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Newquay-Red

Can somebody please explain O’Dowda to me

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6 minutes ago, mozo said:

All fair points but my counter is look at the impact Elliasson had, and always does. He ran at players, won free kicks, simple passes, didn't commit fouls. If anyone deserves a regular slot it's him.

And we know that you can't fit Elliasson and Palmer in the same team (baffling that Johnson tried that at the end!)

All valid points too.

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As I said after CoD had re-signed to the question what does he bring? He’ll bring LJ his P45.

Sums LJs reign up to me. CoD may well run around a lot and be the fastest player in training, with very pleasing mobility stats. No doubt  that qualifies him for Chief Busy Bee status in LJs mind. However, he brings F-all to the table in a real match.

 

Edging now towards having had enough. 

We’re stale.

 

As everything in Bristol Sport is measured in a consumer-type way, time to adopt the ‘product evloution’ analogy, we’re in the mature phase now with LJ on a downward spiral. 

Disappointing end to the project, but continual buying of lightweight mini-mes in midfield and ignoring the age old City problem of lacking a decent pool of strikers have finally caught up with us. 

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Mark Ashton......cough....cough......Mark Ashton. 
 

O’Dowda is Ashton’s golden child. He was his parting gesture to Oxford when he left there to come here. Ashton has basically hung his hat on O’Dowda. 
 

And to think, Ashton wanted to put his eggs in O’Dowda’s one dimensional basket rather than pursue Ollie Watkins. 
 

Poor recruitment. 

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Cant score goals, cant link up play, cant win a header, can't tackle...so what exactly are his attributes (apart from his kit being nice and clean at the end of 90 mins in December).

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2 hours ago, Flagon said:

At the moment I'm just glad he did sign a new contract so that we hopefully get something for him. 

No-one who can pay him half of what he's earning would actually want him. And if they did, they wouldn't want to pay for him.

TLDR he ain't going nowhere.

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2 minutes ago, Sleepy1968 said:

No-one who can pay him half of what he's earning would actually want him. And if they did, they wouldn't want to pay for him.

TLDR he ain't going nowhere.

He’s got a very good agent who, no doubt, is already touting his talents around to bigger Clubs than us. 

Hoping Leeds and Forest have a bidding war come 1 January. 

Would be massively disappointed if our CEO in granting that contract extension hasn’t already got Clubs lined up for bids starting at £5 million. 

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1 hour ago, Fjmcity said:

Not hitting the target after 15 seconds was Pretty inexcusable 

I can actually excuse him for that, its the next 90 odd minutes that he disappeared for that I can't

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If you listen to Ashley Williams post match interview - he is clearly equally frustrated with the lack of quality in the final third.  He mentions, correctly, that the defence and Bentley did their jobs but it’s what he didn’t say about the final third - you can read his thoughts about that.

For far too long we have been very very weak in the final third - and too many ‘attacking midfielders’ don’t have the confidence or ability to drop a shoulder and shoot from distance or look for that killer pass.

We need two strikers, minimum, in Jan - but we still need some quality in the middle of the pitch!

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Just now, RedRock said:

He’s got a very good agent who, no doubt, is already touting his talents around to bigger Clubs than us. 

Hoping Leeds and Forest have a bidding war come 1 January. 

Would be massively disappointed if our CEO in granting that contract extension hasn’t already got Clubs lined up for bids starting at £5 million. 

£5m, anybody who has scouted COD would only be willing to pay a tenth of that!  

Seriously as a CM option, he is really poor (I know he played there for Eire), think he is better played left hand side but still worth nothing like £5m.

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1 hour ago, Newquay-Red said:

Really at a loss now to what he brings. Starting to remind me of Martyn Woolford to be honest. Poor football intelligence, doesn’t link up well with the others and no end product. Let’s hope that Eliasson doesn’t end up like Bolasie; leaving for first team football and then becoming a Premier League player...

