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Silvio Dante

JET (Woo-ooh-ooh-ooh)

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3 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I’m saying the comparison is poor, not judging any player one way or t’other 

Think the fact he couldn’t get in the team most weeks says all we need to know !

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1 minute ago, RedDave said:

Think the fact he couldn’t get in the team most weeks says all we need to know !

Disagree.  That was a stellar city team playing a system that wasn’t built with JET in mind.  Matt Smith wasn’t first choice either.  Carved out a decent career.  Greg Cunningham too?

Wouldve played 40+ in most other team in Lg1 that season, and some would’ve centred it around him.

QPR thought enough to take him the summer.  As I said earlier I think it became tougher to hulk his frame around as he got older.

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7 hours ago, wayne allisons tongues said:

Remember being at Shrewsbury and he received the ball from a throw in. He just started walking with the ball, remember myself and others standing there saying just run once in a while. 
He just did a shimmy and from 20 yds fires it into the net, never again have I accused a player of not running/trying.

Pure magic from him.

Exactly this. He didn't run even when taking a penalty! 

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59 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

The genes mentioned in the article are present in the majority of the populace including the famous speed gene. Some races and regions of the world  have higher ratios but it is hardly conducive evidence. 

In regards to natural ability the worlds largest Countries are not producing as many naturally skilled players as one nation (Brazil). Brazils success is not down to Brazilians possessing more natural skill its down to how they approach the game. The Brazilians success is down to the way they practice and a football culture that encourages high skill levels. If other nations replicated the Brazilians they too would see more naturally skilled players. 

 

 

Genetics that are conducive to football, combined with natural ability...as in awareness, touch, vision and hours of correct practice will develop great footballers.

Regardless of nationality...certain body types reach a higher level performance level over others that have received the same training.

With your theory...you make out everyone can reach the same levels if they had the same coaching. That is simply not true.

Why do you think there are no great black swimmers?

Why are black people more often than not great sprinters?

It's not necessarily race...but they have heavier bone structure and the 'twitch muscle' that is often missing in other genetics.

Football Clubs actually look and test for the twitch muscle....which allows explosive speed and jumping. Some have it genetically...others don't. You can't train that.

 

 

56 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

IF they had coaches that recognise innate natural talent and how to nurture and get the best out of it.

Doesn't happen in this country imo - its why we don't produce world class players. 

As Cowshed implied...correct coaching works. But it only works to certain levels depending on the natural build of a person. Everyone is different. If Jet had the body of Massengo as an example, and the same coaching, training and practice he'd be a far better player all round and be playing Premiership.

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42 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Started 20 (28 subs), 12 goals, 8 assists that season. 1941 minutes, equivalent of circa 22 games.

The comparison with Weimann (who I am a huge fan of) is not a good one.

It wasn't a direct comparison, though.

It was talking about the type of player. 

I also consider Weimann (sincerely apologise for the misspelling ) to be a decent player who has a role in the team. 

I'm terms of league games he had 10 starts and 9 goals. From c. 1100 minutes 

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7 hours ago, Cowshed said:

Its a body shape that does not suit football. The worst. Endomorphs can be suited to sprinting (its anaerobic activity) but frequently not suit endurance activities and post explosive movements have poor recovery times.

An alternative view can be is that he did well and reached his ceiling.

There is no football gene that leads to being naturally gifted. Its not a gift. Skill is created by practice and practice only. This player would have practiced more to gain his level of skill. He did not come out of the womb a skilful footballer.

Your average human cant do fifty kick ups because they do not try to. 

 

 

True, but having coached 6 and 7 year olds, it’s amazing how natural it is to some.

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Genetics might help but the very best players such as Messi and Ronaldo who are nothing like a similar body type have insane spatial awareness and can see a “picture” around them that mere mortals can’t. That is related to BRAIN function .

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7 hours ago, Phileas Fogg said:

Yep I’ve also thought this before. Weirdly Diedhiou also plays like a smaller player. I think a lean 11st 6ft” JET would be amazing.

