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Eliasson.....


Lez

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1 hour ago, Hare Island said:

He creates chances as an unknown quantity. As soon as teams realise he’s one-footed he’ll just get shown down the line and nullified. Johnson knows this. And his positional play needs work. So whilst he is having a good season as an impact player he’s shown he can’t sustain it for 90 mins and needs to improve and adapt his game before he will get in a Championship team as a nailed on starter.

Unknown quantity ? This ain't the 1960's... Every Champ club knows the ins and outs of 10000s of players around the world

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1 hour ago, Hare Island said:

He creates chances as an unknown quantity. As soon as teams realise he’s one-footed he’ll just get shown down the line and nullified. Johnson knows this. And his positional play needs work. So whilst he is having a good season as an impact player he’s shown he can’t sustain it for 90 mins and needs to improve and adapt his game before he will get in a Championship team as a nailed on starter.

With respect. Bollocks!

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10 minutes ago, wood_red said:

You said he was a one trick pony never said this

who could only cross with one foot. True fact

If that is the case how have no team cottoned onto it yet because he is new to the league in and in out of the team so teams and defenders are yet to prioritise countering his one-dimensional threat

 according to your own posts, one minute teams are scouting every player and know exactly what he does, never said this 

Eliasson can go inside or outside,  can cross with both feet, can play full games, Lolololo 

I think you are confused Mrs Eliasson, perhaps too much Christmas Rekorderlig?

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5 minutes ago, cidercity1987 said:

Unknown quantity ? This ain't the 1960's... Every Champ club knows the ins and outs of 10000s of players around the world

This is the real world, not Football Manager. In the Championship players are often playing 2x a week. There’s little time for tactical adaptation, plans for players like Eliasson who may not even get on the pitch. 

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50 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Amazing player. I see him being a very good prem player in the future. 

Why on Earth can't LJ find a way of playing someone who is so good..it is ridiculous. Even play him off of Diedhiou in a 352 if he has to. 

He showed with his goal how dangerous he is when coming more central. He's just a fantastic attacking player with the ball at his feet. Dribbling, speed, end product whether that's crossing or shooting.

Been saying for ages, play him off of the front man and let him roam. If it's up top with Fam, he does enough defensively to cover NE if he stays up top.

If his defensive game is still not very good, then get Murray to do some sessions with him - he did a fair bit of defensive work, pretty sure he played RWB a few times earlier in his career? Obviously the defensive side of the coaching staff don't seem to be able to drill it into him.....

Whatever way you look at it, we don't currently seem to be able to get anything from a game unless NE is on the pitch providing the assists/goals. Whilst that does create a number of other questions, mainly what the hell is going on (again) currently, but it proves that he needs to be played.

With Dasilva now back in contention, we'll probably end up going to a back 4 again, so maybe he'll get more game time with a midfield of 4/5?

You build a team around your best players, and currently NE is one of, if not the best that we have.

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3 hours ago, Lez said:

For those who weren't there......ripped them to shreds time and time again.... not one block from his 7 or 8 crosses. Goal assist.....outstanding again.....I'm sure he will leave and not sign a new deal as why would he....

He has been awfully managed....deserves a RUN OF GAMES.

What, you suggest we play the only player on our books who's both skill and courage to take players on and get forward in preference to the Mock Mick who, with devestating effect today, attempted to take on his opponent and with neither skill or commitment ceded possession, threw himself to the ground and thereafter looked utterly distraught when the ref waved play on whilst looking pitifully at him as much as to question why he was on the pitch? Why would WeeLee do that?

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10 minutes ago, Taz said:

Been saying for ages, play him off of the front man and let him roam. If it's up top with Fam, he does enough defensively to cover NE if he stays up top.

If his defensive game is still not very good, then get Murray to do some sessions with him - he did a fair bit of defensive work, pretty sure he played RWB a few times earlier in his career? Obviously the defensive side of the coaching staff don't seem to be able to drill it into him.....

Whatever way you look at it, we don't currently seem to be able to get anything from a game unless NE is on the pitch providing the assists/goals. Whilst that does create a number of other questions, mainly what the hell is going on (again) currently, but it proves that he needs to be played.

With Dasilva now back in contention, we'll probably end up going to a back 4 again, so maybe he'll get more game time with a midfield of 4/5?

You build a team around your best players, and currently NE is one of, if not the best that we have.

