Rich Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 As per the title, who made the decision to let WBA fans occupy the important area behind the goal, once the decision had been taken to increase our clubs revenue. Now, I've no problem with increasing revenue, though I do have a problem giving a well supported club even more support at our ground. What I really have a problem with is, what idiot suggested letting them sit directly behind the goal, instead of to the side (in the corners) which were vacant anyway. I know the outcome was most probably the same but, what if, one of the teams had a penalty in the dying seconds and the crowd as usual did their best to put off our pen taker, or our keeper. This highlights to me the emphasis within our club. It's based on finances first and foremost, and not what helps the team out on the pitch. In my opinion, every decision taken should be with the ethos, does it help or hinder the team. If it helps, do it, if it hinders, don't. I know finances are important but there comes a time when the decisions to help the team be successful (I know they go hand in hand at times) must be put to the forefront. The number of times our club have made decisions to the detriment of the team is not conducive to success, it's just plain stupid. It shows that there are people in those decision making positions who either don't know, or don't care what the repercussions might or might not be. Now some people might say this is not that important in the whole scheme of things but, is it? S C got the away supporters moved to the other side of the stand so that, our players never had to go through the rigmarole of going down the tunnel surrounded by away supporters, not nice on your home tump. The away team were moved from the Dolman/EE corner because they didn't like the stick they got, (feckum). Our home singing section were moved from pillar to post and eventually located in an area where they are dissected by gangways and a recessed area. The ball boys were changed to save money and the new ones never knew when or how to affect the game. No singing section was catered for in our play off final because we'd make more money by letting ticketmaster do it. Hull had one, did it help them? It just strikes me that we are not very savvy as a club and should wise up quickly. Now I'm sure someone will mention H&S and not being able to use those corner areas, well, we might as well remove them then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Red Hat Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 The away fans should be treated the same as our 'singing section'. A poxy little area in a corner somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denbury Red Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 14 minutes ago, Roger Red Hat said: The away fans should be treated the same as our 'singing section'. A poxy little area in a corner somewhere. Or as was suggested before up in the gods of the Upper Lansdown (a corner!) and then give the Atyeo back to the home fans! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slartibartfast Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 29 minutes ago, Rich said: As per the title, who made the decision to let WBA fans occupy the important area behind the goal, once the decision had been taken to increase our clubs revenue. Now, I've no problem with increasing revenue, though I do have a problem giving a well supported club even more support at our ground. What I really have a problem with is, what idiot suggested letting them sit directly behind the goal, instead of to the side (in the corners) which were vacant anyway. I know the outcome was most probably the same but, what if, one of the teams had a penalty in the dying seconds and the crowd as usual did their best to put off our pen taker, or our keeper. This highlights to me the emphasis within our club. It's based on finances first and foremost, and not what helps the team out on the pitch. In my opinion, every decision taken should be with the ethos, does it help or hinder the team. If it helps, do it, if it hinders, don't. I know finances are important but there comes a time when the decisions to help the team be successful (I know they go hand in hand at times) must be put to the forefront. The number of times our club have made decisions to the detriment of the team is not conducive to success, it's just plain stupid. It shows that there are people in those decision making positions who either don't know, or don't care what the repercussions might or might not be. Now some people might say this is not that important in the whole scheme of things but, is it? S C got the away supporters moved to the other side of the stand so that, our players never had to go through the rigmarole of going down the tunnel surrounded by away supporters, not nice on your home tump. The away team were moved from the Dolman/EE corner because they didn't like the stick they got, (feckum). Our home singing section were moved from pillar to post and eventually located in an area where they are dissected by gangways and a recessed area. The ball boys were changed to save money and the new ones never knew when or how to affect the game. No singing section was catered for in our play off final because we'd make more money by letting ticketmaster do it. Hull had one, did it help them? It just strikes me that we are not very savvy as a club and should wise up quickly. Now I'm sure someone will mention H&S and not being able to use those corner areas, well, we might as well remove them then. As LJ would say .. "fine margins " . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bar BS3 Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 I thought the West Brom fans were great yesterday. Non-stop. I know it’s easier when you are top of the league and then winning away, comfortably - but they sang and we didn’t (much) that’s why they made a racket. Nothing to do with numbers or where they were sat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted February 23, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 5 minutes ago, Bar BS3 said: I thought the West Brom fans were great yesterday. Non-stop. I know it’s easier when you are top of the league and then winning away, comfortably - but they sang and we didn’t (much) that’s why they made a racket. Nothing to do with numbers or where they were sat. Agreed but, that's not what this is about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East Londoner Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 Those who want less away fans are the same people who complain when other clubs do the same and the away allocation sells out when there’s still plenty of space. Surely we should treat away fans how we expect our own away fans to be treated and then includes not being charged a fortune Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 I totally understand the revenue argument; but I've always felt it's poor planning. It stands to reason that having away fans en masse behind one goal gives the away team a marginal advantage. Surely in professional sport you'd want to minimise that if possible. I've always said it should've been home fans in the Atyeo as the 'singing section' with away fans in the corner beside it; either Lansdown or Dolman A/B. People will say it doesn't matter, but you don't want to give any fine marginal advantages to the away team - LJ would agree I'm sure. Wasn't it Cotterill who ordered moving the away fans from around the tunnel in the Atyeo? Unfortunately it's probably logistically impossible now to rectify this. People have 'their' seats in the Dolman and Lansdown and understandably wouldn't want to move. Also would need lots of sign offs from various beauracratic organisations such as SAG to make happen. It's obviously easier to contain the away support in the one isolated stand so I do see their reasoning. Just feel it hinders atmosphere (S82 as far away as possible from away fans is terrible for atmosphere) and gives away fans a marginal advantage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banjo Island Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 From my seat in the south stand i thought the noise coming from the Atyeo was depressingly impressive a wall of sound no acoustics issues there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 52 minutes ago, Rich said: As per the title, who made the decision to let WBA fans occupy the important area behind the goal, once the decision had been taken to increase our clubs revenue. Now, I've no problem with increasing revenue, though I do have a problem giving a well supported club even more support at our ground. What I really have a problem with is, what idiot suggested letting them sit directly behind the goal, instead of to the side (in the corners) which were vacant anyway. I know the outcome was most probably the same but, what if, one of the teams had a penalty in the dying seconds and the crowd as usual did their best to put off our pen taker, or our keeper. This highlights to me the emphasis within our club. It's based on finances first and foremost, and not what helps the team out on the pitch. In my opinion, every decision taken should be with the ethos, does it help or hinder the team. If it helps, do it, if it hinders, don't. I know finances are important but there comes a time when the decisions to help the team be successful (I know they go hand in hand at times) must be put to the forefront. The number of times our club have made decisions to the detriment of the team is not conducive to success, it's just plain stupid. It shows that there are people in those decision making positions who either don't know, or don't care what the repercussions might or might not be. Now some people might say this is not that important in the whole scheme of things but, is it? S C got the away supporters moved to the other side of the stand so that, our players never had to go through the rigmarole of going down the tunnel surrounded by away supporters, not nice on your home tump. The away team were moved from the Dolman/EE corner because they didn't like the stick they got, (feckum). Our home singing section were moved from pillar to post and eventually located in an area where they are dissected by gangways and a recessed area. The ball boys were changed to save money and the new ones never knew when or how to affect the game. No singing section was catered for in our play off final because we'd make more money by letting ticketmaster do it. Hull had one, did it help them? It just strikes me that we are not very savvy as a club and should wise up quickly. Now I'm sure someone will mention H&S and not being able to use those corner areas, well, we might as well remove them then. When were away fans in the corner of the East End where it meets the Dolman?! The only time I remember them being there was for one game when we beat Rotherham to clinch promotion - as City fans had 99.9% of the East End that day the few Millers fans were shoved into a small section in the corner as it was deemed the most suitable place in the ground, but that was only a one off wasn’t it? Apologies if I’ve forgotten something obvious, memory does play tricks on the odd occasion! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreedyHarry Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 If you give away fans a corner of the Atyeo, they will be behind the goal. We saw this when the Atyeo was split between fans during and just after the redevelopment. The 10% ticket rule means they get 2,700 tickets but have to be given an area of approx 3,000 actual seats because away fans are likely to stand. The Atyeo holds about 4,200 from memory. I don’t think the away fans should be in any other part of the ground. The Atyeo has the worst facilities these days, allows complete segregation, is getting old and tired, and you get bloody wet in the front two thirds when it rains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Red Hat Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 3 minutes ago, GreedyHarry said: you get bloody wet in the front two thirds when it rains. The very place for the away fans!