11st? He’d be thin as a rake and certainly not have the strength he possessed.

great watching that video again, what a player he was on his day. Also a blast from the past, completely forgot about Nyron Nosworthy playing for us 

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1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

Started 20 (28 subs), 12 goals, 8 assists that season. 1941 minutes, equivalent of circa 22 games.

The comparison with Weimann (who I am a huge fan of) is not a good one.

Not so much a comparison as such. Just wanted to highlight Weimann’s contribution so far this season.

He’s not really the headless chicken that some people seem to think he is.

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2 minutes ago, RedLionLad said:

Not so much a comparison as such. Just wanted to highlight Weimann’s contribution so far this season.

He’s not really the headless chicken that some people seem to think he is.

Indeed he’s not. Thx

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29 minutes ago, MarcusX said:

11st? He’d be thin as a rake and certainly not have the strength he possessed.

great watching that video again, what a player he was on his day. Also a blast from the past, completely forgot about Nyron Nosworthy playing for us 

Yep, he'd be more like an Adomah or Bolasie in that theoretical. Although his strength was useful JET didn't use it as much as he could have, he relied on pure ball skill for the most part. 

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1 hour ago, spudski said:

Genetics that are conducive to football, combined with natural ability...as in awareness, touch, vision and hours of correct practice will develop great footballers.

Regardless of nationality...certain body types reach a higher level performance level over others that have received the same training.

With your theory...you make out everyone can reach the same levels if they had the same coaching. That is simply not true.

Why do you think there are no great black swimmers?

Why are black people more often than not great sprinters?

It's not necessarily race...but they have heavier bone structure and the 'twitch muscle' that is often missing in other genetics.

Football Clubs actually look and test for the twitch muscle....which allows explosive speed and jumping. Some have it genetically...others don't. You can't train that.

 

 

As Cowshed implied...correct coaching works. But it only works to certain levels depending on the natural build of a person. Everyone is different. If Jet had the body of Massengo as an example, and the same coaching, training and practice he'd be a far better player all round and be playing Premiership.

There is conflation there between skill and athletic ability. I was referring to skill as a natural ability. Skill is not genetic. There is no football skill gene.

Yes certain body shapes will athletically limit potential but that does not necessarily limit football skill acquisition. 

With your theory .. It is not mine and I have not suggested everybody will reach the same level. I have made a point about skill. You noted that individuals who are not blessed athletically by nature can be highly skilful .. Yes I wholly agree. The creation of skill is heavily driven by mindset. A growth mindset does not accept that skill is set at birth. Being a less than perfect specimen psychologically is a driver e.g. I will have to work even harder to achieve.

Away from skill why are black people more often than not great sprinters? Its is not as simple as that. The great sprinters are limited to narrow geographical areas but their genetics are widespread. The speed gene is not shared by all black people and is present in other races. Africa should be producing Olympic 100 metre champions but isn't if it was simple as black people = fast. 

In regards to swimming .. I don't find swimming interesting enough to remember an answer.

Football clubs actually … They may also want to check the achilles tendon as longer length more speed .. Or maybe not. 

1 hour ago, 054123 said:

True, but having coached 6 and 7 year olds, it’s amazing how natural it is to some.

What I found is that most kids that age find it hard to focus. Stick to fun games.

Then you have the child who is the opposite any available ball, any time .. Its that mindset.

2 hours ago, Numero Uno said:

Genetics might help but the very best players such as Messi and Ronaldo who are nothing like a similar body type have insane spatial awareness and can see a “picture” around them that mere mortals can’t. That is related to BRAIN function .

Developed brain function leading to advanced spatial awareness and pattern recognition. And it comes from intense deliberate repetitive practice over years. Without that practice they would be like the rest of us. 

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I always felt that at the end we didn’t really appreciate what JET had done when we were plagued with injury. Thought he was unceremoniously dumped to the bench when other players became fit 

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I know people will say we have moved on, but I’d love to see him back at the Gate. Still only 29 (Jamie Vardy is 32)  would really lift the crowd, and he’s got his own song😀

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On 21/01/2020 at 22:10, MarcusX said:

11st? He’d be thin as a rake and certainly not have the strength he possessed.

great watching that video again, what a player he was on his day. Also a blast from the past, completely forgot about Nyron Nosworthy playing for us 

I thought Nosworthy came from a London club , Brentford’s Nyron wasn’t it ? 

