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old_eastender

Ratings from today

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Bentley - 7 - Another solid performance, couple of decent (if expected) saves.

Pedro - 6 - Defended OK and did much better getting forward, but his crosses at times were poor, need Hunt back in the side for me.

Baker - 6 - Largely steady, with some sloppy passes.

Wright - 6 - Largely steady, with a few trademark silly fouls esp. when he went up into their box.

Williams - 8 - Pick of the 3 CBs, quality defending.

Rowe - 5 - Didn't have much to do defensively and was poor going forward.

Nagy - 7 - Saw a lot of the ball and overall neat and tidy with it, faded a bit in last 20 mins.

Brownhill - 6 - Not one of his best, busy but a few overhit passes.

COD - 4 - One good run just before HT than won a corner, aside from that offered very little.

Fammy - 7 - Cleared one of the line, won a lot of defensive balls and did much better holding the ball up.

Wiemann - 6 - Usual endless running, but skied one good chance over and even in the passage of play where we hit the post he should have done better. 

SUBS:

Eliasson - 7 - Series of quality crosses as per usual, we really need to pick a formation to accommodate him starting in home games at least.

Palmer - 5 - Disappointing, hit a couple of poor cross field passes that were cut out and failed to control an Eliasson cross when ball at his feet inside the box.

Rodri - 4 - Looked way off the pace, silly fouls and hopeless attempt near the death to hit over from 8 yards out.

 

 

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25 minutes ago, ohhhshauntaylor said:

What does COD offer? 

Thinking that myself all season. He made a wondergoal last season vs Norwich, cant really understand why he is in the starting eleven time after time.

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I’d struggle to give anyone above a 6 today .. COD would struggle to get a 4 ... Fams 6 would be for his defensive work not his attacking ... not a shot on goal in 90mins and against 10 men for 40 mins is woeful !! 

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5 minutes ago, Garland-sweden said:

Thinking that myself all season. He made a wondergoal last season vs Norwich, cant really understand why he is in the starting eleven time after time.

I think it's because Johnson likes players with energy. Sadly, in our case energy doesn't really translate to goals

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Just now, GILLI said:

I’d struggle to give anyone above a 6 today .. COD would struggle to get a 4 ... Fams 6 would be for his defensive work not his attacking ... not a shot on goal in 90mins and against 10 men for 40 mins is woeful !! 

Very harsh. Pereira, Bentley, Williams, Nagy all over 6. 

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I get what your saying it was such an average non descript game though, that it’s hard to think back at what anyone did to warrant more but the players you said were the ‘better’ players 

Edited by GILLI
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Bentley 7 - Did well at everything he needed to do, like not dropping a decent shot that a Forest player would have pounced on.

Pereira 5 - kept giving it away. Not getting a 4 because he did the occasional good thing on the ball, mainly linked up well with Eliasson. And mainly defended very well.

Rowe 5 - Defended solid enough, but was it him or Pereira who did a absolutely shocking mistake that they should have scored from? Apologies to Rowe on that one if it wasn't him!

But blimey his inability to get in a cross or attack the full back is really starting to annoy me. He is a WING back. How many times have we even seen him cross the ball? Didn't help when Palmer came on who was drifting inside too. We had absolutely nothing on that left side. You have Dasilva or Kelly of last season there and problem solved. Someone who offers some kind of attacking threat. I just could not believe LJ's game plan when with a man advantage is to play it to the right wing at every opportunity. Need to stretch them. Vary the attack. Keep O'Dowda on at least and keep him wide left and bring off Rowe. 

Baker 6 - Very poor on the ball. And thought he was the weakest of our centre backs defensively. Compare him to what Wright does when on a player. Grabban chests a high ball down, Baker in his back just puts out his chest that has zero affect on Grabban. What would Wright do in that situation? A lot more than that! Baker does not get tight enough and is not aggressive enough. Only shows aggression when doing a stupid two footed challenge which he didn't do today, but when he does that is not a good thing!

Wright 7 - Dealt superbly with Ameobi. Thought Pereira did very well on him too. But Wright's strength, the way he goes into players on the ball. Kind of just about passes as a legal challenge most of the time. He is a rock. And actually better than Baker at bringing it out and linking play. Yes, looks awkward, but effective enough at playing football. Those games at right back certainly helped him there.

Williams 7.5 - The best of our centre backs. Thought he got more and more solid as the game went on. His reading of the game is real top quality. Seeing something is going to happen earlier than what most centre backs do. Really tidy on the ball. I think we may need to consider playing him and Kalas in a 2 from now on once Kalas is back.

