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Is racism a problem at City games?


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@Furious Custard

Given that it happened away from home, I'm not sure a home game behind closed doors is correct.

Some sort of away restrictions maybe for the next high profile game? Away stewards for certain games to help to more easily identify would be troublemakers- but also to show, to demonstrate that the club are doing all that they reasonably can.

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39 minutes ago, Notbarrymanc said:

You’re wrong and you need to get into the 21st century because your archaic opinions are no longer acceptable.

Some might reasonably argue the same citing abhorrent, irrational, restrictive and oppressive religious adherence, which in the case of Islam appears stuck somewhere around the late 8th Century CE (though Christianity and the rest aren't that further advanced.)

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30 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

The only positive from this, is that with Luton playing in a small stadium and away tickets not making general sale, should the authorities (or club) decide that the behaviour of some supporters no longer be welcome at Ashton Gate, they should be easily identified and whatever action is deemed appropriate can be taken.

If that means a fair number are excluded from games, I won't be weeping about it. If some people reflect on what they thought was banter and understand that their behaviour made a lot of people uncomfortable and learn from it, then society benefits.

It's a football match at the end of the day, not a Nuremberg rally. People attended to be entertained and hope that the multi-national team, of many religions, representing our City, win the game.

Because of the way tickets were sold, online suddenly and sold out instantly, many tickets ended up being passed around or sold on. City have no idea who ended up with them unfortunately.

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3 minutes ago, RedM said:

Because of the way tickets were sold, online suddenly and sold out instantly, many tickets ended up being passed around or sold on. City have no idea who ended up with them unfortunately.

This- absolutely agree with this.

Was thinking of making similar points myself on Twitter but thought better of it in case it's picked up on in some media outlet! However yes, this sounds spot on.

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11 minutes ago, BTRFTG said:

Some might reasonably argue the same citing abhorrent, irrational, restrictive and oppressive religious adherence, which in the case of Islam appears stuck somewhere around the late 8th Century CE (though Christianity and the rest aren't that further advanced.)

Which football teams are citing these views?

 

How in any way is it relevant?

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Even if we take this thread as a sample size of City fans, there are a handful of people on here that are willing to do the mental gymnastics to justify racism at football matches. They might not openly say "it's okay to discriminate against black people", but when you try to justify it by saying "football has always been this way" or "we do it to the welsh/scottish", then you're helping to normalise this kind of behaviour.

I am absolutely disgusted in my club, and in the westcountry in general. In one weekend, a mere four days after the country slated Bulgaria for open racism, we see at least three separate events in our country - two of which are in the immediate area we're based in.

The one positive is that Yeovil took the right step in abandoning the match, and I felt that their manager spoke well after the match to illustrate that this kind of behaviour should not be tolerated. I can only hope our club takes a similar approach, and does everything in their power to find those involved in the chants and to ban them from attending any football matches. To be frank, while I think it's great that our chairman has spoke out, saying that "we'll investigate" is a blanket gesture that means **** all.

Call it hyperbole all you want, but this kind of stuff sets a football club back several years. Yeovil will be remembered as a racist club for years, and for those that read the Bristol City news we'll probably be branded in the same light. IMO, Bristol City should be doing everything it can to be an inclusive club, and this should the catalyst to really double-down on that goal.

Finally, if these thick ***** are caught, I hope that they are referred to the police, and are forced to go through some kind of educational programme/scheme to help them learn the error of their ways, and to learn that Britain is a multi-cultural and diverse country. IMO, it's the only way to fight the sheer amount of ignorance we see nowadays, and simply punishing people for holding negative views is only going to make things worse. Teach them a lesson by literally teaching them a lesson, and let them re-integrate into society and football as changed people.

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4 minutes ago, Notbarrymanc said:

Which football teams are citing these views?

 

How in any way is it relevant?

Yes, quite.

Political views or bigoted views or otherwise should be left at the door when coming to football- IMO.

Having said that IF people express these views at games, then it makes them easier to identify and root out- either banning, education, prosecution or some combination of all 3.

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52 minutes ago, foghornred said:

Recism is part of football how we take the piss out of the Welsh when we play Cardiff and Swansea and even the chant 'I want to go home this place is a s---hole' can be said to be racist  

With all due respect I don’t really think you understand what racism is. 

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3 minutes ago, famouslastword said:

I didn't vote.... i was also born in greece and then migrated to this country as a child from Europe. I Just think to say that 52% of the country is racist is a little far fetched just because they have a different viewpoint to yours! 

I don’t think I did say that though did I mate. 

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21 minutes ago, RedM said:

Because of the way tickets were sold, online suddenly and sold out instantly, many tickets ended up being passed around or sold on. City have no idea who ended up with them unfortunately.

