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Diesel ban near AG (merged)


Red Army 75

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It's a bloody joke.

Reason Bristol is polluted is because of all the pedestrian crossings. Traffic is stood still not going anywhere.

Bridges and Subways were the answer...and we got rid of them.

Add to the fact a modern diesel is cleaner than a petrol car.

And public transport isn't efficient enough.

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Ah, a return to the 60s plan of a two level centre - motors on the lower with pedestrians walking on a web of footbridges above. Now there's a plan that was ahead of its time. Pity it's dead now.

Not quite sure about what effect of banning all diesels it will have on the life of the city. Is removing them, including the revered public transport, the answer? How will goods move? Taxis: they are expensive enough without putting the 'tax' into taxi and might cause a cull.

Clearly, the long overdue Clean Air Plan was dragging and given a massive chivvy-up when the Government started legal proceedings. Marvin must have had a fright. He is also behind the proposed massive redevelopment of the Harbourside road system, what with its controversial ideas of building some strange roads around the Cumberland Basin. And speaking of his nibbs, is there an important Mayoral election coming up soon? Big plans are coming out just in time, eh? Hmmm...

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6 hours ago, spudski said:

It's a bloody joke.

Reason Bristol is polluted is because of all the pedestrian crossings. Traffic is stood still not going anywhere.

Bridges and Subways were the answer...and we got rid of them.

Add to the fact a modern diesel is cleaner than a petrol car.

And public transport isn't efficient enough.

Add to that, people have been encouraged to buy diesel cars and now face being penalised.  

Totally agree about the ridiculous road planning and layouts, the removal of footbridges and underpasses is insane, not replacing the flyover at Temple Meads / Redcliffe is another poor decision.

No way would I use public transport to get to/from work, it would take far too long.

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I certainly won't be getting rid of my diesel if this plan comes in for good. Along with that I also just will not drive into town ever and spend money there either. If it does go as far as Ashton Gate I will not renew my season ticket either as it is my transport to games. 

Too many pedestrian crossings in town - I have to say I haven't noticed (along with the lights and crossings through Redfield/Lawrence Hill)......

Bristol is a complete joke when it comes to the roads, and all the changes must be made from someone sat in an office in another City, another great move is out by Frenchay where you now have to drive further and congest the roundabout by the M32 as the turning to Hambrook has been closed.

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First step to their longed for congestion charge? I do wonder about those in charge in Bristol. As said above about coach and train stations, then try and potentially stop some people using the shopping centre while complying that people aren’t using the shopping centre.

Same geniuses that don’t want the Arena next to a major rail network, but want to put it where, everyone to use the roads, while complaining  that the pollution is caused by too many people using the roads. 

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I got rid of a diesel a couple of years back and replaced it with a low emissions petrol engine.

No green agenda, just needed a smaller car as my travelling habits changed and I might not use my car for a couple of weeks and when I do, it's mostly for short local journeys.

Will banning diesel cars make much of a difference? I doubt it.

Will making Bristol more difficult to visit have a knock on effect? More than likely. With Cribbs a local beneficiary - free parking and diesel friendly!

What they should be doing, is improving public transport so the motivation to use any car is reduced, which if course they won't, as that would cost money.

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I'm not one of the Extinction Rebellion fans and in particular think they scored a huge own goal with their Tube stuff.

That said, it will- don't just mean this, but as a whole necessitate a major change in how people live. Just will, how far down the line I'm unsure.

Without decent and affordable alternatives at least as a starting point though, it'll be pointless- but talking about the wider issue, if people think this is something major, it's really  a pretty thin end of a major wedge! Our city is and has been hopeless on the public transport front though.

The goalposts suddenly shifting on diesel- and I say this as a non driver too- did the issue no favours though!

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20 minutes ago, Reigate Red said:

Am I missing something...….. so I drive to Bristol in my diesel car all the way from Surrey and get to the end of the M32 - then what am I supposed to do? Leave it on the hard shoulder and walk?

Your situation sounds less than ideal, and naturally I have sympathy with it and people in your boat.