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1 hour ago, Major Isewater said:

I thought Nosworthy came from a London club , Brentford’s Nyron wasn’t it ? 

Watford I would have guessed. I’ll look it up. 

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On 21/01/2020 at 13:12, Phileas Fogg said:

SO'D is the only manager that Jet has performed for relatively consistently - I remember him absolutely dominating us for Doncaster when on loan from Arsenal. Got a standing ovation at AG which is pretty unusual.

There have been a few: Evander Sno in a pre-season friendly against AJAX and John Salako, when we got absolutely battered by Swansea.

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On 21/01/2020 at 20:22, spudski said:

Genetics that are conducive to football, combined with natural ability...as in awareness, touch, vision and hours of correct practice will develop great footballers.

Regardless of nationality...certain body types reach a higher level performance level over others that have received the same training.

With your theory...you make out everyone can reach the same levels if they had the same coaching. That is simply not true.

Why do you think there are no great black swimmers?

Why are black people more often than not great sprinters?

It's not necessarily race...but they have heavier bone structure and the 'twitch muscle' that is often missing in other genetics.

Football Clubs actually look and test for the twitch muscle....which allows explosive speed and jumping. Some have it genetically...others don't. You can't train that.

 

 

As Cowshed implied...correct coaching works. But it only works to certain levels depending on the natural build of a person. Everyone is different. If Jet had the body of Massengo as an example, and the same coaching, training and practice he'd be a far better player all round and be playing Premiership.

I’m afraid this post is packed full of racial stereotyping.  ‘Black people have heavier bone structure’ - what all black people?  ‘There are no great black swimmers’ so that (if it is true) must prove that they are physically different - though the evidence in the USA suggests their lack of black swimmers may be more to do with the historical opportunities for black people to swim at municipal facilities.  I’m afraid you are treading very dangerous water here, and I was just waiting for you to suggest that black people have a natural sense of rhythm.  As to this myth of ‘natural talent’ are you honestly suggesting that some infants are predestined to be good at one thing or another.  Who by?  God?  It’s been proved that anyone can be pretty much trained to do anything, given any physical or mental limitations, but the ones who succeed are the ones with dedication and determination, and who enjoy it.  Is that ‘natural talent’?  

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2 hours ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

I’m afraid this post is packed full of racial stereotyping.  ‘Black people have heavier bone structure’ - what all black people?  ‘There are no great black swimmers’ so that (if it is true) must prove that they are physically different - though the evidence in the USA suggests their lack of black swimmers may be more to do with the historical opportunities for black people to swim at municipal facilities.  I’m afraid you are treading very dangerous water here, and I was just waiting for you to suggest that black people have a natural sense of rhythm.  As to this myth of ‘natural talent’ are you honestly suggesting that some infants are predestined to be good at one thing or another.  Who by?  God?  It’s been proved that anyone can be pretty much trained to do anything, given any physical or mental limitations, but the ones who succeed are the ones with dedication and determination, and who enjoy it.  Is that ‘natural talent’?  

Look it up...in general, black people have heavier bone density, and muscle mass. White people generally have higher fat, and are generally more boyant.

I used this as an example...nothing to do with discrimination. As humans across the globe, there are many diferering aspects to our build, skeleton etc. Many have stronger and weaker aspects.

Put two white children together and get them to play catch. I use white...as you seem offended 🙄 this isn't about racism.🙄...those two children can practice the same things, at the same amount of time. One will always be better than the other...regardless of how much they train.

It's life. Your theory suggests that if anyone dedicated their life to a subject they would become the best. That's simply not true...practice, correct training, time, dedication are essential...but you also have to have the natural genetics to combine to make you the best.

We all find our levels...regardless of time, training and dedication.

 

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1 hour ago, spudski said:

Look it up...in general, black people have heavier bone density, and muscle mass. White people generally have higher fat, and are generally more boyant.

