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Post story - LJ and Palmer conflict means Nketiah could go elsewhere


Major Isewater

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May 2019 

"Yes, I would like to keep all three players," said Johnson, who has promised a "bold summer" of recruitment at BS3.

Whilst the pre season he wanted did not happen (with KP) he did want to sign him. 

The EP took the information from KP agent ? Really. Possibly Gregor just spoke to someone much closer to home. It would hardly need Poirot to find that info. #noshitsherlock

Sensational stuff that people are now  suggesting the squad has nothing to do with LJ , and that they are not his players, and that is why he is struggling.

Mr Lansdown, over to you " Is it true you and MA have signed all these players without LJ's agreement ? "

Fascinating situation. I rather feel something is going to be said about that idea. 

Teflon Lee "it's all their fault, players, the opposition, the owner, MA, I told them to sign Firmino they got me Watkins,  the weather, the pies , leaves on the training ground, anything but me " 

In any case, every time Gregor says anything slightly off of party message, within a few hours you get a story pushed by the club to say everything is fine. Indeed if it is true that LJ does not decide what players we sign, it is quite a key point and may explain the random nature of the current set up. Let's hope Gregor can ask SL directly that question. 

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Lots of overreaction to this story. 
 

Have people actually read it? 
 

It says :

- There is interest in Palmer from other clubs but KP believes in City’s premier league push but wouldn’t be against a move if he’s continually out of favour. 
- The relationship has had its ups and downs but is certainly still “salvageable”. 
- Palmer has spoken to Nketiah and the feedback is still “all positive”. 
 

My conclusion. Palmer is miffed at being out of the team (as any professional should be). LJ has likely told him to improve his performances, which have likely led to some heated conversations, but it’s a manager’s prerogative to tell his players where he wants them to improve. The relationship is not at rock bottom but if Palmer continues to find himself out of favour and LJ doesn’t think he merits a place then he’ll likely become more disaffected. This is just normal day to day football issues. 
Plus if Nketiah doesn’t sign, its nothing to do with KP as he’s given positive feedback. 
 

As for those saying that LJ can’t manage creative players. Are we talking about Tomlin here? I think you’ll find Tomlins issues were all of Tomlins making. Nothing to do with LJ’s man management. Are there any other examples of other ‘big name’ players falling out with LJ? I can’t recall any. 

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2 hours ago, Major Isewater said:

The article says that it was an Ashton ‘ punt ‘ signing and it appears that LJ wasn’t that keen on KP. 
 

We all saw the lack of game time given to KP during his loan and many were surprised that we signed him after that .

We can also factor in a despondent Afobe if KP goes . 
 

I don’t doubt that KP isn’t perfect but a good coach would harness his abundant talent and apparent desire to settle at a club . 
 

 

This would tend to support @Harry's post yesterday about Ashton's recruitment although I still find it hard to believe that the coach is simply given players with no say in recruitment.

When you get such a situation something has to give, either Ashton or Johnson goes, or Lansdown changes his "vision" and adjusts roles.

Be a convenient cop out for the coach if he could point to the squad and say "I couldn't pick a consistent team or structure but none of them were my choices " wouldn't it.

 

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IF this is true, it seems to highlight the issue that LJ has in managing the ‘flair’ players. These players who have the ability to change a game with one moment of magic are often the brunt of LJ’s team rotation. 

Tomlin, Freeman and now Palmer.

If we lose Palmer I doubt he would be replaced. If we manage to bring in a striker who makes the runs, then who is going to supply the pass?

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1 hour ago, RedSA said:

He overthinks EVERYTHING due to insecurity.

He hasn’t found his own identity, no surprise his team doesn’t have one. 

...seems to be overly influenced by 'analysis data' and reacts irrationally when 'computer says no!'  even when that contradicts the evidence of his own eyes of events on the pitch. 

(measuring optimum length of grass ffs … strikes me as OCD … one thing we've been well blessed with over the years is excellent grounds people - trust 'em! .Thats what they're paid for. ) 

 

PS : @phantom … happy to be corrected re the grass measuring thing.  I wrongly viewed it as a slight to our ground staff by Lee.. I was wrong and apologise to LJ for that, I should have known better.

 

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1 hour ago, Alessandro said:

Gregor is a sensible journalist, I'm sure his source is credible. 