He was signed under the pretense that he was a raw player and one for the future. Yet, he seems to just get into the team despite doing very little of note. Run up the wing a bit, turn around, make a short pass which sometimes doesn’t even go right. Is certainly not a natural finisher but even his crossing leaves a lot to be desired most of the time. As to why Johnson keeps trying getting  to shoehorn him at left wing back to play this turgid 3-5-2, God knows. Actually I think even she would struggle to comprehend why.

Please please please please someone enlighten me as the fact that he got a new contract is beyond me. Ask yourself; when he gets the ball, do you get up off your seat in anticipation or do you resign yourself to what is inevitably going to happen next?

Great summary. In short, O'Dowda dug a a very deep hole and disappeared into it. For the whole game. Again.

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1 hour ago, RedRock said:

He’s got a very good agent who, no doubt, is already touting his talents around to bigger Clubs than us. 

Hoping Leeds and Forest have a bidding war come 1 January. 

Would be massively disappointed if our CEO in granting that contract extension hasn’t already got Clubs lined up for bids starting at £5 million. 

Maybe you're right. But given his post sulk contract negitiation form hasn't improved I'd be happy to offload him now and be done with it.

£25 to CHSW if COD goes on a perm in January.

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10 minutes ago, old_eastender said:

£5m, anybody who has scouted COD would only be willing to pay a tenth of that!  

Seriously as a CM option, he is really poor (I know he played there for Eire), think he is better played left hand side but still worth nothing like £5m.

Did I type £5 million?

Sorry, I meant £5.

 

That’ll mean we’re just £14,999,995 short of the price Brentford want for Ollie Watkins. The player we could of got from Exeter for  about £500,000 more than we paid Oxford for CoD around the same time we signed him. 

Classic piece of BCFC transfer business. 

Then just to make Oxford feel better about things we loan them MattyTaylor while the strikers we keep can’t create a chance or hit a barn door. Clearly our Club have a soft spot for Oxford. 

Edited by RedRock

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1 minute ago, RedRock said:

Did I type £5 million?

Sorry, I meant £5.

 

That’ll mean we’re just £14,999,995 short of the price Brentford want for Ollie Watkins. The player we could of got from Exeter for  about £500,000 more than we paid Oxford for CoD around the same time we signed him. 

Classic piece of BCFC transfer business. 

Then just to make Oxford feel better about things we loan them Marty Taylor while the strikers we keep can’t create a chance or hit a barn door. Clearly our Club have a soft spot for Oxford. 

You mean mark Ashton has a soft spot

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1 hour ago, ohhhshauntaylor said:

**He will start @ Charlton again on Boxing Day. 
 

absolute disgrace of a footballer. 

** hope so, and hope he manages to conjure up a rare motm performance and maybe even a goal or two...

That should create a bit of decent money interest come  the January transfer window...

(could be our 'Steve Austin' - $6 million dollar man 🤞)   Hic, Happy Christmas, hic... 

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I don't want Hughton. But then LJ does not even play attractive football anymore. You get teams like Leeds, Brentford, WBA, Fulham who play their football every game it seems. We will try and play it at times, but then games like today LJ more or less admits we came for a 0-0 in his post match interview. Hardly brave and hardly what I thought was LJ's philosophy.  

There is no real consistency in how we play. And I do not get some of these decisions. Diedhiou and Weimann has pretty much always looked like an awful partnership, yet he persists with it. 

LJ clearly has a problem with knowing what shape and what style of football we should be playing. Players look lost.

I do feel a bit sorry for Brownhill and O'Dowda in this weird 3322 formation. There isn't really anything to pass to ahead of them. No link player as Weimann doesn't come short. No width as Rowe hasn't the legs to charge forward quickly. And Hunt having a shocker and mainly stuck back defending Harris all game until he was subbed.

LJ moved away from the 3322 because it looked so poor, and now he has gone back to it. Has he ran out of ideas?

I thought LJ would keep changing systems until something works and then stick with that. But now he is choosing to go back to something that does not work. How many times did that 3322 look good since Afobe got injured? Even Cardiff game we hardly looked great going forward. One moment of brilliance from Brownhill and a solid defensive display. We relied on a bit of luck. This way of playing is not going to get us in the playoffs.

