LJ WBA Press Conference

[spudski]

I see it more as a playing 'culture' than an 'Identity'...where our players have an excellent work ethic in line to their technical, tactical, psychological, physical and social skills. 

A mentality of producing and signing young hard working players, mixed with experience to generate a ‘togetherness’, and great team spirit which galvanises the team. With a DNA that fits in with our ethics.

The Club encourage the players to challenge themselves to be the best that they can be. To carry out instruction to the best of their ability, and to find individual strengths on the pitch and have self belief in their ability and the system.

When LJ mentioned that he didn't see our Identity against Leeds...I see certain elements of some of the above not being carried out. Self belief being the one thing that stood out to me. Some of our players have ability, but so often go hiding. 

[ExiledAjax]

5 hours ago, Trueredsupporter said:

Find how coaches talk interesting major. in interviews LJ says a lot and sometimes it says little or meanders. wonder if he is totally different person on the training pitch where its bang bang info info drop out keeper switch.

I went to watch the pre-season training in Tampa. He was very different. Much more direct, much more as you say in bold there. Basically they'd set up an exercise, mini-game with tiny goals kind of thing, players play through the drill for 5 mins, he'd shout at certain players at times, just general encouragement or reminders. Then LJ stops them, say one or two sentences, maybe some specific direction to a certain player, then they go again. He was far more succinct than he is in the press conferences.

[reddoh]

On 20/02/2020 at 14:40, downendcity said:

Is this something you can get on the NHS and what do they make them out of?

it's really quite innovative, when old men die the NHS chop them off when they have 5 hundred weight and sell them as a load of old bollocks for people to use as they see fit.

so don't worry lads they will go to use when you no longer need them (you could say they are recycleballs).

[BS4 on Tour...]

On 20/02/2020 at 10:03, Phileas Fogg said:

Really good press conference. Very interesting. He sounded very calm I felt.

Very interesting point about how Sheffield United recruit. He used them as an archetype for a club of our size, but explained exactly why we don't just 'Do what Sheffield United did' (as a few people on here have said) as we have a very different recruitment model. 

Shame we don’t do ‘what Sheffield United did’ - in 2017 they were in league one and in 2019 they were in the premier league - Chris Wilder, bloody genius....

[TonyTonyTony]

On 20/02/2020 at 15:47, BobBobSuperBob said:

I expect the vast majority of EFL managers look at you with total envy , for the backing the owners given you when most would have been replaced  

Utter Drivel.

What owner would sack a manager delivering year on year improvement despite losing key players every year? 

I get the fact you are bored by the football (your billion posts have been noted) but owners don’t think like you. Johnson ain’t going anywhere this season so I suggest you support or piss off. Negative bollocks all the time does my head in 

[Nibor]

1 minute ago, TonyTonyTony said:

Utter Drivel.

What owner would sack a manager delivering year on year improvement despite losing key players every year? 

I get the fact you are bored by the football (your billion posts have been noted) but owners don’t think like you. Johnson ain’t going anywhere this season so I suggest you support or piss off. Negative bollocks all the time does my head in 

Literally any owner who thought that another manager could deliver faster improvement.

[TonyTonyTony]

48 minutes ago, Nibor said:

Literally any owner who thought that another manager could deliver faster improvement.

 Example please

[Redstoke]

On 19/02/2020 at 20:54, BCFC Richard said:

A pretty good interview this, interesting bits about selection, Kasey and positives about the  progress for Afobe. 

Other thing to add is that I know he gets stick sometimes (probably form me too!) but MacGregor does actually do a great job, he might work for a bit of a rag but he does his research (eg. in this interview talking about wells + upcoming Bermuda friendly) bothers to look at what the fans are asking about and puts decent question to LJ and BCFC.

That smug little face knowing he has a job for life..safest job in British football.

[NickJ]

5 hours ago, TonyTonyTony said:

 Example please

Daren Moore at West Brom

Nigel Adkins at Southampton

 - just for starters

[Port Said Red]

On 20/02/2020 at 10:43, Harry said:

I find the Sheff Utd comparison very interesting. 
 

Baldock - they signed at 24. He was recommended to City at 19. 
Stevens - they signed at 26. He was recommended to City at 22. 
O’Connell - they signed at 22. He was recommended to City at 19. 
Egan - they signed at 25. He was recommended to City at 21. 
Freeman - they signed at 27. He was recommended to City at 20 (and eventually signed for us at 22). 
I’d also add Lee Evans, who Sheff Utd signed at 23. He was recommended to City at 17. 
 

So, the players which we know of and recommend at a young age are eventually picked up by Sheff U at a more ‘established’ age. 