I used this as an example...nothing to do with discrimination. As humans across the globe, there are many diferering aspects to our build, skeleton etc. Many have stronger and weaker aspects.

Put two white children together and get them to play catch. I use white...as you seem offended 🙄 this isn't about racism.🙄...those two children can practice the same things, at the same amount of time. One will always be better than the other...regardless of how much they train.

It's life. Your theory suggests that if anyone dedicated their life to a subject they would become the best. That's simply not true...practice, correct training, time, dedication are essential...but you also have to have the natural genetics to combine to make you the best.

We all find our levels...regardless of time, training and dedication.

 

I’m afraid you’re just digging yourself in deeper.  I have no theories, all I’m doing is pointing out that you shouldn’t stereotype on the basis of race.  That is the definition of racism.  Let’s leave it there.

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23 minutes ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

I’m afraid you’re just digging yourself in deeper.  I have no theories, all I’m doing is pointing out that you shouldn’t stereotype on the basis of race.  That is the definition of racism.  Let’s leave it there.

I'm happy to leave it... However Racism is not how you define it.

There is no malice or saying one race is better than another. That is racism.

All I've done is point out, as humans, we all have different strengths and weaknesses. And some of it is down to genetics. 

 

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1 hour ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

I’m afraid you’re just digging yourself in deeper.  I have no theories, all I’m doing is pointing out that you shouldn’t stereotype on the basis of race.  That is the definition of racism.  Let’s leave it there.

You're talking rubbish, you do realise you can talk about different races of people without it being racist dont you ? 

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2 hours ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

I’m afraid you’re just digging yourself in deeper.  I have no theories, all I’m doing is pointing out that you shouldn’t stereotype on the basis of race.  That is the definition of racism.  Let’s leave it there.

There’s definitely differences though there’s lots of debates and studies about whether it’s down to race, genes, culture or environments etc

The Chinese make great weightlifters, they (typically) have great mobility/flexibility but they don’t have any renowned sprinters.

those of west African descent make up around 8% of the population (from the study I’ve read) yet dominate the sprinting world whereas East Africans are better at long distance/endurance events.

As someone else pointed out, there aren’t many top black swimmers in part because higher bone density doesn’t lend itself to buoyancy and swimming. You could argue there’s an access limitation here, especially historically (not being allowed in pools back in the 50s etc)

No 2 people are alike and there’s very few people in the world who could Overcompensate for genetics - the top athletes tend to follow the path of their genetics.

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6 hours ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

I’m afraid this post is packed full of racial stereotyping.  ‘Black people have heavier bone structure’ - what all black people?  ‘There are no great black swimmers’ so that (if it is true) must prove that they are physically different - though the evidence in the USA suggests their lack of black swimmers may be more to do with the historical opportunities for black people to swim at municipal facilities.  I’m afraid you are treading very dangerous water here, and I was just waiting for you to suggest that black people have a natural sense of rhythm.  As to this myth of ‘natural talent’ are you honestly suggesting that some infants are predestined to be good at one thing or another.  Who by?  God?  It’s been proved that anyone can be pretty much trained to do anything, given any physical or mental limitations, but the ones who succeed are the ones with dedication and determination, and who enjoy it.  Is that ‘natural talent’?  

I think you’re searching for racism that wasn’t there... just a few scientific facts. 
 

As for natural talent, we’ve all got a mate who can’t catch for toffee and another mate who’s pretty damn talented at any sport they turn their hand to. Yes, some talent can be taught but those with a better baseline of talent will be better than those who start below them given the same level of practice. 
 

I have a natural flair for foreign languages. I’m not sure why. I just grew up being very good at them without necessarily Having to put the effort in.... alright it didn’t do me much good, but it comes in handy when on holiday. Anyway, I digress and I’ve forgotten what my point is!

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4 hours ago, spudski said:

Look it up...in general, black people have heavier bone density, and muscle mass. White people generally have higher fat, and are generally more boyant.

I used this as an example...nothing to do with discrimination. As humans across the globe, there are many diferering aspects to our build, skeleton etc. Many have stronger and weaker aspects.

