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where's the joy

the Weiman thing

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Ok so Bobby left and Weiman came in; it looked like a direct 'run about a bit' replacement.

The difference was that Bobby had a first touch and some turns and could make Fammy look good.

Weiman has none of these qualities. He chases lost causes, has a 'Toblerone boot' touch and cannot hold the ball up.

Currently we don't have a midfielder able to play him in nor a manager able to train the team how to get the best out of him.

I now long for the days when Cotterill didn't fill his bench with spare 'clubs', built a tempo and belief into a settled team

and crucially believed all his defensive problems could be solved by buying a quicksilver striker.

Which is precisely the place we are in now, needing to spend proper money on a 'top talent' striker

we have wasted all this time on Streaky Johnson and us fans have given him an easy ride.

Its time for him to shape up or ship out and replace Weiman

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I don’t think we have ‘wasted our time’ with Johnson at all. He has given me the best times of my life as a City fan. While Weimann can be inconsistent I do feel that the increasingly negative sentiment towards Johnson is a bit unnecessary and reactive. 

Ultimately we have improved year on year. Barring a flash in the pan eleven years ago we have been a total embarrassment in this division until he was appointed. I feel this is forgotten somewhat when people turn on LJ after a couple of bad results, and I say this as someone that couldn’t wait to see the back of him during the losing streak.

Edited by Newquay-Red
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20 minutes ago, where's the joy said:

Ok so Bobby left and Weiman came in; it looked like a direct 'run about a bit' replacement.

The difference was that Bobby had a first touch and some turns and could make Fammy look good.

Weiman has none of these qualities. He chases lost causes, has a 'Toblerone boot' touch and cannot hold the ball up.

Currently we don't have a midfielder able to play him in nor a manager able to train the team how to get the best out of him.

I now long for the days when Cotterill didn't fill his bench with spare 'clubs', built a tempo and belief into a settled team

and crucially believed all his defensive problems could be solved by buying a quicksilver striker.

Which is precisely the place we are in now, needing to spend proper money on a 'top talent' striker

we have wasted all this time on Streaky Johnson and us fans have given him an easy ride.

Its time for him to shape up or ship out and replace Weiman

He’s our top goal scorer and you want us to get rid of him😂 

he’s been poor last few games he needs a rest but he does the running of famera most games and chips in with goals aswell 

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6 minutes ago, Highguy said:

He’s our top goal scorer and you want us to get rid of him😂 

he’s been poor last few games he needs a rest but he does the running of famera most games and chips in with goals aswell 

Goal scoring record is poor where ever he has been

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31 minutes ago, Newquay-Red said:

I do feel that the increasingly negative sentiment towards Johnson is a bit unnecessary and reactive.

There's a certain subsection of the posters on here that have been waiting all season for us to lose a couple of games on the bounce, and now that we have they are back with their anti-Johnson agenda.

Why they exist I don't know, but they do. They will all crawl back into their holes when we go a couple of games unbeaten again.

Edited by richwwtk
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58 minutes ago, where's the joy said:

Ok so Bobby left and Weiman came in; it looked like a direct 'run about a bit' replacement.

The difference was that Bobby had a first touch and some turns and could make Fammy look good.

Weiman has none of these qualities. He chases lost causes, has a 'Toblerone boot' touch and cannot hold the ball up.

 

Been doing this his entire career.

100% effort ...... very limited ability

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Weimann is a 1/3 goalscorer at best. But if you add his assists he's a 1/2 man for average goal contribution.

Based on minutes played, Diedhiou still isn't a mile off from 1/2 which is mad really. 

Afobe still has the best rate of contribution though...

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Weimann isnt a goal scoring striker.....he works hard makes good runs and brings others into play.....works well away from home but not at the gate when teams sit in.

In terms of promotion and top championship teams I dont think he is at that level especially for home fixtures when you need that fox in the box.

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1 hour ago, Coxy27 said:

An easy ride? 😂 You're on the wind up pal.

Some fans have been on Lee Johnson's back since the day he arrived. Some don't like that he's supposedly a friend of the Lansdowns, some don't like that he's Gary's son, some don't like him because they criminally underrated him as a player for us and somehow think that is relevant to his role as a manager.

The year on year finishing position improvement, the amazing cup run, the development of players, all this is ignored by many who had an arbitrary, deep-seated dislike for the man from the very start.

Whatever you think of him, he absolutely has not been given an easy ride.

