Bob Turnip Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 17 hours ago, Super said: The trouble is he is the one player who creates chances in a team that creates very little. Is it as simple as that though? Be interesting to know how many of his assists came from when he was brought on v when he started. Plus, going on early season performances and with the right players up front, the likes of Palmer would be up there statistically from a creative point of view I would think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riaz Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 Think the squad is made for 3-5-2. Especially since we since benkovic. problem was Elliasson was in form and does not fit into 3-5-2 We must play a team like this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clutton Caveman Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 Surely LJ must have done all of this analysis and more He knows the players better than us and sees them in training all the time. If he cannot by this point in the season work our his best formation and team it is a sad state of affairs His obsession of picking a team to stop the opposition shows his lack of confidence in his players Perhaps its time for him to have a chat with his more experienced players and get their perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 30 minutes ago, Clutton Caveman said: Surely LJ must have done all of this analysis and more He knows the players better than us and sees them in training all the time. If he cannot by this point in the season work our his best formation and team it is a sad state of affairs His obsession of picking a team to stop the opposition shows his lack of confidence in his players Perhaps its time for him to have a chat with his more experienced players and get their perspective. Starting to come round to the view that he's just stubborn- "My way or the Highway, I know best" etc. OTOH, doesn't explain all the chopping and changing- seems both stubborn and to like his tinkering- an odd combination but he's managed it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UREDS_91 Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 Easy, drop him. Play Pato/Palmer in behind a front two and give the wingback an opportunity to get forward. (Pato would probably be my choice away from home due to his tackling back) Elliason is (even with rose tinted glasses on) a one trick pony, if cutting in and crossing doesn't work, he doesn't have the ability to drive inside and create space on the wings for Dasilva/Hunt or even have a strike at goal. Now, if we needed to change the game when players are tired, bring him on to have a go at crossing into the box. We played our best football playing 5-3-2 and have ruined it trying to shoehorn in Elliason. Fans booing his substitution on Saturday was embarrassing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted February 25, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 2 hours ago, Bob Turnip said: Is it as simple as that though? Be interesting to know how many of his assists came from when he was brought on v when he started. Plus, going on early season performances and with the right players up front, the likes of Palmer would be up there statistically from a creative point of view I would think. Eliasson: 20 starts: 2 goals / 9 assists (1623 mins) 13 subs: 1 goal / 5 assists (449 mins) 4 unused Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UREDS_91 Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 2 hours ago, Riaz said: Think the squad is made for 3-5-2. Especially since we since benkovic. problem was Elliasson was in form and does not fit into 3-5-2 We must play a team like this Agree, rotate Massengo/Smith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roe Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 I don't think he was particularly good against West Brom but I'll be disappointed if Nagy doesn't play again tbh (unless Smith is fit). We need to start building partnerships and believing in our own players rather than dropping them in and out all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coxy27 Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 12 minutes ago, Roe said: I don't think he was particularly good against West Brom but I'll be disappointed if Nagy doesn't play again tbh (unless Smith is fit). We need to start building partnerships and believing in our own players rather than dropping them in and out all the time. Not particularly good is an understatement tbh - He was really quite awful. However, agree with the principle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bard Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 The problem isn't Eliasson. It's the rest of the creative department. Headline is a misrepresentation of the reality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bard Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 59 minutes ago, Davefevs said: Eliasson: 20 starts: 2 goals / 9 assists (1623 mins) 13 subs: 1 goal / 5 assists (449 mins) 4 unused Put those stats alongside our overall pattern of scoring goals and they will have context. Or next to O'Dowda's or Palmer's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AppyDAZE Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 If Johnson is here for the long haul he may as well leave him out. Let's face it Niclas Eliasson is going in the summer anyway. Loved watching him, good luck in the game young man You are a credit as a person too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted February 25, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 28 minutes ago, The Bard said: Put those stats alongside our overall pattern of scoring goals and they will have context. Or next to O'Dowda's or Palmer's Feel free! The topic tries to focus on a complex perceived /suggested correlation of results versus formation versus number of strikers versus wingers (one of which is Eliasson). You can draw and debate your own conclusions. 