Ziderarmy Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 Just watching Gerwyn Price v Michael Van Gerwen, sections of the crowd are chanting sheep, sheep, sheep sh&£@r at Price who is obviously Welsh. Is this racist? Banter? Harmless fun? Will these darts fans be identified by cctv and banned from future events? Double standards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshtonGreat Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 8 minutes ago, ziderheadarmy said: Just watching Gerwyn Price v Michael Van Gerwyn, sections of the crowd are chanting sheep, sheep, sheep sh&£@r at Price who is obviously Welsh. Is this racist? Banter? Harmless fun? Will these darts fans be identified by cctv and banned from future events? Double standards? There's a lot of Gerwyns in there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
city1983 Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 14 minutes ago, ziderheadarmy said: Just watching Gerwyn Price v Michael Van Gerwen, sections of the crowd are chanting sheep, sheep, sheep sh&£@r at Price who is obviously Welsh. Is this racist? Banter? Harmless fun? Will these darts fans be identified by cctv and banned from future events? Double standards? Idiot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torpey'sBigToe Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 Not really. It’s a valid question. Where would you draw the line? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ziderarmy Posted October 20, 2019 Author Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 4 minutes ago, city1983 said: Idiot @city1983 Intelligent post. Well done. 1 minute ago, Torpey'sBigToe said: Not really. It’s a valid question. Where would you draw the line? Thank you, this is my question in essence. You need a line I expect but what’s funny to one person could well upset another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torpey'sBigToe Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 The problem, I think, is that ‘racism’ seems to be defined by abuse of people of a different ethnicity, not nationality. Is that differentiation not in itself racist? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsquirrel Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 is it any different to paddy,jock and taff though? or are they swear words now too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ziderarmy Posted October 20, 2019 Author Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 That’s my point. It’s difficult now. I don’t personally see Jock or Taffy as derogatory. It’s like Aussies calling us Poms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
189thoughts Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 42 minutes ago, ziderheadarmy said: 43 minutes ago, ziderheadarmy said: Just watching Gerwyn Price v Michael Van Gerwen, sections of the crowd are chanting sheep, sheep, sheep sh&£@r at Price who is obviously Welsh. Is this racist? Banter? Harmless fun? Will these darts fans be identified by cctv and banned from future events? Double standards? If you seriously can't differentiate between national rivalry/banter and racism then God help you. 11 minutes ago, redsquirrel said: is it any different to paddy,jock and taff though? or are they swear words now too? I've heard Paddy get used in a discriminating way but its not quite comparable to racism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torpey'sBigToe Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 Exactly. If a welsh Cardiff (or other team) player complain to the officials at being called a sheep fondler, would the game be stopped/abandoned? For consistency, it should be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ziderarmy Posted October 20, 2019 Author Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 2 minutes ago, Torpey'sBigToe said: Exactly. If a welsh Cardiff (or other team) player complain to the officials at being called a sheep fondler, would the game be stopped/abandoned? For consistency, it should be. Yes this was my point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDOXO Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 I made this point on another thread. Is sheep shagger a racist comment or just observational humor aimed at a particular culture. To be frank most of us know what is banter and where the line is. Some don’t! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torpey'sBigToe Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 7 minutes ago, Neutral said: If you seriously can't differentiate between national rivalry/banter and racism then God help you. If you think that every individual that you might aim a particular term at would all deem it to be banter, as opposed to derogatory, then god help you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TinMan's left peg Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 Going to give people the benefit of the doubt here and assume everyone is well meaning. The difference is hundreds of years of genocide and oppression based on white supremacy. Context is important. Taunting Welsh people with stereotypes might not be the pinnacle of wit but no, it’s not the same as racist chanting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AppyDAZE Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 The Welsh are a different "race" ? Oh, right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!james Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 Context. These are the sort of people who's Twitter bio says: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redinthehead Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 If you think chanting things like that at Welsh people is really offensive the easiest thing to do is not to chant it. This odd double standards argument that pops up on here makes no sense unless you take enjoyment in mocking towns and cities for