I took a while to warm to LJ....I had no “previous” with him because I’d only seen him play 40-odd minutes v Watford in the play-off season.

But we are 7th, level on points with 6th, two points behind 3rd....albeit having “wasted” two home games.  It’s a good position to be in, but it’s introduced panic from some fans, because it could’ve been so much better.

The players have dipped in form, not just the odd one, but 3,4,5....we are a team that relies of the sum of its parts.  LJ is doing a good job, it’s a tough league.  In his head he probably thinks he is a bit better than he actually is, but he’s still good head-coach, doing a good job.

The one thing I think this recent run (since Huddersfield) is that there is no magic formation / system.  We’ve played well v Huddersfield and Fulham, yet poorly v Millwall and Blackburn (I watched about 30 minutes on a stream), with the same method.

What does seem material in that 4 game mini-run is that we can play against the technical sides, but struggle against the more physical sides (inc Leeds and Luton too, who pressed us physically, West Brom were just too good on the night).

We miss that physicality in the middle of the park at times.  Blackburn and Millwall we missed a Rennie, a Newman-type CM.  We don’t have one.

So I don’t think chopping and changing the system is the answer.  Get the best eleven players out there in a system, and then rotate around fatigue and form.

Luton aside, I think we’ve looked stronger with a back 3 and wingbacks, we seem more compact too, less likely to be caught in transition too, which in turn becomes knackering.

 

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5 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I took a while to warm to LJ....I had no “previous” with him because I’d only seen him play 40-odd minutes v Watford in the play-off season.

But we are 7th, level on points with 6th, two points behind 3rd....albeit having “wasted” two home games.  It’s a good position to be in, but it’s introduced panic from some fans, because it could’ve been so much better.

The players have dipped in form, not just the odd one, but 3,4,5....we are a team that relies of the sum of its parts.  LJ is doing a good job, it’s a tough league.  In his head he probably thinks he is a bit better than he actually is, but he’s still good head-coach, doing a good job.

The one thing I think this recent run (since Huddersfield) is that there is no magic formation / system.  We’ve played well v Huddersfield and Fulham, yet poorly v Millwall and Blackburn (I watched about 30 minutes on a stream), with the same method.

What does seem material in that 4 game mini-run is that we can play against the technical sides, but struggle against the more physical sides (inc Leeds and Luton too, who pressed us physically, West Brom were just too good on the night).

We miss that physicality in the middle of the park at times.  Blackburn and Millwall we missed a Rennie, a Newman-type CM.  We don’t have one.

So I don’t think chopping and changing the system is the answer.  Get the best eleven players out there in a system, and then rotate around fatigue and form.

Luton aside, I think we’ve looked stronger with a back 3 and wingbacks, we seem more compact too, less likely to be caught in transition too, which in turn becomes knackering.

 

Often agree with your posts Dave, but wonder about this bit.

Given their possession, physical first and foremost? They bossed us with and without the ball first half especially- high energy but they're clearly quite technical- teams that average nearly 60% possession tend to be!

Edited by Mr Popodopolous

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7 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Often agree with your posts Dave, but wonder about this bit.

Given their possession, physical first and foremost? They bossed us with and without the ball first half especially- high energy but they're clearly quite technical- teams that average nearly 60% possession tend to be!

I did say, “pressed us physically”, didn’t say they were just a physical team.  They were on us so quickly and then physical with their challenges.  Don’t get me wrong they are good technically, but they aren’t just a good technical team, they are strong too.  Even Bamford, who used to be a lightweight, pushes his CB markers around this season.

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What I get miffed about is this ‘ playing it out from the back ‘ bit .

 I understand that it is to keep possession but for Bob’s sake why have creative midfielders if our main playmakers are the centre backs ? 
 

We no longer have Webster , Taylor Moore is the nearest in style so why persist  with the idea ?

Bentley gives to Ash or ‘ Nononsense   Nathan ‘ and they seem to just pass it to each other or hit it long to Famaral ,who mostly gets swarmed over , or where they imagine wandering Weiman will be .

This is down to coaching .

 

 

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12 minutes ago, Major Isewater said:

What I get miffed about is this ‘ playing it out from the back ‘ bit .

 I understand that it is to keep possession but for Bob’s sake why have creative midfielders if our main playmakers are the centre backs ? 
 

We no longer have Webster , Taylor Moore is the nearest in style so why persist  with the idea ?