Put two white children together and get them to play catch. I use white...as you seem offended 🙄 this isn't about racism.🙄...those two children can practice the same things, at the same amount of time. One will always be better than the other...regardless of how much they train.

It's life. Your theory suggests that if anyone dedicated their life to a subject they would become the best. That's simply not true...practice, correct training, time, dedication are essential...but you also have to have the natural genetics to combine to make you the best.

We all find our levels...regardless of time, training and dedication.

 

There are areas of the globe that don't.

I certainly would not agree with that point the poster is making.

26 minutes ago, MarcusX said:

There’s definitely differences though there’s lots of debates and studies about whether it’s down to race, genes, culture or environments etc

The Chinese make great weightlifters, they (typically) have great mobility/flexibility but they don’t have any renowned sprinters.

those of west African descent make up around 8% of the population (from the study I’ve read) yet dominate the sprinting world whereas East Africans are better at long distance/endurance events.

As someone else pointed out, there aren’t many top black swimmers in part because higher bone density doesn’t lend itself to buoyancy and swimming. You could argue there’s an access limitation here, especially historically (not being allowed in pools back in the 50s etc)

No 2 people are alike and there’s very few people in the world who could Overcompensate for genetics - the top athletes tend to follow the path of their genetics.

But Western Africans do not dominate sprinting.

The speed gene frequently associated with sprinting is present in huge swathes of the earths populace regardless of race.

East Africans are better at long distance events .. Actually one tribe in Kenya are better than the entire region. Better than billions across the globe but their genetics are widely shared.

We can state that people can lack the genetics to reach elite levels in some sports but stating that humans are just born naturally gifted for a sport is completely wrong.  

 

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12 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

There are areas of the globe that don't.

But Western Africans do not dominate sprinting.

The speed gene frequently associated with sprinting is present in huge swathes of the earths populace regardless of race.

East Africans are better at long distance events .. Actually one tribe in Kenya are better than the entire region. Better than billions across the globe but their genetics are widely shared.

We can state that people can lack the genetics to reach elite levels in some sports but stating that humans are just born naturally gifted for a sport is completely wrong.  

 

Hence my words 'in general'...not 'all'.

There wouldn't be any studies about it if their were no relevance.

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28 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

There are areas of the globe that don't.

I certainly would not agree with that point the poster is making.

But Western Africans do not dominate sprinting.

The speed gene frequently associated with sprinting is present in huge swathes of the earths populace regardless of race.

East Africans are better at long distance events .. Actually one tribe in Kenya are better than the entire region. Better than billions across the globe but their genetics are widely shared.

We can state that people can lack the genetics to reach elite levels in some sports but stating that humans are just born naturally gifted for a sport is completely wrong.  

 

Then why do Scientists and Sports look for specific gene types in certain sportsmen?

It's acknowledged by both Scientists and Sports Establishments, that certain genetics in humans are advantageous to different sports. Combined with the right training, you have an advantage over someone who doesn't.

There's enough reports on it... you've only got to Google it, read it and find the conclusion that there is no gene that will make you superior just by gene only.but combine the preferred studied and proven genetic with training and it's advantageous over those without.

For example...if you've got the 'twitch muscle' you will be more explosive than those without. And I'm not talking dodgy balti pie 🤪😉

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10 hours ago, spudski said:

Then why do Scientists and Sports look for specific gene types in certain sportsmen?

It's acknowledged by both Scientists and Sports Establishments, that certain genetics in humans are advantageous to different sports. Combined with the right training, you have an advantage over someone who doesn't.

There's enough reports on it... you've only got to Google it, read it and find the conclusion that there is no gene that will make you superior just by gene only.but combine the preferred studied and proven genetic with training and it's advantageous over those without.

For example...if you've got the 'twitch muscle' you will be more explosive than those without. And I'm not talking dodgy balti pie 🤪😉

You avoided the point about black people and heavy bones .. 

You earlier conflated skill with athleticism.

Scientists study the World. 

Scientists cannot identify a sports gene, a football skill gene, it does not at this point exist. That was the original point.