having large Asian populations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torpey'sBigToe Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 10 minutes ago, TinMan's left peg said: Going to give people the benefit of the doubt here and assume everyone is well meaning. The difference is hundreds of years of genocide and oppression based on white supremacy. Context is important. Taunting Welsh people with stereotypes might not be the pinnacle of wit but no, it’s not the same as racist chanting. I see what you’re trying to say, but you make it sound like the English never spent years fighting and persecuting the welsh, Scottish or Irish at any point... ‘white supremacy’ is a little blinkered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AppyDAZE Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 13 minutes ago, !james said: Context. These are the sort of people who's Twitter bio says: Nice belly, Alan. Divorced? Surely not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AppyDAZE Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 This country really does seem to appear more and more to consist of the haves and have nots these days... and we're talking brains by the way , in case you wondered Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torpey'sBigToe Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 its really whether the words are said with any malice that makes the difference, as well as how the ‘victim’ perceives it. As long as both sides see it as being good natured, there’s no issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
189thoughts Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 28 minutes ago, Torpey'sBigToe said: If you think that every individual that you might aim a particular term at would all deem it to be banter, as opposed to derogatory, then god help you. The thing is mate, I don't aim those terms. I'm half Irish with Welsh family. I can just clearly see the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 12 minutes ago, AppyDAZE said: Nice belly, Alan. Divorced? Surely not I wonder which direction he gets swiped the most on Tinder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron W Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 1 hour ago, Torpey'sBigToe said: The problem, I think, is that ‘racism’ seems to be defined by abuse of people of a different ethnicity, not nationality. Is that differentiation not in itself racist? Let me spell this out in language you may understand, given recent events: 1) How often have Asian/black/people of colour folk been the victims of hate or discriminated against for their ethnicity? 2) How often have Welsh people been victims of hate or been discriminated against for their ethnicity? You're welcome, you can stop pretending to be ignorant now. It’s not funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozo Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 1 hour ago, ziderheadarmy said: Just watching Gerwyn Price v Michael Van Gerwen, sections of the crowd are chanting sheep, sheep, sheep sh&£@r at Price who is obviously Welsh. Is this racist? Banter? Harmless fun? Will these darts fans be identified by cctv and banned from future events? Double standards? I've got an answer for you... It depends on precedent. So, it depends on what's gone on before. Why is the 'n' word so bad? Because it was used during slavery and racist attacks. Why is the 'p' word so bad? Because it was used by racist aggressors. Alternatively... Why is 'pom' not an especially bad word? Well because the English have never been subordinated, attacked or dehumanised by Australians (cricket fans may disagree). So, when you consider using the word 'taff' or the sheep accusations, just consider first whether there is a current context, or a precedent, that would make the use of the word particularly cruel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhistleHappy Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 All I know is, I learned this at an early age.... ...you gotta stay out of the Black and into the Red cos you get nothin' in this game for two in a bed! (cant help myself, I'm still well into the Red!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 30 minutes ago, !james said: Context. These are the sort of people who's Twitter bio says: Parody account surely! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AppyDAZE Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 7 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: :D Parody account surely! 37 minutes ago, !james said: Context. These are the sort of people who's Twitter bio says: Voted OUT and he's from Brighton... and before you accuse me of insinuating anything dodgy, I've said nothing btw But you can only imagine this guy's views on THOSE people Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murraysrightplum Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 41 minutes ago, REDOXO said: I made this point on another thread. Is sheep shagger a racist comment or just observational humor aimed at a particular culture. To be frank most of us know what is banter and where the line is. Some don’t! What you been observing?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torpey'sBigToe Posted October 20, 2019 Report Share Posted October 20, 2019 12 minutes ago, RonWalker said: Let me spell this out in language you may understand, given recent events: 1) How often have Asian/black/people of colour folk been the victims of hate or discriminated against for their ethnicity? 2) How often have Welsh people been victims of hate or been discriminated against for their ethnicity? You're welcome, you can stop pretending to be ignorant now. It’s not funny. That doesn’t mean it’s not racist... It’s contextual, which is the point. You’re welcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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