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1 hour ago, MelksRed said:

Never rated him. Superficial player, seemingly narcissistic. Get rid

That is no way to talk about our Head Coach. But I do agree with you.

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11 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

I don't want Hughton. But then LJ does not even play attractive football anymore. You get teams like Leeds, Brentford, WBA, Fulham who play their football every game it seems. We will try and play it at times, but then games like today LJ more or less admits we came for a 0-0 in his post match interview. Hardly brave and hardly what I thought was LJ's philosophy.  

There is no real consistency in how we play. And I do not get some of these decisions. Diedhiou and Weimann has pretty much always looked like an awful partnership, yet he persists with it. 

LJ clearly has a problem with knowing what shape and what style of football we should be playing. Players look lost.

I do feel a bit sorry for Brownhill and O'Dowda in this weird 3322 formation. There isn't really anything to pass to ahead of them. No link player as Weimann doesn't come short. No width as Rowe hasn't the legs to charge forward quickly. And Hunt having a shocker and mainly stuck back defending Harris all game until he was subbed.

LJ moved away from the 3322 because it looked so poor, and now he has gone back to it. Has he ran out of ideas?

I thought LJ would keep changing systems until something works and then stick with that. But now he is choosing to go back to something that does not work. How many times did that 3322 look good since Afobe got injured? Even Cardiff game we hardly looked great going forward. One moment of brilliance from Brownhill and a solid defensive display. We relied on a bit of luck. This way of playing is not going to get us in the playoffs.

Well he did stick with the back four with Eliasson, then we lost with it so we might not see it again...

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13 minutes ago, mozo said:

Well he did stick with the back four with Eliasson, then we lost with it so we might not see it again...

But the problem with the back 4 for me was going 2 up top. Should have gone a more solid looking 4231 or 4141. 

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O’dowda is currently in my list of worst players to ever play for us? 
 

Missing that chance cost us the game, useless, offers absolutely nothing to the side. God knows why LJ is playing him. 

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3 hours ago, Harry said:

Mark Ashton......cough....cough......Mark Ashton. 
 

O’Dowda is Ashton’s golden child. He was his parting gesture to Oxford when he left there to come here. Ashton has basically hung his hat on O’Dowda. 
 

And to think, Ashton wanted to put his eggs in O’Dowda’s one dimensional basket rather than pursue Ollie Watkins. 
 

Poor recruitment. 

Yet you neglect to mention in this post, despite it being posted on here, perhaps even by you in the past even the full part of the Watkins story- pretty sure we were quoted a different fee to Brentford, weren't we?

Granted, that could've been linked to, down to a failure to cultivate relationships at some level.

@JonDolman Fulham...had a quick look, 36% possession. 3 shots on target! Win 2-1 (vs Leeds), the opener a penalty that was suspect- granted sometimes teams have to dig in and I get the general point you're making.

Identity- we lack one!

Edited by Mr Popodopolous

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Anyone who slows down to avoid a tackle shouldn’t be wearing the shirt imo. Losing a tackle is fair enough, some people are stronger than others but don’t shit out, at least try and affect the opponent.

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5 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Yet you neglect to mention in this post, despite it being posted on here, perhaps even by you in the past even the full part of the Watkins story- pretty sure we were quoted a different fee to Brentford, weren't we?

Granted, that could've been linked to, down to a failure to cultivate relationships at some level.

@JonDolman Fulham...had a quick look, 36% possession. 3 shots on target! Win 2-1 (vs Leeds), the opener a penalty that was suspect- granted sometimes teams have to dig in and I get the general point you're making.

Identity- we lack one!

Should have had him way before Brentford were interested 

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41 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Yet you neglect to mention in this post, despite it being posted on here, perhaps even by you in the past even the full part of the Watkins story- pretty sure we were quoted a different fee to Brentford, weren't we?

Granted, that could've been linked to, down to a failure to cultivate relationships at some level.

@JonDolman Fulham...had a quick look, 36% possession. 3 shots on target! Win 2-1 (vs Leeds), the opener a penalty that was suspect- granted sometimes teams have to dig in and I get the general point you're making.

Identity- we lack one!