Best offensive players him and Dasilva for me. Well and Brownhill when he's at his best. Not hard to fit in Eliasson. He works hard and tackles. I don't get what the problem is from LJ. Why so obsessed with Weimann. 

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Eliasson has kicked on this season.

Even in the home game v Reading, he created the goal for Diedhiou, but was bloody awful defensively second half.  For me, he was on the balance...does the creativity outweigh the flaws defensively.

Over the past two months, the answer is most definitely yes.

He’s got to play.  A poor game is no reason to drop him.  Three on the trot maybe yes, if the rest of the team are playing well, I.e his performance is standout bad.

Some say LJ got lucky at Barnsley, in that injuries forced him to pick a side that the fans had been crying out for....and on a ‘streak” they went.

Is it now time to throw caution to the wind, and try and thrill the fans back, maybe even with Palmer too.  What has he got to lose?

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The fact is that with only one or two exceptions (Huddersfield being the most notable), he has had more impact as a sub than when he has started.   I thing wrong with that, it’s a squad game.  I’d rather see him rip a tiring defence apart in the second half than be mediocre for 75 minutes.  We went all out attack in the second half and left ourselves open at the back.

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2 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Best offensive players him and Dasilva for me. Well and Brownhill when he's at his best. Not hard to fit in Eliasson. He works hard and tackles. I don't get what the problem is from LJ. Why so obsessed with Weimann. 

Yes, why are you? ?

Seriously, 8 goals this season, whilst often playing anywhere other than the main striker.  Pops up in the centre of the penalty area to get across his man, to head home.  Not bad really is it.

I’d say that it proves (to an extent) that Diedhiou doesn’t need to be the recipient.  Diedhiou’s defensive abilities is another debate, and worrying that we expect our CF to be so crucial at defensive set pieces.

Without Diedhiou (who has been better of late), we have much more flexibility to overload midfield.

I’s still play him predominantly left side.  Him and Dasilva could save LJ’s bacon.

Could imagine a front 6 of:

                      Nagy or Smith

Brownhill | Palmer | Massengo | Eliasson

                         Weimann

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1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

Yes, why are you? ?

Seriously, 8 goals this season, whilst often playing anywhere other than the main striker.  Pops up in the centre of the penalty area to get across his man, to head home.  Not bad really is it.

I’d say that it proves (to an extent) that Diedhiou doesn’t need to be the recipient.  Diedhiou’s defensive abilities is another debate, and worrying that we expect our CF to be so crucial at defensive set pieces.

Without Diedhiou (who has been better of late), we have much more flexibility to overload midfield.

I’s still play him predominantly left side.  Him and Dasilva could save LJ’s bacon.

Could imagine a front 6 of:

                      Nagy or Smith

Brownhill | Palmer | Massengo | Eliasson

                         Weimann

Massengo shouldn't be starting on recent performances.

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1 hour ago, Hare Island said:

This is the real world, not Football Manager. In the Championship players are often playing 2x a week. There’s little time for tactical adaptation, plans for players like Eliasson who may not even get on the pitch. 

Yeah I'm calling BS, someone like Eliasson would stand out for any pre game opposition work, so many assists in the same style.

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11 minutes ago, petehinton said:

Him and Palmer are two players who don’t know how to be played properly and it’ll come back to bite us pretty soon 

So what are the club doing wrong with Palmer then?  I see a player who is significantly underperforming and it’s time the players took responsibility for their own game.  Too much blaming the manager and letting lazy players off the hook.

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7 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Yes, why are you? ?

Seriously, 8 goals this season, whilst often playing anywhere other than the main striker.  Pops up in the centre of the penalty area to get across his man, to head home.  Not bad really is it.

I’d say that it proves (to an extent) that Diedhiou doesn’t need to be the recipient.  Diedhiou’s defensive abilities is another debate, and worrying that we expect our CF to be so crucial at defensive set pieces.

Without Diedhiou (who has been better of late), we have much more flexibility to overload midfield.

I’s still play him predominantly left side.  Him and Dasilva could save LJ’s bacon.

Could imagine a front 6 of:

                      Nagy or Smith

Brownhill | Palmer | Massengo | Eliasson

                         Weimann

We disagree again Dave!

Weimann has played nearly every minute and has 8 in 24. He has played up front in almost every game and is in and around the box.

But the goals is not the most important factor for me. It's what can he do on the ball as a lone striker.

For me he only seems comfortable on the ball when in space. He often runs wide right, sometimes wide left where funnily enough he looks most comfortable on the ball even though everyone says he isn't a winger!

