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Agree with much of what you say. 

Personally I don't think we need many more players. Firstly, our budget won't permit it. 

We need, simply, to get the most from what we have, and this is the reason the coaches need to be changed. 

Yes, the players are fragile egos who act like wilting flowers, but the only way is to manage this attitude away. We can't sack the players. 

The standard of football right now - and I mean a grasp of basic passing - is definitely the worst I can remember. And we've been unable to retain simple possession properly for 2 years. For me that makes LJ a below average L1 manager at best. He has flattered to deceive since he's been here, but given the same amount of time, I'm sure many average managers with a decent purse would too. 

Time for SL to take a pragmatic, dispassionate approach, accepting he really gave LJ a fair crack of the whip. Nobody would argue otherwise. 

And yes, the home football/match day experience is the least entertaining I can remember in 40 years, bar the odd 10 minutes here and there. 

I still don't think SL will sack him, assuming we don't plummet to relegation candidates. He'll recognise that we can probably sell £20m of players again this year, including Josh Brownhill. It's these sales that are cementing LJs position, I think. After this summer though, I fancy we'll have little else to command such big fees. 

Edited by CotswoldRed
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We played our most enjoyable football under Johnson when the team wasn’t fully “his”. Now we have his (and Ashton’s) team and unfortunately both are bullshitters. No obvious transfer strategy, no playing identity, no academy pathway. Massive unbalanced squad that is a result of all the transfer fees we received being badly reinvested and now we have no player assets we can sell to cover future spending. It makes me sad and angry. 

Edited by SuperRed
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Same. This sums it up for me. Been supporting since my Dad took me down the Gate start of season 1966-67.

There seemed to be real progress during that Cup run period, 2 years ago, including in the league. A desire to play exciting high energy, high press football. A template for a real playing style and identity.

Everything now feels stale. The club seems like it needs a real shot in the arm to get it going again.

 

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I think the injury to Afobe so early on has severely damaged our progress this season, if we still had him I think we'd be firmly in top 6 with a chance of top 2. The forward line was identified as a weakness in the summer but we've only got the same players we had last year, if we can recruit a special forward in January with a similar status to Afobe I think it will give the whole squad a lift and we can still make the play-offs.

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2 minutes ago, ashton_fan said:

I think the injury to Afobe so early on has severely damaged our progress this season, if we still had him I think we'd be firmly in top 6 with a chance of top 2. The forward line was identified as a weakness in the summer but we've only got the same players we had last year, if we can recruit a special forward in January with a similar status to Afobe I think it will give the whole squad a lift and we can still make the play-offs.

Agree but the rot was well and truly there before afobe even came and probably the reason why we had been unable to bring in a real striker- the club had and still has an Achilles heal and he don’t seem to be going anywhere 

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2 minutes ago, SuperRed said:

We played our most enjoyable football under Johnson when the team wasn’t fully “his”. Now we have his (and Ashton’s) team and unfortunately both are 

....struggling a bit, currently. To be kind.

Interesting point, though: the best stuff under Johnson was with Flint, Pack, Bryan, Reid, Frankie, Korey. And while Fam was injured. And a back four of Wright, Flint, Baker, Magnússon (ie, four defenders at the back).

Reid made an enormous difference: with Reid, LJ was a "great coach;" without Reid, he is pretty ordinary. Only so much he can do.

 

 

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5 minutes ago, ashton_fan said:

I think the injury to Afobe so early on has severely damaged our progress this season, if we still had him I think we'd be firmly in top 6 with a chance of top 2. The forward line was identified as a weakness in the summer but we've only got the same players we had last year, if we can recruit a special forward in January with a similar status to Afobe I think it will give the whole squad a lift and we can still make the play-offs.

Does any other club pin their success (or lack of) on a single player like we appear to? 

If we've managed ourselves into that position then we're bound to fail. 

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Superbly written, and agree with everything you’ve said.I have only followed the club for just over 40 years, been a season ticket holder for 20 of those years. This season I thought we would be in the top 6 come the end, and the start of the season was looking good, but since the Huddersfield games, the team have completely derailed. I was so disappointed with the home performances against both Millwall and Blackburn. Brentford came as no shock, but yesterday was  another new low. Shrewsbury can count themselves very unlucky not to have won that game as in my eyes that is what they deserved.

I’m now in the camp of a change is needed if we are to get back to winning ways. We have two games coming up against Wigan and Barnsley, which on paper we should be picking up at least 4 points, but on current form I am fearing it may be only one.

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2 minutes ago, dave36 said:

Agree but the rot was well and truly there before afobe even came and probably the reason why we had been unable to bring in a real striker- the club had and still has an Achilles heal and he don’t seem to be going anywhere 

Totally disagree while Afobe was playing in early season we played some great stuff

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3 minutes ago, CotswoldRed said:

Does any other club pin their success (or lack of) on a single player like we appear to? 

If we've managed ourselves into that position then we're bound to fail. 

I would say at most clubs if they lose their main star striker then they will struggle as it's a key position, we're not a Liverpool or Man Utd who can afford to have ready-made replacements standing by 

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1 minute ago, ashton_fan said:

I would say at most clubs if they lose their main star striker then they will struggle as it's a key position, we're not a Liverpool or Man Utd who can afford to have ready-made replacements standing by 

I understand that point. But my question still stands.

