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Highguy

Var in championship?

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After seeing LJ interview on sky sports saying about using var in the championship apparently some clubs we’re favour for it aswell 


Can’t see it happening just yet as the premier league haven’t worked out how to use it properly to get the correct decisions yet and also English cup comps don’t seem to use them

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Mistakes and controversy are part and parcel of the game we love, creates injustices', discussion, argument and opinion..

(a bad decision going your way, virtually everyone is happy, when one goes against you it has the opposite effect, ether way controversy always livens up the atmosphere) …. Yes I know in the modern game peoples jobs are sometimes at stake, promotion or relegation can be multi million pounds situations and sometimes an error of judgement on the field can tip the balance either way... But I say its all wrapped up in the game, sometimes its highly emotional and the people in the game, owners, managers, players, sponsors, fans are all in it together playing for high risk stakes... Occasionally a glaringly incorrect onfield  decision can have huge consequences … but its all part of the game that each participant chooses to get involved in.. It's exciting.

If a perfect foolproof VAR system is ever created, eliminating the human error side of the game, it'll be like having an all seeing, all powerful big brother scrutinising everything that happens, everything played to the rules, nothing left to chance... a robotic omnipotent emotionless  overlord of everything …. Ultimately doing away with the human element of gameplay, technically perfect but boring and clinical as F * * k … 

Gimme good old controversy, human error, decisions that tend to even out over a period of time anyway.. A bad decision today cost us a point,  - its given us something to talk about though... and on another day a penalty, offside decision, etc goes the other way …

so what....  It's All Part Of The Game  and  I think it remains an important part of it too. 

Let's not make it anymore sterile than it already is. 

 

 

 

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If VAR was bought into my ‘match day’ experience at Ashton Gate I would be done with it.

If it happens and you love football, pack your bags and go and enjoy Bath City or Clevedon Town or whoever you want and get back to loving football for the simple game that it is.

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3 hours ago, WhistleHappy said:

Mistakes and controversy are part and parcel of the game we love, creates injustices', discussion, argument and opinion..

(a bad decision going your way, virtually everyone is happy, when one goes against you it has the opposite effect, ether way controversy always livens up the atmosphere) …. Yes I know in the modern game peoples jobs are sometimes at stake, promotion or relegation can be multi million pounds situations and sometimes an error of judgement on the field can tip the balance either way... But I say its all wrapped up in the game, sometimes its highly emotional and the people in the game, owners, managers, players, sponsors, fans are all in it together playing for high risk stakes... Occasionally a glaringly incorrect onfield  decision can have huge consequences … but its all part of the game that each participant chooses to get involved in.. It's exciting.

If a perfect foolproof VAR system is ever created, eliminating the human error side of the game, it'll be like having an all seeing, all powerful big brother scrutinising everything that happens, everything played to the rules, nothing left to chance... a robotic omnipotent emotionless  overlord of everything …. Ultimately doing away with the human element of gameplay, technically perfect but boring and clinical as F * * k … 

Gimme good old controversy, human error, decisions that tend to even out over a period of time anyway.. A bad decision today cost us a point,  - its given us something to talk about though... and on another day a penalty, offside decision, etc goes the other way …

so what....  It's All Part Of The Game  and  I think it remains an important part of it too. 

Let's not make it anymore sterile than it already is. 

 

 

 

100% agree with you It’s always been part of the game Maradona hand of god goal (one of the most famous incidents in football)then you got game Against the Germans at World Cup lampard goal not given, Garcia ghost goal 2005 champion league just a few of the top of my head can think of 

but unfortunately they’ve brought in var and it isn’t going anywhere by looks things but luckily it’s still not used properly so we still get incidents that we can all debate and talk about  

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7 hours ago, WhistleHappy said:

Mistakes and controversy are part and parcel of the game we love, creates injustices', discussion, argument and opinion..

(a bad decision going your way, virtually everyone is happy, when one goes against you it has the opposite effect, ether way controversy always livens up the atmosphere) …. Yes I know in the modern game peoples jobs are sometimes at stake, promotion or relegation can be multi million pounds situations and sometimes an error of judgement on the field can tip the balance either way... But I say its all wrapped up in the game, sometimes its highly emotional and the people in the game, owners, managers, players, sponsors, fans are all in it together playing for high risk stakes... Occasionally a glaringly incorrect onfield  decision can have huge consequences … but its all part of the game that each participant chooses to get involved in.. It's exciting.

If a perfect foolproof VAR system is ever created, eliminating the human error side of the game, it'll be like having an all seeing, all powerful big brother scrutinising everything that happens, everything played to the rules, nothing left to chance... a robotic omnipotent emotionless  overlord of everything …. Ultimately doing away with the human element of gameplay, technically perfect but boring and clinical as F * * k … 

Gimme good old controversy, human error, decisions that tend to even out over a period of time anyway.. A bad decision today cost us a point,  - its given us something to talk about though... and on another day a penalty, offside decision, etc goes the other way …

so what....  It's All Part Of The Game  and  I think it remains an important part of it too. 

