Mr Popodopolous Posted October 29, 2019 Report Share Posted October 29, 2019 True, but it seems quite convenient for some let's say. I'd argue the lenience point too- the fines however are pointless, very much so. Think you'll find too @Northern Red that it doesn't do our credibility at a UEFA level much good when pushing for more stringent punishments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZiderEyed Posted October 29, 2019 Report Share Posted October 29, 2019 12 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: And Millwall got what punishment exactly for the Everton game? Those in glass houses...when was the last closed doors game @Super for racism from a stand in the UK? I'll give you a clue- pick any year but it's the 31st September...ie never. Do you work with UEFA/for a company aided or funded by UEFA by any chance? You seem to defend them at any opportunity, even when they do things like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted October 29, 2019 Report Share Posted October 29, 2019 3 minutes ago, ZiderEyed said: Do you work with UEFA/for a company aided or funded by UEFA by any chance? You seem to defend them at any opportunity, even when they do things like this. Ha, no- I wish! Would be some nice pay and a bit of a junket though I'm sure, so if any vacancies... I think a match behind closed doors, while inadequate, isn't the worst. I also think that some people in the media, albeit not on here- maybe prone to criticising them not because of this issue but because of bandwagon jumping/UEFA bashing/hypocrisy. Stand by my view too that it doesn't necessarily help our FA's cause to push for better punishments at UEFA level if ours themselves are quite lax at best! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 Interested to know the take of @The Gasbuster on this latest "few grand" fine. Okay £67k is nothing to an FA but match ban with a 2nd suspended is also a bit more. That viewpoint may well be the type I was alluding to, happy to slate UEFA for inaction or a weak response, while giving issues or possible issues closer to home a bit of a swerve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Up The City! Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 I'm starting to wonder if those who dish out these punishments are actually racists themselves, it's the only logical conclusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted October 30, 2019 Admin Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 Just to put this punishment into context with other fines issued by UEFA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 Easy for people with a possible anti UEFA agenda to jump on it though and ignore our own shortcomings however. I'd include @The Gasbuster and maybe @Super in that one. @phantom Leeds fine was by our own EFL or FA. UEFA wouldn't get involved in Spygate as a domestic thing. Bendtner- yes, agreed. AC Milan Lazio one- any link? EDIT, found it- that would have been domestically and by a domestic body- not UEFA. FIGC are a domestic body- UEFA wouldn't get involved in domestic issues. Whoever wrote that list is not fully correct Bendtner aside, though I hesitate to call it fake news. I also note that they neglect to mention Millwall chants v Everton.- £10k. @Up The City! Any opinion on UK racism at football, punishment or lack of? I look forward to you digging out some posting history...bated breath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 Surprised a journo wouldn't check facts though!! https://twitter.com/craigybratt He made the original Tweet or it appears so anyway, and well though the fines were accurate, the context was somewhat misleading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 Question for @Up The City! @Super @The Gasbuster The last time we in England had ANY game behind closed doors, or even partially behind closed doors, as mandated by the FA was...? (Ironically there was one in the 1980s, West Ham v Castilla aka Real Madrid B- but this was mandated by...UEFA??). Actually worth a quick read for context etc, the above example. Suspect I will be waiting a while for answers on this one though- simple question, last time the FA mandated a partial or full behind closed doors game was...? HOWEVER yes, the fine was too low, as it tends to be by UEFA- that I really cannot argue with- possibly the punishment too but the fine seemed like tokenism! A decent read by David Conn though. Good journo- bit more nuanced than my ranting! https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2019/oct/29/english-football-high-horse-racism-eufa-sanction-bulgaria-fa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gasbuster Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 29 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: Question for @Up The City! @Super @The Gasbuster The last time we in England had ANY game behind closed doors, or even partially behind closed doors, as mandated by the FA was... (Ironically there was one in the 1980s, West Ham v Castilla aka Real Madrid B- but this was mandated by...UEFA??). Actually worth a quick read for context etc, the above example. Suspect I will be waiting a while for answers on this one though- simple question, last time the FA mandated a partial or full behind closed doors game was...? HOWEVER yes, the fine was too low, as it tends to be by UEFA- that I really cannot argue with- possibly the punishment too but the fine seemed like tokenism! I really don't know why you keep tagging me with regard to this issue ? I don't have an "anti UEFA agenda" as you call it in a previous post, and never have. F.W.I.W. I still consider the fine to be lightweight, and would have thought two games behind closed doors, without either being suspended, would have been a reasonable punishment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 1 minute ago, The Gasbuster said: I really don't know why you keep tagging me with regard to this issue ? I don't have an "anti UEFA agenda" as you call it in a previous post, and never have. F.W.I.W. I still consider the fine to be lightweight, and would have thought two games behind closed doors, without either being suspended, would have been a reasonable punishment. Okay fair enough, you made a post or 2 a few weeks ago on about Bulgaria fine which seemed a bit one sided but fair enough. Still quite interesting how our media can run with one but kind of overlook the other aspects a bit. I agree the fine is too low as UEFA- but also our own FA- fines for these things often are, can be- and I also agree 2 behind closed doors- maybe it wasn't really aimed at anyone on here, merely trying to offer a bit of balance- that journo certainly didn't post his Tweet in a proper context though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natchfever Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 From what I can gather, that group of black clad men are not fans of the national side so no doubt there are plenty more where they came from in future matches without closed doors. I think its a bigger issue at club level and actually far easier to impose sanctions that will hurt and perhaps get the message across that however you feel about people who are different from yourself, you cannot express those views in a football stadium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B1ackbird Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 