But with his back to goal I never see him hold it up, or do any kind of skill like Bobby. For me to be a lightweight lone striker, the striker has to be at least very good on the ball, or if not then at least be very quick.

He is neither very good on the ball, or even willing to do what that role needs as I imagine he'd just run out wide at every opportunity. But also he isn't so quick that a ball can be threaded through and he's away. I don't think he is generally quicker than championship centre backs.

Hope I'm wrong, as we could do with a hard working lone striker, but can he do what's needed on the ball. I doubt he can. 

When he played as the main striker against Swansea with Szmodics sort of playing off of him, the ball just kept coming back. We desperately needed Fam on, which we then saw near the end of the first half.

Away at WBA he kept running to the right wing. A tactic by LJ? Possibly. Though a very strange one if so.

But whenever he was central he looked lost. He only looks comfortable when running out wide. That's generally what his movement seems to be most of the time. Getting into space on the flanks having been in a central position.

 

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Its obvious he wont have a massive impact every game, If he did he wouldnt be with us BUT he simply has to play as he makes things happen. He has one bad game and he is dumped for the next. LJ hasnt a clue how to manage him.

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9 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Eliasson has kicked on this season.

Even in the home game v Reading, he created the goal for Diedhiou, but was bloody awful defensively second half.  For me, he was on the balance...does the creativity outweigh the flaws defensively.

Over the past two months, the answer is most definitely yes.

He’s got to play.  A poor game is no reason to drop him.  Three on the trot maybe yes, if the rest of the team are playing well, I.e his performance is standout bad.

Some say LJ got lucky at Barnsley, in that injuries forced him to pick a side that the fans had been crying out for....and on a ‘streak” they went.

Is it now time to throw caution to the wind, and try and thrill the fans back, maybe even with Palmer too.  What has he got to lose?

I really thought he had done when we played how we did against Huddersfield and Fulham, then after 2 poor performances it seems it is back to the boring defensive set up (yet we are conceding loads). At least with the likes of Brentford they all know what they are trying to do and are reaping the rewards at the moment - even if they do have some poor performances thrown in. Most fans will happily accept the odd poor performance if we can see what our "identity" is, and see more consistency with attacking flowing football.

Players just seem to be disjointed and all over the place because they don't seem to know what they actually should be doing.

If you were Eliasson you would be getting your agent getting your name out there for a move, I just don't see him signing a new deal bar the extra year option - and then go for nothing (or a small fee end of this season), unless some bids come in January.

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5 hours ago, JonDolman said:

We disagree again Dave!

Weimann has played nearly every minute and has 8 in 24. He has played up front in almost every game and is in and around the box.

But the goals is not the most important factor for me. It's what can he do on the ball as a lone striker.

For me he only seems comfortable on the ball when in space. He often runs wide right, sometimes wide left where funnily enough he looks most comfortable on the ball even though everyone says he isn't a winger!

But with his back to goal I never see him hold it up, or do any kind of skill like Bobby. For me to be a lightweight lone striker, the striker has to be at least very good on the ball, or if not then at least be very quick.

He is neither very good on the ball, or even willing to do what that role needs as I imagine he'd just run out wide at every opportunity. But also he isn't so quick that a ball can be threaded through and he's away. I don't think he is generally quicker than championship centre backs.

Hope I'm wrong, as we could do with a hard working lone striker, but can he do what's needed on the ball. I doubt he can. 

When he played as the main striker against Swansea with Szmodics sort of playing off of him, the ball just kept coming back. We desperately needed Fam on, which we then saw near the end of the first half.

Away at WBA he kept running to the right wing. A tactic by LJ? Possibly. Though a very strange one if so.

But whenever he was central he looked lost. He only looks comfortable when running out wide. That's generally what his movement seems to be most of the time. Getting into space on the flanks having been in a central position.

 

Part of the problem is the way we are playing because LJ is playing Fam and Andi together as a pair.

In the Huddersfield game Weimann played more as the no10, pivoting around Diedhiou, Brownhill narrow, meaning we could play lop-sided to accommodate Eliasson.  It meant we were more compact as a team, able to play shorter passes and what a surprise, it entertained us.  Fulham was pretty similar, apart from we didn’t press their CBs unless there was a real chance to pinch the ball, therefore we didn’t get strung out, remained compact, and were able to play short passes.