1st half: 1g / 9a (853 mins) 2nd half: 2g / 5a (1219 mins) Summarised - start him but take him off at h-t, or bring him on as sub!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spud55 Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 16 hours ago, Davefevs said: We could! I would prefer: Weimann | Wells | Eliasson Why would yo drop by far our best striker at the moment to accommodate Weimann? All the people suggesting that we leave fam out, did anyone see how totally shit we were without him against Leeds? Add to that him being our best player against WBA, I find it absolutely mental that people are genuinely advocating the man who has been by far our best player over the last 2/3 months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon bristol Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 Well liverpool play 433 as far as i know, and get a crazy amount of assists from the full backs as well as the 3 forwards. The 3 midfielders are pretty much ball winners who can play a bit, and have great energy, the whole team is set up to press. It all depends on personnel, but our strongest players are at centre back, plus eliasson and wells and diedhou. Eliasson can play off either side in terms of whipping crosses in, it seems to me if we could trust him at right wing back with JD on the left, that would be ideal,,,, however, he doesnt have the defensive mentality or the engine to do it. to sum up, i dont know what the answer is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcofisher Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 Bentley Kalas Benkovic Baker Pereira Henriksen Nagy Dasilva Pato/Palmer Wells Diedhiou Eliasson needs a rest so happy to see us change to this for the next game. I don't understand the logic of many for not playing Diedhiou if we are playing 352, especially if we are playing Pato in the 10 role. They have shown before that they have the ability to link up well (Wigan away?), and considering that Pato covers more ground than Palmer and doesn't necessarily hold on to it for as long, it could be very useful to have a presence that he and Wells can play the ball off of going forward. Even if Fammy did not link well with Palmer in the 352 as Palmer was more the static player that required runners in behind, Pato is not that type of player and definitely could be considered more of a 'mover' that could get in behind himself. That being said, i'm still not convinced that Palmer and Diedhiou wouldn't be able to learn to play together over time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted February 25, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 5 minutes ago, Spud55 said: Why would yo drop by far our best striker at the moment to accommodate Weimann? All the people suggesting that we leave fam out, did anyone see how totally shit we were without him against Leeds? Add to that him being our best player against WBA, I find it absolutely mental that people are genuinely advocating the man who has been by far our best player over the last 2/3 months. I responded to a 3 man attack that had Wells on the right. I’d rather have Wells in the middle, so in that suggestion, yes, I’d leave Fam out. Best player v West Brom? That’s subjective. Made some great clearances from corners, lost the ball dribbling out for their second, consistently had the ball nipped away from him by Sawyers and Livermore, when he got it into feet first hour. He had a better final 30 minutes. In general he’s been playing well over a decent period of games. Personally I’d play 532/5212, and he’d partner Wells. I rate Weimann, but at the mo’ Fam deserves the pairing. But in a 3 man attack I think very differently! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephjnr Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 21 hours ago, Major Isewater said: This whole thread just highlights to me that despite everything LJ doesn’t know our best team or our best formations . After 4 years and a transfer budget far beyond Dad and Cotts. 22 minutes ago, marcofisher said: Bentley Kalas Benkovic Baker Pereira Henriksen Nagy Dasilva Pato/Palmer Wells Diedhiou Only two options I can come up with against this: * Weimann starting and Diedhiou replacing him up front. We need Fam's energy much later on when we bring off the hole man for Eliasson. * Weimann starting, then putting Diedhou in the hole in place of Pato/Palmer. It would give him more holding responsibility yet more freedom to move as he won't be the focal point of attack, he'll have less ground to cover if he needs to defend and it'll confuse a lot of H'field players as to who theyre marking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcofisher Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 15 minutes ago, sephjnr said: After 4 years and a transfer budget far beyond Dad and Cotts. Only two options I can come up with against this: * Weimann starting and Diedhiou replacing him up front. We need Fam's energy much later on when we bring off the hole man for Eliasson. * Weimann starting, then putting Diedhou in the hole in place of Pato/Palmer. It would give him more holding responsibility yet more freedom to move as he won't be the focal point of attack, he'll have less ground to cover if he needs to defend and it'll confuse a lot of H'field players as to who theyre marking. 