Bentley gives to Ash or ‘ Nononsense   Nathan ‘ and they seem to just pass it to each other or hit it long to Famaral ,who mostly gets swarmed over , or where they imagine wandering Weiman will be .

This is down to coaching .

 

 

Think Kalas is not bad technically either, but more conservative. As a pair though, or an axis, then Bentley-Kalas-Moore-Nagy could set things moving quite well- when all fit of course.

Certainly centre backs shouldn't be the main playmakers- that's only one part of the process. I question whether LJ can move properly towards the end goal that he seems to want, in terms of playing out.

Don't have a diagram or triangle or graphic thing handy bit I'd see it as...

Bentley

Either to Kalas, for the simpler pass- or Moore for the mix of simpler pass and bringing it up the pitch.

Perhaps draw the opposition out somewhat- Nagy could receive from one of these two- or to mix it and keep the opposition guessing at times, a medium range from Bentley to Nagy. The more players you have who are comfortable on the ball, be it simpler passing or be it bringing it forward- ie the Kalas v Moore in this current side, the harder it is for the opposition to negate, to shut down.

Nagy moving it onto Brownhill, Eliasson or Massengo even dependent on circs.  Palmer then into Weimann, and some of these can support- Hunt a strong outlet, but especially DaSilva- in turn can create space.

That's just one set of combinations anyway- there will be many more!

We have the many of the ingredients now or will when all fit- but Webster a key loss- the question is whether LJ can make the best cake out of it. Jury out a bit for me.

Edited by Mr Popodopolous

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Absolutely agree with Dave's post above and I have been saying it all along. 352 / 532 is our best most solid formation. 442 leaves us too exposed in midfield and offers little protection to the back 4. With this system we also have the ability to change the game by using Eliason as an impact sub. Stick to this system using round pegs in round holes and it is easy to keep refreshing / rotating players.

Bently

Hunt or Pereira   Williams, Baker, Moore, Rowe or Dasilva

     Nagy, Massengo,Smith (2 from3)

                Brownhill or Palmer

             Weiman / Dhiedou

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Bit disappointed really, the thread title made me think this was going to be some kind of film review for a new thriller like The Ipcress File or Day Of The Jackel etc... Not what I was thinking to be honest, not into fantasy football manager type movies. 

The Weiman Thing sounds like a great book which I'm sure would have made a decent cold sore thriller … shame, wonder who the leading man and rest of the cast of characters would have been?

Surely a role in it somewhere for villainous a Warnock and a Holloway somewhere, but who'd play the good guys?

Job for Cotts perhaps?  

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1 hour ago, Sir Geoff said:

Absolutely agree with Dave's post above and I have been saying it all along. 352 / 532 is our best most solid formation. 442 leaves us too exposed in midfield and offers little protection to the back 4. With this system we also have the ability to change the game by using Eliason as an impact sub. Stick to this system using round pegs in round holes and it is easy to keep refreshing / rotating players.

Bently

Hunt or Pereira   Williams, Baker, Moore, Rowe or Dasilva

     Nagy, Massengo,Smith (2 from3)

                Brownhill or Palmer

             Weiman / Dhiedou

I'm still puzzling if any of it makes any difference....v Blackburn nobody,,literally nobody picked up the runner,/ free man on the edge of the box - Sunday league stuff - even Sunday league outfits would be mightily pissed off about it...talk about basic & it puts you one down from the kick off??.....f all to do with freshness or tactics... attitude.

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9 minutes ago, Robert the bruce said:

I'm still puzzling if any of it makes any difference....v Blackburn nobody,,literally nobody picked up the runner,/ free man on the edge of the box - Sunday league stuff - even Sunday league outfits would be mightily pissed off about it...talk about basic & it puts you one down from the kick off??.....f all to do with freshness or tactics... attitude.

But we may not have conceded a sloppy corner in the first place.

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I think the main concern about weimann is not whether he's actually any good or not (he is), it's why the rest of the squad have not yet been trained to spot his runs 

He (and Kasey palmer too,on his day) appear to be a higher calibre of player than the rest, the aim should be to make our entire team of equal quality 

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29 minutes ago, Bernard Lerring said:

I think the main concern about weimann is not whether he's actually any good or not (he is), it's why the rest of the squad have not yet been trained to spot his runs 

This- very much this!

It's funny as I thought that on paper Palmer pushed high and close to Weimann, in a fairly free role could have been the one to do this but not so much to date.