However, OTOH wider issue wise- have you any better ideas? I'm not fully sold on it myself as it goes.

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10 hours ago, RedLionLad said:

Not building a bus/coach station alongside our train station tells you everything you need to know about the council’s transport planners. That alone would have stopped so many unnecessary taxi journeys between the two sites.

Hey, but where would we have put the desperately needed twenty-one storey highrise student accommodation blocks if we'd put an integrated public transport hub bus station there handily adjacent to the train station? 

Come on RRL show some priorities eh?  

 

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1 minute ago, WhistleHappy said:

Hey, but where would we have put the desperately needed twenty-one storey highrise student accommodation blocks if we'd put an integrated public transport hub bus station there handily adjacent to the train station? 

Come on RRL show some priorities eh?  

 

Agree 1m% on this!

Still, in the coming decades I suspect significant lifestyle changes will be inevitable- but yes, totally agree- the student flat thing is just...well.

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21 hours ago, spudski said:

It's a bloody joke.

Reason Bristol is polluted is because of all the pedestrian crossings. Traffic is stood still not going anywhere.

Bridges and Subways were the answer...and we got rid of them.

Add to the fact a modern diesel is cleaner than a petrol car.

And public transport isn't efficient enough.

No, the reason Bristol is polluted is volume of traffic. There are far too many cars on our roads and no amount of traffic management is going to solve that fundamental problem. Much of the central area of Bristol is covered by an AQMA where the amount of carbon dioxide in the air is at levels which are dangerous to humans. Hundreds of people in Bristol lose their lives each year due to the city's air pollution problem. It's the same in most other cities in the UK with Leeds being one of the worst. I don't know about you but that says to me that urgent and divisive action is required? Bridges and subways ain't gonna cut the mustard.

Post-2013 diesel cars are better than pre-2013 ones. Frankly, the government should've have done a scrappage scheme on old "dirty" diesels years ago, I had one and believe me the stuff they pump out is disgusting. The government were even taken to court over this inaction (Andrea Leadsom was head of the department at the time, surprise, surprise). It's costing people their lives and she sat there and did nothing about it. Typical callous Tory, anyway I digress...

Modern diesels are not cleaner than petrol's because of the amount of nitrogen oxides they produce which have been linked to all manner of respiratory diseases. The government got this wrong as previously they thought modern diesels were cleaner but the VW emissions scandal proved this not to be the case.

I must admit I have a post-2013 diesel but personally I am fully in favour of anything that will clean up the air in our city in the shortest amount of time possible. Totally agree with others that the public transport needs sorting out too...…….

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I know its too late now, but does anyone have old plans of the rail network that used to serve Bristol and connect the surrounding  communities pre Beeching?  

Why the **** we continue trusting the wisdom of so called 'experts' after decades of incompetent systematic destruction of what was good and clearly obvious to anyone using a modicum of common sense... We're going around in ever decreasing circles 'fixing' (& f'ing up again) the disastrous 'fixes' of previous national and local authority incompetents. 

Too many cooks continue to spoil the broth, when what was always needed was a small think tank of knowledgeable people sat around a table with a pot of tea!  (whatever has happened to Britain's great engineers of yesteryear, they're all too clever and overqualified by half nowadays, over payed and common sense has been consigned to room 101.

A plan of those lost and lamented local rail lines and stations would without doubt show where it all went wrong... What a waste, Fishponds, StapleHill, Mangotsfield Oldland Common, Bitton etc etc all linked to Bristol /Bath.. Imagine what loops like we used to have such as these throughout the region would be worth nowadays.. Priceless and destroyed by bloody 'experts' .

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I'm not too bothered. Both our cars are diesel because we were doing lots of motorway miles but my next will be electric and the wife will probably do the same. If this restriction comes in I'll swap it out sooner (doubt it will pass).  Air quality is awful in Bristol and needs sorting. They should however sort out the park and ride options with proper funding and stop infilling flats everywhere. Bristol doesn't need more people, the UK needs more towns and villages not bigger cities.