Nagy 8 - Wow, well ok I get the hype now. I know he has looked class for us before, but that was a very difficult game for him to play so well in. Forest let the likes of Baker have it so they could deny midfielders space. Very compact in there.

His ability to play it early, quickly off either foot. Always looking to move it forward. Very sharp thinker when passing it, chipping it over a players leg for example so it reaches our man. Absolute class. What a signing he is looking now.

Brownhill 6 - Difficult one to score. I don't think our tactics against their tactics helped at all. He was very quiet. Did the occasional very good thing, but had more sloppy moments than usual. Worked his socks off, but for his kind of levels it was a bad day.

O'Dowda 6.5 - Thought like Brownhill it was a tough one with little room to play. But he did drive us on at times. What a run first half. Don't know why he was subbed. Works so hard and does a bit of everything.

Weimann 6 - Close to getting a 5. I don't think he is as good as people say. Or maybe it's simply because him and Fam don't work well. We all know this, so LJ needs to stop playing those 2 together. That cross to no one first half after being sent through by Nagy kind of sums up his ability. Great run, good pace. Gets in a great position where he needs to show a bit of skill, do a trick, hold it up and wait for players to arrive. But as he hasn't really got a trick on the ball, and lacks composure too, he just crosses a ball to no one as he hasn't looked up. Chance second half he has to get over it. Kind of knew he would slice that high and wide on his left foot. 

Diedhiou 7 - Very good first 60 mins. Some of his hold up play was immense. Won headers and also defended well on corners like he always does, saving a goal on the line. Thought he struggled a bit more last 20-30. Eliasson coming on actually didn't suit him as he just doesn't get to those amazing crosses. Wasn't helped with zero service from other side though.

SUBS

Eliasson 9 - Beat his man nearly every single time. Nearly every cross was brilliant. What is impressing me is how much stronger he is looking. Is it because he is fresher than the players on him maybe? Not sure. But there were a few occasions he needed strength to come away with the ball and he certainly showed it. Been saying all season he has to start games. The guy has unreal talent.

Palmer 4 - Thought when he came on that was the wrong move. Did very little right. Not yet seen him look good when in that left sided position in a 4222, which he has played a few times now. 

Rodri 5 - Just didn't get enough of the ball. Maybe should have been sent off for a bad challenge. Overhead kick was a bit unlucky I thought.

Edited by JonDolman
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1 minute ago, JonDolman said:

Bentley 7 - Did well at everything he needed to do, like not dropping a decent shot that a Forest player would have pounced on.

Pereira 5 - kept giving it away. Not getting a 4 because he did the occasional good thing on the ball, mainly linked up well with Eliasson. And mainly defended very well.

Rowe 5 - Defended solid enough, but was it him or Pereira who did a absolutely shocking mistake that they should have scored from? Apologies to Rowe on that one if it wasn't him!

But blimey his inability to get in a cross or attack the full back is really starting to annoy me. He is a WING back. How many times have we even seen him cross the ball? Didn't help when Palmer came on who was drifting inside too. We had absolutely nothing on that left side. You have Dasilva or Kelly of last season there and problem solved. Someone who offers some kind of attacking threat. I just could not believe LJ's game plan when with a man advantage is to play it to the right wing at every opportunity. Need to stretch them. Vary the attack. Keep O'Dowda on at least and keep him wide left and bring off Rowe. 

Baker 6 - Very poor on the ball. And thought he was the weakest of our centre backs defensively. Compare him to what Wright does when on a player. Grabban chests a high ball down, Baker in his back just puts out his chest that has zero affect on Grabban. What would Wright do in that situation? A lot more than that! Baker does not get tight enough and is not aggressive enough. Only shows aggression when doing a stupid two footed challenge which he didn't do today, but when he does that is not a good thing!

Wright 7 - Dealt superbly with Ameobi. Thought Pereira did very well on him too. But Wright's strength, the way he goes into players on the ball. Kind of just about passes as a legal challenge most of the time. He is a rock. And actually better than Baker at bringing it out and linking play. Yes, looks awkward, but effective enough at playing football. Those games at right back certainly helped him there.

Williams 7.5 - The best of our centre backs. Thought he got more and more solid as the game went on. His reading of the game is real top quality. Seeing something is going to happen earlier than what most centre backs do. Really tidy on the ball. I think we may need to consider playing him and Kalas in a 2 from now on once Kalas is back.

Nagy 8 - Wow, well ok I get the hype now. I know he has looked class for us before, but that was a very difficult game for him to play so well in. Forest let the likes of Baker have it so they could deny midfielders space. Very compact in there.