Let's not make it anymore sterile than it already is. 

 

 

 

If there’s one thing the EFL can learn from the Premiership it’s don’t touch VAR with a barge pole.

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VAR is the death of football. If you can no longer celebrate a goal then the game is dead. The feeling of scoring a last minute winner is enough to keep me buzzing all week until the next game. Imagine waiting 2 minutes to know if its a goal or not?

When we scored the winner V Man United, how amazing did it feel? How would it feel if the ball hit the back of the net and we had to wait 2 minutes for the review before being awarded the goal?

People been saying for a while that TV is ruining the game, you could see it coming years ago with Andy Gray scrutinizing every tiny mistake, pausing the play and drawing lines across the page. Suddenly the tiniest errors were being highlighted to the nation, other broadcasters soon followed and done the same at international tournaments to the extent that FIFA had to get involved.

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Interesting that VAR can be seen as 'the death' of football. Some will obviously love it. 

Another view is televised football is 'the death'. Without TV, VAR would never have been thought of and we could go back to stadiums having atmosphere and controversy discussed in the home and pubs pre and post match. Hard on those totally unable to get to games, i know. Yesterday, a fantastic ground with 23k people inside was like any library up and down the country. And (very few) City fans could  help as the other 20k fans we have watched TV rather than the game! We cant have it both ways

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Not a fan of VAR at all and then you see the ref yesterday giving Spurs a free kick for what was the most obvious blatant penalty to Chelsea you'd ever see. VAR of course sorted that out. Regretfully with referee's still giving shocking decisions like that it will only strengthen the case to keep VAR. 

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Imo...VAR should only be used to detect whether a ball has crossed the line or not.

I'd be more in favour of having two referees...one in each half.

Refs are generally twice the age of players, they run further than the players, expected to keep up with play, have less resting time and are expected to see the minutest details whilst often blowing out their arse, head spinning and often blind sided.

A ref in both halves would help.

 

 

Edited by spudski
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That's not even var that's just goal line tech which we have in the champ already. 

Personally id scrap it for offsides and just have it for penalty and red card decisions. 

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10 hours ago, 054123 said:

If VAR was bought into my ‘match day’ experience at Ashton Gate I would be done with it.

If it happens and you love football, pack your bags and go and enjoy Bath City or Clevedon Town or whoever you want and get back to loving football for the simple game that it is.

It would kill it for me too.

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11 hours ago, Sir Geoff said:

Today's penalty would not have been overturned as it was not a clear and obvious error.

Then the rules for VAR should change. It was not a penalty. I would not be happy to celebrate a goal that rightly should be overruled. But the VAR decision could be done by a jury and the ref told in a few seconds.

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1 hour ago, bristolcitysweden said:

Then the rules for VAR should change. It was not a penalty. I would not be happy to celebrate a goal that rightly should be overruled. But the VAR decision could be done by a jury and the ref told in a few seconds.

VAR needs clear evidence to overturn a referee's on field decision, if the referee has decided that's enough contact for a penalty that would have been communicated to VAR and therefore would stand. And frankly its the way it should stay, why should a on field referees subjective decision be overturned by someone else's subjective decision? On field ref should just be encouraged to use the monitors pitch side. If you can't make up your mind within a minute of watching then stick with original decision.

Edited by hodge

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16 minutes ago, hodge said:

VAR needs clear evidence to overturn a referee's on field decision, if the referee has decided that's enough contact for a penalty that would have been communicated to VAR and therefore would stand. And frankly its the way it should stay, why should a on field referees subjective decision be overturned by someone else's subjective decision? On field ref should just be encouraged to use the monitors pitch side. If you can't make up your mind within a minute of watching then stick with original decision.

VAR should not need clear evidence to overturn a refs decision. The rules for VAR must be changed. The refs decision should be overruled because it's made in a second without the hindsight and replays VAR got. Refs do their best online but it's not good enough in a world of constant replays. The first thing I do when a goal is scored is to look up for the lines mans flag. It'll take half a second. I don't mind five seconds for the correct decision in the refs ear. Right is right. Wrong is wrong. 

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Watch this.... 

...then consider what a VAR offside review would have done to this moment...

...then ask yourself if getting every decision right to the letter of the law - which would work both in our favour and against - is worth it.

 

 

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12 minutes ago, ChippenhamRed said:

Watch this.... 

...then consider what a VAR offside review would have done to this moment...

...then ask yourself if getting every decision right to the letter of the law - which would work both in our favour and against - is worth it.

 

 

Has the refs decision been questioned?

Edited by bristolcitysweden

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No-one ever left a match saying `Well, it`s a shame our last minute winner didn`t count because of a fractional offside in the buildup but at least the VAR decision was correct. Ah well, another year in the Championship it is I suppose`.

If VAR is brought in to the Championship that`s me done with football until it`s removed.

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27 minutes ago, Lanterne Rouge said:

No-one ever left a match saying `Well, it`s a shame our last minute winner didn`t count because of a fractional offside in the buildup but at least the VAR decision was correct. Ah well, another year in the Championship it is I suppose`.