If we could pick the early runs in good time then I think Weimann up there as not quite lone striker but especially the main presence could be the way.

One way to go might be the right back line and yes good possession, if Nagy can move it on to Brownhill and Eliasson, there is ample creativity yet control to pick these runs. Or should be!

OTOH, once in a while, Bentley bypasses defence a bit with the quick pass to Nagy and bypass one of the thirds. Weimann's runs can help to keep defence occupied, quick distribution to Nagy stops them filtering back in....

I think there are some real exciting combinations there and the movement of Weimann plays its part. Disappointed we haven't seen it enough tbh.

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10 hours ago, where's the joy said:

Ok so Bobby left and Weiman came in; it looked like a direct 'run about a bit' replacement.

The difference was that Bobby had a first touch and some turns and could make Fammy look good.

Weiman has none of these qualities. He chases lost causes, has a 'Toblerone boot' touch and cannot hold the ball up.

Currently we don't have a midfielder able to play him in nor a manager able to train the team how to get the best out of him.

I now long for the days when Cotterill didn't fill his bench with spare 'clubs', built a tempo and belief into a settled team

and crucially believed all his defensive problems could be solved by buying a quicksilver striker.

Which is precisely the place we are in now, needing to spend proper money on a 'top talent' striker

we have wasted all this time on Streaky Johnson and us fans have given him an easy ride.

Its time for him to shape up or ship out and replace Weiman

Best player we’ve got ... and to answer your point that we ‘don’t have a midfielder able to play him in ...’ - we do, he’s called Kasey Palmer ... oh, and Weimann has played 113 premier league games compared to Bobby Reid’s 27 games at the top level. Weimann is a very intelligent football player who makes incisive runs that many players can’t read - to suggest Reid is a better player, having had just one fine season in his whole career (and he’s now 26 years old), is ridiculous .... Weimann played in the premier league for five consecutive seasons .... and you could even do him the courtesy of spelling his name correctly 

Edited by BS4 on Tour...
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11 hours ago, where's the joy said:

Ok so Bobby left and Weiman came in; it looked like a direct 'run about a bit' replacement.

The difference was that Bobby had a first touch and some turns and could make Fammy look good.

Weiman has none of these qualities. He chases lost causes, has a 'Toblerone boot' touch and cannot hold the ball up.

Currently we don't have a midfielder able to play him in nor a manager able to train the team how to get the best out of him.

I now long for the days when Cotterill didn't fill his bench with spare 'clubs', built a tempo and belief into a settled team

and crucially believed all his defensive problems could be solved by buying a quicksilver striker.

Which is precisely the place we are in now, needing to spend proper money on a 'top talent' striker

we have wasted all this time on Streaky Johnson and us fans have given him an easy ride.

Its time for him to shape up or ship out and replace Weiman

I'll probably get a mark against me, but you sir are a cock of the highest order. **** off, and when you get somewhere, **** off again. Pr1ck. 

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11 hours ago, where's the joy said:

Ok so Bobby left and Weiman came in; it looked like a direct 'run about a bit' replacement.

The difference was that Bobby had a first touch and some turns and could make Fammy look good.

Weiman has none of these qualities. He chases lost causes, has a 'Toblerone boot' touch and cannot hold the ball up.

Currently we don't have a midfielder able to play him in nor a manager able to train the team how to get the best out of him.

I now long for the days when Cotterill didn't fill his bench with spare 'clubs', built a tempo and belief into a settled team

and crucially believed all his defensive problems could be solved by buying a quicksilver striker.

Which is precisely the place we are in now, needing to spend proper money on a 'top talent' striker

we have wasted all this time on Streaky Johnson and us fans have given him an easy ride.

Its time for him to shape up or ship out and replace Weiman

Clueless, charlie uniform november tango. 

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11 hours ago, Newquay-Red said:

Barring a flash in the pan eleven years ago we have been a total embarrassment in this division until he was appointed...

You are obviously a young un - but we haven’t been a ‘total embarrassment’ in this division until LJ was appointed, in four consecutive seasons in the ‘90s we finished 9th, 14th, 15th, 13th in this division - that is far, far from being a ‘total embarrassment’ and in five consecutive seasons in the ‘70s we finished 8th, 5th, 16th, 5th, 2nd in this division .... you really think that’s embarrassing?! Or do you think football only started after 1992 ?!

