Bristol Oil Services Posted October 23, 2019 Report Share Posted October 23, 2019 58 minutes ago, red panda said: Another justification for positive discrimination is that it helps to overcome unconscious bias, which can easily affect the decisions of people who think they are being fair. There is a lot of training available these days (I've done some myself, as everyone at my level had to) but most of the evidence suggests that such training doesn't really change behaviour and can even backfire. The trouble with all these unconscious biases is they are the work, or discoveries, of them darn pesky "experts," and some folks have had enough of experts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnderMB Posted October 23, 2019 Report Share Posted October 23, 2019 2 hours ago, Riaz said: Your key example. Thats not discrimination, they clealy need black people for testing. I'm against so called positive discrimination, because, a white man should never get an opportunity because the the colour of their skin, but then again, neither should non white people! If i get a job for example, i want to get it because i am the best man for the job, not because i am brown and i tick a box. Its just as bad as when a non white person does not get a job because of the colour of their skin. In many ways, you're actually arguing for positive discrimination. You talk of meritocracy, but in my example what actually makes someone the best person for the job? You say they need black people for testing, but I would argue that this mistake would have never happened if they had hired an engineer from a minority background, because their background would give them the sense to test against people without light skin. In this instance, and in many others across multiple industries, the best person for the job was the person with the foresight to test all likely outcomes - not just those familiar to themselves. This is why companies hire people outside of the majority. If your customer base is diverse and your company isn't, then your skills are largely irrelevant, even in industries that pride themselves on meritocracy. The sad truth nowadays, having been involved in hiring in the past, is that the market is flooded with qualified people, and that if someone achieves the same as you while facing harder adversity, they'll probably make more of a mark in the interview than you will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDOXO Posted October 23, 2019 Report Share Posted October 23, 2019 Other than singing of Tommy Robinson what else was sung or gesticulated etc. I am getting a bit confused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTRFTG Posted October 23, 2019 Report Share Posted October 23, 2019 2 hours ago, EnderMB said: A key example is in automatic hand washers in bathrooms. If you read the FM press (sadly I'm obliged,) you'll know 'that' video showed Marriott using the cheapest, most defective soap dispensers on the market. One way in which we are equal is we all emit heat (IR) and skin tone makes sweet FA difference to that. I assure you bog-standard (every pun intended) automated doors, active controls and security detection systems work just dandy across all sectors of society. You'll also have experienced that technology found on most phones these days has little issue in handling skin tone. I was directly involved in the development of biometric identity management within the public sector and whilst that's improved leaps and bounds you'll have seen continued press around issues with automated passport recognition, which is passed off as a 'race' issue but which isn't. There are a number of non racial issues that produce the same effect and which relate to lack of definition at key points to be measured. One common issue (along with facial disfigurement) being those with dark skin pigmentation tend more to have matte complexions (less hair, perspire less,) plus such individuals also tend to wear less make-up. The key features on which the algorithms are based in extremis struggle to identify areas of contrast, or contrast in areas where it's normally found. It's rare, but inevitable given the permutations out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AppyDAZE Posted October 23, 2019 Report Share Posted October 23, 2019 51 minutes ago, BTRFTG said: If you read the FM press (sadly I'm obliged,) you'll know 'that' video showed Marriott using the cheapest, most defective soap dispensers on the market. One way in which we are equal is we all emit heat (IR) and skin tone makes sweet FA difference to that. I assure you bog-standard (every pun intended) automated doors, active controls and security detection systems work just dandy across all sectors of society. You'll also have experienced that technology found on most phones these days has little issue in handling skin tone. I was directly involved in the development of biometric identity management within the public sector and whilst that's improved leaps and bounds you'll have seen continued press around issues with automated passport recognition, which is passed off as a 'race' issue but which isn't. There are a number of non racial issues that produce the same effect and which relate to lack of definition at key points to be measured. One common issue (along with facial disfigurement) being those with dark skin pigmentation tend more to have matte complexions (less hair, perspire less,) plus such individuals also tend to wear less make-up. The key features on which the algorithms are based in extremis struggle to identify areas of contrast, or contrast in areas where it's normally found. It's rare, but inevitable given the permutations out there. Ooh, get you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshtonGreat Posted October 23, 2019 Report Share Posted October 23, 2019 The problem with positive discrimination is that it's rarely