His ability to play it early, quickly off either foot. Always looking to move it forward. Very sharp thinker when passing it, chipping it over a players leg for example so it reaches our man. Absolute class. What a signing he is looking now.

Brownhill 6 - Difficult one to score. I don't think our tactics matched with their tactics helped at all. He was very quiet. Did the occasional very good thing, but had more sloppy moments than usual. Worked his socks off, but for his kind of levels it was a bad day.

O'Dowda 6.5 - Thought like Brownhill it was a tough one with little room to play. But he did drive us on at times. What a run first half. Don't know why he was subbed. Works so hard and does a bit of everything.

Weimann 6 - Close to getting a 5. I don't think he is as good as people say. Or maybe it's simply because him and Fam don't work well. We all know this, so LJ needs to stop playing those 2 together. That cross to no one first half after being sent through by Nagy kind of sums up his ability. Great run, good pace. Gets in a great position where he needs to show a bit of skill, do a trick, hold it up and wait for players to arrive. But as he hasn't really got a trick on the ball, and lacks composure too, he just crosses a ball to no one as he hasn't looked up. Chance second half he has to get over it. Kind of knew he would slice that high and wide on his left foot. 

Diedhiou 7 - Very good first 60 mins. Some of his hold up play was immense. Won headers and also defended well on corners like he always does, saving a goal on the line. Thought he struggled a bit more last 20-30. Eliasson coming on actually didn't suit him as he just doesn't get to those amazing crosses. Wasn't helped with zero service from other side though.

SUBS

Eliasson 9 - Beat his man nearly every single time. Nearly every cross was brilliant. What is impressing me is how much stronger he is looking. Is it because he is fresher than the players on him maybe? Not sure. But there were a few occasions he needed strength to come away with the ball and he certainly showed it. Been saying all season he has to start games. The guy has unreal talent.

Palmer 4 - Thought when he came on that was the wrong move. Did very little right. Not yet seen him look good when in that left sided position in a 4222, which he has played a few times now. 

Rodri 5 - Just didn't get enough of the ball. Maybe should have been sent off for a bad challenge. Overhead kick was a bit unlucky I thought.

We were deffo a more attacking offering the second Eliasson came on ... made a big impact 

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6 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

 

O'Dowda 6.5 - Thought like Brownhill it was a tough one with little room to play. But he did drive us on at times. What a run first half. Don't know why he was subbed. Works so hard and does a bit of everything.

 

Seriously, thought he was his usual anonymous self in that ACM role today. Yes one really good run just before HT, er… that's it. For me, we should have lowered our asking price and got rid in the summer.

 

Edited by old_eastender
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18 minutes ago, AshtonGreat said:

I think it's because Johnson likes players with energy. Sadly, in our case energy doesn't really translate to goals

For me he has no energy in the defensive. When he gets the ball most of the times he runs with it and looking on the ground. Most of the time he has no end product. He seldom score and have few assists even if he start most of the games. Vs Cardiff i think he was good but that is rare.

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3 minutes ago, old_eastender said:

Seriously, thought he was his usual anonymous self in that ACM role today. Yes one really good run just before HT, er… that's it. For me, we should have lowered our asking price and got rid in the summer.

 

I think his work rate in that midfield is immense. Really does a bit of everything for me. Maybe one of those managers love and fans not so much.

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1 minute ago, JonDolman said:

I think his work rate in that midfield is immense. Really does a bit of everything for me. Maybe one of those managers love and fans not so much.

Maybe, LJ clearly sees something in him but for me we have much better options.

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35 minutes ago, RedDave said:

Very harsh. Pereira, Bentley, Williams, Nagy all over 6. 

Agree with others but Pereira was sloppy, poor control, poor lethargic distribution, no overlaps.

he is not worth the agreed fee at the moment imo

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36 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Bentley 7 - Did well at everything he needed to do, like not dropping a decent shot that a Forest player would have pounced on.

Pereira 5 - kept giving it away. Not getting a 4 because he did the occasional good thing on the ball, mainly linked up well with Eliasson. And mainly defended very well.

Rowe 5 - Defended solid enough, but was it him or Pereira who did a absolutely shocking mistake that they should have scored from? Apologies to Rowe on that one if it wasn't him!