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31 minutes ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

You are obviously a young un - but we haven’t been a ‘total embarrassment’ in this division until LJ was appointed, in four consecutive seasons in the ‘90s we finished 9th, 14th, 15th, 13th in this division - that is far, far from being a ‘total embarrassment’ and in five consecutive seasons in the ‘70s we finished 8th, 5th, 16th, 5th, 2nd in this division .... you really think that’s embarrassing?! Or do you think football only started after 1992 ?!

'In my day we could watch City for half a crown, still buy a bovril, and yet still would have change for the horse-bus home. 

'My great uncle once saw an FA Cup final and us reach 2nd place, and you know what, it was only a century ago!'

Exaggerated point by me, but how long is a piece of string. Correct time frame to judge, game changes etc- how far is a sensible comparison basically?

Edited by Mr Popodopolous
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1 hour ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

You are obviously a young un - but we haven’t been a ‘total embarrassment’ in this division until LJ was appointed, in four consecutive seasons in the ‘90s we finished 9th, 14th, 15th, 13th in this division - that is far, far from being a ‘total embarrassment’ and in five consecutive seasons in the ‘70s we finished 8th, 5th, 16th, 5th, 2nd in this division .... you really think that’s embarrassing?! Or do you think football only started after 1992 ?!

Oooh, 9th, 14th, 15th and 13th twenty years ago. What an iconic time. Maybe we should get some banners put up around the Gate? Other clubs would be fiercely envious I’m sure. 

The 70s were a long time ago whether you like it or not and saying ‘well we were good 40 years ago’; that’s embarrassing. Barring that time, we have historically underachieved. I always find it funny when older fans on here gatekeep that time. Well done; you were born in a different era and were fortunate that us being in the first division occurred at that time. What a fantastic personal achievement! You should definitely make us all aware of that on a regular basis...

Plus the whole tired ‘hurr durr do you think football started in 1992’ attitude is totally moronic considering you’re saying it to a fellow fan of this club. Not exactly Premier League glory hunting around here is it mate? 

You’ve formed that condescending attitude of yours solely due to your age and definitely not wisdom. We are on an upward trajectory over the past couple of years and it’s funny how on here that’s becoming a controversial opinion after two- yes only TWO- losses.

Edited by Newquay-Red
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7 hours ago, Newquay-Red said:

Oooh, 9th, 14th, 15th and 13th twenty years ago. What an iconic time. Maybe we should get some banners put up around the Gate? Other clubs would be fiercely envious I’m sure. 

The 70s were a long time ago whether you like it or not and saying ‘well we were good 40 years ago’; that’s embarrassing. Barring that time, we have historically underachieved. I always find it funny when older fans on here gatekeep that time. Well done; you were born in a different era and were fortunate that us being in the first division occurred at that time. What a fantastic personal achievement! You should definitely make us all aware of that on a regular basis...

Plus the whole tired ‘hurr durr do you think football started in 1992’ attitude is totally moronic considering you’re saying it to a fellow fan of this club. Not exactly Premier League glory hunting around here is it mate? 

You’ve formed that condescending attitude of yours solely due to your age and definitely not wisdom. We are on an upward trajectory over the past couple of years and it’s funny how on here that’s becoming a controversial opinion after two- yes only TWO- losses.

I think the derogatory tone of your reply is a bit unnecessary, but I agree with your main point.  I saw my first City march in 1962 and my enduring feeling about a lifetime supporting City is that it’s been over 50 years of disappointment and underachievement.  Why that is the case, I have given up trying to work out, but four years in the top division for a club with our resources and in a city this size is frankly pathetic.  Given that the Championship now is about the same standard as Division One was in the late 70s, I actually think the the last two or three seasons have been about as good as it gets.

Edited by The Dolman Pragmatist
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8 hours ago, Newquay-Red said:

Oooh, 9th, 14th, 15th and 13th twenty years ago. What an iconic time. Maybe we should get some banners put up around the Gate? Other clubs would be fiercely envious I’m sure. 

The 70s were a long time ago whether you like it or not and saying ‘well we were good 40 years ago’; that’s embarrassing. Barring that time, we have historically underachieved. I always find it funny when older fans on here gatekeep that time. Well done; you were born in a different era and were fortunate that us being in the first division occurred at that time. What a fantastic personal achievement! You should definitely make us all aware of that on a regular basis...

Plus the whole tired ‘hurr durr do you think football started in 1992’ attitude is totally moronic considering you’re saying it to a fellow fan of this club. Not exactly Premier League glory hunting around here is it mate? 