Hadn't given that much thought. Either way, I'm sure there is sufficient CCTV if they are seeking to identify people. 

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45 minutes ago, billywedlock said:

Having grown up with terrible racist abuse at games, I had wrongly, clearly, assumed that it was something from the past. All of this has been so sad to go through and read and leaves me disappointed , sad and frustrated that racism is getting worse not better. I personally have not heard any racist comment for well over a decade, and if this becomes more widespread I would stop going to games. It is not something BCFC should ever be associated with or to tolerate. I hope the people responsible are found and banned. 

Agreed mate. Early in this thread I mentioned that I hadn't heard overt racism at City for about 30 years. And I meant it, I had been genuinely pleased about the general lack of racial bigotry on show at home and away games since the 90's (with a handful of isolated exceptions). Well now I look a bit daft don't I? 

As a child of the triumphant 2 Tone movement, which had no truck with party politics, I'm bemused that a couple of posters on here are suggesting that taking an anti-racist stance is 'left wing'. Anti-racism is not the preserve of the Left, neither is it 'politically correct'. 

It is just correct.
 

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3 minutes ago, City Rocker said:

Agreed mate. Early in this thread I mentioned that I hadn't heard overt racism at City for about 30 years. And I meant it, I had been genuinely pleased about the general lack of racial bigotry on show at home and away games since the 90's (with a handful of isolated exceptions). Well now I look a bit daft don't I? 

As a child of the triumphant 2 Tone movement, which had no truck with party politics, I'm bemused that a couple of posters on here are suggesting that taking an anti-racist stance is 'left wing'. Anti-racism is not the preserve of the Left, neither is it 'politically correct'. 

It is just correct.
 

If I could like this twice, I would do.

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7 minutes ago, Notbarrymanc said:

Which football teams are citing these views?

 

How in any way is it relevant?

Your quote was used to call out a poster for not holding the same brainwashed zealotry as yourself. That's the issue with politically correct fascism, others aren't allowed to hold contrary views, which of course is a fundamental principle of major religions ( thou shalt have no other God before Me, indeed....) You suggested the poster join the 21st Century and I highlighted the main reason Saturday happened and will continue to happen is because, as that poster suggested, folks who once used to be sensible enough to see the wheat from the chaff are now coward for fear of not blindly following diktat.

City made the press because of the 'he said - she said' at Haringey. The FA will make something of it because they think they'll have to, but amazing in these days where phones and cameras are omnipresent nobody has yet captured any of the reported incidents. I've no doubt one or two Yeovil fans made reprehensible remarks to some Haringey players, but sufficient for it to escalate to this? Some say that reaction was only in response to the keeper spraying fans with his water bottle. Either way abuse not so bad as to prevent the offended keeper first attempting to save the penalty.....

Methinks I'll read again Wolfe's 'Bonfire of the Vanities' - hard to conceive these days it was written as satire......

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18 minutes ago, BTRFTG said:

Your quote was used to call out a poster for not holding the same brainwashed zealotry as yourself. That's the issue with politically correct fascism, others aren't allowed to hold contrary views, which of course is a fundamental principle of major religions ( thou shalt have no other God before Me, indeed....) You suggested the poster join the 21st Century and I highlighted the main reason Saturday happened and will continue to happen is because, as that poster suggested, folks who once used to be sensible enough to see the wheat from the chaff are now coward for fear of not blindly following diktat.

City made the press because of the 'he said - she said' at Haringey. The FA will make something of it because they think they'll have to, but amazing in these days where phones and cameras are omnipresent nobody has yet captured any of the reported incidents. I've no doubt one or two Yeovil fans made reprehensible remarks to some Haringey players, but sufficient for it to escalate to this? Some say that reaction was only in response to the keeper spraying fans with his water bottle. Either way abuse not so bad as to prevent the offended keeper first attempting to save the penalty.....

Methinks I'll read again Wolfe's 'Bonfire of the Vanities' - hard to conceive these days it was written as satire......

You seem to be trivialising racism. You also show a complete lack of empathy. 

 

Yeovil fans did not do some 'he said she said’. They committed deplorable actions and will be vilified as a result. Don’t try and protect or support this behaviour as it brings you down to their level. 
 

This is not PC gone mad, and this is not over reaction. Enoch Powell should be at the forefront of people’s minds as we are on a slippery slope if we accept this sort of behaviour. 

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@JulieH / Others

The point i was trying to make was,

If someone went up to a welsh person and went

You stupid welsh sheep shagging ****

and then someone went to to someone who was Welsh and had an Asian appearance

You stupid welsh “insert race related comment” sheep shagging ****

Are both offensive? Why does it only become offensive when race for example is mentioned.

The same with if it was

You stupid welsh “Insert homophobic comment” sheep shagging ****

Surely it’s all offensive?