I think we can have less possession than 50% and still play well, pass the ball well and deserve to win a game. Maybe 36% is a bit low, and maybe we got lucky to win that game. And maybe our low percentage possession may have been a reason why we would have let in a late equaliser as we were inviting too much pressure on our goal.

But I think Huddersfield we were exceptional in how we passed the ball, and I think we may have had less than 50% possession then. 

One thing is clear though is that in most games we really struggle to pass the ball. There seems to have been various reasons for this.

One thing for me is that we play 2 strikers and neither like to, or are that good at dropping back between the lines to receive the ball. We don't have players out wide in space. It's all far too narrow. 

On the other thread people are blaming players. But for me we are not set up right. I think 2 up front is a problem when they link up so poorly. I don't get why LJ doesn't change this. 

 

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The kid is useless. And to think him and his old man had the cheek to delay on signing a new contract. We should have ****** him out of the door last summer.

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4 hours ago, JonDolman said:

LJ moved away from the 3322 because it looked so poor, and now he has gone back to it. Has he ran out of ideas?

I thought LJ would keep changing systems until something works and then stick with that. But now he is choosing to go back to something that does not work. How many times did that 3322 look good since Afobe got injured? Even Cardiff game we hardly looked great going forward. One moment of brilliance from Brownhill and a solid defensive display. We relied on a bit of luck. This way of playing is not going to get us in the playoffs.

 

3 hours ago, JonDolman said:

But the problem with the back 4 for me was going 2 up top. Should have gone a more solid looking 4231 or 4141. 

Spot on in both posts JD.

He us back to square one. I thought he’d go back to a back 3, but never envisaged O’Dowda starting today with Brownhill, Nagy, Massengo and Smith to choose from.

I think the Afobe thing was key, the 5212 with Palmer meant the opposition worried about us!!

That no longer works!!

What I can’t understand is we now appear to have a squad that has players inflexible in certain formations, or players incompatible with each other, or both!

He really needs to pick an 11 in a system and stick to it....coach it, drill it, go with the courage of his convictions.

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33 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

I think we can have less possession than 50% and still play well, pass the ball well and deserve to win a game. Maybe 36% is a bit low, and maybe we got lucky to win that game. And maybe our low percentage possession may have been a reason why we would have let in a late equaliser as we were inviting too much pressure on our goal.

But I think Huddersfield we were exceptional in how we passed the ball, and I think we may have had less than 50% possession then. 

One thing is clear though is that in most games we really struggle to pass the ball. There seems to have been various reasons for this.

One thing for me is that we play 2 strikers and neither like to, or are that good at dropping back between the lines to receive the ball. We don't have players out wide in space. It's all far too narrow. 

On the other thread people are blaming players. But for me we are not set up right. I think 2 up front is a problem when they link up so poorly. I don't get why LJ doesn't change this. 

 

What I'm saying is, that Fulham had this on Saturday when they beat Leeds- just to be clear on what I meant!

Ours was about 32% in our win there. Likewise, think we invited too much and less possession played a part.

Agreed.

Agreed.

I still think a better run with Weimann as sole striker and correct support, correct tactics is a way to go.

Think 2 up front, given Afobe's injury, is a problem yeah. We don't set up right and haven't for some while IMO.

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How he is an international player totally dumbfounds me ... then again how he is a championship player does too ... 4 seasons and just 6 goals for a player with his pace ... is shocking 

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27 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

 

Spot on in both posts JD.

He us back to square one. I thought he’d go back to a back 3, but never envisaged O’Dowda starting today with Brownhill, Nagy, Massengo and Smith to choose from.

I think the Afobe thing was key, the 5212 with Palmer meant the opposition worried about us!!

That no longer works!!

What I can’t understand is we now appear to have a squad that has players inflexible in certain formations, or players incompatible with each other, or both!

He really needs to pick an 11 in a system and stick to it....coach it, drill it, go with the courage of his convictions.

Yep agree.

I often wonder what other managers would do with our bunch of players. Certainly very different to what Lee did today I reckon.

Not saying I'd sack LJ. But this is my point when saying I don't really blame the players as there seems no team cohesion. It's not simply they all can't control and pass a ball, there's more to it than that.

