Jump to content

Welcome to One Team in Bristol - Bristol City Forums

Welcome to One Team in Bristol - Bristol City Forums, like most online communities you must register to view or post in our community, but don't worry this is a simple free process that requires minimal information for you to signup. Be a part of One Team in Bristol - Bristol City Forums by signing in or creating an account.

  • Start new topics and reply to others
  • Full access to all forums (not all viewable as guest)
  • Subscribe to topics and forums to get email updates
  • Get your own profile page and make new friends
  • Send personal messages to other members.
  • Support OTIB with a premium membership

Eddie Notgetinya

Players more responsible than LJ

Recommended Posts

Yet these players keep playing 🤔 are they responsible for being selected? One example is O’Dowda what has he actually done to get 106 appearances for us? 
 

Some weren’t up for it today like Brownhill and Weimann but I know that is closer to a one off than a trend. It was the same with Paterson. Same with Pack. Same with Diedhiou to an extent but he has had 4-5 good games in a row for me. Players continue to play after a run of 5-6-7 performances of 5 or 6 out of 10. But O’Dowda, Smith and Brownhill are mates so they were selected today(LJs words pregame). 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
46 minutes ago, NorwichbasedWurzel said:

Paid thousands of pounds per week and can’t retain the ball to save their lives - that shouldn't need coaching at professional level. 

 

We are utterly dreadful at retaining possession when trying to go forward, and it's a large part of why we're not good to watch.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Never understood this 'blame the players' argument. LJ picks them, buys them, trains them. It's down to LJ.

Yeah, let's let them off. Totally blameless...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
45 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

Yet these players keep playing 🤔 are they responsible for being selected? One example is O’Dowda what has he actually done to get 106 appearances for us? 
 

Some weren’t up for it today like Brownhill and Weimann but I know that is closer to a one off than a trend. It was the same with Paterson. Same with Pack. Same with Diedhiou to an extent but he has had 4-5 good games in a row for me. Players continue to play after a run of 5-6-7 performances of 5 or 6 out of 10. But O’Dowda, Smith and Brownhill are mates so they were selected today(LJs words pregame). 

Brownhill has been poor all season bar a few games for me. It seems like his head maybe turned. Diedhiou played well considering the service he got. O’Dowda completely agree with

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Never understood this 'blame the players' argument. LJ picks them, buys them, trains them. It's down to LJ.

Yes but by that logic, SL picks LJ so it’s his fault. Of course that’s where the buck ultimately stops, but at a more relevant level to today’s performance I think it’s fair to call out some of the players. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

I think they are well motivated. Just given wrong instructions, wrong tactics. I don't see a lack of effort.

Any professional should be able to look after the ball and give it to a player wearing the same colour though surely? Giving it away time and time again when the passes aren’t even hard to make is unacceptable 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, City Ben said:

Yes but by that logic, SL picks LJ so it’s his fault. Of course that’s where the buck ultimately stops, but at a more relevant level to today’s performance I think it’s fair to call out some of the players. 

And that's true. If LJ can't get us playing better then SL may at some point have to consider getting in someone who he feels can do better. It's like if players aren't good enough then LJ shouldn't be playing them. 

25 minutes ago, NorwichbasedWurzel said:

Any professional should be able to look after the ball and give it to a player wearing the same colour though surely? Giving it away time and time again when the passes aren’t even hard to make is unacceptable 

We've seen us look after the ball and pass it well in games in the past. So therefore I see it as a problem with team selection and tactics rather than players being incapable of looking after ball. But then any players that can't look after ball shouldn't be in the side. 

LJ gets credit from me when it goes well, but also gets blame when it goes badly. He is the one that picks the team.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, Charlie BCFC said:

Brownhill has been poor all season bar a few games for me. It seems like his head maybe turned. Diedhiou played well considering the service he got. O’Dowda completely agree with

For me Brownhill has never played his natural position with us as a box to box midfielder in a 3. He is always asked to be more of the holding midfielder or on the right. 
 

Diedhiou and Weimann have had no service for ages and have done well with scraps really. Both doing their part to get us up the pitch

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

And that's true. If LJ can't get us playing better then SL may at some point have to consider getting in someone who he feels can do better. It's like if players aren't good enough then LJ shouldn't be playing them. 