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Red Hat Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 15 minutes ago, BS4 on Tour... said: When were away fans in the corner of the East End where it meets the Dolman? I seem to remember when I first started going in the mid 60's that the away fans were on one side of the EE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xerox6060 Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 Cant see away fans moving until the stand is redeveloped and they are housed top tier (if there is a top tier).. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted February 23, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 1 hour ago, BS4 on Tour... said: When were away fans in the corner of the East End where it meets the Dolman?! The only time I remember them being there was for one game when we beat Rotherham to clinch promotion - as City fans had 99.9% of the East End that day the few Millers fans were shoved into a small section in the corner as it was deemed the most suitable place in the ground, but that was only a one off wasn’t it? Apologies if I’ve forgotten something obvious, memory does play tricks on the odd occasion! Not fans, team. They used to warm up there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted February 23, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 Sadly, this has turned into a where to put away supporters. That is not what the thread is about. It's about who makes the decisions that don't help our team. As happened yesterday, the away support could have been split up along the lower section and not placed directly behind the goal. It's obvious that some people haven't read the thread properly and are responding to other posts. Perhaps I should edit the title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 1 minute ago, Rich said: Sadly, this has turned into a where to put away supporters. That is not what the thread is about. It's about who makes the decisions that don't help our team. As happened yesterday, the away support could have been split up along the lower section and not placed directly behind the goal. It's obvious that some people haven't read the thread properly and are responding to other posts. Perhaps I should edit the title. Sorry Rich, I must admit I skimmed your post - laziness on my part really because it was quite a long couple of paragraphs. Apologies for derailing the thread! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted February 23, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 2 hours ago, slartibartfast said: As LJ would say .. "fine margins " . It would appear that you understand what I'm saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myol'man Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 1 hour ago, Roger Red Hat said: I seem to remember when I first started going in the mid 60's that the away fans were on one side of the EE. No segregation mid 60s, didn't really start until mid early 70s when the Park End was split. 8 minutes ago, Rich said: Sadly, this has turned into a where to put away supporters. That is not what the thread is about. It's about who makes the decisions that don't help our team. As happened yesterday, the away support could have been split up along the lower section and not placed directly behind the goal. It's obvious that some people haven't read the thread properly and are responding to other posts. Perhaps I should edit the title. Stadium safety officer would have made the decision in conjunction with police. I doubt whether the football coaching staff even knew about it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted February 23, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 10 minutes ago, myol'man said: No segregation mid 60s, didn't really start until mid early 70s when the Park End was split. Stadium safety officer would have made the decision in conjunction with police. I doubt whether the football coaching staff even knew about it If that is the case, then it should not be. There's no reason to not have fans in the corners, we have had that at other times. If that has caused problems then it's down to the safety officers not organising it properly. This is what I'm highlighting. Decisions affect football, and it seems particularly at our club. This would not happen at many other clubs, they would find a way around it. To have the "fine margins" in our favour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Geoff Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 Surely from a safety aspect its better that the 'overload' of fans is in the middle rather than at the sides. Otherwise they are too close to the Home supporters and we all remember what happened V Swansea last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted February 23, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 18 minutes ago, Sir Geoff said: Surely from a safety aspect its better that the 'overload' of fans is in the middle rather than at the sides. Otherwise they are too close to the Home supporters and we all remember what happened V Swansea last season. As I sated before, if that's the case, remove the seats. There is no need to have them (away fans) in the central area. A problem occurred before at the Dolman side. As I remember it was because Swansea fans came in and weren't restricted to the seating, so played billy big balls and our fans responded likewise. That's a stewarding problem, not a safety issue as such. Fans entered the field of play yesterday, after a goal was scored and from the area behind the goal, should we restrict there then? Anyway, that's not the question or the problem, as I see it. The problem in my opinion is, we have to be more savvy and any decisions taken, must be to the benefit of the team firstly, rather than just on financial terms Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Fred Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 1 hour ago, xerox6060 said: Cant see away fans moving until the stand is redeveloped and they are housed top tier (if there is a top tier).. It's been done to death....what redevelopment?