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13 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

No, the reason Bristol is polluted is volume of traffic. There are far too many cars on our roads and no amount of traffic management is going to solve that fundamental problem. Much of the central area of Bristol is covered by an AQMA where the amount of carbon dioxide in the air is at levels which are dangerous to humans. Hundreds of people in Bristol lose their lives each year due to the city's air pollution problem. It's the same in most other cities in the UK with Leeds being one of the worst. I don't know about you but that says to me that urgent and divisive action is required? Bridges and subways ain't gonna cut the mustard.

Post-2013 diesel cars are better than pre-2013 ones. Frankly, the government should've have done a scrappage scheme on old "dirty" diesels years ago, I had one and believe me the stuff they pump out is disgusting. The government were even taken to court over this inaction (Andrea Leadsom was head of the department at the time, surprise, surprise). It's costing people their lives and she sat there and did nothing about it. Typical callous Tory, anyway I digress...

Modern diesels are not cleaner than petrol's because of the amount of nitrogen oxides they produce which have been linked to all manner of respiratory diseases. The government got this wrong as previously they thought modern diesels were cleaner but the VW emissions scandal proved this not to be the case.

I must admit I have a post-2013 diesel but personally I am fully in favour of anything that will clean up the air in our city in the shortest amount of time possible. Totally agree with others that the public transport needs sorting out too...…….

Yes there is a massive amount of traffic...however the road system isn't conducive to keeping it moving. It's stationary on so many accounts because of traffic lights and Pedestrian crossing. You've only got to look at the amount between the M32 and bus depot. Madness... don't get me started on the four zebra crossings at St Mary Redcliffe roundabout.

The reason people still choose to drive is because the public transport system just isn't efficient enough. Everyone wants to do their bit for the environment...but it doesn't work...penalising people with Diesel cars is ridiculous. It makes no sense. Just a notion to get the Bristol Council noticed by the rest of the country.

As an Island that has limited room for infra structure we will eventually become like Hong Kong.

Just keep letting people in and watch us implode.

But some wise spark thinks banning a few diesels is going to make a difference... don't make me laugh.

And I don't even own a Diesel.

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Just now, spudski said:

Yes there is a massive amount of traffic...however the road system isn't conducive to keeping it moving. It's stationary on so many accounts because of traffic lights and Pedestrian crossing. You've only got to look at the amount between the M32 and bus depot. Madness... don't get me started on the four zebra crossings at St Mary Redcliffe roundabout.

No, it's not conducive to keeping traffic moving but I'm afraid it's a bit late to fix it now! I'd imagine the last thing people want is the whole of the road system to be dug up/more road works etc. Also, small point but a lot of cars post 2013 now have start-stop technology where the engine cuts at the lights so I'm not buying this as the big issue. It's number of vehicles. 

Just now, spudski said:

The reason people still choose to drive is because the public transport system just isn't efficient enough. Everyone wants to do their bit for the environment...but it doesn't work...penalising people with Diesel cars is ridiculous. It makes no sense. Just a notion to get the Bristol Council noticed by the rest of the country.

It's not a "notion". It's based on scientific evidence. Nitrogen oxides are dangerous to humans. 

Just now, spudski said:

But some wise spark thinks banning a few diesels is going to make a difference... don't make me laugh.

And I don't even own a Diesel.

Even if it only saves a few lives surely it's worth doing? It's a small step along the way and whether you like it or not change is coming. Volvo don't even make petrol/diesels anymore, they're all hybrid or electric. 

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1 minute ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Volvo don't even make petrol/diesels anymore, they're all hybrid or electric. 

Well done on Volvo, but surely the bottom line is if everybody could afford an electric/hybrid car they surely wouldn't have an issue with buying/driving one - but they just cannot afford one. 

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30 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

No, it's not conducive to keeping traffic moving but I'm afraid it's a bit late to fix it now! I'd imagine the last thing people want is the whole of the road system to be dug up/more road works etc. Also, small point but a lot of cars post 2013 now have start-stop technology where the engine cuts at the lights so I'm not buying this as the big issue. It's number of vehicles. 

