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Nagy and Massengo


MC RISK77

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3 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Totally agree.  His back to goal play was as good as I’ve seen since 17/18.  He played at full tilt today, and showed what a menace he can be.

If ever a performance deserved a goal it was today.

Disagree Spud.  He came short off his man, the timing of such was in sync with the passer.  In a 4231, with Weimann floating, I thought his coming short, stopped us going long and getting too big a distance between our 3 lines.  It enabled our midfield to move forward onto the ball.

Second half was game over after 10 minutes.  Most players nowhere near as effective as they were first half.

Agree Dave...I commented to the friends around me that he plays much better with a partner...his best days were alongside Reid today looked similar to that with Weimann playing slightly behind him

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Good to get our best 2 central midfielders together at last. Injuries have hampered this partnership. 
I’m certain this is the best midfield 2 and that Brownhill is better out of the central area. 
Brownhill’s best form came 2 seasons ago when he played from a wide right position and was given licence to drift and roam, creating space for an overlapping full back or creating little one-twos around the box. This for me is his most effective position. Today saw that in full flow, Brownhill’s movement inside allowing Hunt to run free. But also giving JB the freedom to get in the box more - something he didn’t do effectively from a central role. 
 

Long may the AN/HNM partnership reign - it’ll bring the best out of JB too. 

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I would like to think we could have a midfield three of HNM, Adam & Josh to build a side around for many years to come but realistically it won`t happen as one or more will go.

They were different class today, it was a joy to watch and probably the best I`ve seen us play in midfield for months.

As someone said above, Josh , HNM and Adam are our Busquets, Xavi and Iniesta. If they can play like that every week we can be some side. Think of their ages too - 19, 23 & 24 isn`t it?

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1 hour ago, chinapig said:

We have scored as many goals as Fulham, who have a top striker. What seems to pass people by is that we concede far too many. Fix that and a top striker is less relevant. Especially as we are unlikely to be able to attract a top striker like Mitrovic.

We have had a horrible injury record with our defenders this season I believe apart from Williams they have all been injured at some point this season

we need a out and out goal scorer been needing one for years we attracted afobe who’s a proven championship striker hopefully he returns the same and everyone keeps fit and we have a hell of a squad of players 

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Still only 18?

Wow.

His ceiling, well it seems very high indeed if he keeps progressing,  focuses on football and the right things and of course keeps fit etc. Ability and potential wise,  he can really go far.

As for the midfield in general,  excellent today. Nice balance,  that pair helped to free up Brownhill. The fluidity and flexibility,  this was great to see- 3 of them in those central areas can really give us some control!

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1 hour ago, spudski said:

He played more like an offensive midfielder than a outward threat. His movement in the final third was very static. Sat between two defenders and hardly moved away from them. His heat map is not what you'd want from your CF imo. Went missing second half imo.

He hasn’t many strengths , and I agree generally his movement is very poor . Like I replied to you earlier though in a different thread, that system plays into his hands . He can get it under, lay off to runners around him and imo had a good game 

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Brownhill is a decent centre mid but the tempo that M&N pass and move at is superior, And by moving Brownhill wider it gave him so much more space to operate in. We just looked really nicely balanced with NE on the other side, and a much more effective attacking side.

Plus we're 2nd top scorers after today but 16th best defence. It's funny, I would have had us the other way round!

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32 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Incredible. There can surely only be one scenario in which he remains a City player next season; if we are promoted to the Premier League. 

What about: next week, Joe Bryan cleans him out with a tasty two footed, red card, 20 man brawl instigating lunge and HNM breaks both ankles, thus ruling him out until next autumn?

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I think the pair of them in the middle is definitely the way forward. Both technically gifted, they move the ball quick, great energy levels, tenacity in both of them & have a knack of sensing danger & finding space. Also allows us to play 4-4-2, so able to get Eliasson in the starting 11, without fear of being overrun in the middle, as Brownhill will tuck in as & when. Which then allows Hunt to overlap when the opportunity comes. Certainly have great options in the middle of the park at the moment. COYR 

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1 minute ago, ralphindevon said:

Wiki says 7th July, so maybe just a typo from Davefevs.

18 going on 28, unbelievable awareness and passing ability 

His awareness is unreal. His ability to break a press with a body feint or dummy is ridiculous. 
 

Nagy gets a mention too because it seems like his touches in tight space gets him 2-3 yards of space somehow. Has the ability to know where to guide the ball on the touch and today no one got close to him. 

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I remember during a certain period (post our top flight adventure) being told by the club that our “most promising youngsters” were guys like Nigel Hawkins and Jason Eaton ... absolutely no disrespect intended towards them, they represented Bristol City FC so were obviously good players, but when you think they were both a year or so older than Massengo you realise we have an exceptionally fine player on our hands ...

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4 hours ago, spudski said:

Allowed Josh to play freely and more offensive, which allowed Weimann to play in more dangerous positions.

Eliasson did well, but still lacked in defensive areas, but were covered by Nagy and Massengo, which negated Eliassons weaknesses.

My only criticism from today was that I thought Fam was very average and we took our foot off the pedal. 

Imo if we had kept on the gas and worked just as hard throughout, we could have done a Brentford. Which would have done our GD a world of good.

I wonder how well all our other attacking players would have played had Fam not been on the pitch. It will be interesting to see what that side would look like with Weimann up top and no Fam. It may be we miss his ability to win headers, and ability to hold it up and occupy the opposing centre backs.

I gave Fam an 8 out of 10 today. Thought he was such a problem for their defence. His hold up play is something no one else can do. Potentially Semenyo with his strength, maybe Watkins can to a certain extent. But neither got what Fam has at this moment in time.