 

Looking at that age range, all before MA, LJ and the current recruitment policy were in place then?

Also I wonder how many of them would have been written off on here before they eventually reached their potential, 3 or 4 years after we had signed them?

[Harry]

1 hour ago, Port Said Red said:

Looking at that age range, all before MA, LJ and the current recruitment policy were in place then?

Also I wonder how many of them would have been written off on here before they eventually reached their potential, 3 or 4 years after we had signed them?

Certainly before LJ. However MA was aware, from when he was here as a ‘consultant’, and was responsible for putting together the ‘new’ recruitment database. Albeit he was only here briefly. Those to whom these players were recommended were McInnes, Sod, Cotterill (and of course Burt at the time). 

[Davefevs]

9 hours ago, TonyTonyTony said:

Utter Drivel.

What owner would sack a manager delivering year on year improvement despite losing key players every year? 

I get the fact you are bored by the football (your billion posts have been noted) but owners don’t think like you. Johnson ain’t going anywhere this season so I suggest you support or piss off. Negative bollocks all the time does my head in 

9 hours ago, Nibor said:

Literally any owner who thought that another manager could deliver faster improvement.

It depends on whether you think year on year league position improvements in the only factor.  We are constantly told that is not the only reason, e.g. Finances, Youth progression etc come into.

If we finish 6th or above, he will be in credit.

If we finish 7th/8th there will be a challenge whether we should’ve done better.

There are gonna be “fine margins” (ironic) in deciding whether he is taking us forward, or whether at the limits of the finances available we are starting to plateau.

I don’t know the answer, but I think SL is expecting the play-offs!!  I’m not saying anything but will result in the sack though.  Within that expectation Lee knows he probably needs to sell at least £15m of talent each season and improve by spending a fraction of it....as are most other clubs in our division.  That is the reality.  In some cases it’s not the finances driving sales, but player ambition.

[Nibor]

38 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

It depends on whether you think year on year league position improvements in the only factor.  We are constantly told that is not the only reason, e.g. Finances, Youth progression etc come into.

If we finish 6th or above, he will be in credit.

If we finish 7th/8th there will be a challenge whether we should’ve done better.

There are gonna be “fine margins” (ironic) in deciding whether he is taking us forward, or whether at the limits of the finances available we are starting to plateau.

I don’t know the answer, but I think SL is expecting the play-offs!!  I’m not saying anything but will result in the sack though.  Within that expectation Lee knows he probably needs to sell at least £15m of talent each season and improve by spending a fraction of it....as are most other clubs in our division.  That is the reality.  In some cases it’s not the finances driving sales, but player ambition.

SL is running the club at an £8m real loss (ignoring player trading, depreciation and ammortisation) - the wage bill this season will be above £25m on an income of ~£17m unless we make the playoff final.  It's only by selling players that we fund bringing players in and that is a fairly risky business, we can't rely on it every year.  There are no ways to significantly improve the income in the Championship.  That means we have a runway during which he's expecting to get promotion or he'll have to change the way the club runs drastically - cutting the playing budget and cutting jobs in the fairly massive support staff.

LJ has delivered year on year improvement in league position, that is true, however it is not quick.  SL will be asking himself how many years away we are from promotion and how likely it is LJ can deliver it in the next few years, and if he thinks there's an option more likely to succeed - particularly if that option doesn't involve tearing down the structure that has been built - he will consider it. 

It's not purely financial either, there's an unusually high level of dissatisfaction amongst fans given our league position for a few reasons:

1. Our home form is much poorer than our away form.
2. Our performances particularly at home are very inconsistent and that's easy to attribute to a manager who changes formations and selections an awful lot.
3. There's a small residual feeling of LJ not deserving the job probably going all the way back to when GJ kept picking him despite his obvious weaknesses as a player.

Sentiment comes into it only slightly, if we miss 6th this year I think LJ will be on his last chance - even more so if nobody is sold for big bucks as that will shorten the promotion runway due to FFP.

[Davefevs]

@Nibor couldn’t agree more

[mozo]

It's funny that Johnson uses the term identity so often when in fact he's much more pragmatic than dogmatic. You sense that Bielsa would apply the same approach to tactics even if half his team were injured and suspended. But Johnson will always adapt the gameplan, formation, philosophy based on opposition, players available and player form. Johnson is much more about practicality than identity. 

[JamesBCFC]

4 hours ago, NickJ said:

Daren Moore at West Brom

Nigel Adkins at Southampton

 - just for starters

Darren Moore hadn't delivered year on year improvement, a qualifier at the start of the statement.