My question would be the motive of his source. An agent, certainly someone from within the KP 'camp'. Well it's going to be from their side of the story and we all know there are always two sides to every story.

As always, choose how your bread is buttered - KP = mismanaged talent, again another LJ failing? Or..... KP = talented enigma who has an attitude and arrogance that has held him back at numerous clubs under numerous managers?

Either way, a few interesting takes from the article -

1) GmcG, who has always seemed to have a good relationship with LJ is burning bridges with this....why?

2) Discourse, again, between MA/board and LJ on signings....I thought we were passed that? LJ aside, which top manager will be happy about 'having' to play players at the request of the board? Not many.

3) Unrest in the camp, however small - dangerous times for LJ - I think you could add the actions of Ash Williams against Brentford as well as a sign of another frustrated player, perhaps. Or did he just lose his temper.  

4) January window is a key time for the squad - what are the clubs true ambitions and how does that effect their ruthlessness, or not, regarding the manager? We will see.

Agree, Gregor doesn’t make stuff up.  He got duff info re Tinnion this season, which from what I’m led to believe was an ex-City player shit-stirring because he wanted Tins job!

Gregor is paid by BP, and he’s said, he’ll never refrain from publishing a story just to maintain relations, unless his boss pulls it.

When teams are winning there is never any unrest, so unsurprisingly 5 defeats in 6 and we hear of unrest.

I said on another post if MA really is signing players that LJ doesn't want, then LJ should offer a “me or him” ultimatum.  LJ would get a lot of credit from me if he did.

Re Nketiah, I would prefer we only loaned players with an option to buy.  I’m not that fussed if we miss out on him.  I might be alone in that view.

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3 hours ago, Spud55 said:

Agree with that but again I can only go on hearsay but if what I am hearing is correct Palmer hasn't fallen out with LJ because of not being in the team rather a collection of senior players as well have taken exception to how LJ managed another situation entirely, also explains why COD has disappeared completely despite being in the squad no matter how crap he was. 

 

Can you say what the "other situation" was?

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33 minutes ago, RedRock said:

Lummydaze.

We can’t have a CEO signing players he wants and a Manager doing likewise. My suspicions that we have a twin-track transfer policy are being realised. That is why this news is so important. 

Pretty clear to me now why we have a bloated squad with no identity, seemingly random team selections/formations. May also explain the CoD re-signing although if MA thought he was going to make a quick profit on that one then he’s deluded imo. 

 

What would be quite interesting would be a comparison of MA vs LJ signings and value added. My money would be on Cotts acquisitions trumping the lot. 

 

Think this may be revealing issues within the Club that are more significant than just a manager in/out. 

 

There's clearly a disconnect somewhere between MA and LJ - hence our bloated and incoherent squad.

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This is a tricky one.  
At the start of the season he was as fit as he has ever been due to his summer fitness plan as we all saw.   He came in did well etc 

perhaps his fitness dropped we don’t know    The problem with this is that fans want to see flair players but if the flair player isn’t doing what he is supposed to do off the ball then it causes a problem. If KP is getting 2 assists and scoring 2 every game then the positives out weigh the negatives but he isn’t.  
when he made his last couple of sub appearances, he gave the ball away loads on the edge of our own box which cost us    Someone like Patterson would get stick from most on here for that but a flair favourite wouldn’t 

he took exception from being given a rollicking from what I hear.   Well tough hold your hands up and move on.  
In saying that. It is starting to sound similar to GJs ending after falling out with trundle over wearing gloves on the training pitch 

player power will always win so you may all get your wish soon

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29 minutes ago, italian dave said:

I'm still unclear how those comments translate as disruptive and bad attitude.

RR, I'm far closer to your take on the current situation at the club than I am to the Johnson out brigade. But that doesn't make me blind to potential shortcomings.

As others have said already, man management wasn't his Dad's forte, and it certainly doesn't seem to be Lee's. And ultimately that was his Dad's downfall at City

All managers have shortcomings Dave and LJ is no exception and I remain neutral between the LJ in and the LJ out brigade - the reason being is because history has shown us that SL will stick by his man unless City are deep in relegation mire and I’m resigned to that fact.