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18 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Yep agree.

I often wonder what other managers would do with our bunch of players. Certainly very different to what Lee did today I reckon.

Not saying I'd sack LJ. But this is my point when saying I don't really blame the players as there seems no team cohesion. It's not simply they all can't control and pass a ball, there's more to it than that.

It’s a good squad on paper (someone on twitter said we don’t play on paper!).

I honestly don’t think you can lay the blame totally at LJ today, the players need to hold their hands up for that too...but it is the manager who sends them over the line.

Out of interest, if you had used 3 subs today, what would you have done?

I haven’t thought about but I would be thinking about the performances of Rowe, Hunt, Brownhill, O’Dowda and Weimann.  That’s not calling out their efforts or lack of it, just they were all below the level I would expect today.  The other six carried them!

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5 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

It’s a good squad on paper (someone on twitter said we don’t play on paper!).

I honestly don’t think you can lay the blame totally at LJ today, the players need to hold their hands up for that too...but it is the manager who sends them over the line.

Out of interest, if you had used 3 subs today, what would you have done?

I haven’t thought about but I would be thinking about the performances of Rowe, Hunt, Brownhill, O’Dowda and Weimann.  That’s not calling out their efforts or lack of it, just they were all below the level I would expect today.  The other six carried them!

Agree they were all our worst players. Well actually Palmer too when he came on!

I would have brought on Nagy, Eliasson and Pereira. Gone 4 at the back. 4-2-3-1. Push up more as Nuhui was far too close to our goal. Sitting back like we were gave Bannan too much room and meant we were too deep against Nuhui.

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1 minute ago, JonDolman said:

Agree they were all our worst players. Well actually Palmer too when he came on!

I would have brought on Nagy, Eliasson and Pereira. Gone 4 at the back. 4-2-3-1. Push up more as Nuhui was far too close to our goal. Sitting back like we were gave Bannan too much room and meant we were too deep against Nuhui.

Ta, who did you take off?

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1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

Ta, who did you take off?

 

I was thinking if we go 4 at the back then LJ is bound to bring off Moore. And thought if i had to take one of the 3 centre backs off then it'd be Williams, as he'd not been as good as the other 2 today imo. Hadn't thought Moore would do well against Harris like he did at right back.

So Williams, Hunt and then I thought O'Dowda and Weimann had to come off, so not sure which one out of those 2!

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12 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

 

I was thinking if we go 4 at the back then LJ is bound to bring off Moore. And thought if i had to take one of the 3 centre backs off then it'd be Williams, as he'd not been as good as the other 2 today imo. Hadn't thought Moore would do well against Harris like he did at right back.

So Williams, Hunt and then I thought O'Dowda and Weimann had to come off, so not sure which one out of those 2!

Might’ve been better subbing 4 off and only bringing 3 on 😂😂😂

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39 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

It’s a good squad on paper (someone on twitter said we don’t play on paper!).

A good squad doesn't necessarily make a good team and that seems to be our problem. On paper we have a more than capable squad for this division but still seem to be trying to work out our best TEAM. We all said "wait till we get all our injured players back" but only Afobe and Dasilva are still out and we seem to have gotten worse as opposed to getting better. We were bereft of ideas today and as regards the passing.......that was shocking. 

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For my money the first change was made too early. We were comfortable (ish) at 0-0. As soon as he made the double switch and changed the system we were wide open again in midfield. If he wanted to go for the win then Eliason should have come on around the 80th minute mark in place of Hunt. The Earlier change should have been to replace CoD or Smith with Nagy. and put Brownhill as AM behind the front 2.

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I actually think O'Dowda has the attributes to be a good player, which is probably why we (and his agent) persist, but his main problem is he has zero interest in winning football matches, so his skillset amounts to very little.

Not sure I can recall a more gutless City player, he can run around a bit if you need to tick those boxes, but turns back and passes inside at the first sight of trouble, he plays it safe so often he's a waste of an attacking selection.