You’ve formed that condescending attitude of yours solely due to your age and definitely not wisdom. We are on an upward trajectory over the past couple of years and it’s funny how on here that’s becoming a controversial opinion after two- yes only TWO- losses.

....and you maintain a rose tinted outlook solely due to your age and definitely not wisdom. We have not been ‘a total embarrassment at this level until LJ came along’ - as a club we have never really set the world alight but we have certainly not always been a ‘total embarrassment’ in tier 2 either

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8 hours ago, Newquay-Red said:

Oooh, 9th, 14th, 15th and 13th twenty years ago. What an iconic time. Maybe we should get some banners put up around the Gate? Other clubs would be fiercely envious I’m sure. 

The 70s were a long time ago whether you like it or not and saying ‘well we were good 40 years ago’; that’s embarrassing. Barring that time, we have historically underachieved. I always find it funny when older fans on here gatekeep that time. Well done; you were born in a different era and were fortunate that us being in the first division occurred at that time. What a fantastic personal achievement! You should definitely make us all aware of that on a regular basis...

Plus the whole tired ‘hurr durr do you think football started in 1992’ attitude is totally moronic considering you’re saying it to a fellow fan of this club. Not exactly Premier League glory hunting around here is it mate? 

You’ve formed that condescending attitude of yours solely due to your age and definitely not wisdom. We are on an upward trajectory over the past couple of years and it’s funny how on here that’s becoming a controversial opinion after two- yes only TWO- losses.

From where do you get your opinion that we are entitled to be a top performing club in this division?

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Weiman scored 10 goals last season is already on 6 so far. He always gives 100%. 
Johnson believes in him and has managed to get him scoring he has scored more goals at city than anytime in his career and in fewer games. So there are more positive s than negatives. It is just a shame that Afobe got injured. We are not in bad position so let’s look at the positives for once !

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14 hours ago, Bernard Lerring said:

I think the main concern about weimann is not whether he's actually any good or not (he is), it's why the rest of the squad have not yet been trained to spot his runs 

He (and Kasey palmer too,on his day) appear to be a higher calibre of player than the rest, the aim should be to make our entire team of equal quality 

 

13 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

This- very much this!

It's funny as I thought that on paper Palmer pushed high and close to Weimann, in a fairly free role could have been the one to do this but not so much to date.

If we could pick the early runs in good time then I think Weimann up there as not quite lone striker but especially the main presence could be the way.

One way to go might be the right back line and yes good possession, if Nagy can move it on to Brownhill and Eliasson, there is ample creativity yet control to pick these runs. Or should be!

OTOH, once in a while, Bentley bypasses defence a bit with the quick pass to Nagy and bypass one of the thirds. Weimann's runs can help to keep defence occupied, quick distribution to Nagy stops them filtering back in....

I think there are some real exciting combinations there and the movement of Weimann plays its part. Disappointed we haven't seen it enough tbh.

 

13 hours ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

Best player we’ve got ... and to answer your point that we ‘don’t have a midfielder able to play him in ...’ - we do, he’s called Kasey Palmer ... oh, and Weimann has played 113 premier league games compared to Bobby Reid’s 27 games at the top level. Weimann is a very intelligent football player who makes incisive runs that many players can’t read - to suggest Reid is a better player, having had just one fine season in his whole career (and he’s now 26 years old), is ridiculous .... Weimann played in the premier league for five consecutive seasons .... and you could even do him the courtesy of spelling his name correctly 

To paraphrase Eric Morecombe , we have all the right players, but don't necessarily play them in the right order.

Palmer is not the type of player you want receiving the ball where he is double marked and all his passing options have been closed down, but with our ponderous build up play from from the back that is what will happen. Against Blackburn, you could time our build up with a calendar, and by the time we got anywhere near the Blackburn half, they had got men behind the ball cutting down options and space. I know Palmer wasn't playing in that game, but had he been then he would almost certainly have been stifled and closed down before having chance to move the ball on.

Weimann drags defenders all over the place and creates room form himself, but he needs someone able to spot his runs and play an early ball into that space. Again Palmer has shown that he can do this. Fans say that he only does this on a few occasions, but how many game winning passes do you need a player to make?

In my view losing Afobe has been detrimental to both Weimann and Palmer, as all three seemed to be getting on the same wavelength early in the season. Adobe seems a more mobile forward than Famara and by playing more on the shoulder of defenders creates the option for Palmer to play a killer ball into space. All too often our style of play without Afobe seems not to create that type of space. 

the risk of repeating myself

 

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5 hours ago, Drew Peacock said:

From where do you get your opinion that we are entitled to be a top performing club in this division?

