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2 hours ago, hodge said:

PGMOL saying red card not overturned because Son's challenge endangered the safety of Gomes, but they don't know at which point his leg broke, whether it was before or after the following challenge.

So basically, any trip on a player is now an automatic red card offence based on a player potentially being caught again after the trip and breaking their leg?

What ******* nonsense!

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Joke of a red card, Atkinson had a yellow in his hand to start with and since when have cards been dished out due to injuries? Loads of injuries caused by totally fair and legal tackles. 

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4 hours ago, hodge said:

PGMOL saying red card not overturned because Son's challenge endangered the safety of Gomes, but they don't know at which point his leg broke, whether it was before or after the following challenge.

That's just nonsense. They are making up the rules as they go along each week. By that token the trip on Massengo at Barnsley was a straight red, and the follow up would probably warrant a lifetime ban. It was a trip, deliberate, yellow. 

Edited by italian dave

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In the bad old days ( or perhaps the good old days?) it was often commented that a referee had lost control of a game, usually when it got out of hand.

Watching the Everton highlights tonight and the VAR incidents it struck me that the referee had lost control , as he was no longer the person making the decisions. I also think there is a real danger that referees will be increasingly abdicating responsibility for contentious decisions in the hope that VAR will address them and any flack over the decision will then fall on VAR.

As was mentioned on MOTD, I still fail to understand why referees are not referring to pitch side monitors, as from fans' point of view it would surely better that the on field referee was making the final decision following a review of the incident, than the current situation when there is a complete vacuum while the VAR review takes place in a studio miles from the ground.

Just heard MOTD talking about the statement issued over Son's red card, justifying it on the basis that Son's challenge endanger the Everton player subsequently and also that the red card reflected the seriousness of the injury. I'm sorry but this seems like making the rules up as they go along. Son's challenge was a foul and probably a yellow card, but could not see it as reckless. Applying that logic back in the day, then Shilton would have been sent off when Cheesley came down and bust his knee.

There is just too much interference in the game, the rules of the game and the officiating during games this is becoming more dominant that the players' performance on the pitch and if the authorities are not careful they will make the game so sterile that it will lose it's appeal.

P.S. @italian dave saw your post after I posted mine saying the same about making the rules up as they go along - great minds and all of that!

Edited by downendcity
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It’s easier to forgive a ref for getting it wrong seeing it once, than forgive a team of refs for getting it wrong having seen it 50 times from 10 different angles. 
 

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http://www.thefa.com/football-rules-governance/lawsandrules/laws/football-11-11/law-12---fouls-and-misconduct

Under "Serious Foul Play", yes it might offer a provision for a straight red for Son.

"A tackle or challenge that endangers the safety of an opponent or uses excessive force or brutality must be sanctioned as serious foul play".

Endangers safety? Well it's definitely not deliberate but could be argued. Likewise, excessive force? Again, could make a case perhaps. Will watch it back however.

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In AFL the Ump blows the whistle for 'time off' when there is a free-kick/goal/whatever, the 'time on' when play restarts.

It stops and starts the game time clock.

 

Use it in football - blow the whistle  - clock stops. You can roll around the floor for 10 minutes if you want while VAR is used.

You still get a full 90 minutes played.

 

Really should be used anyway - a game apparently has something like 68 minutes where the ball is being used.The rest, fouls, back-chat, subs, good old time wasting.

 

Make the buggers play 90 - some of them are on £300,000 a week anyway!!

 

VAR besides being stupid, makes you realise just how little actual play you get for your money.

In AFL,NRL - you get the full allotted time of the game in motion - as you should.

 

 

Edited by SX227
spelling

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Honestly, if they keep VAR (which I'm 100% they will), you can stick promotion to the prem where the sun don't shine. Its an abomination and killing any enjoyment.  

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5 hours ago, cityloyal473 said:

Honestly, if they keep VAR (which I'm 100% they will), you can stick promotion to the prem where the sun don't shine. Its an abomination and killing any enjoyment.  

Yep totally agree, I wouldn't go anywhere near a game as a fan if VAR was involved.

It is an utter disgrace, I just hope that enough people and pro's will think this, to ensure it is soon removed.