1st one I could understand, it's good to rotate as well. 2nd I can't at all, Fammy doesn't have the passing range, close control and vision to play in that role. It would be incredibly defensive even if we were to be winning and would result in us frequently giving the ball away in the middle of the park. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephjnr Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 3 hours ago, marcofisher said: 1st one I could understand, it's good to rotate as well. 2nd I can't at all, Fammy doesn't have the passing range, close control and vision to play in that role. It would be incredibly defensive even if we were to be winning and would result in us frequently giving the ball away in the middle of the park. It's playing to Fammy's strengths as a defender, in the hole he doesn't need tremendous passing range as his presence is diversionary, and he will have Weimann, Wells, either Pedro or Henriksen and Jay moving for him to play to. Plus with our current setup more passes are (ahem) bypassing the midfield/forward-mid altogether. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveInSA Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 6 hours ago, UREDS_91 said: Easy, drop him. Play Pato/Palmer in behind a front two and give the wingback an opportunity to get forward. (Pato would probably be my choice away from home due to his tackling back) Elliason is (even with rose tinted glasses on) a one trick pony, if cutting in and crossing doesn't work, he doesn't have the ability to drive inside and create space on the wings for Dasilva/Hunt or even have a strike at goal. Now, if we needed to change the game when players are tired, bring him on to have a go at crossing into the box. We played our best football playing 5-3-2 and have ruined it trying to shoehorn in Elliason. Fans booing his substitution on Saturday was embarrassing. exactly this. A one trick pony is the only creative talent in the team...except he isn't. Teams figured him out pretty quickly. I rate he'd be a great impact sub in a free ranging attacking role to cause havoc in the final third. 4-3-3 for me. If it's good enough for the scousers it's good enough for us Apparently they've just won 18 in a row. 18. Streaky Johnson take a bow! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcusX Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 On 24/02/2020 at 14:17, Shtanley said: I’d take out Eliasson and Diedhiou and go 352. Bring both on if needed. Palmer behind Weimann and Wells. Weimanns been woeful and Diedhiou’s been the only one to show a bit of fight, odd decision Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted February 25, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 To the OP (that’s me). This is how he’s solved it. 3-5-effin-2 (probably 3412/5212 in reality). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shtanley Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 13 minutes ago, MarcusX said: Weimanns been woeful and Diedhiou’s been the only one to show a bit of fight, odd decision Apart from Sheffield U (a) I can't recall Diedhiou doing too well in the 352. Palmer isn't starting so I'm fine with Diedhiou playing, if he was I would want Weimann up top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo76 Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 Have to say, that is the exact team I would have picked. Just not sure how we expect a team to perform well with such frequent changing of personnel and formation. Fingers crossed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numero Uno Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 Let’s hope this weeks tombola selection is a lucky one for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roe Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 I'm not really against the team picked tonight but it's more weirdness. O'Dowda goes from getting his first start in 11 games to not even in the squad 3 days later. We've now also got the problem of trying to find a way to get our most creative player back into the team at some point as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numero Uno Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 3 minutes ago, Roe said: I'm not really against the team picked tonight but it's more weirdness. O'Dowda goes from getting his first start in 11 games to not even in the squad 3 days later. We've now also got the problem of trying to find a way to get our most creative player back into the team at some point as well. Whatever we say about this selection he’s bang on dropping O’Dowda out of it altogether imo...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted February 25, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 1 minute ago, Roe said: I'm not really against the team picked tonight but it's more weirdness. O'Dowda goes from getting his first start in 11 games to not even in the squad 3 days later. failed the audition on Saturday. We've now also got the problem of trying to find a way to get our most creative player back into the team at some point as well. or not!! Seriously though, big chance for some players to stake their claim tonight. Rowe especially, but also a chance for Kalas, Baker and Benkovic to forge a defensive partnership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roe Posted February 25, 2020 Report Share Posted February 25, 2020 3 minutes ago, Numero Uno said: Whatever we say about this selection he’s bang on dropping O’Dowda out of it altogether imo...... Maybe true, he wasn't very good. But I just find it a bit odd and it's not the first player it's happened to. Why do so many of our players often go from not getting in the team at all, to being thrown in at the deep end and then left completely out of the squad again after? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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