But blimey his inability to get in a cross or attack the full back is really starting to annoy me. He is a WING back. How many times have we even seen him cross the ball? Didn't help when Palmer came on who was drifting inside too. We had absolutely nothing on that left side. You have Dasilva or Kelly of last season there and problem solved. Someone who offers some kind of attacking threat. I just could not believe LJ's game plan when with a man advantage is to play it to the right wing at every opportunity. Need to stretch them. Vary the attack. Keep O'Dowda on at least and keep him wide left and bring off Rowe. 

Baker 6 - Very poor on the ball. And thought he was the weakest of our centre backs defensively. Compare him to what Wright does when on a player. Grabban chests a high ball down, Baker in his back just puts out his chest that has zero affect on Grabban. What would Wright do in that situation? A lot more than that! Baker does not get tight enough and is not aggressive enough. Only shows aggression when doing a stupid two footed challenge which he didn't do today, but when he does that is not a good thing!

Wright 7 - Dealt superbly with Ameobi. Thought Pereira did very well on him too. But Wright's strength, the way he goes into players on the ball. Kind of just about passes as a legal challenge most of the time. He is a rock. And actually better than Baker at bringing it out and linking play. Yes, looks awkward, but effective enough at playing football. Those games at right back certainly helped him there.

Williams 7.5 - The best of our centre backs. Thought he got more and more solid as the game went on. His reading of the game is real top quality. Seeing something is going to happen earlier than what most centre backs do. Really tidy on the ball. I think we may need to consider playing him and Kalas in a 2 from now on once Kalas is back.

Nagy 8 - Wow, well ok I get the hype now. I know he has looked class for us before, but that was a very difficult game for him to play so well in. Forest let the likes of Baker have it so they could deny midfielders space. Very compact in there.

His ability to play it early, quickly off either foot. Always looking to move it forward. Very sharp thinker when passing it, chipping it over a players leg for example so it reaches our man. Absolute class. What a signing he is looking now.

Brownhill 6 - Difficult one to score. I don't think our tactics against their tactics helped at all. He was very quiet. Did the occasional very good thing, but had more sloppy moments than usual. Worked his socks off, but for his kind of levels it was a bad day.

O'Dowda 6.5 - Thought like Brownhill it was a tough one with little room to play. But he did drive us on at times. What a run first half. Don't know why he was subbed. Works so hard and does a bit of everything.

Weimann 6 - Close to getting a 5. I don't think he is as good as people say. Or maybe it's simply because him and Fam don't work well. We all know this, so LJ needs to stop playing those 2 together. That cross to no one first half after being sent through by Nagy kind of sums up his ability. Great run, good pace. Gets in a great position where he needs to show a bit of skill, do a trick, hold it up and wait for players to arrive. But as he hasn't really got a trick on the ball, and lacks composure too, he just crosses a ball to no one as he hasn't looked up. Chance second half he has to get over it. Kind of knew he would slice that high and wide on his left foot. 

Diedhiou 7 - Very good first 60 mins. Some of his hold up play was immense. Won headers and also defended well on corners like he always does, saving a goal on the line. Thought he struggled a bit more last 20-30. Eliasson coming on actually didn't suit him as he just doesn't get to those amazing crosses. Wasn't helped with zero service from other side though.

SUBS

Eliasson 9 - Beat his man nearly every single time. Nearly every cross was brilliant. What is impressing me is how much stronger he is looking. Is it because he is fresher than the players on him maybe? Not sure. But there were a few occasions he needed strength to come away with the ball and he certainly showed it. Been saying all season he has to start games. The guy has unreal talent.

Palmer 4 - Thought when he came on that was the wrong move. Did very little right. Not yet seen him look good when in that left sided position in a 4222, which he has played a few times now. 

Rodri 5 - Just didn't get enough of the ball. Maybe should have been sent off for a bad challenge. Overhead kick was a bit unlucky I thought.

Square peg, round hole.

He’s no wing back, he’s a CM playing a position that we have no cover in. Credit where credits is due he’s been solid for us. 

Free transfer!

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1 hour ago, ohhhshauntaylor said:

What does COD offer? 

Usually a bit of dinner on a Saturday.  Nice with chips vinegar and a Little tomato. 
 

 

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Just now, RedRobin96 said:

Square peg, round hole.

He’s no wing back, he’s a CM playing a position that we have no cover in. Credit where credits is due he’s been solid for us. 

Free transfer!

I can't sit there during the game and see a wing back offering no width whatsoever and keep saying it doesn't matter because he was a free transfer.

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47 minutes ago, old_eastender said:

Seriously, thought he was his usual anonymous self in that ACM role today. Yes one really good run just before HT, er… that's it. For me, we should have lowered our asking price and got rid in the summer.

