Phileas Fogg Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 2 hours ago, RedDave said: Worth £8m?! Are you crazy? Look how good he is at 18. The potential is absolutely massive. Clubs pay for potential. He’s worth at least £15m but probably £20m+ Beat me to it - people seem to think it's like Fifa where you buy players based on their current ability 'score' - really basic way of thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeAman08 Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 4 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said: Clubs signing him aren't paying for his current ability, they're paying for maybe 15 years of potential. If we sold him it would be for a huge amount, assuming he doesn't have any transfer clauses in his account. Yea but you have to take into account loads of other things like current market value for that position, contract length and wages. Some mentioning 30m on here and that is just fantasy putting too much emphasis on potential. We aren’t going to get the fee Leicester got for Kante for Massengo. He at the moment is a high energy win the ball back and play quick short pass midfielder. Possibly he can grow to more but the value for these types is not high. He is harder to value than anyone we have had before because of his pedigree but I am not sure we will be selling Massengo for more than 12-15m in the next two windows. If he stays and can dominate games for us through next season think his valuation can rise tremendously but at the moment most of his value is in potential and that will only take a fee so high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Brent Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 Current value would be about 4M but any club wanting him would have to pay upwards of 25M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILINFRANCE Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 3 hours ago, glynriley said: Ben Sherman...?!! A clear sign of your age. Brutus, anybody? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 1 hour ago, JoeAman08 said: Yea but you have to take into account loads of other things like current market value for that position, contract length and wages. Some mentioning 30m on here and that is just fantasy putting too much emphasis on potential. We aren’t going to get the fee Leicester got for Kante for Massengo. He at the moment is a high energy win the ball back and play quick short pass midfielder. Possibly he can grow to more but the value for these types is not high. He is harder to value than anyone we have had before because of his pedigree but I am not sure we will be selling Massengo for more than 12-15m in the next two windows. If he stays and can dominate games for us through next season think his valuation can rise tremendously but at the moment most of his value is in potential and that will only take a fee so high. Kante left Leicester a few years ago. The market keeps going up. Kante is no better now than then but would be worth double nowadays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeAman08 Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 1 minute ago, RedDave said: Kante left Leicester a few years ago. The market keeps going up. Kante is no better now than then but would be worth double nowadays. There are still values recently that suggest the price for these type of midfielders is not massive. Fabinho 45m Rodri 65m but that was release clause with a well of club. Llorente an established pro 35m this summer to Atletico from Real. So the 30m to me is still well OTT. Massengo would be bought almost exclusively with potential in mind. It is like the difference bewteen Webster and Kelly. Webster much more established player while Kelly has high potential. Similar positions but 5-7m difference in valuations. Massengo hasn’t played enough to be a 20m player imo. Which is good for us because it means he will stay longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 52 minutes ago, PHILINFRANCE said: A clear sign of your age. Brutus, anybody? Et tu ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Port Said Red Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 5 hours ago, Brooko said: Hate to disappoint you but he already part owned by Chelsea! Well that seems to break all the rules around player ownership, so you had better be able produce some decent proof of this before spouting it on a public forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBCFC Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 What confused you @poland_exile? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 16 minutes ago, Port Said Red said: Well that seems to break all the rules around player ownership, so you had better be able produce some decent proof of this before spouting it on a public forum. Though, I'm not fully up to speed on these rules. I don't go in for the Massengo story, but I know that in Serie A and in some other notable cases- Samuel Eto'o in the [past in La Liga, this seems to happen- is it outlawed in English football? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Port Said Red Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 Just now, Mr Popodopolous said: Though, I'm not fully up to speed on these rules. I don't go in for the Massengo story, but I know that in Serie A and in some other notable cases- Samuel Eto'o in the [past in La Liga, this seems to happen- is it outlawed in English football? I was under the impression that a player could not have 3rd party owners due to modern slavery laws, is this not the case? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 1 minute ago, Port Said Red said: I was under the impression that a player could not have 3rd party owners due to modern slavery laws, is this not the case? Ah 3rd party, maybe I'm out of touch with it tbh. Just know that there's dual ownership or has been in Serie A, but maybe it's different here. Maybe my view is outdated! I think it's where Club A owns 50% of a players rights and Club B 50%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Port Said Red Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 3 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: Ah 3rd party, maybe I'm out of touch with it tbh. Just know that there's dual ownership or has been in Serie A, but maybe it's different here. Maybe my view is outdated! I think it's where Club A owns 50% of a players rights and Club B 50%. Apparently no longer allowed in Italy, it’s not 3rd party though, it’s co ownership. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Co-ownership_(association_football) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 1 minute ago, Port Said Red said: Apparently no longer allowed in Italy, it’s not 3rd party though, it’s co ownership. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Co-ownership_(association_football) Thanks- that clears that up. Never say never, but I think it's therefore- ie confirming it- fair to say that Massengo quite likely isn't partially owned by Chelsea! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjak Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 5 hours ago, Robbored said: Not according to LJ. Nuff said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBCFC Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 9 minutes ago, maxjak said: Source please?........or have you been chatting to him down the pub? "The conspiracy theories being circulated on social media regarding City being a holding destination for another English club have been dismissed as "ridiculous" by sources in France. Firstly, it would be highly illegal with City a club who, sometimes to their detriment, are straight shooters in the transfer market and, secondly, Massengo's talents have been known for at least two years so the concept of a club deliberately buying him for in excess of £10m one or two years down the line simply doesn't make financial sense" From Bristol Post. Not a quote from LJ here. Though I'm pretty sure he has also dismissed it as the nonsense it so obviously is. The fact it's against the rules here to have co-ownership of a player should be the first hint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carey 6 Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 46 minutes ago, Port Said Red said: Well that seems to break all the rules around player ownership, so you had better be able produce some decent proof of this before spouting it on a public forum. Claims he isn't but I'm pretty sure Brooko is O'Dowdas dad. Look through posting history! Either he's on the wind up based on the rumours in the summer, or he genuinely knows something we dont! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Port Said Red Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 1 minute ago, Carey 6 said: Claims he isn't but I'm pretty sure Brooko is O'Dowdas dad. Look through posting history! Either he's on the wind up based on the rumours in the summer, or he genuinely knows something we dont! We’ll see, as I have shown in my subsequent posts, it would appear that co ownership is illegal in Europe, would we seriously flout the rules that way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
underhanded Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 2 hours ago, David Brent said: Current value would be about 4M but any club wanting him would have to pay upwards of 25M Call me old fashoined but I always thought value and the price paid for things were a bit more closely linked than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Up The City! Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 45 minutes ago, Port Said Red said: We’ll see, as I have shown in my subsequent posts, it would appear that co ownership is illegal in Europe, would we seriously flout the rules that way? No we wouldnt. However an option to buy/first refusal is entirely legal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Port Said Red Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 5 minutes ago, Up The City! said: No we wouldnt. However an option to buy/first refusal is entirely legal. But entirely pointless as any such agreement would probably change as the personnel at each club changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Brent Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 2 hours ago, underhanded said: Call me old fashoined but I always thought value and the price paid for things were a bit more closely linked than that. Well he isn’t a £25M player. Far from it. Based on his current ability he’s probably worth about £4M. But a buying club would be paying for his potential so would have to pay us £25M. This is football by the way, not grocery shopping at Tesco. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColeCiderRed Posted December 20, 2019 Report Share Posted December 20, 2019 8 hours ago, RedDave said: Worth £8m?! Are you crazy? Look how good he is at 18. The potential is absolutely massive. Clubs pay for potential. He’s worth at least £15m but probably £20m+ potential is absolutely massive.... I thought that was his hair?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted December 21, 2019 Report Share Posted December 21, 2019 16 hours ago, Carey 6 said: Claims he isn't but I'm pretty sure Brooko is O'Dowdas dad. Look through posting history! Either he's on the wind up based on the rumours in the summer, or he genuinely knows something we dont! 16 hours ago, Port Said Red said: We’ll see, as I have shown in my subsequent posts, it would appear that co ownership is illegal in Europe, would we seriously flout the rules that way? Wouldn’t surprise me if it was or perhaps his agent. If you notice, always very disparaging about other players around CO’D’s age who are seen as a bit more exciting or interesting. Never criticises CO’D’s mate Brownhill either.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshtonGreat Posted December 21, 2019 Report Share Posted December 21, 2019 14 hours ago, David Brent said: Well he isn’t a £25M player. Far from it. Based on his current ability he’s probably worth about £4M. But a buying club would be paying for his potential so would have to pay us £25M. This is football by the way, not grocery shopping at Tesco. That's assuming they think he has that much potential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooko Posted December 21, 2019 Report Share Posted December 21, 2019 2 hours ago, Phileas Fogg said: Wouldn’t surprise me if it was or perhaps his agent. If you notice, always very disparaging about other players around CO’D’s age who are seen as a bit more exciting or interesting. Never criticises CO’D’s mate Brownhill either.. Sorry to dull the speculation - no agent or relative. I just post what I think & what I pick up on. On the Chelsea business link with Massengo, this has been doing the rounds for months. Time will tell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBCFC Posted December 21, 2019 Report Share Posted December 21, 2019 Still waiting for an answer @poland_exile... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBCFC Posted December 21, 2019 Report Share Posted December 21, 2019 12 minutes ago, Brooko said: Sorry to dull the speculation - no agent or relative. I just post what I think & what I pick up on. On the Chelsea business link with Massengo, this has been doing the rounds for months. Time will tell It was a bollocks conspiracy that started on here. The person who first said it even said it wasn't a real thing. So again, if you could refrain from spreading known bollocks that would be great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loco Rojo Posted December 21, 2019 Report Share Posted December 21, 2019 On 20/12/2019 at 09:19, Brooko said: Hate to disappoint you but he already part owned by Chelsea! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swanker Posted December 21, 2019 Report Share Posted December 21, 2019 On 20/12/2019 at 10:24, Major Isewater said: Shirt ? What type of shit you smokin’ bro ? What it is man! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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