We've seen us look after the ball and pass it well in games in the past. So therefore I see it as a problem with team selection and tactics rather than players being incapable of looking after ball. But then any players that can't look after ball shouldn't be in the side. 

LJ gets credit from me when it goes well, but also gets blame when it goes badly. He is the one that picks the team.

How far back do we want to go? We've averaged <50% this season, so clearly not now!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
46 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

LJ can always drop the ones you blame. Plenty of players in our squad.

Which will lead to tombola references. They are adults but it seems they need take no responsibility for their performance, nor do they need to be self motivated.

I wonder if I can persuade my boss that if I perform badly it's nothing to do with me, it's all his fault, and that he should spend his working hours motivating me because I am incapable of motivating myself?

Nice work if you can get it!

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

How far back do we want to go? We've averaged <50% this season, so clearly not now!

Well in games like today where LJ sets us up to defend and try to keep a clean sheet, we aren't going to pass it well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
57 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

I think they are well motivated. Just given wrong instructions, wrong tactics. I don't see a lack of effort.

Usually agree with you fella...but most of our goals conceded have resulted from individual error...not down to wrong instructions.

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, chinapig said:

Which will lead to tombola references. They are adults but it seems they need take no responsibility for their performance, nor do they need to be self motivated.

I wonder if I can persuade my boss that if I perform badly it's nothing to do with me, it's all his fault, and that he should spend his working hours motivating me because I am incapable of motivating myself?

Nice work if you can get it!

If they aren't good enough then maybe LJ shouldn't have signed them.

To me it's tactical. I bet if he picks a different system and has a more positive attitude to todays game rather than setting us up to get 0-0 then we keep the ball better.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, chinapig said:

Which will lead to tombola references. They are adults but it seems they need take no responsibility for their performance, nor do they need to be self motivated.

I wonder if I can persuade my boss that if I perform badly it's nothing to do with me, it's all his fault, and that he should spend his working hours motivating me because I am incapable of motivating myself?

Nice work if you can get it!

I think this could become a recurring theme in football tbh, at decent and well paid levels.

Not making any excuses for LJ here but...

  1. Player is paid a nice wage- more than most fans I dare say.
  2. Has a nice lifestyle.
  3. In this instance and various places at least, has quite a nice city and though they probably live in the sticks, rurality all in the vicinity- it's a fairly nice bit of the world basically.
  4. Near Christmas- do we want to risk injury
  5. Paid regardless.

Not easy is it- what motivational tools does a manager use?

Not saying they've downed tools but isn't easy.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, NorwichbasedWurzel said:

Paid thousands of pounds per week and can’t retain the ball to save their lives - that shouldn't need coaching at professional level. 

 

That's the difference between responsibility and accountability......they may be responsible for the losses....but LJ is accountable for them! 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, MelksRed said:

That's the difference between responsibility and accountability......they may be responsible for the losses....but LJ is accountable for them! 

Agreed, but the argument seems to be being made that players have no responsibility at all and if they fail to apply their basic skills on the pitch it's all down to the manager.

Whatever the club and whoever the manager is I find it increasingly irksome how little responsibility the modern player takes and how often fans seem to accept and encourage that.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

If they aren't good enough then maybe LJ shouldn't have signed them.

To me it's tactical. I bet if he picks a different system and has a more positive attitude to todays game rather than setting us up to get 0-0 then we keep the ball better.

Unless you are arguing that, for instance, none of the players concerned is capable of better, your first sentence doesn't apply.

Good players can have bad games. When they do maybe they should man up and take some responsibility?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What a team needs most when they've lost 3 on the bounce is SUPPORT. Not us so called fans getting on their backs. It is even more shameful that the same two players names are being singled out for criticism. If I were able to, I would've gone into that dressing room at Hillsborough and given a motivational speech after the defeat today. I would've put a metaphorical arm around all the players and told them that we are a team and that we will win, lose or draw as a team and that everyone has to take plaudits and brickbats alike.

I would then add, that that having been said O'Dowda and Brownhill you were f*****g sh**e today!

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, chinapig said:

Agreed, but the argument seems to be being made that players have no responsibility at all and if they fail to apply their basic skills on the pitch it's all down to the manager.

Whatever the club and whoever the manager is I find it increasingly irksome how little responsibility the modern player takes and how often fans seem to accept and encourage that.

Bang on. Scream for managers to be sacked whilst the players get off scot-free.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, handsofclay said:

If I were able to, I would've gone into that dressing room at Hillsborough and given a motivational speech after the defeat today.