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 1 hour ago, Rich said: If that is the case, then it should not be. There's no reason to not have fans in the corners, we have had that at other times. If that has caused problems then it's down to the safety officers not organising it properly. This is what I'm highlighting. Decisions affect football, and it seems particularly at our club. This would not happen at many other clubs, they would find a way around it. To have the "fine margins" in our favour. It’s false to say that other clubs wouldn’t let away fans behind the goal. In our division the following clubs give away fans the whole end behind the goal : Brentford, Preston, Swansea, Millwall, Sheff weds, QPR, Charlton, Wigan, Barnsley, Luton. Also, these clubs give half the end, which includes either full or partial section behind the goal : West Brom, Fulham, Forest, Blackburn, Reading, Stoke, Huddersfield. There’s only 6 grounds in this league where away fans are on the side or in a corner which doesn’t stretch to behind the goal : Leeds, Cardiff, Derby, Brum, Hull, Boro. The argument about putting away fans behind the goal is a paltry one. Fans should be able to create noise wherever they are, so long as enough of them want to join in. The West Brom fans yesterday were loud because they ALL sang, not because they had a few hundred extra tickets in the lower section behind the goal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted February 23, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 2 hours ago, GreedyHarry said: If you give away fans a corner of the Atyeo, they will be behind the goal. We saw this when the Atyeo was split between fans during and just after the redevelopment. The 10% ticket rule means they get 2,700 tickets but have to be given an area of approx 3,000 actual seats because away fans are likely to stand. The Atyeo holds about 4,200 from memory. I don’t think the away fans should be in any other part of the ground. The Atyeo has the worst facilities these days, allows complete segregation, is getting old and tired, and you get bloody wet in the front two thirds when it rains. If you are replying to my post, then perhaps I've not explained it properly. We now normally accommodate away supporters along the top of the Atyeo, Yesterday that included the middle blocks, while the corner blocks at the front were empty. I'm suggesting that we leave the middle blocks out and place the extra away supporters in the front corner blocks. That way, there's no influence from supporters directly behind the goal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 1 hour ago, Rich said: Not fans, team. They used to warm up there. Oh right, apologies for the misunderstanding Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 3 hours ago, Roger Red Hat said: The away fans should be treated the same as our 'singing section'. A poxy little area in a corner somewhere. 2,000 is the minimum with a ground our capacity. In PL it's 3,000 so I'm not sure where you put them in that scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUSSEL85 Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 Not sure I’d be comfortable with certain fans above us in the upper landsdown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted February 23, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 3 minutes ago, Harry said: It’s false to say that other clubs wouldn’t let away fans behind the goal. In our division the following clubs give away fans the whole end behind the goal : Brentford, Preston, Swansea, Millwall, Sheff weds, QPR, Charlton, Wigan, Barnsley, Luton. Also, these clubs give half the end, which includes either full or partial section behind the goal : West Brom, Fulham, Forest, Blackburn, Reading, Stoke, Huddersfield. There’s only 6 grounds in this league where away fans are on the side or in a corner which doesn’t stretch to behind the goal : Leeds, Cardiff, Derby, Brum, Hull, Boro. The argument about putting away fans behind the goal is a paltry one. Fans should be able to create noise wherever they are, so long as enough of them want to join in. The West Brom fans yesterday were loud because they ALL sang, not because they had a few hundred extra tickets in the lower section behind the goal. You haven't understood what I posted, I didn't mean to imply other clubs wouldn't let away support behind the goal. I'm trying to get across that other clubs try to help their teams as much as they can within physical restraints. Probably best to read the original post. As for the rest of it, I know that QPR , Millwall and I believe Brentford sell out the top sections first for away support. Perhaps the others don't have an option but, would they intentionally place away supporters directly behind a goal, regardless of numbers, I think not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chappers Posted February 23, 2020 Report Share Posted February 23, 2020 Presumably, those moaning about giving West Brom too many seats are not the ones that moan about us getting too small an allocation at certain grounds? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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