Athleticism is again a different thing but if hundreds of millions of people share a gene, tens of millions in one Country, if that gene is present across the globe and millions have it even in small Countries where is this extraordinary gift? The speed gene for instance is common. 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Cowshed said:

You avoided the point about black people and heavy bones .. 

You earlier conflated skill with athleticism.

Scientists study the World. 

Scientists cannot identify a sports gene, a football skill gene, it does not at this point exist. That was the original point.

Athleticism is again a different thing but if hundreds of millions of people share a gene, tens of millions in one Country, if that gene is present across the globe and millions have it even in small Countries where is this extraordinary gift? The speed gene for instance is common. 

 

 

 

No I haven't...read my posts in this thread.

Skill and athleticism are completely different... obviously.

Quote from an online study...

Conclusion

Current evidence suggests that a favorable genetic profile, when combined with the appropriate training, is advantageous, if not critical for the achievement of elite athletic status. However, though a few genes have now been repeatedly associated with elite athletic performance, these associations are not strong enough to be predictive and the use of genetic testing of these variants in talent selection is premature.

 

 

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12 hours ago, Cowshed said:

There are areas of the globe that don't.

I certainly would not agree with that point the poster is making.

But Western Africans do not dominate sprinting.

The speed gene frequently associated with sprinting is present in huge swathes of the earths populace regardless of race.

East Africans are better at long distance events .. Actually one tribe in Kenya are better than the entire region. Better than billions across the globe but their genetics are widely shared.

We can state that people can lack the genetics to reach elite levels in some sports but stating that humans are just born naturally gifted for a sport is completely wrong.  

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jonentine/2012/08/12/the-dna-olympics-jamaicans-win-sprinting-genetic-lottery-and-why-we-should-all-care/#5ed9b83e2a2e

It's not just one gene that defines whether someone is built more for speed or endurance but a combination of skeletal structure, distribution of muscle fibre types ie fast-twitch/slow-twitch, metabolism, lung capacity etc. These things ARE genetic, therefore some people are born better built for one type of sport or another. Maybe not literally "born a good footballer" - but certainly if they were a footballer whether they are more of a strong and powerful slower player, like JET or a lean, speedy winger for example.

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2 minutes ago, MarcusX said:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jonentine/2012/08/12/the-dna-olympics-jamaicans-win-sprinting-genetic-lottery-and-why-we-should-all-care/#5ed9b83e2a2e

It's not just one gene that defines whether someone is built more for speed or endurance but a combination of skeletal structure, distribution of muscle fibre types ie fast-twitch/slow-twitch, metabolism, lung capacity etc. These things ARE genetic, therefore some people are born better built for one type of sport or another. Maybe not literally "born a good footballer" - but certainly if they were a footballer whether they are more of a strong and powerful slower player, like JET or a lean, speedy winger for example.

And the more people migrate and mix, the different gene types will come together from country to country.

I remember reading a while back that Tim Cahill was tested for the twitch muscle and that he had the highest standing jump from a footballer.

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On 21/01/2020 at 13:15, RedM said:

For those of you who don’t like the Bristol Post site, me included as I Googled instead. JET is having a trial with Cheltenham, possibly to just build his fitness after a spell in Thailand. Google tells me that he turned 29 just after Christmas. 

I cant imagine Cheltenham is much of a social hot spot for him, quite a weird choice of clubs unless beggars can’t be choosers. But he should be getting better offers than Cheltenham or Thailand at his age with his experience.

Soho Farmhouse just down the road - he can hook up with Dave and Vicky. 

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On 21/01/2020 at 20:22, spudski said:

Why do you think there are no great black swimmers?

 

20 hours ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

‘There are no great black swimmers’ so that (if it is true)

It's not true.

Simone Manuel. Double Olympic champion. Multiple World and American record holder.

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19 minutes ago, Coxy27 said:

 

It's not true.

Simone Manuel. Double Olympic champion. Multiple World and American record holder.

Yep...the first and only. And in the sprint not long distance swimming.