 

[old_eastender]

15 minutes ago, mozo said:

It's funny that Johnson uses the term identity so often when in fact he's much more pragmatic than dogmatic. You sense that Bielsa would apply the same approach to tactics even if half his team were injured and suspended. But Johnson will always adapt the gameplan, formation, philosophy based on opposition, players available and player form. Johnson is much more about practicality than identity. 

More like LJ over complicates and chops and changes far too much, which is why our play is often so disjointed! 

 

 

 

 

[Davefevs]

56 minutes ago, mozo said:

It's funny that Johnson uses the term identity so often when in fact he's much more pragmatic than dogmatic. You sense that Bielsa would apply the same approach to tactics even if half his team were injured and suspended. But Johnson will always adapt the gameplan, formation, philosophy based on opposition, players available and player form. Johnson is much more about practicality than identity. 

That’s how how I describe our football.  I don’t see that as lacking identity per se.

[Cowshed]

54 minutes ago, mozo said:

It's funny that Johnson uses the term identity so often when in fact he's much more pragmatic than dogmatic. You sense that Bielsa would apply the same approach to tactics even if half his team were injured and suspended. But Johnson will always adapt the gameplan, formation, philosophy based on opposition, players available and player form. Johnson is much more about practicality than identity. 

What about Burnley and Sean Dyche? 

There is a tendency to look at expansive teams as displaying clear identity. The identity of Burnley is pragmatic, conservative and based upon clear playing principles. Burnley bring in players that fit the football it plays (identity) and display the mental characteristics (dna) to match - Selfless hard workers.

Sean Dyche will also take command of teams outside of the XI for matches and training to oversee further that Burnley's approach to its football runs throughout the club. 

Its wholly pragmatic.

[mozo]

3 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

What about Burnley and Sean Dyche? 

There is a tendency to look at expansive teams as displaying clear identity. The identity of Burnley is pragmatic, conservative and based upon clear playing principles. Burnley bring in players that fit the football it plays (identity) and display the mental characteristics (dna) to match - Selfless hard workers.

Sean Dyche will also take command of teams outside of the XI for matches and training to oversee further that Burnley's approach to its football runs throughout the club. 

Its wholly pragmatic.

Good point, and identity isn't about being expansive (look at Atletico Madrid). But it must be consistent and ingrained. Johnson is pragmatic in a different way; in that he chops and changes. He probably sees it as fluid and versatile. Others see it as lacking clarity.

[Cowshed]

1 minute ago, mozo said:

Good point, and identity isn't about being expansive (look at Atletico Madrid). But it must be consistent and ingrained. Johnson is pragmatic in a different way; in that he chops and changes. He probably sees it as fluid and versatile. Others see it as lacking clarity.

Mr Johnson has said he wanted to see a playing identity throughout the club.

Do the academy and U teams display this fluid and versatile ahem identity? No they do not. Yes that lacks clarity. It is illogical to have players playing to systems the XI  are not. 

How do you recruit for chopping and changing when your resources are limited? How do you ingrain chopping and changing into players? It is pragmatic to do the polar opposite on a training level - Human beings are less likely to internalise (ingrain) chopping .. 

[BS4 on Tour...]

11 hours ago, TonyTonyTony said:

Utter Drivel.

What owner would sack a manager delivering year on year improvement despite losing key players every year? 

I get the fact you are bored by the football (your billion posts have been noted) but owners don’t think like you. Johnson ain’t going anywhere this season so I suggest you support or piss off. Negative bollocks all the time does my head in 

Ah, here we go - another dig at @BobBobSuperBob for giving his opinion on an open forum and demanding that he be positive or else he should ‘piss off’ ...

What is ‘utter drivel’ is people trying to regulate free speech on here by trying to push everyone towards the same point of view. What a dreadful place this Forum would be if everyone agreed and just shared their admiration for every player and every member of the management team! Utopia! 

Within reason, every poster can post whatever they wish without being told to ‘support or piss off’ ...

[mozo]

1 minute ago, Cowshed said:

Mr Johnson has said he wanted to see a playing identity throughout the club.

Do the academy and U teams display this fluid and versatile ahem identity? No they do not. Yes that lacks clarity. It is illogical to have players playing to systems the XI  are not. 

How do you recruit for chopping and changing when your resources are limited? How do you ingrain chopping and changing into players? It is pragmatic to do the polar opposite on a training level - Human beings are less likely to internalise (ingrain) chopping .. 

Totally agree. I'm guess what Johnson is saying in the presser is that his hand was forced by a variety of weird and wonderful happenings. He says he'd like to play the same 11 every week. It's hard to believe that. 

[BS4 on Tour...]

1 hour ago, JamesBCFC said:

Darren Moore hadn't delivered year on year improvement, a qualifier at the start of the statement.