Then LJ abandoned it over the next two games, pushing Eliasson right, Weimann left, Brownhill in behind in a 4411-type.  LJ can’t help himself.  He isn’t strong enough in his principles to stick with something.  The players need to be able to realise Eliasson is being double-teamed and exploit elsewhere.  Yet LJ messes with it.  By Wednesday (Sheffield) we are unrecognisable from the team v Huddersfield and Fulham.  By now we are 3 units, playing too far apart, with no cohesion.

If you’re pinging 40 yard passes into Weimann from back to front, I’m totally with you, wrong man for the job.  But if you’re getting passes into him from half that distance or shorter, or spinning him down the side that’s a very different matter.  That is why I see Weimann being able to play on his own, but it requires bravery to play through the thirds.  It requires bravery to leave Diedhiou out, it requires someone to take ownership defensively at set-pieces.  He’s an “In to out” runner, who unfortunately makes runs that his teammates aren’t seeing.  

Even playing Diedhiou up top and pinging 40 yard balls into him does work....so why do we persist with it.

I don’t see Nketiah as the answer in our current system(s) either.

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37 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Then LJ abandoned it over the next two games, pushing Eliasson right, Weimann left, Brownhill in behind in a 4411-type.  LJ can’t help himself.  He isn’t strong enough in his principles to stick with something.

He worries way too much about cancelling out the other team (even though we concede far too many which shows that doesn't work), but thinks it is the right thing to do every single game

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17 hours ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

So what are the club doing wrong with Palmer then?  I see a player who is significantly underperforming and it’s time the players took responsibility for their own game.  Too much blaming the manager and letting lazy players off the hook.

Significantly underperforming because he has not been used correctly at all, the guy should not be anywhere near the edge of our own penalty area yet he is having to come all the way back to there to try and drive it out, thus losing it. 

Palmer would be tearing up this league under the right manager. 

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5 minutes ago, marcofisher said:

Significantly underperforming because he has not been used correctly at all, the guy should not be anywhere near the edge of our own penalty area yet he is having to come all the way back to there to try and drive it out, thus losing it. 

Palmer would be tearing up this league under the right manager. 

Nail. On. Head. 
 

Not just Palmer either, this is the best City squad since we were in Division One and their talents are not being maximised. So frustrating.

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2 minutes ago, Hare Island said:

Nail. On. Head. 
 

Not just Palmer either, this is the best City squad since we were in Division One and their talents are not being maximised. So frustrating.

Same with Eliasson, find a way to get them both in the team as they are our most talent and we will be able to keep teams at bay. I think Weimann needs to see the bench for a while. Perhaps we can play an almost 4-3-2-1 system, with Palmer and Eliasson drifting inside and playing off Fammy. With JD back we certainly have the fullbacks for it. 

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4 hours ago, Davefevs said:

He isn’t strong enough in his principles.

I began trying to explain this in a different thread but abandoned it because I figured I’m probably on my own with it.

Contrary to popular belief, I think LJ 100% knows how he wants his team to play, who his best players are, what his favourite shape is etc... the problem is he doesn’t believe it in enough anymore, I suspect partly because he knows he’s under short-term pressure to get results.

Aa a result he gets so sucked into trying to tick all the various boxes he talks about, attempting to create a team with all the perceived right ingredients rather than a team with the philosophy he really believes in. As a result, he’s abandoned his own principles and we’ve ended up with increasingly confused thinking. It’s no wonder the players look like they’ve lost a bit of belief in what they’re being asked to do.

It feels, to me at least, a bit like the end of Gary’s time here. It’s a worry.

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1 minute ago, The Journalist said:

I began trying to explain this in a different thread but abandoned it because I figured I’m probably on my own with it.

Contrary to popular belief, I think LJ 100% knows how he wants his team to play, who his best players are, what his favourite shape is etc... the problem is he doesn’t believe it in enough anymore, I suspect partly because he knows he’s under short-term pressure to get results.

Aa a result he gets so sucked into trying to tick all the various boxes he talks about, attempting to create a team with all the perceived right ingredients rather than a team with the philosophy he really believes in. As a result, he’s abandoned his own principles and we’ve ended up with increasingly confused thinking. It’s no wonder the players look like they’ve lost a bit of belief in what they’re being asked to do.

It feels, to me at least, a bit like the end of Gary’s time here. It’s a worry.

It’s almost a bit like “Well this is what I really want to do, but it’s not working as well/quickly as I thought it would, so I’ll give something else a go because it seems to make sense”.

That is not a recipe for success in any line of management.

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