To me there’s absolutely no point in calling for his head - it simply won’t happen and exactly why I find these LJ out posts completely pointless.

Btw - his dad was sacked after getting into a brawl with his players and afterwards the senior players went to SL saying they refused to play for him any longer.
 

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The only point in signng Nketiah would be if we played to his strengths, which we don't. If he needs quick ball to feet the Show Pony is about our only option, but with him now on the GON/Tomlin naughty step were I his advisor I'd suggest Brentford or otherwise be the call.

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3 hours ago, steviestevieneville said:

Think he’s always been fairly credible . If anything I would say he’s always been too easy in LJ  in interviews , never asking the tough questions.  

I’m glad somebody has raised this.

He does make it easy for LJ in pre and post match interviews. Gregor will bring up a topic to Lee and then virtually goes on to answer his own question making it easy for Lee just to agree with him.

I heard the post match interview after Brentford with Lee there was another bloke laughing and joking with him. 

He should be answering honest questions about where we are, where are we going, what is our identity etc. 

Then let Lee just do the talking. It’s all too matey for my liking.

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5 minutes ago, Badger08 said:

This. 

Have people actually read the article, or are the anti-Johnson brigade just using this as leverage to have yet another pop?  Do people think this sort of thing is useful? 

Surely anyone would want their friend to join! And if Eddie takes on board Palmers opinion that much, why did he join Leeds in the first place? 

Nothing to see here folks, but lets pour loads of petrol on this and see what damage we can cause.....  More drama than an episode of loose women on here. 

I read it. Here are some quotes:

"...the relationship between Palmer and Lee Johnson has continued to nosedive"

"Palmer feels singled out and that Johnson has been unjustified and has reacted out of proportion to several match performances of late, with several disagreements between the pair over Palmer's life outside of football too. Often concerning trivial matters"

"he is not against moving if he is unwanted"

"relationship between Palmer and Johnson is still salvageable but is fast deteriorating"

"Nketiah has now spoken to Palmer to find out what life at Ashton Gate is like"

 

How is this not concerning?

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15 minutes ago, WhistleHappy said:

measuring optimum length of grass ffs … 

 

Very odd thing to do, but this is at away grounds, whether the ball will stick in the grass a fraction more of just spin off the surface

Interestingly the grass at AG8 has been longer over December, whether that is a concious change or more to do with protecting the pitch with the rugby over the winter months?

15 minutes ago, Red Army 75 said:

Not bothered if Eddie didn’t come here. Didn’t want to in the summer. 5 months later still not here . As for KP the situation it doesn’t surprise me . IMO LJ is losing the dressing room 

I am probably the only person who says this, but I have never got this clamour to sign EN, he HASN'T done anything at any serious level of football, for him not to be rotated at any point into the Leeds starting side was always odd. I keep reading about how great he his, but I bet nobody has seen him play regularly and even then it wasn't at any great level.

It is just as likely he falls flat like Semenyo has this season 

15 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Agree, Gregor doesn’t make stuff up.  He got duff info re Tinnion this season, which from what I’m led to believe was an ex-City player shit-stirring because he wanted Tins job!

This is in no way a slight on Tins because he is a City legend in my eyes, but I am not sure what he actually does on a daily basis with these loan players?

It's not like he has any input into their training etc, he seems to be an admin go between for linking the players up?

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14 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Agree, Gregor doesn’t make stuff up.  He got duff info re Tinnion this season, which from what I’m led to believe was an ex-City player shit-stirring because he wanted Tins job! - Carey???

Gregor is paid by BP, and he’s said, he’ll never refrain from publishing a story just to maintain relations, unless his boss pulls it. - absolutely how it should be.

When teams are winning there is never any unrest, so unsurprisingly 5 defeats in 6 and we hear of unrest. - quite.

I said on another post if MA really is signing players that LJ doesn't want, then LJ should offer a “me or him” ultimatum.  LJ would get a lot of credit from me if he did. - LJ doesn't have the balls (we all know he'll never find another job so cushty)

Re Nketiah, I would prefer we only loaned players with an option to buy.  I’m not that fussed if we miss out on him.  I might be alone in that view. - agree 100% about loan to buy being preferable but I would be fussed in this instance because he's exactly the sort of player we're desperate for i.e. a forward with pace who will run in behind.

 

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