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17 hours ago, cityloyal473 said:

Honestly, if they keep VAR (which I'm 100% they will), you can stick promotion to the prem where the sun don't shine. Its an abomination and killing any enjoyment.  

Yep. If it ever comes to the Championship I reckon I`m done with football.

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Although not strictly VAR, the latest twist in the Gomez injury is that after the ref originally went to award a yellow but then having seen the extent of Gomez's injury changed it it to red, today the red card has been rescinded.

Was odds on to happen as otherwise it would have created a difficult precedent, whereby the type of card dished out would be dependant on the extent of injury suffered by the opposition player.

 

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1 hour ago, downendcity said:

Although not strictly VAR, the latest twist in the Gomez injury is that after the ref originally went to award a yellow but then having seen the extent of Gomez's injury changed it it to red, today the red card has been rescinded.

Was odds on to happen as otherwise it would have created a difficult precedent, whereby the type of card dished out would be dependant on the extent of injury suffered by the opposition player.

 

Really poor to get it wrong at the time when it was so obvious it wasn’t a red. 

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Why can't they just say to close to call, stand by ref's decision?

Not that I want VAR in any shape or form. Nobody is going to celebrate a goal anymore, unbelievable they can't see that it's sucking all the joy from the game.

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It seems to work sooooo much better in Europe!

the reason .....  Refs go and look at the screen on the touch line and still make the final decision. 
 

players rarely argue with the ref and the time taken is significantly less than we are seeing in the Premier.

Come on Premier League - do it the same way .........  please!!!

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Re the Sheffield Utd one and screen shot above I thought the offside had to be a part of the body with which you could score a goal with. That's his hand offside !

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50 minutes ago, FrozenRobin said:

 

 

 

look at his head and shoulder

 

Head and shoulder from the defender further forward than the knee that they drew the line from.

Also how many phases back do they check ...

 

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It's not VAR  that is killing the game , it's the refs that don't use it properly.  

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Positions changing between frames, angles of the camera etc. Just too much grey area to be making calls like that offside for such marginal differences.

I think the only way is to have a thicker line on the VAR replays that can allow for these potential discrepancies - anything falling inside it is not conclusive enough, anything outside has the potential to be changed.
 

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5 minutes ago, Up The City! said:

How the hell was that not a penalty? Think the fact Liverpool scored had a big impact on the decision. 

Silva handled it first.

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5 minutes ago, Super said:

Silva handled it first.

Then it's a free kick to Liverpool, you can't play advantage ignore a blatant pen and just let the game cary on. Only 2 decision that can be given there, neither are a goal for Liverpool. 

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As it stands, or as its being applied in the Premier League, VAR is not fit for purpose. And it won't be unless a way can be found to make it almost instantaneous, as with goal line technology. 

In most sports where technology is used it is after the event I. E. Once play has been stopped and where the ball is 'dead'. For example, in Rugby the touch lines, and indeed the player if it contact with the ball, are deemed out of play whereas in football a ball on the line is deemed in play which continues. While the lines are in during tennis most technology decisions are made when the ball has fizzed past an opponent and play has stopped. 

For me VAR has proved a failure and should cease at the end of the season until it improves. I don't for one minute of course think this will happen, especially when Championship refs have been told to attend VAR training. Not that VAR training will make any difference if they don't know the laws of the game in the first place, like the plonker who disallowed Firmino's 'goal' against Villa when the only part of his body 'offside' was one it is illegal to score with. This only proved that we have to revert to clear daylight before offside can be given. The idea that a player can be offside because he takes a size 11 boot as opposed to a size 9 is patently ridiculous. 

VAR is not to be used to referee the game but to clear up obvious errors. Accordingly, it should be made clear that the man in the middle of the pitch is in charge and should be able to tell the man in the booth miles from the ground to go forth and multiply, or something politer, if he is content with his decision. 

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Just now, wayne allisons tongues said:

No penalty given due to Alexander Arnold atm is in a natural position according to PL

I think I agree with that - they are down by his side and I don’t think you have to put arms behind your back.

Its certainly not a deliberate handball which I guess would be a ‘clear and obvious’ error missed by the referee. 

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