 

Seriously,  you are watching a different game. Should never have gone off. Nagy has to go once they were down to 10 men. Offers little going forward. 

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4 hours ago, ohhhshauntaylor said:

What does COD offer? 

LJ his P45 if he doesn’t start to deliver soon.

 

Baffling to me that we offered a lucrative new contract, unless a sale is lined up in January. I really just don’t get him ... another of LJs busy achieving **** all  bees. Not only has failed to progress (ala Patto et al) , he never really got started aside from a couple of decent games and a worldie goal.

The guy owes a massive rest-of-season to justify LJs faith in him. As Johnson Snr would say, we need players who affect games. For me, he is a light-weight passenger in most. Telling that after around 3 years with us, I still have no idea what his ‘best’ position is. 

Anyhow, let’s see him go out and put a devastating, dominant, goal-scoring display against WBA. 

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40 minutes ago, RedRock said:

LJ his P45 if he doesn’t start to deliver soon.

 

Baffling to me that we offered a lucrative new contract, unless a sale is lined up in January. I really just don’t get him ... another of LJs busy achieving **** all  bees. Not only has failed to progress (ala Patto et al) , he never really got started aside from a couple of decent games and a worldie goal.

The guy owes a massive rest-of-season to justify LJs faith in him. As Johnson Snr would say, we need players who affect games. For me, he is a light-weight passenger in most. Telling that after around 3 years with us, I still have no idea what his ‘best’ position is. 

Anyhow, let’s see him go out and put a devastating, dominant, goal-scoring display against WBA. 

He never seems to want to drive forward with the ball. So frustrating to watch, and doesn’t assist or score anywhere near enough, and as you say, to my eye doesn’t effect the game at all. 
KP has to start ahead of him in that role, also Szmodics deserves a chance ahead of COD. 
 

woudnt be at all upset should COD be sold in Jan but can’t see it myself. 

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5 hours ago, JonDolman said:

I think his work rate in that midfield is immense. Really does a bit of everything for me. Maybe one of those managers love and fans not so much.

Today, his workrate reminded me of Paterson, always a yard further away from where he needed to be to press / tackle / intercept.  It gives an impression of graft, but today it was passive.  Way down the levels from Cardiff, where he was good.

Brownhill had a poor game today too.

For me Williams our best player today.  

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My feeling was that everyone had a fairly decent game today, but decent individual performances do not always culminate in a decent team performance.

Diedhiou looked a lot better and Nagy impressed me too.

I felt a bit sorry for Palmer as he didn't seem to get a lot of the ball when he came on.

I'm sorry to say that Rodri doesn't seem to have worked out so I expect him to move on at the end of his short contract.

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5 hours ago, JonDolman said:

I can't sit there during the game and see a wing back offering no width whatsoever and keep saying it doesn't matter because he was a free transfer.

Not sure what you want or expect. He is filling in, in a less than natural position , and to be fair doing a decent job.
Today he wasn't good, along with Brownhill and others, except they are playing in their proper positions. The alternative is play a wide man in that role, that would offer no cover what so ever. He does try, but today wasn't at his best. Until JD is fit we have little or no option.

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3 hours ago, Bas's perfect hattrick said:

Where do you get it from? 

Every time I go back to the UK the first meal I have is fish & chips and a cup of curry Source poured over the top, also with mushy peas if I’m lucky. I was back six months ago for about ten days and I think I had the same meal six times.

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11 hours ago, old_eastender said:

Rodri - 4 - Looked way off the pace,

For me having this bloke fill a first team place is an absolute waste of time for us - long long way off the mark,,watched him enough now,including 'close up' for the U23's - just awful.

Would much rather we have one of our 'babbers' in there - more value to us & given the experience than continue with a pointless exercise.

Not sure of the loan arrangements' with Yate Town re; Louis Britton..??....

Would say goodbye to Rodri in the new year & place 'our own kiddy on the bench

 

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4 hours ago, 1960maaan said:

Not sure what you want or expect. He is filling in, in a less than natural position , and to be fair doing a decent job.
Today he wasn't good, along with Brownhill and others, except they are playing in their proper positions. The alternative is play a wide man in that role, that would offer no cover what so ever. He does try, but today wasn't at his best. Until JD is fit we have little or no option.

I expect when playing against 10 men LJ to play someone like O'Dowda there who can attack that space on that side. He does offer cover as he's played there before against 11 men and looked comfortable defensively. If LJ was willing to play O'Dowda there against 11 men because on that day Rowe was playing so badly, then why not against 10 men.

