some of the above is heart over head.

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3 hours ago, Simon bristol said:

Explain?

They weren't flogged "as soon as possible".

They were sold when a couple of exceptional offers came in.

 

If we were just flogging them then Webster would have gone for about half of what he actually did, based on the reported opening offers. It literally took a bid that was too good to refuse for us to sell them.

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30 minutes ago, JamesBCFC said:

They weren't flogged "as soon as possible".

They were sold when a couple of exceptional offers came in.

 

If we were just flogging them then Webster would have gone for about half of what he actually did, based on the reported opening offers. It literally took a bid that was too good to refuse for us to sell them.

The fact is that Webster came to us with a sketchy injury record, played a full season, and we cashed in after 1 year means we pretty much sold him as quick as we could, a january bid was unlikely given his history of injuries but in this summer window it was just a matter of time before we sold him on.

kelly got more games, got england under 21 call ups, then we sold him immediately at the start of the transfer window, if we had turned down bournemouth who is to say whether someone else might have come in later offering 20 million, like what happened with Webster?

hey the club should be accepting the best offer, but lets not be under any misunderstanding about what will happen to massengo if an acceptable bid comes in january for him, regardless of trying to build a squad for promotion etc etc. We have the money, but arguably our defence is weaker than if webster and kelly had stayed, which in most cases would mean we have to make up in the weakening of our defence in other areas.

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2 minutes ago, Simon bristol said:

The fact is that Webster came to us with a sketchy injury record, played a full season, and we cashed in after 1 year means we pretty much sold him as quick as we could, a january bid was unlikely given his history of injuries but in this summer window it was just a matter of time before we sold him on.

kelly got more games, got england under 21 call ups, then we sold him immediately at the start of the transfer window, if we had turned down bournemouth who is to say whether someone else might have come in later offering 20 million, like what happened with Webster?

hey the club should be accepting the best offer, but lets not be under any misunderstanding about what will happen to massengo if an acceptable bid comes in january for him, regardless of trying to build a squad for promotion etc etc. We have the money, but arguably our defence is weaker than if webster and kelly had stayed, which in most cases would mean we have to make up in the weakening of our defence in other areas.

The fact is the initial bid for Webster was around half of what we actually sold him for.

So we did not just flog at the earliest chance.

 

It's been pretty well documented that Bournemouth made their move early because bigger clubs were looking, but nothing to suggest a higher price would have been bid.

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12 minutes ago, Simon bristol said:

The fact is that Webster came to us with a sketchy injury record, played a full season, and we cashed in after 1 year means we pretty much sold him as quick as we could, a january bid was unlikely given his history of injuries but in this summer window it was just a matter of time before we sold him on.

kelly got more games, got england under 21 call ups, then we sold him immediately at the start of the transfer window, if we had turned down bournemouth who is to say whether someone else might have come in later offering 20 million, like what happened with Webster?

hey the club should be accepting the best offer, but lets not be under any misunderstanding about what will happen to massengo if an acceptable bid comes in january for him, regardless of trying to build a squad for promotion etc etc. We have the money, but arguably our defence is weaker than if webster and kelly had stayed, which in most cases would mean we have to make up in the weakening of our defence in other areas.

I'm with @JamesBCFC on this one. We set a high price for Webster because we didn't want to sell and relatively stood our ground until it was right. We may have wanted to "cash in" but only at the right price. I highly doubt there was just one bid for Webster and we accepted, if that was the case then i'd agree. 

A similar situation I could see happening to Messengo 

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28 minutes ago, Simon bristol said:

The fact is that Webster came to us with a sketchy injury record, played a full season, and we cashed in after 1 year means we pretty much sold him as quick as we could, a january bid was unlikely given his history of injuries but in this summer window it was just a matter of time before we sold him on.

kelly got more games, got england under 21 call ups, then we sold him immediately at the start of the transfer window, if we had turned down bournemouth who is to say whether someone else might have come in later offering 20 million, like what happened with Webster?

hey the club should be accepting the best offer, but lets not be under any misunderstanding about what will happen to massengo if an acceptable bid comes in january for him, regardless of trying to build a squad for promotion etc etc. We have the money, but arguably our defence is weaker than if webster and kelly had stayed, which in most cases would mean we have to make up in the weakening of our defence in other areas.

Tactical sale early on (MA eluded to this), to bring in funds to gain an advantage in the transfer window...especially with so many clubs hamstrung financial, including some under embargo.  On the flip-side I think Bournemouth keen to do early before a bigger club came in too. 

It meant we could propose deals to Dasilva, Kalas and Palmer, even if they wouldn’t commit there and then.  The £15m from Kelly meant we could make opening gambits....whilst knowing we could back it up.  Other clubs would’ve been dependent on selling first....we’d done ours!