I don’t hold this opinion at all and find the ‘sleeping giant’ narrative that is spread about us to be cliched and untrue. We are still a relatively small club in this league without a doubt. Our current status is a club punching above their weight and this has been due to our coaching staff and improved infrastructure around the club; I find it a shame that some bash LJ despite all of this. My aspired status for us is to be a club that builds on this and sneaks up, beating bigger, richer and more established clubs along the way.

 

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On 16/12/2019 at 11:43, where's the joy said:

Ok so Bobby left and Weiman came in; it looked like a direct 'run about a bit' replacement.

The difference was that Bobby had a first touch and some turns and could make Fammy look good.

Weiman has none of these qualities. He chases lost causes, has a 'Toblerone boot' touch and cannot hold the ball up.

Currently we don't have a midfielder able to play him in nor a manager able to train the team how to get the best out of him.

I now long for the days when Cotterill didn't fill his bench with spare 'clubs', built a tempo and belief into a settled team

and crucially believed all his defensive problems could be solved by buying a quicksilver striker.

Which is precisely the place we are in now, needing to spend proper money on a 'top talent' striker

we have wasted all this time on Streaky Johnson and us fans have given him an easy ride.

Its time for him to shape up or ship out and replace Weiman

I agree with the first bit where you say Bobby has a much better touch, turns and that Weimann struggles to hold it up.

Disagree with the Johnson bit of your post. He's generally done well imo.

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11 hours ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

I think the derogatory tone of your reply is a bit unnecessary, but I agree with your main point.  I saw my first City march in 1962 and my enduring feeling about a lifetime supporting City is that it’s been over 50 years of disappointment and underachievement.  Why that is the case, I have given up trying to work out, but four years in the top division for a club with our resources and in a city this size is frankly pathetic.  Given that the Championship now is about the same standard as Division One was in the late 70s, I actually think the the last two or three seasons have been about as good as it gets.

I started in 1950 and have exactly the same opinions as you.

Some on here really do not understand how this club has let us all down with one GOOD YEAR IN TEN. 

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Oh for Christ's sake.

Weimann is not the problem. He came here under promises that he wouldn't be stuck out on the wing like he was at Derby.

Anybody that can't see that when he is played up front in a FRONT TWO he is a goalscorer just plainly can't see full stop.

Just like they "can't see" the qualities of Famara when he is played in the same way. 

Diedhiou and Weimann should be upfront (by which I mean through the ****ing middle)together whenever they are both fit.

The problem is not Weimann. The problem is not Diedhiou. 

The problem is in the dugout.

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1 hour ago, cidered abroad said:

I started in 1950 and have exactly the same opinions as you.

Some on here really do not understand how this club has let us all down with one GOOD YEAR IN TEN. 

The 'one GOOD YEAR IN TEN' I don't mind so much. It's that that 'one GOOD YEAR' tends to be in League bloody One, beating the likes of Walsall, Gillingham, Swindon etc,

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46 minutes ago, Superjack said:

Oh for Christ's sake.

Weimann is not the problem. He came here under promises that he wouldn't be stuck out on the wing like he was at Derby.

Anybody that can't see that when he is played up front in a FRONT TWO he is a goalscorer just plainly can't see full stop.

Just like they "can't see" the qualities of Famara when he is played in the same way. 

Diedhiou and Weimann should be upfront (by which I mean through the ****ing middle)together whenever they are both fit.

The problem is not Weimann. The problem is not Diedhiou. 

The problem is in the dugout.

I don't think Weimann is much of a goalscorer to be honest. A goal every 278 minutes this season - that's not a particularly good rate.

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6 hours ago, Newquay-Red said:

I don’t hold this opinion at all and find the ‘sleeping giant’ narrative that is spread about us to be cliched and untrue. We are still a relatively small club in this league without a doubt. Our current status is a club punching above their weight and this has been due to our coaching staff and improved infrastructure around the club; I find it a shame that some bash LJ despite all of this. My aspired status for us is to be a club that builds on this and sneaks up, beating bigger, richer and more established clubs along the way.

 

Small clubs in this division: Barnsley, Luton, QPR, Preston, Brentford, Millwall, Wigan, Hull

Medium size clubs: Charlton, Swansea, Cardiff, Brum, Reading, Huddersfield, Blackburn, Bristol City.