 

 

  • Haha 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Hampshire Red said:

What is the point of this post, or is it just another waste of time

Probably to add a bit of perspective to the LJ out comments on here.

I think the OP is spot on. The players need to take responsibility for their performances on the pitch at the moment. 

We've seen this group have ability and skill but right now some of them are getting the basics wrong. It's as if they've never played football before.

Edited by Loco Rojo
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the point is that of course players have responsibility for their performances, but if those poor performances have become a pattern then it is the managers responsibility to manage/change the pattern. 
 

After a couple of years of seeing poor or at least uninspiring performances, (despite sometimes having good periods of results) regardless of personnel it’s not unfair to be questioning whether the manager is able to get the best out of his players. 

Edited by RedSA
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, chinapig said:

Which will lead to tombola references. They are adults but it seems they need take no responsibility for their performance, nor do they need to be self motivated.

I wonder if I can persuade my boss that if I perform badly it's nothing to do with me, it's all his fault, and that he should spend his working hours motivating me because I am incapable of motivating myself?

Nice work if you can get it!

Of course, you could ask the question... Why are there SO MANY under performing at the same time? We are making changes (4 today, was it?) most games, and still the majority are off-form. A bit weird if it's not tactically related.

 

 

Edited by AppyDAZE

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, NorwichbasedWurzel said:

Paid thousands of pounds per week and can’t retain the ball to save their lives - that shouldn't need coaching at professional level. 

 

Get rid of the coaches then. 

Man City and Liverpool seem to benefit from coaching to be fair though. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, NorwichbasedWurzel said:

Paid thousands of pounds per week and can’t retain the ball to save their lives - that shouldn't need coaching at professional level. 

 

Responsibility always end with the manager it's not difficult

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Northern Red said:

Bang on. Scream for managers to be sacked whilst the players get off scot-free.

To be clear - I wasn't calling for Johnson to be sacked - merely pointing out that we live in a blame culture - and that there is a difference between responsibility and accountability. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, MelksRed said:

To be clear - I wasn't calling for Johnson to be sacked - merely pointing out that we live in a blame culture - and that there is a difference between responsibility and accountability. 

Oh of course, LJ will carry the can because that's what happens. It's just frustrating that so many fans, not just at City, never look beyond the manager when things go wrong.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, NorwichbasedWurzel said:

Paid thousands of pounds per week and can’t retain the ball to save their lives - that shouldn't need coaching at professional level. 

 

That's the norm for our players. It's by no means an anomoly. Just watch almost any game on catchup. We simply don't keep the ball. 

I know of no team in this division worse than us at retaining possession. 

Either they're not as good as LJ thinks they are, or his coaching and direction is leaving them robbed of the freedom to play as they want, completely bound by strict instruction on what to do and when. 

They seem scared. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, JoeAman08 said:

Yet these players keep playing 🤔 are they responsible for being selected? One example is O’Dowda what has he actually done to get 106 appearances for us? 
 

Some weren’t up for it today like Brownhill and Weimann but I know that is closer to a one off than a trend. It was the same with Paterson. Same with Pack. Same with Diedhiou to an extent but he has had 4-5 good games in a row for me. Players continue to play after a run of 5-6-7 performances of 5 or 6 out of 10. But O’Dowda, Smith and Brownhill are mates so they were selected today(LJs words pregame). 

Re Weimann, no idea if he was or wasn’t up for it.  He wasn’t at Charlton Farm on Tuesday as he was ill (flu-type bug), so might’ve been suffering from that.  If so, shouldn’t have played.

Thats not the point of my post.  It’s more LJ and MA keep suggesting they need two strikers.  What does that do to the confidence of your top-scorer?  Especially when you contradict that with the fact that Weimann must always play.

cant help can it?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, spudski said:

Usually agree with you fella...but most of our goals conceded have resulted from individual error...not down to wrong instructions.

 

If the opposition didn't have the ball in the first place - because we haven't lost the ball for the 50th time - maybe the opposition would have less time to draw mistakes from us. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The buck stops with the manager. He has no idea on his best team or formation. Expect another 5 changes for boxing day.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Super said:

The buck stops with the manager. He has no idea on his best team or formation. Expect another 5 changes for boxing day.

...and in some respects 4/5 don’t deserve to play.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...