I understand there's a slight more risk because of lack of experience in that position, but my point is you can't have a left back who doesn't get forward when we have no one else on that side of the pitch. Palmer was in field. It was Rowe's responsibility to offer width on that side and he didn't.

If we can't expect much from back up players then half our squad we should just say well they're only filling in so let's just say good things about them.

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24 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

I expect when playing against 10 men LJ to play someone like O'Dowda there who can attack that space on that side. He does offer cover as he's played there before against 11 men and looked comfortable defensively. If LJ was willing to play O'Dowda there against 11 men because on that day Rowe was playing so badly, then why not against 10 men.

I understand there's a slight more risk because of lack of experience in that position, but my point is you can't have a left back who doesn't get forward when we have no one else on that side of the pitch. Palmer was in field. It was Rowe's responsibility to offer width on that side and he didn't.

If we can't expect much from back up players then half our squad we should just say well they're only filling in so let's just say good things about them.

I don't think anyone is suggesting that Rowe had a good game today, but you have been pro-COD and anti-Rowe all season. The bias is showing in this thread. 

Other players are equally as or more culpable for our failure to create anything going forward than a fairly isolated wing back. 

 

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9 minutes ago, Chris_Brown said:

I don't think anyone is suggesting that Rowe had a good game today, but you have been pro-COD and anti-Rowe all season. The bias is showing in this thread. 

Other players are equally as or more culpable for our failure to create anything going forward than a fairly isolated wing back. 

 

I do not have any bias to any players. I just see a player who is incapable of doing what I feel we needed on that side of the pitch yesterday. I criticise other players I feel are not good enough. I didn't think Pisano was good enough for very similar reasons to Rowe.

 

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7 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Today, his workrate reminded me of Paterson, always a yard further away from where he needed to be to press / tackle / intercept.  It gives an impression of graft, but today it was passive.  Way down the levels from Cardiff, where he was good.

Brownhill had a poor game today too.

For me Williams our best player today.  

Beginning to look far to much like a Paterson Mk2, but without the goals, for me. 

Hopefully, Palmer does not end up going down the totally ineffective path as well. What with Sammy, LJ is beginning to get a bit of a reputation for this type of player. Maybe Bobby was a one-off fluke. 

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14 hours ago, AshtonGreat said:

I think it's because Johnson likes players with energy. Sadly, in our case energy doesn't really translate to goals

We also seem to break the first law of thermodynamics then because this energy also doesn't seem to translate into energy. 

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2 hours ago, JonDolman said:

I expect when playing against 10 men LJ to play someone like O'Dowda there who can attack that space on that side. He does offer cover as he's played there before against 11 men and looked comfortable defensively. If LJ was willing to play O'Dowda there against 11 men because on that day Rowe was playing so badly, then why not against 10 men.

I understand there's a slight more risk because of lack of experience in that position, but my point is you can't have a left back who doesn't get forward when we have no one else on that side of the pitch. Palmer was in field. It was Rowe's responsibility to offer width on that side and he didn't.

If we can't expect much from back up players then half our squad we should just say well they're only filling in so let's just say good things about them.

That's a different thing altogether. You criticised Rowe for lacking in WB/FB position, I was defending him as he is filling in, in an unfamiliar position. The highlighted bit I can understand . While we had Eliasson on the right ( a bug bear of mine) the width on left wasn't exploited enough. Vs 10 men, the tactic has to be spread the play and try and make the pitch as large as possible. They maybe should have gone 4-4-2 or 4-5-1 to allow a genuine winger. But my point stands, Rowe is doing a decent job filling in. I do wonder if Jan could see Pring come back, he could be the academy player on the bench and allow Semenyo a loan run. Not sure if Pring is quite our level yet though, but clips I've seen suggest he can do a proper WB job.

Interesting to look at the heat maps from yesterday. We play predominantly down the right, and although Rowe averages around half way, Pereira played noticeably further on. Some of the heat map would have been due to Eliasson doing that winger role solely pushing on.383464428_Screenshot2019-11-24at08_16_50.png.64e55c7e224a86c62c4804b7ad70de11.png  

 

153636913_Screenshot2019-11-24at08_18_01.png.82177eff184c7c374f51ce64ed5406b4.png

 

1281956250_Screenshot2019-11-24at08_18_15.png.a4b84c1b8b9fe0723670b26546ceeea0.png

 

 

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2 hours ago, Chris_Brown said:

I don't think anyone is suggesting that Rowe had a good game today, but you have been pro-COD and anti-Rowe all season. The bias is showing in this thread. 