I now suspect Webster interest was there all summer, but official bids or at least bids out there in the media seen later on.

From my calculations we haven’t much left in the kitty for January, unless we trade.

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42 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

From my calculations we haven’t much left in the kitty for January, unless we trade.

What do you make it, in and out, then?

With much of our business undisclosed, I would be interested to know rough figures each way.

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4 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

 

I would humbly suggest you have misunderstood the intention of my post.

I'm not sure of the relevance of mentioning 'posters on the matchday thread' ?   As generally I don't comment on these, so I'm not sure why the actions of other people is pertinent to any point I have attempted to make?

 

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16 minutes ago, Coxy27 said:

What do you make it, in and out, then?

With much of our business undisclosed, I would be interested to know rough figures each way.

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As you say all stuff pretty much undisclosed, but caveated by stuff in media and the likes of Kid On The Riot...and my previous estimates haven’t been a million miles away when previous years accounts have been produced either.  Always happy to be challenged on any of them, e.g. Bentley £4m or £2m rumoured...so I’ve plumped for £3m.

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1 hour ago, soultrader said:

I would humbly suggest you have misunderstood the intention of my post.

I'm not sure of the relevance of mentioning 'posters on the matchday thread' ?   As generally I don't comment on these, so I'm not sure why the actions of other people is pertinent to any point I have attempted to make?

 

I’m not going to keep posting on this subject

The intention of your original post is clear , and akin to the comments I related to in the Matchday thread , as an example 

You have claimed something, twice,  (using capital letters to I presume emphasise your jibe ) that’s simply isn’t correct 

If you can show me where these people/ posters thought Massengo was a ‘Massive Risk’ it would be helpful 

 

 

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2 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

I’m not going to keep posting on this subject

The intention of your original post is clear , and akin to the comments I related to in the Matchday thread , as an example 

You have claimed something, twice,  (using capital letters to I presume emphasise your jibe ) that’s simply isn’t correct 

If you can show me where these people/ posters thought Massengo was a ‘Massive Risk’ it would be helpful 

 

 

As I said I fear your presumptions are incorrect.

But as you do not appear interested in seeking an alternative explanation.  I'm unsure I can help

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11 hours ago, RedDave said:

Posters said Massengo was a risk, or words to that affect, when the fee was incorrectly told as £7m.  We now know it only builds to that so the transfer is low risk 

From L’Equipe ;

’ 

 
Le jeune milieu monégasque Han-Noah Massengo (18 ans) poursuivra sa carrière à Bristol City (D2 anglaise). Selon différentes sources proches du dossier, son transfert est estimé à 8 M€, auxquels s'ajoutent différents bonus et 20% du montant de la revente.’
 
From différent sources close to the deal , his transfer is estimated at € 8 million to which you have to add different bonuses and 20% of the total sell on fee. 
 
Monaco must have leaked the deal because all the French press and media quoted practically, word for word , what is written above concerning the details of the deal. 
 
We will probably never know but either way Massengo was the jewel of their academy and they would not have sold him cheaply or wished the fans to think that they had . 
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12 hours ago, Major Isewater said:

From L’Equipe ;

’ 

 
Le jeune milieu monégasque Han-Noah Massengo (18 ans) poursuivra sa carrière à Bristol City (D2 anglaise). Selon différentes sources proches du dossier, son transfert est estimé à 8 M€, auxquels s'ajoutent différents bonus et 20% du montant de la revente.’
 
From différent sources close to the deal , his transfer is estimated at € 8 million to which you have to add different bonuses and 20% of the total sell on fee. 
 
Monaco must have leaked the deal because all the French press and media quoted practically, word for word , what is written above concerning the details of the deal. 
 
We will probably never know but either way Massengo was the jewel of their academy and they would not have sold him cheaply or wished the fans to think that they had . 

But we still believe the €8m to be including performance add-ons (as opposed to sell-on add-on).

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9 minutes ago, mozo said:

Could our success (thus far) with Massengo lead to more French (or maybe Belgian or Dutch) starlets following the same pathway?

And would thus be a positive development or would it just stifle the development of local talent?

If the local talent is playing international football and is good enough then the club won’t spend money unnecessarily to bring in a foreign starlet .

It can only be good for the players at the club to have exceptional talent to play with and learn from .

 

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44 minutes ago, mozo said:

I thought he was the star man again today. 

Really?

I thought he was overran, outmuscled and out thought. He struggled to keep hold of the ball when he had it and was bullied off getting it back on a few occasions. 
 

His worst performance for us by far

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10 hours ago, JBFC II said:

Really?

I thought he was overran, outmuscled and out thought. He struggled to keep hold of the ball when he had it and was bullied off getting it back on a few occasions. 
 

His worst performance for us by far

What he lacked was back up . When he won balls due to his tenacity there was rarely a team mate to take advantage.

 

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