representative Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The dastardly red Posted October 23, 2019 Report Share Posted October 23, 2019 This whole thing is just so unbelievably depressing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Constant Rabbit Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 On 23/10/2019 at 00:19, RonWalker said: @SX227 - You are very angry for someone complaining about everyone else being offended. You sure you’re ok? @SX227 - You are very angry for someone complaining about everyone else being offended. You sure you’re ok? Here we go again Barrymanc and now Ronniewalker Usual snarky antifa type reponses. Step 1: Aggression - Nazi!! Racist!!! Scum!! Step 2: Be patronising - 'you ok Hun' , 'You off your meds' etc etc Step 3: Boast about your intellectual prowess (as the person with an opposing view is simply too stupid to understand the magnificence of your worldview) Step 4: I refuse to converse anymore as the insults and patronism aren't working - fin Rabid left wingers and Antifa types are worse than the far right. The National Socialist Workers Party. The Irony..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron W Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 10 minutes ago, SX227 said: @SX227 - You are very angry for someone complaining about everyone else being offended. You sure you’re ok? Here we go again Barrymanc and now Ronniewalker Usual snarky antifa type reponses. Step 1: Aggression - Nazi!! Racist!!! Scum!! Step 2: Be patronising - 'you ok Hun' , 'You off your meds' etc etc Step 3: Boast about your intellectual prowess (as the person with an opposing view is simply too stupid to understand the magnificence of your worldview) Step 4: I refuse to converse anymore as the insults and patronism aren't working - fin Rabid left wingers and Antifa types are worse than the far right. The National Socialist Workers Party. The Irony..... Is this meant to be a cutting analysis or are you going to calm down enough to make an actual point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Constant Rabbit Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 15 minutes ago, RonWalker said: Is this meant to be a cutting analysis or are you going to calm down enough to make an actual point? Nah - just wanted to see how quickly you'd come running when I whistled. 3 minutes. Not bad Fido. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshtonGreat Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 15 hours ago, The dastardly red said: This whole thing is just so unbelievably depressing. For what reason? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 Liverpool fans in trouble for racism now. It really is on the rise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS2 Red Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 6 hours ago, SX227 said: The National Socialist Workers Party. The Democratic People's Republic of Korea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted October 24, 2019 Admin Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 1 hour ago, RedDave said: Liverpool fans in trouble for racism now. It really is on the rise I honestly wonder whether it is or is it now just the favoured thing in the press? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PooPants Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 1 hour ago, RedDave said: Liverpool fans in trouble for racism now. It really is on the rise It was a banner of Origi with a big dick wasn't it? I can't see how that's racist tbh, I'd be buzzing if someone said that of me.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Notbarrymanc Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 22 minutes ago, Diddlydonkey said: It was a banner of Origi with a big dick wasn't it? I can't see how that's racist tbh, I'd be buzzing if someone said that of me.. You’re a massive dick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PooPants Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 3 minutes ago, Notbarrymanc said: You’re a massive dick Aw shucks, cheers man! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 39 minutes ago, phantom said: I honestly wonder whether it is or is it now just the favoured thing in the press? 34 minutes ago, Diddlydonkey said: It was a banner of Origi with a big dick wasn't it? I can't see how that's racist tbh, I'd be buzzing if someone said that of me.. Black people are saying it’s racist. When I was in my teens I joked to a black colleague that he probably had a massive penis (I was young and stupid) and he didn’t react particularly well and called me racist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PooPants Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 2 minutes ago, RedDave said: Black people are saying it’s racist. When I was in my teens I joked to a black colleague that he probably had a massive penis (I was young and stupid) and he didn’t react particularly well and called me racist. Fair, perhaps ignorance on my part as my black mate revels in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Red Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 37 minutes ago, Diddlydonkey said: It was a banner of Origi with a big dick wasn't it? I can't see how that's racist tbh, I'd be buzzing if someone said that of me.. Are you black? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The dastardly red Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 4 hours ago, AshtonGreat said: For what reason? Because I'm sad that fans were chanting Tommy Robinson's name at Luton. I'm embarrassed that we appear in the press because of it. It upsets me that our city and our country are nowhere near as progressive as I once thought they were. Personally, I find this bickering over what's racist and what isn't to be utterly depressing and I'm starting to lose a bit of hope in people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the frampton balti Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 There is a racism problem at bristol city .We should be particularly sensitive about this because our city has a history of wealth generated by racist slavery and ashton gate is the first football ground to have a reported incidence of racist abuse. (See the Walter Tull story) I dont think its good enough to say that all football clubs are as bad. We can and should be better than other football clubs. Lets set up a racist singing section at AG and flush these bastards out! Section Hatey Free any one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 I can't agree that we have any particular problem with racism as a club or a fanbase. Depends how you define a problem too? Much as I didn't like the events at Luton, do we think it would have made it into the news and up the news agenda had it been say 6 months ago? Before the FA started pushing it with UEFA due to events in Montenegro. Not saying it wasn't newsworthy of course, but there has also been a significantly larger spotlight than the past on this issue in the UK of late. Would be good to identify them yes, but think @Olé summed it up well on the OSIB podcast. It's downright selfish and I suppose in a sense anti social to sing songs like those at Luton as well. Clearly racism is not acceptable though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numero Uno Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 8 hours ago, RedDave said: Liverpool fans in trouble for racism now. It really is on the rise They are after one fan I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshtonGreat Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 9 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: I can't agree that we have any particular problem with racism as a club or a fanbase. Depends how you define a problem too? Much as I didn't like the events at Luton, do we think it would have made it into the news and up the news agenda had it been say 6 months ago? Before the FA started pushing it with UEFA due to events in Montenegro. Not saying it wasn't newsworthy of course, but there has also been a significantly larger spotlight than the past on this issue in the UK of late. Would be good to identify them yes, but think @Olé summed it up well on the OSIB podcast. It's downright selfish and I suppose in a sense anti social to sing songs like those at Luton as well. I agree. I don't think I've heard or seen any racist activity either at City or in the city since the 80s. That's not to say it doesn't happen, but it's relatively rare these days. I'm not sure a bunch of drunken dufuses singing some stupid chants at a football match warrants 15 pages on a forum. As regrettable as it was, there are countless horrific crimes happening every day that get barely a mention on here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 12 minutes ago, AshtonGreat said: I agree. I don't think I've heard or seen any racist activity either at City or in the city since the 80s. That's not to say it doesn't happen, but it's relatively rare these days. I'm not sure a bunch of drunken dufuses singing some stupid chants at a football match warrants 15 pages on a forum. As regrettable as it was, there are countless horrific crimes happening every day that get barely a mention on here. Depends what you define as racism I guess- a few times vs Leicester in the past some of the chants have been contentious let's say. Yes and no. In this climate it might? We as a nation/FA are making a big deal of it, rightly at UEFA level, which in turn shines a light on the UK. The fact there were so many media reports, and the stuff about the police working with City on it means there is plenty to discuss and debate in this thread. Yep agreed- for the non football Chat bit though IMO. Like reasonable chunks of this thread arguably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshtonGreat Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 3 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: Depends what you define as racism I guess- a few times vs Leicester some of the chants have been contentious let's say. Yes and no. In this climate it might? We as a nation/FA are making a big deal of it, rightly at UEFA level, which in turn shines a light on the UK. The fact there were so many media reports, and the stuff about the police working with City on it means there is plenty to discuss and debate in this thread. Yep agreed- for the non football Chat bit though IMO. Like reasonable chunks of this thread arguably. Yeah I guess Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swanker Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 1 hour ago, the frampton balti said: There is a racism problem at bristol city .We should be particularly sensitive about this because our city has a history of wealth generated by racist slavery and ashton gate is the first football ground to have a reported incidence of racist abuse. (See the Walter Tull story) I dont think its good enough to say that all football clubs are as bad. We can and should be better than other football clubs. Lets set up a racist singing section at AG and flush these bastards out! Section Hatey Free any one? Is this a wind up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 Hi @JulieH We are still waiting on the legislation to which Cowshed and Ashton Park were referring, the legislation that differentiates the chants I think it was. Indeed, believe I heard a chant or 2 from the away end last night which referenced Wales or Welsh! Presumably this was aimed at us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the frampton balti Posted October 24, 2019 Report Share Posted October 24, 2019 1 hour ago, swanker said: Is this a wind up? Which bit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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