Other players are equally as or more culpable for our failure to create anything going forward than a fairly isolated wing back. 

 

He's not biased imo, more balanced around player strengths and weaknesses. Today Rowe wasn't really at the races, Nagy flatters to deceive and even Brownhill wasnt great. Kasey couldnt get into it and Nicklas did he usual flashy step overs and crossing into no-one on the end of it. 
Games of opinions. Onto a very slick and physical WBA. For me, Nagy gets a rest for Kasey 

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16 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

That's a different thing altogether. You criticised Rowe for lacking in WB/FB position, I was defending him as he is filling in, in an unfamiliar position. The highlighted bit I can understand . While we had Eliasson on the right ( a bug bear of mine) the width on left wasn't exploited enough. Vs 10 men, the tactic has to be spread the play and try and make the pitch as large as possible. They maybe should have gone 4-4-2 or 4-5-1 to allow a genuine winger. But my point stands, Rowe is doing a decent job filling in. I do wonder if Jan could see Pring come back, he could be the academy player on the bench and allow Semenyo a loan run. Not sure if Pring is quite our level yet though, but clips I've seen suggest he can do a proper WB job.

Interesting to look at the heat maps from yesterday. We play predominantly down the right, and although Rowe averages around half way, Pereira played noticeably further on. Some of the heat map would have been due to Eliasson doing that winger role solely pushing on.383464428_Screenshot2019-11-24at08_16_50.png.64e55c7e224a86c62c4804b7ad70de11.png  

 

153636913_Screenshot2019-11-24at08_18_01.png.82177eff184c7c374f51ce64ed5406b4.png

 

1281956250_Screenshot2019-11-24at08_18_15.png.a4b84c1b8b9fe0723670b26546ceeea0.png

 

 

Whether Rowe is filling in or not isn’t really relevant. He isn’t good enough as a left wing back. Not his fault really but doesn’t make it any less true. 

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16 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

That's a different thing altogether. You criticised Rowe for lacking in WB/FB position, I was defending him as he is filling in, in an unfamiliar position. The highlighted bit I can understand . While we had Eliasson on the right ( a bug bear of mine) the width on left wasn't exploited enough. Vs 10 men, the tactic has to be spread the play and try and make the pitch as large as possible. They maybe should have gone 4-4-2 or 4-5-1 to allow a genuine winger. But my point stands, Rowe is doing a decent job filling in. I do wonder if Jan could see Pring come back, he could be the academy player on the bench and allow Semenyo a loan run. Not sure if Pring is quite our level yet though, but clips I've seen suggest he can do a proper WB job.

Interesting to look at the heat maps from yesterday. We play predominantly down the right, and although Rowe averages around half way, Pereira played noticeably further on. Some of the heat map would have been due to Eliasson doing that winger role solely pushing on.383464428_Screenshot2019-11-24at08_16_50.png.64e55c7e224a86c62c4804b7ad70de11.png  

 

153636913_Screenshot2019-11-24at08_18_01.png.82177eff184c7c374f51ce64ed5406b4.png

 

1281956250_Screenshot2019-11-24at08_18_15.png.a4b84c1b8b9fe0723670b26546ceeea0.png

 

 

Agree. So you agree Rowe is incapable of doing what was needed on that side. Which is my exact point.

All our players have different strengths and weaknesses. My point is about Rowe is he was not capable of giving us the right balance on the left we needed yesterday, especially second half when they were sitting in even more, but space was on that side of the pitch that they could more or less ignore as we had no threat with Rowe not being capable of what we IMO needed on that side.

It's a strange thing that people can go on about O'Dowda not offering anything, which I disagree with, but accept that is what many on here think. Or we can say Fam has poor movement and at times a poor touch and poor passing. But we have to accept that Rowe is just filling in, is not a left back, so lets not say anything at all negative about his performance. 

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15 hours ago, sh1t_ref_again said:

Jondolman agree with your ratings, our composure in front of goal was very poor. Baker is so negative in his ball playing rarely forward but at least he did not decide to even up the player count today

This has been apparent for a while. Yes defensively strong but with ball at feet looks awkward and when it comes to passing forward he struggles. Normally just ends in a chip/punt forward.

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18 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Agree. So you agree Rowe is incapable of doing what was needed on that side.