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2 hours ago, Notbarrymanc said:

I don’t think it is an overreaction. There is a 0 tolerance  approach to racism and rightly so.
 

This behaviour will cost city money - fact. I will not bring my children to a racist environment, so that is a minor loss. My company, who currently have sponsorships with 5 sports teams and are looking to sponsor more, will not be associated with racism. That is a much more substantial loss. 
 

We’re recruiting from fields afar - if the next Massengo goes on google and sees these reports he’s going to think twice. For that matter, if Dwight Gayle reads these reports he’s going to go to a normal team instead. 
 

But more than that, on a human level this behaviour is just unacceptable and the dinosaurs that promote it need to be brought to account for their actions. 
 

And finally, I’m not saying all brexiteers are racist, but all racists are definitely brexiteers. 

Tosh. Labours anti-semites vote? 

Voting remain is a racist vote. Most of Europe is white.The rest of the World that the EU discriminates against is not. It just as crass a notion as your last line.

A quick google finds this thread -  

The thread was prior to Brexit. It was banter to some then, contentious to others and racist to others. There were other threads similar to this  years before it. Brexit? Give it a rest.

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41 minutes ago, Notbarrymanc said:

You seem to be trivialising racism. You also show a complete lack of empathy. 

 

Yeovil fans did not do some 'he said she said’. They committed deplorable actions and will be vilified as a result. Don’t try and protect or support this behaviour as it brings you down to their level. 
 

This is not PC gone mad, and this is not over reaction. Enoch Powell should be at the forefront of people’s minds as we are on a slippery slope if we accept this sort of behaviour. 

Now that is a very confused response.

You accuse me of triviality but demonstrate not how that to be the case.

You appear to have more evidence of what happened at Haringey than has otherwise been reported; I trust you've sent this to the authorities such any miscreants might be punished?

You reference Powell, one presumes in particular his speech quoting Virgil, though I'm not sure your reasons for believing him to be at the forefront of people's minds would necessarily accord with some of those chanting Saturday. Famously in that speech he made clear all citizens must be treated equally and his concern that without controls "the native" would end up being  the discriminated. Should you bother to read the text of his speech you'll find many of his predictions prescient, notwithstanding many white racists used his platform to 'justify' their own, perverted beliefs. 

As to the slippery slope, we commenced down that years ago. Your own moral compass appears subject to an inquistion as to reasons and motives for behaving in one lawful manner rather than another? I wonder where I once read that?

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2 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

Tosh. Labours anti-semites vote? 

Voting remain is a racist vote. Most of Europe is white.The rest of the World that the EU discriminates against is not. It just as crass a notion as your last line.

I quick google finds this thread -  

The thread was prior to Brexit. It was banter to some then, contentious to others and racist to others. There were other threads similar to this  years before it. Brexit? Give it a rest.

Good god. I’ve seen it all now! 

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15 minutes ago, AshtonPark said:

@JulieH / Others

The point i was trying to make was,

 

If someone went up to a welsh person and went

 

You stupid welsh sheep shagging ****

 

and then someone went to to someone who was Welsh and had an Asian appearance

 

You stupid welsh “insert race related comment” sheep shagging ****

 

Are both offensive? Why does it only become offensive when race for example is mentioned.

 

The same with if it was

 

You stupid welsh “Insert homophobic comment” sheep shagging ****

 

Surely it’s all offensive?

 

They are all offensive.

But only one of those examples is racist. Only one was homophobic. Whereas all of them were xenophobic towards the Welsh.

As soon as you add a racist word in, it becomes racist. As soon as you add a homophobic word in, it becomes homophobic.

The reason the Welsh things are not (usually) racist is because a white Englishman saying something to a white Welshman is not a racist statement. It’s certainly offensive and xenophobic though.

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3 minutes ago, BTRFTG said:

Now that is a very confused response.

You accuse me of triviality but demonstrate not how that to be the case.

You appear to have more evidence of what happened at Haringey than has otherwise been reported; I trust you've sent this to the authorities such any miscreants might be punished?

You reference Powell, one presumes in particular his speech quoting Virgil, though I'm not sure your reasons for believing him to be at the forefront of people's minds would necessarily accord with some of those chanting Saturday. Famously in that speech he made clear all citizens must be treated equally and his concern that without controls "the native" would end up being  the duscriminated. Should you bother to read the text of his speech you'll find many of his predictions prescient, notwithstanding many white racists used his platform to 'justify' their own, perverted beliefs. 

As to the slippery slope, we commenced down that years ago. Your own moral compass appears subject to an inquistion as to reasons and motives for behaving in one lawful manner rather than another? I wonder where I once read that?

What are you doing? :facepalm:
 

Once you get into a conversation with someone who defends Enoch Powell you know it’s time to get out.

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