It's not a "notion". It's based on scientific evidence. Nitrogen oxides are dangerous to humans. 

Even if it only saves a few lives surely it's worth doing? It's a small step along the way and whether you like it or not change is coming. Volvo don't even make petrol/diesels anymore, they're all hybrid or electric. 

A good start would be for more Companies to get people to work from home. Many don't need to go into an office anymore with today's technology.

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2 hours ago, Nibor said:

I'm not too bothered. Both our cars are diesel because we were doing lots of motorway miles but my next will be electric and the wife will probably do the same. If this restriction comes in I'll swap it out sooner (doubt it will pass).  Air quality is awful in Bristol and needs sorting. They should however sort out the park and ride options with proper funding and stop infilling flats everywhere. Bristol doesn't need more people, the UK needs more towns and villages not bigger cities.

I would have an electric car for my daily commute, but I can’t afford one, so that’s out of the window.  I need my diesel vehicle for my life away from work, so no choice in that at the moment, unless I give up my hobbies and social life.

Public transport is a joke, I live 12 miles from work, one side of Bristol to the other, 35 minutes from my drive to my work parking space, buses would be a minimum of 1:45 each way, with either two or 3 buses being involved , plus the walking times. So realistically, with bus waiting times and walking times, 2-3 hours each way to work.  That isn’t happening.

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1 hour ago, spudski said:

A good start would be for more Companies to get people to work from home. Many don't need to go into an office anymore with today's technology.

Depends on your job. I think the HSE would take a dim view of my chemical plant being remotely operated!

But yeah, definitely a lot of pen pusher type jobs.

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I haven’t read all the article, but is this all diesel vehicles or just privately owned ones? If it is all, and I think it is, then what about all the company diesel vehicles used for deliveries and services, eg Water, electric etc. A family member works for a utility company and he is in and out of the city centre several times a day. What is he meant to do, park up and carry his tools ( not possible by the way)

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4 minutes ago, Maesknoll Red said:

I would have an electric car for my daily commute, but I can’t afford one, so that’s out of the window.  I need my diesel vehicle for my life away from work, so no choice in that at the moment, unless I give up my hobbies and social life.

Public transport is a joke, I live 12 miles from work, one side of Bristol to the other, 35 minutes from my drive to my work parking space, buses would be a minimum of 1:45 each way, with either two or 3 buses being involved , plus the walking times. So realistically, with bus waiting times and walking times, 2-3 hours each way to work.  That isn’t happening.

There are many ways to handle the situation you describe, they don't all involve driving a diesel through the centre of the city twice a day.

Banning diesels in the centre may not be the best solution to the dangerous level of air pollution or the only solution or the one selected but fundamentally I'd suggest health trumps convenience.

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9 minutes ago, Nibor said:

There are many ways to handle the situation you describe, they don't all involve driving a diesel through the centre of the city twice a day.

Banning diesels in the centre may not be the best solution to the dangerous level of air pollution or the only solution or the one selected but fundamentally I'd suggest health trumps convenience.

Really, many ways for me to get to work, there really aren’t, it’s the bus or drive and I am not spending up to 6 hours a day traveling to and from work.  I am more fortunate than some, I have reasonably flexible hours and work from home some days, but can’t work from home every day, that’s purely due to the nature of the job.

I already try to circuit Bristol, but the incompetence in building a ring road doesn’t help.  A ring road should have slip roads on and off, not traffic lights, roundabouts and intersections.  

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3 minutes ago, Maesknoll Red said:

Really, many ways for me to get to work, there really aren’t, it’s the bus or drive and I am not spending up to 6 hours a day traveling to and from work.  I am more fortunate than some, I have reasonably flexible hours and work from home some days, but can’t work from home every day, that’s purely due to the nature of the job.

I already try to circuit Bristol, but the incompetence in building a ring road doesn’t help.  A ring road should have slip roads on and off, not traffic lights, roundabouts and intersections.  

Move house

Switch jobs

Buy a non diesel runabout

Car share

All some level of inconvenient, sure, but less so than dying.

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