If VAR is brought in to the Championship that`s me done with football until it`s removed.

If that was the correct decision what's the problem? What if the goal falsely was allowed and the opponent team was not promoted? Any incident happening thirty seconds before the "goal" should be ignored by rule though.

Edited by bristolcitysweden

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6 hours ago, bristolcitysweden said:

If that was the correct decision what's the problem? What if the goal falsely was allowed and the opponent team was not promoted? Any incident happening thirty seconds before the "goal" should be ignored by rule though.

The problem is for me city scoring a goal is better than sex, better than the feeling when you leave work at 5pm on a Friday and better than the feeling when you have a 6am pint at the airport on the way to Spain for a holiday. Nothing compares to the instant feeling of the ball hitting the back of the net, you take that feeling away, then you take everything away.

I was in the England end when we thought we put that winner away in the nations league against Holland, there was limbs everywhere, it was chaos, only for it to be ruled out. for me, that was the end of following England at games that has VAR. I went to the next game V Switzerland, but i left after just 20 minutes when I realised if England scored I couldn't celebrate the goal until some bloke in a dark room a few hundred miles away gave the all clear.

 

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7 hours ago, bristolcitysweden said:

If that was the correct decision what's the problem? What if the goal falsely was allowed and the opponent team was not promoted? Any incident happening thirty seconds before the "goal" should be ignored by rule though.

Because it sucks the life out of the game. Football is about raw emotion and not clinical observation. Take the emotion away and the game is nothing.

@antlers puts it brilliantly in the post above this.

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It's coming under increasing fire. Coady, Farke and Pep all have come out strongly last few days! We all know Wilder's views too.

This article is interesting- quite big claim!

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/premier-league-var-wrong-offside-review-ifab-goals-replays-a9264306.html

Some notable quotes:

Quote

"Clear and obvious still remains - it's an important principle. There should not be a lot of time spent to find something marginal," Lukas Brud, Ifab’s general secretary, told the Press Association.

Quote

"If something is not clear on the first sight, then it's not obvious and it shouldn't be considered. Looking at one camera angle is one thing but looking at 15, trying to find something that was potentially not even there, this was not the idea of the VAR principle. It should be clear and obvious."

I wonder why the PL are choosing to do it this way?

Quote

Wolves captain Conor Coady spoke out after his side were denied an equaliser just before half-time at runaway leaders Liverpool on Sunday. Neto's goal was ruled out because Spanish wing-back Jonny was ruled to be offside in the build-up.

"It's horrible for me, it's tough to take," Coady told the BBC.

"A lot of people are going to tell me that they have come to the right decision and they might have. But what is it, an armpit that's offside, or a toe, or something like that?"

Quote

Sheffield United were denied a goal against Manchester City - the fifth time this season VAR has ruled out a goal they have scored.

Blades manager Chris Wilder said: "Yet again we had another goal disallowed by VAR. That's about eight or nine over the weekend, this is not a situation helping the game."

His opposite number Pep Guardiola said VAR was "a big mess" and added: "Hopefully next season it can do better."

Cannot find Farke's comments in the article.

Also worth a read, an interview with someone high up in IFAB on the subject.

https://www.protipster.com/betting-news/var-in-the-premier-league-interview-with-lukas-brud-4834

Edited by Mr Popodopolous

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On 23/12/2019 at 09:35, spudski said:

Imo...VAR should only be used to detect whether a ball has crossed the line or not.

I'd be more in favour of having two referees...one in each half.

Refs are generally twice the age of players, they run further than the players, expected to keep up with play, have less resting time and are expected to see the minutest details whilst often blowing out their arse, head spinning and often blind sided.

A ref in both halves would help.

 

 

Keith Stroud in one half, Gavin Ward in the other!!

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VAR is here to stay and it's only a matter of time until it's in the Championship.

Rather than recognising its shite, the powers that be will change the rules to make VAR 'fit'.

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8 minutes ago, cityloyal473 said:

VAR is here to stay and it's only a matter of time until it's in the Championship.

Rather than recognising its shite, the powers that be will change the rules to make VAR 'fit'.

Unsure it's shite if used sparingly and for the true clear and obvious...as FIFA themselves have pointed out.

However at the minute, it's not shite...it's total shite!!

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8 hours ago, cityloyal473 said:

VAR is here to stay and it's only a matter of time until it's in the Championship.

Rather than recognising its shite, the powers that be will change the rules to make VAR 'fit'.

If it happens, I`m done.

`It`s not football any more`

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46 minutes ago, Lanterne Rouge said:

If it happens, I`m done.

`It`s not football any more`

I'm with you on this, Bristol Manor Farm for me when this happens.

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13 minutes ago, EmissionImpossible said:

VAR has been in one season, it will change year on year and likely improve but it won’t go away. Top flight football = VAR

Ironically, VAR has solved nothing.  The same decisions are still being debated.

2 hours ago, glos old boy said:

Well the game is fine lines according to LJ so it could happen, imo its a right pain leave it to the ref, stick with goal line tech thats it.

This^^.

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