No, but yes. I think Rowe has done a brilliant job filling in for JD. He works hard but would probably find it easier in a FB role rather than have the added expectation a WB role brings. So I think you are being unfair to criticise too much. The need for width I agree with, maybe COD wide left,NE right and Palmer just off of Fam might have been the way to go. That is more a problem that LJ should have seen/sorted rather than Rowe's failings. 
If Rowe had been brought in as a LB/LWB I would probably be a little more critical . It's similar to when Wright was playing RB, he was always just filling in, and I think you have to make allowances for short comings. Unless they make a complete bollix of it, which (up to now) Rowe hasn't.
I think, at home at least , we could play 4 at the back. Specially as Nagy is back to play that deeper role. 

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16 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

No, but yes. I think Rowe has done a brilliant job filling in for JD. He works hard but would probably find it easier in a FB role rather than have the added expectation a WB role brings. So I think you are being unfair to criticise too much. The need for width I agree with, maybe COD wide left,NE right and Palmer just off of Fam might have been the way to go. That is more a problem that LJ should have seen/sorted rather than Rowe's failings. 
If Rowe had been brought in as a LB/LWB I would probably be a little more critical . It's similar to when Wright was playing RB, he was always just filling in, and I think you have to make allowances for short comings. Unless they make a complete bollix of it, which (up to now) Rowe hasn't.
I think, at home at least , we could play 4 at the back. Specially as Nagy is back to play that deeper role. 

I'm just pointing out what Rowe can't do, which we were missing on that side yesterday. I think his number one role for us was always going to be left back/ left wing back. We have Nagy, Brownhill, Massengo, Korey, even O'Dowda as a central midfielders, so I am surprised if Rowe was brought in as a central midfielder when we had no cover left backs for Dasilva. It seemed to be the plan that Rowe was our back up left back to me more than anything else.

Rowe may have done better than some expected, considering he couldn't get in Doncaster side a lot last season. But I don't think we should just not say anything about him when he has a bad game, or doesn't offer what is needed on that side.

I think with Wright the system seemed to let us get away with it, and Magnússon too on the other side. Same with Pisano when we went on a winning run which was mainly counter attacking football. But all of them I would say were not good enough when looking at what we ideally needed in those positions. 

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2 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

I'm just pointing out what Rowe can't do, which we were missing on that side yesterday. I think his number one role for us was always going to be left back/ left wing back. We have Nagy, Brownhill, Massengo, Korey, even O'Dowda as a central midfielders, so I am surprised if Rowe was brought in as a central midfielder when we had no cover left backs for Dasilva. It seemed to be the plan that Rowe was our back up left back to me more than anything else.

Rowe may have done better than some expected, considering he couldn't get in Doncaster side a lot last season. But I don't think we should just not say anything about him when he has a bad game, or doesn't offer what is needed on that side.

I think with Wright the system seemed to let us get away with it, and Magnússon too on the other side. Same with Pisano when we went on a winning run which was mainly counter attacking football. But all of them I would say were not good enough when looking at what we ideally needed in those positions. 

I think the reason BW got away with it, was he was playing behind Eliasson who doesn't defend. So a sitting FB doesn't need to do much more than defend and give the ball to the winger in front . JD should make a big difference once he's back, naturally attack minded, so will add that missing width. The other side Pereira is improving, and while we pick up points and look solid I don't see a system change soon.

 

1 hour ago, RedDave said:

Whether Rowe is filling in or not isn’t really relevant. He isn’t good enough as a left wing back. Not his fault really but doesn’t make it any less true. 

So what are the options? Play a winger there? COD could do a job, and would get forward better, but the first defensive mistake, or gap left to gift a goal and he would be murdered as he was only filling in. It is what it is, the only way it changes is a system change to a 4 at the back. The current set up has been successful away from home, if not pretty, so until JD is back that's what we have. Rowe has his limitations, but anyone else would have too, how many times has he been criticised for poor defending? Can't remember many, in fact the only moan yesterday was missing a header in the positions box.

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10 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

I think the reason BW got away with it, was he was playing behind Eliasson who doesn't defend. So a sitting FB doesn't need to do much more than defend and give the ball to the winger in front . JD should make a big difference once he's back, naturally attack minded, so will add that missing width. The other side Pereira is improving, and while we pick up points and look solid I don't see a system change soon.

 

So what are the options? Play a winger there? COD could do a job, and would get forward better, but the first defensive mistake, or gap left to gift a goal and he would be murdered as he was only filling in. It is what it is, the only way it changes is a system change to a 4 at the back. The current set up has been successful away from home, if not pretty, so until JD is back that's what we have. Rowe has his limitations, but anyone else would have too, how many times has he been criticised for poor defending? Can't remember many, in fact the only moan yesterday was missing a header in the positions box.

The flick on for Grabban to miss the sitter was hardly the best bit of defending from Rowe!

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