Big clubs: Leeds, West Brom, Sheff Weds, Forest, Derby, Fulham, Stoke, Middlesbrough 

 

We are not in any way, shape or form a "small" club in this division. I struggle to fathom why some folks persist with their belief that we are. Baffling.

*(Blackburn could be "small, really. Their crowds are;" Stoke will be "medium" once their PP are gone; Fulham are "medium" without PP; Swansea are pretty "small" really; Middlesbrough are in danger of becoming "medium;" Huddersfield were "small" prior to their streaky promotion to the Prem, and will at some point resort to being "small" again; we are 9th best supported in this division so far this season, just outside the top/"big" 8).

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3 minutes ago, Moments of Pleasure said:

Small clubs in this division: Barnsley, Luton, QPR, Preston, Brentford, Millwall, Wigan, Hull

Medium size clubs: Charlton, Swansea, Cardiff, Brum, Reading, Huddersfield, Blackburn, Bristol City.

Big clubs: Leeds, West Brom, Sheff Weds, Forest, Derby, Fulham, Stoke, Middlesbrough 

 

We are not in any way, shape or form a "small" club in this division. I struggle to fathom why some folks persist with their belief that we are. Baffling.

*(Blackburn could be "small, really. Their crowds are;" Stoke will be "medium" once their PP are gone; Fulham are "medium" without PP; Swansea are pretty "small" really; Middlesbrough are in danger of becoming "medium;" Huddersfield were "small" prior to their streaky promotion to the Prem, and will at some point resort to being "small" again; we are 9th best supported in this division so far this season, just outside the top/"big" 8).

Warming to my own theme, there, I now present, in order of size (beginning with the "biggest") who the "big" boys are amongst the "medium" size Championship clubs:

1. Cardiff

2. Brum

3. Bristol City 

4. Huddersfield 

5. Charlton 

6. Blackburn 

7. Swansea 

8. Reading 

 

Oooh,look at us - we're one of the "big" "medium" size Championship clubs.....

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1 hour ago, JonDolman said:

I don't think Weimann is much of a goalscorer to be honest. A goal every 278 minutes this season - that's not a particularly good rate.

His contribution is more than just goals per minute.

If you played him as a true “9”, or the “main striker” you might see a different goal return. But that is not the role he’s been given since Fam returned from his game ban.  That’s not me dissing Fam either .

 

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On 16/12/2019 at 19:08, BigTone said:

I read this forum and I am so glad that non of the posters actually pick the team.

Only a matter of time, Tone.

Nowadays we - at great cost - elect representatives to go away and spend time on our behalf considering all those highly complex matters such as our trade and foreign relationships, and to consider the best approach and tactics. We also employ advisers to research, evaluate, coach them for us to get the best results. But then we turn round and say forget all that we're going to tell you what to do, based on something we read on the side of a bus, and you get on and do it.

By comparison, team selection by OTIB - just leaving LJ and his team to make the best of it - is positively sensible.

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10 hours ago, JonDolman said:

I don't think Weimann is much of a goalscorer to be honest. A goal every 278 minutes this season - that's not a particularly good rate.

Spot on, he is not a natural finisher, the recent wasted chance to score after 3 mins at home to Millwall is a prime example. Yes his movement, when not asked to play wide, is good and he runs about an awful lot and is a pest to defenders, BUT he is not and never will be a 20 goal a season proper striker. If we were to sign Nketiah then I'd hope Weimann finds himself on the bench, but knowing LJ he will ask him to play wide (which really is a poor option).

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22 hours ago, hertsexile said:

Weiman scored 10 goals last season is already on 6 so far. He always gives 100%. 
Johnson believes in him and has managed to get him scoring he has scored more goals at city than anytime in his career and in fewer games. So there are more positive s than negatives. It is just a shame that Afobe got injured. We are not in bad position so let’s look at the positives for once !

Hertsexile. True, let's not be overly negative 

There is always going to be split views on players and we all have a little 'football manager' in us. My main gripe is that there appear to be a couple of players in key positions that LJ just won't drop/rotate - currently Weimann and Brownhill (perhaps Nagy but I suspect he will get hooked for a few games). Both need taking out for a few games and their positions freshened up with bench warmers chomping at the bit. 
Taylor not playing is plain baffling, COD at LWB crazy and the continued partnership of Nagy and Massengo in the engine room totally bonkers 

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