I suppose he is useful in the press but he's virtually become an attacking non-entity which is remarkable for a player of his attributes. I used to bemoan Paterson but Paterson takes on players and tries to win football games.

The nicest thing I can say about O'Dowda is he tries hard not to lose football games, sadly he has very little interest in winning them. The pass inside to the opposition at 1-0 down with players ahead of him summed up his cowardice.

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2 minutes ago, Sir Geoff said:

For my money the first change was made too early. We were comfortable (ish) at 0-0. As soon as he made the double switch and changed the system we were wide open again in midfield. If he wanted to go for the win then Eliason should have come on around the 80th minute mark in place of Hunt. The Earlier change should have been to replace CoD or Smith with Nagy. and put Brownhill as AM behind the front 2.

You’re right, we were marginally better second half.  O’Dowda got put through and didn’t cut it back.  Rowe crosses for Hunt to see his header off the line.

But again, it gets thrown in a bin for a drastic change rather than a subtle tweak.

Now when did I title a thread “sledgehammer to crack a walnut” 👀

Most of us would’ve taken 0-0.

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2 minutes ago, Olé said:

The nicest thing I can say about O'Dowda is he tries hard not to lose football games, sadly he has very little interest in winning them. The pass inside to the opposition at 1-0 down with players ahead of him summed up his cowardice.

That bit epitomised it for me.  Chance to stretch his legs....checked back.

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1 minute ago, Olé said:

I actually think O'Dowda has the attributes to be a good player, which is probably why we (and his agent) persist, but his main problem is he has zero interest in winning football matches, so his skillset amounts to very little.

Not sure I can recall a more gutless City player, he can run around a bit if you need to tick those boxes, but turns back and passes inside at the first sight of trouble, he plays it safe so often he's a waste of an attacking selection.

I suppose he is useful in the press but he's virtually become an attacking non-entity which is remarkable for a player of his attributes. I used to bemoan Paterson but Paterson takes on players and tries to win football games.

The nicest thing I can say about O'Dowda is he tries hard not to lose football games, sadly he has very little interest in winning them. The pass inside to the opposition at 1-0 down with players ahead of him summed up his cowardice.

Spot on @Olé  

His attributes on paper (as previously mentioned it’s not played on paper) are everything you want- tall, quick, etc. But he rarely drives us forward, creates anything nor does he seem to have the football brain to be part of the squad. 
Ive never rated him, he has always frustrated me and I’m amazed it’s taken this long for others to really see this. 
the fact he started today didn’t surprise me, but instantly frustrated me- and the early chance summed him up. 
The fact he then stayed on for 90 minutes was quite remarkable and must serious harm morale of others, like Szmodics, Massengo, Nagy, Palmer etc. 
 

sadly I can’t see anyone wanting him, nor bidding for him. 

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1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

 

Spot on in both posts JD.

He us back to square one. I thought he’d go back to a back 3, but never envisaged O’Dowda starting today with Brownhill, Nagy, Massengo and Smith to choose from.

I think the Afobe thing was key, the 5212 with Palmer meant the opposition worried about us!!

That no longer works!!

What I can’t understand is we now appear to have a squad that has players inflexible in certain formations, or players incompatible with each other, or both!

He really needs to pick an 11 in a system and stick to it....coach it, drill it, go with the courage of his convictions.

The problem is, Davefevs, that I don't believe that he has a clue what he is doing. He cannot stop tinkering/changing on a match/weekly basis.

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3 hours ago, Rob k said:

Should have had him way before Brentford were interested 

Does anyone seriously think that if we had signed Ollie Watkins at the time, he would still be the player he is today, with us? He would be another bloody Marley Watkins, having had all his skills sucked out of him. 

Edited by The Horse With No Name
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1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

You’re right, we were marginally better second half.  O’Dowda got put through and didn’t cut it back.  Rowe crosses for Hunt to see his header off the line.

But again, it gets thrown in a bin for a drastic change rather than a subtle tweak.

Now when did I title a thread “sledgehammer to crack a walnut” 👀

Most of us would’ve taken 0-0.

0-0 was the only result I could see us getting. We were toothless in attack and never really troubled the keeper all game.

 

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