26 minutes ago, Loon plage said: From what I can gather, that group of black clad men are not fans of the national side so no doubt there are plenty more where they came from in future matches without closed doors. I think its a bigger issue at club level and actually far easier to impose sanctions that will hurt and perhaps get the message across that however you feel about people who are different from yourself, you cannot express those views in a football stadium. I agree mate, it's come to a point where its obvious that any fine or stand closure has no effect at all. Sean Wright-Phillips and David James were playing in Eastern Europe and when interviewed both said its not ten or twenty fans who want to look tough in front of their peers, it's entire stands making monkey noises and singing racial songs. With the best will in the world, you ain't changing that engrained hatered, so in five years time it will all happen again and black players will be subjected to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natchfever Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 3 minutes ago, B1ackbird said: I agree mate, it's come to a point where its obvious that any fine or stand closure has no effect at all. Sean Wright-Phillips and David James were playing in Eastern Europe and when interviewed both said its not ten or twenty fans who want to look tough in front of their peers, it's entire stands making monkey noises and singing racial songs. With the best will in the world, you ain't changing that engrained hatered, so in five years time it will all happen again and black players will be subjected to it. Dead right 3 strikes and you're out of European club competitions for five years and whoever is runner up in your domestic competition don't get in because of it. Thereafter zero tolerance and immediate explusion. That is (to such clubs) a big loss of income, but tough shit eh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B1ackbird Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 Surely the countries/clubs have to be accountable, or just do what the Russians did, move the effects mike so it can't be heard... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 Wonder if there will be a debate about Rudiger on here? Or is it just foreign racism we're interested in...granted, the problem here is a lot less widespread than elsewhere or indeed past times in the UK but he certainly got racist abuse. UK though? For some...naming no names? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Red Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 I don't think anyone has denied that racism exists in English football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 It's a lot less pronounced here granted, but perhaps there is less emphasis about it on here, than when it happens elsewhere. Certainly the relative thread sizes are interesting, if used to form a comparison. As are some of the posters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natchfever Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 42 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: It's a lot less pronounced here granted, but perhaps there is less emphasis about it on here, than when it happens elsewhere. Certainly the relative thread sizes are interesting, if used to form a comparison. As are some of the posters. How many people involved in the Rudiger incident and have there been any arrests ? Genuine question Mr P as I don't know. Difference between here and the rest of Europe though is that generally you get a very small number spouting racist comments etc in an English stadium, sometimes just an individual whereas in Italy, Serbia to name but 2, it could be an entire Curva or section of a stadium, and has more than a hint of organisation about it. The notion that a club should get into trouble or players walk off because of one or two pissed up bigots is ludicrous, unless of course the home club ignores whats happening once reported. Quite why a "fan" of a club like Spurs, whose first team is full of black players would make monkey chants is hard to comprehend to be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 42 minutes ago, glos old boy said: If 2 teams were playing each other, in a play off promo place final or a top 2 final promo place, and their team was losing, what`s to stop a fan/or fans shouting obsenities to get the game stopped/cancelled? would the score at the time stand or would it be a replay.? Fair. Can't really penalize a club for a lone idiot/couple of idiots. Possible even rivals could get a club in trouble for it- turn up, chant, buy ticket- can be hard to say. 11 minutes ago, Natchfever said: How many people involved in the Rudiger incident and have there been any arrests ? Genuine question Mr P as I don't know. Difference between here and the rest of Europe though is that generally you get a very small number spouting racist comments etc in an English stadium, sometimes just an individual whereas in Italy, Serbia to name but 2, it could be an entire Curva or section of a stadium, and has more than a hint of organisation about it. The notion that a club should get into trouble or players walk off because of one or two pissed up bigots is ludicrous, unless of course the home club ignores whats happening once reported. Quite why a "fan" of a club like Spurs, whose first team is full of black players would make monkey chants is hard to comprehend to be honest. Dunno about arrests yet Natch, only happened Sunday tbh- these things may take time. This is true- I think there are some in the English game who can be a bit holier than thou on it but a bit quiet when it happens here though, that's a point I was trying to make. No doubt it's a lot worse abroad. Yeah agreed- arrest them, eject them on the day- the club will doubtless act. Agreed. Listening on the radio too to some discussion about it, someone mentioned it's a highly multicultural, mixed area too- of course that maybe misleading, fans can come from anywhere for a start, plus a lot more geographical mobility these days. We're still certainly amongst the best in this country when it comes to dealing with it IMO. Also to add though, that if we want our (justified) complaints for foreign countries to carry most weight, it must be dealt with strongly here too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
054123 Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 We shall see what evidence is brought forward and who is arrested. When the banana skin was thrown at Aubameyang there was a quick arrest and prosecution. This is seems a more complex scenario than the headlines would have you believe. Some spurs fans sat in that area not sure what is supposed to have happened as apparently it’s a quite a mixed heritage section and if some idiots would have genuinely started monkey chants there. would have been bigger issues. Let the authorities sort it out and hopefully if there is a case to answer those responsible will be brought to justice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isawjonshaw Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 The irony that it's Chelsea who are complaining about racist remarks/chants with their club/fans history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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