I will have to watch the game back, but it seemed like he was mainly staying in centre of the pitch, which is where I want to see him. His movement is not the best, but for how big he is, it isn't bad. He isn't lazy as we have seen him often knackered with 20 minutes to go because of all the hard work he gets through. 

Realistically I would have Afobe in front of him if he comes back the same player. But last 3 appearances Fam has improved hugely imo.

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Just now, JonDolman said:

I wonder how well all our other attacking players would have played had Fam not been on the pitch.

He had a v.good game today imho

It will be interesting to see what that side would look like with Weimann up top and no Fam.

Different!!

It may be we miss his ability to win headers, and ability to hold it up and occupy the opposing centre backs.

But it’s a team game.  I’ve says before that sometimes there are other unnoticed little cogs helping the big cog work.  You cannot look at Fam’s performance in isolation.  What about the things other players did to make him play well (Johnson often talks about players who make others play better.  At times Weimann pulling into pockets (rather than his usual running on the shoulder) meant the 2xCBs were unsure whether to double up on Fam or one pick up Weimann, but leave Fam 1on1, meaning they marked on the “safe side” in case he rolled them.  He did hold it up well.

I gave Fam an 8 out of 10 today.

Me too.

Thought he was such a problem for their defence.

He was, no argument from me, but partly due to a cohesive team performance for 60-65 mins (we then coasted).

His hold up play is something no one else can do. Potentially Semenyo with his strength, maybe Watkins can to a certain extent. But neither got what Fam has at this moment in time.

I will have to watch the game back, but it seemed like he was mainly staying in centre of the pitch, which is where I want to see him.

Here you go, that bright blue bit was noticeable, on one occasion, Baker fizzed a ball into him, his touch was spot on, and another attack was formed.  That quicker pass from Baker was a feature today from several players.

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His movement is not the best, but for how big he is, it isn't bad. He isn't lazy as we have seen him often knackered with 20 minutes to go because of all the hard work he gets through.

There were two situations today when Fam went flat-out for a ball, it was great to see.  We don’t see that enough.

Realistically I would have Afobe in front of him if he comes back the same player. But last 3 appearances Fam has improved hugely imo.

it’s like he’s been given a kick up the backside, even Charlton he was good, just got carried away!  I said in the week that if he continues to play at this level, he’s a handful, beyond his pretty decent goals record.

 

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7 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

 

I think today it helped massively having Eliasson and Brownhill in wide areas and switching with Weimann.

Eliasson and Brownhill being imo our 2 best attacking players, Weimann being such a good team player to compliment them.

Fam being the one that occupies the centre backs. The blend worked so well. And really looked great when Nagy or Massengo joined in our attacks. 

I guess LJ mainly sticks with this 4231 (or whatever we want to call it) from now on. I actually thought Weimann seemed to look more effective when deeper and pressing the midfield rather than the centre backs. Maybe something we see more of.

So in this system when Fam is unavailable, or rested, who plays instead I wonder. It will be something LJ will need to work out I am sure with so many games up to when we can possibly bring in another forward.

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It's a strange thing but almost by default LJ has arrived at his best midfield combination and that is Natch and Massengo in the middle and Brownhill out wide.

As good a player as Brownhill undoubtedly is our Hungarian cider maestro and French wonderkid are a level above and barring fatigue should be the way forward from now on.

I know they tired today but they will only get better and with Korey gradually getting match fit we should expect to see a marked improvement in the middle.

I actually think we get the best out of Josh in that position.

Long may it continue.

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6 hours ago, MC RISK77 said:

Only first start together and while it can be argued we won the game on the flanks, we wouldn’t have had as many opportunities to get the ball into the box if it wasn’t for these two breaking up play with the energy they had.

josh looked very comfortable on the right so hopefully we can see more of the pairing in the middle.

elliason was superb as well.

Well said that man. I mentioned on RB that Nagy and Massengo were like a tag team, wrestling the ball from Huddersfield to create the space for Eliasson and Brownhill to power through. Here's to a very happy NagMass.

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1 hour ago, Davefevs said:
1 hour ago, JonDolman said:

it’s like he’s been given a kick up the backside, even Charlton he was good, just got carried away!  I said in the week that if he continues to play at this level, he’s a handful, beyond his pretty decent goals record.

 

I'm really not sure we can understate how good it is for him to be back involved with Senegal, and playing and scoring for them. From his social feeds it looks like it genuinely means a lot to him. 

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So how do we fit them all in? Whilst also addressing our leaky defence. 

I see HNM and JB as more box-to-box than Ngy, who excels when he's sitting in front of defence breaking stuff up and spreading play. So how about the following?

                               DB

          AW               TM               TK

PP                        Nagy                        JD

           Brownhill              Massengo

                   AW                    FD

I think that would give us tremendous fluidity up front, whilst still having width with the wingbacks. Plus Brownhill can drift wide. (I realize that this leaves out Eliasson - as I say, how do we fit them all in?!)

Did England play this sort of 3-3-2-2 at the last World Cup?

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8 hours ago, JoeAman08 said:

His awareness is unreal. His ability to break a press with a body feint or dummy is ridiculous. 
 

Nagy gets a mention too because it seems like his touches in tight space gets him 2-3 yards of space somehow. Has the ability to know where to guide the ball on the touch and today no one got close to him. 

What I like about Nagy is his pass and move , he doesn’t just admire his work but presents himself for the return ball. 
 

We have , equally, now two small midfielders who know how to draw fouls . Our game management has stepped up a level.

 

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