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3 minutes ago, dave36 said:

Agree but the rot was well and truly there before afobe even came and probably the reason why we had been unable to bring in a real striker- the club had and still has an Achilles heal and he don’t seem to be going anywhere 

We desperatley need at least a couple of quality proven signings, loans will only move the need further away.

We lack a talisman striker and midfield general/leader to keep and build on, the fans and this club need an identity one LJ has failed to find

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3 minutes ago, dave36 said:

Did not argue with you, Afobe was brilliant, reason he was so last minute was we could not attract a CF due to our coach’s reputation 

But Afobe wasn't worried about LJ, and how did we ever get Tammy Abraham if that's the case? You can't blame LJ for everything bad that's happened although that's what a lot on here seem to want to do

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Yep. Streaky Lee as even sky sports call him. Seems a constant.
All clubs have dips in form but our dips are always bit special. Yesterday we were TBH out played by a mid table league 1 side  and well done to the shrews on that, but then LJ comes out with more tosh that  this was  half expected as they had a 10 day break, which was  also factually incorrect. 

Watching City is shall we say ‘challenging’  And that is being kind

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1 minute ago, glos old boy said:

We desperatley need at least a couple of quality proven signings, loans will only move the need further away.

We lack a talisman striker and midfield general/leader to keep and build on, the fans and this club need an identity one LJ has failed to find

I think we have the midfielders we need, if managed correctly. 

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2 minutes ago, CotswoldRed said:

I understand that point. But my question still stands.

We don’t get to see our younger players, but there has to be one that would have been worth not sending out on loan and kept as a possible 

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6 minutes ago, dave36 said:

Did not argue with you, Afobe was brilliant, reason he was so last minute was we could not attract a CF due to our coach’s reputation 

This 100% Afobe was far from our number 1 choice, got lucky with him then unlucky, and had no suitible replacement. Strange with such a big squad.

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Ho hum, seen a lot worse in my 41 years watching City home and away. I never understood the optimism for this season, Webster replaced with Moore, a decent player who needs a season of Championship football to develop. We lost Pack, limited but reliable, ‘upgrading’ with an 18 year old of no experience, and someone who has no experience of English football, and not played much in 3 years. The midfield looked very lightweight, which we masked to a degree by playing 3 CB’s. 
Palmer was always likely to need time to develop, Adobes (I won’t correct this, but Benik was no acrobat😁) injury left us short up front, and fitting in Elliason has not been easy, and in fairness, early season he was prone to vanishing for long periods when he started.

So this season has gone pretty much as expected, and now, under pressure, Lee tries to be more positive, which has produced mixed results at home. 

Edited by Chappers
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if captain sensible was that worried about them having ten days rest,why didnt he assemble a different team with his spare players 10 days ago. its all 'happy talk' with him and its got beyond boring now, its just bullshit to cover his tracks

8 minutes ago, DT The Optimist said:

Yep. Streaky Lee as even sky sports call him. Seems a constant.
All clubs have dips in form but our dips are always bit special. Yesterday we were TBH out played by a mid table league 1 side  and well done to the shrews on that, but then LJ comes out with more tosh that  this was  half expected as they had a 10 day break, which was  also factually incorrect. 

Watching City is shall we say ‘challenging’  And that is being kind

 

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3 minutes ago, Chappers said:

Ho hum, seen a lot worse in my 41 years watching City home and away. I never understood the optimism for this season, Webster replaced with Moore, a decent player who needs a season of Championship football to develop. We lost Pack, limited but reliable, ‘upgrading’ with an 18 year old of no experience, and someone who has no experience of English football, and not played much in 3 years. The midfield looked very lightweight, which we masked to a degree by playing 3 CB’s. 
Palmer was always likely to need time to develop, Adobes injury left us short up front, and fitting in Elliason has not been easy, and in fairness, early season he was prone to vanishing for long periods when he started.

So this season has gone pretty much as expected, and now, under pressure, Lee tries to be more positive, which has produced mixed results at home. 

Agreed. I've always said I expected 12th or 13th, or thereabouts. 

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We had sad as a title, now sad and embarrassed. Anyone get anything more to add? Sad Embarrassed and scared? Sad embarrassed angry?

just remember you are describing the poor run of a football team ffs and give your head a little wobble.

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5 minutes ago, ashton_fan said:

But Afobe wasn't worried about LJ, and how did we ever get Tammy Abraham if that's the case? You can't blame LJ for everything bad that's happened although that's what a lot on here seem to want to do

Afobe and Tammy to some extent were left on the shelf and we were never going to get/buy Tammy, he used us as a shop window and was just passing through. LJ has established us as a championship club but he needs to move on if we are to move on.

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4 minutes ago, CotswoldRed said:

Agreed. I've always said I expected 12th or 13th, or thereabouts. 

We spent a lot of money, but on existing players and ones who were unlikely to be an immediate improvement, with the exception of Bentley.

Felt sorry for Massengo yesterday, gets knocked around a lot, and treated the ball like a hand grenade, never looked happy in possession. He looks way off being Championship ready, and for a club like us, it’s a lot of money tied up in a long term prospect.

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