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12 minutes ago, spudski said:

Yep...the first and only. And in the sprint not long distance swimming.

Again - not true.

Anthony Nesty - Olympic gold in 1988

Cullen Jones - Double Olympic and World gold

Don't worry about facts though when you're making impact statements.

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5 minutes ago, Coxy27 said:

Again - not true.

Anthony Nesty - Olympic gold in 1988

Cullen Jones - Double Olympic and World gold

Don't worry about facts though when you're making impact statements.

First black African American according to her Wiki.

Either way...even if you named 10, in the big picture of things, that the gist.

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On 24/01/2020 at 10:37, MarcusX said:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jonentine/2012/08/12/the-dna-olympics-jamaicans-win-sprinting-genetic-lottery-and-why-we-should-all-care/#5ed9b83e2a2e

It's not just one gene that defines whether someone is built more for speed or endurance but a combination of skeletal structure, distribution of muscle fibre types ie fast-twitch/slow-twitch, metabolism, lung capacity etc. These things ARE genetic, therefore some people are born better built for one type of sport or another. Maybe not literally "born a good footballer" - but certainly if they were a footballer whether they are more of a strong and powerful slower player, like JET or a lean, speedy winger for example.

There is no football skill gene and that was the point I made regarding JET and gifted natural ability. 

I have not disagreed that some individuals are not built for speed or that some individuals are. Some is hundreds of millions of people. Take muscle fibre types and ACTN3 (the articles smoking gun) . That gene is the gene associated with muscle power and speed. Of course its genetic it is a gene .. But the gene and its sprint variant is found in huge swathes of any race. It does not equal gifted natural born athlete. Its common, not extraordinary. 

RE ..Entine in that article he is using race as a biological category then oddly narrowing down his argument to nationality - Jamaica/Kenya. If his theory is correct running success should be far more broad spread because his successful nations characteristics are also widespread. Entine has demonstrated how successfully the Jamaicans and Kenyans have adapted, not that they are unique or more naturally gifted than other nations 

On 24/01/2020 at 10:02, spudski said:

No I haven't...read my posts in this thread.

 

Hardly. You made a sweeping generalisation. You were racial stereotyping.

Edited by Cowshed

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On 21/01/2020 at 16:47, J-mat said:

As someone else alluded to earlier, I don't remember the last time Weimman did anything. Yet he's lauded by most. 

On 21/01/2020 at 17:44, J-mat said:

I’d rather a player like Jay do one thing a game than a player like Weimman try and fail over and over again but look busy whilst he's at it. 

Oh dear, and I’m sorry about your memory

(*Weimann...)

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On 23/01/2020 at 14:52, PHILINFRANCE said:

There have been a few: Evander Sno in a pre-season friendly against AJAX and John Salako, when we got absolutely battered by Swansea.

Wasn’t it an ovation for Darren Pratley when he scored both for the Swans in one of the most complete performances I’ve ever seen from an away side at Ashton Gate? We lost 0-2 - I think it was around 2010 or 2011, they were just sublime, gave us a real footballing lesson and were roundly applauded by the Ashton Gate crowd at the end ... Salako only played around 10 games for Swansea on loan didn’t he? Don’t remember us getting absolutely battered by them in his short time there, could be wrong though ...

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12 minutes ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

Wasn’t it an ovation for Darren Pratley when he scored both for the Swans in one of the most complete performances I’ve ever seen from an away side at Ashton Gate? We lost 0-2 - I think it was around 2010 or 2011, they were just sublime, gave us a real footballing lesson and were roundly applauded by the Ashton Gate crowd at the end ... Salako only played around 10 games for Swansea on loan didn’t he? Don’t remember us getting absolutely battered by them in his short time there, could be wrong though ...

Leon Brittan I think mate but you`re right, it was a superb performance from them that night.

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On 24/01/2020 at 12:03, spudski said:

First black African American according to her Wiki.

Either way...even if you named 10, in the big picture of things, that the gist.

“Why are there no black swimmers?”

”Simone Manuel?”

”Ok but she’s the only one!”

”Here’s two more”

”Yeah but try and name 10!”

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