A bit unfair on Moore there James - he took over a Baggies side that was bottom of the premier league and ten points from safety with one month of the season to go, can’t blame that relegation on him at all. Then the next season he was sacked when they were 4th in the championship ...

[JamesBCFC]

19 minutes ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

A bit unfair on Moore there James - he took over a Baggies side that was bottom of the premier league and ten points from safety with one month of the season to go, can’t blame that relegation on him at all. Then the next season he was sacked when they were 4th in the championship ...

I didnt say he had done a bad job, nor did I blame their relegation on him, so I wasn't being harsh in the slightest.

The question was asked of who would be sacked when delivering year on year improvement. 

Moore was given as an answer when it is an incorrect one.

[The Journalist]

1 hour ago, Nibor said:

SL is running the club at an £8m real loss (ignoring player trading, depreciation and ammortisation) - the wage bill this season will be above £25m on an income of ~£17m unless we make the playoff final.  It's only by selling players that we fund bringing players in and that is a fairly risky business, we can't rely on it every year.  There are no ways to significantly improve the income in the Championship.  That means we have a runway during which he's expecting to get promotion or he'll have to change the way the club runs drastically - cutting the playing budget and cutting jobs in the fairly massive support staff.

LJ has delivered year on year improvement in league position, that is true, however it is not quick.  SL will be asking himself how many years away we are from promotion and how likely it is LJ can deliver it in the next few years, and if he thinks there's an option more likely to succeed - particularly if that option doesn't involve tearing down the structure that has been built - he will consider it. 

It's not purely financial either, there's an unusually high level of dissatisfaction amongst fans given our league position for a few reasons:

1. Our home form is much poorer than our away form.
2. Our performances particularly at home are very inconsistent and that's easy to attribute to a manager who changes formations and selections an awful lot.
3. There's a small residual feeling of LJ not deserving the job probably going all the way back to when GJ kept picking him despite his obvious weaknesses as a player.

Sentiment comes into it only slightly, if we miss 6th this year I think LJ will be on his last chance - even more so if nobody is sold for big bucks as that will shorten the promotion runway due to FFP.

This reasoned explanation deserves a far better airing than being buried in this thread.

Your last paragraph is also interesting - and something I completely agree with - because, as I’ve said previously, I think it’s also partly why we’ve become so much more pragmatic over time.

 

[Nogbad the Bad]

On 20/02/2020 at 09:14, spudski said:

Tbh...I think a lot of the anti LJ stuff is down to lack of information. As LJ rightly points out, we are dealing with human beings, and fans don't have a clue what's going on in their lives. He gets slagged off for certain selections, but none of us know what's going on behind closed doors. Some of its not even sickness or injury, but where a players head at. LJ has implied that before. Players have things going on in their lives, just like us, that can effect their performance. I think some forget that when commenting. So many factors to take into consideration.

But it's always been the case that players will have off field personal issues, young children disrupting their sleep etc.

Alan Dicks' promotion team for instance - 8 or 9 players playing all or most games whatever was going on in their lives.

No 3 subs to regularly give several players half an hour off either.

No large squad in those days, and little sympathy, I suspect, for outside issues. No choice but to put everything else out of their minds and play every week to the high standards expected.

I doubt any allowances were made for personal issues leading to a drop in performance, let alone players being omitted from the team because of them.

[TonyTonyTony]

9 hours ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

Ah, here we go - another dig at @BobBobSuperBob for giving his opinion on an open forum and demanding that he be positive or else he should ‘piss off’ ...

What is ‘utter drivel’ is people trying to regulate free speech on here by trying to push everyone towards the same point of view. What a dreadful place this Forum would be if everyone agreed and just shared their admiration for every player and every member of the management team! Utopia! 

Within reason, every poster can post whatever they wish without being told to ‘support or piss off’ ...

Are you his nurse?

if so I’d suggest you up his medication

[BS4 on Tour...]

3 minutes ago, TonyTonyTony said:

Are you his nurse?

if so I’d suggest you up his medication

‘Utter drivel..’

[reddoh]

10 hours ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

But it's always been the case that players will have off field personal issues, young children disrupting their sleep etc.

Alan Dicks' promotion team for instance - 8 or 9 players playing all or most games whatever was going on in their lives.

No 3 subs to regularly give several players half an hour off either.

No large squad in those days, and little sympathy, I suspect, for outside issues. No choice but to put everything else out of their minds and play every week to the high standards expected.

I doubt any allowances were made for personal issues leading to a drop in performance, let alone players being omitted from the team because of them.

Whilst totally agreeing with you football has changed from those days and the power has shifted from the club to the player so if the player doesn't want to play he doesn't unfortunately usually on the pitch.