Todays interviews

[Robbored]

2 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

 

@Robbored cmon, you should be jumping to the defence of your #1 otib contributor

Spudski is very capable of defending himself Dave.............

He’s my number one poster because his posts are always thoughtful and spot on.

[Davefevs]

3 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Spudski is very capable of defending himself Dave.............

He’s my number one poster because his posts are always thoughtful and spot on.

He is, but you know he loves it

[Robbored]

4 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

He is, but you know he loves it

I’ve never met him so wouldn’t know what he thinks. 

[spudski]

11 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Bit of both imho. Re the first bit - if you don’t persevere you never have any experiences to fall back on / show learning from.

Re the second bit, you wonder whether there is an emphasis on looking at what our future opponents do with the ball, and prep for that... but maybe less emphasis on looking at what they do off the ball (when they attempt to stop us).  Matches v Millwall, Blackburn, Charlton etc at home have caught my eye in terms of how our opponents have stopped us, more than what they did when they got the ball. 

@Robbored cmon, you should be jumping to the defence of your #1 otib contributor

I noticed that too. Not a criticism of Callum at all, just imagine LJ talking about HIS identity and HIS philosophy a bit too much and it being more words than substance.  

I agree Dave...but what I can't get my head around is why it's taking so long for players to understand different methods.

Take Eliasson as an example...we all know his qualities, but he's been here long enough now to know that he has to track back and cover the LB. Have you noticed how many teams now are pinpointing the area just behind DaSilva and overload players there. They know it's a weakness.

LJ made a comment about Nagy in a recent game saying how well he did when he came on creating angles.

Isn't that what all our players should be doing naturally...it's a basic if football.

It crossed my mind that LJ had come across some magic formula where playing in straight lines and being static was now the way forward

Regardless of methods and tactics...when struggling to find form you revert to the basics and build from that.

Give and go, create angles, find space, come for the ball etc...basics. Our players don't even do that well. And we know they can, because we've seen it before.

 

My gut instinct tells me certain players are not confident in their own ability and scared. We've even had that alluded to from LJ. 

 

[spudski]

11 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

He is, but you know he loves it

 

6 minutes ago, Robbored said:

I’ve never met him so wouldn’t know what he thinks. 

Haven't a clue what's going on here :laugh:

[Robbored]

5 minutes ago, spudski said:

Haven't a clue what's going on here

I’ve only read your earlier post Spudski that Dave referred to and it’s well considered as usual.

However my take is slightly different in as much that I often feel that the players are performing with shackles on. Now to me that can only be because they’re trying to replicate LJs instructions and it frequently doesn’t materialise.

I struggle to recall seeing any City player running at the opposition as Murray or Walsh used to.Theres little or no flair and that lack of flair can contribute to a poor atmosphere.

Most of can remember Walsh, Smudger, Murray thrilling the crowd with their pace and skill. It was exciting to watch and that’s been missing at AG for too long.

Elliasson and CoD are both capable of producing that kind of attacking play but we rarely see it - is that because the shackles are on?

[exAtyeoMax]

4 minutes ago, Robbored said:

I’ve only read your earlier post Spudski that Dave referred to and it’s well considered as usual.

However my take is slightly different in as much that I often feel that the players are performing with shackles on. Now to me that can only be because they’re trying to replicate LJs instructions and it frequently doesn’t materialise.

I struggle to recall seeing any City player running at the opposition as Murray or Walsh used to.Theres little or no flair and that lack of flair can contribute to a poor atmosphere.

Most of can remember Walsh, Smudger, Murray thrilling the crowd with their pace and skill. It was exciting to watch and that’s been missing at AG for too long.

Elliasson and CoD are both capable of producing that kind of attacking play but we rarely see it - is that because the shackles are on?

Jack Hunt has mentioned the term 'shackled' on several occasions ("being unshackled", especially after a win), this has been discussed on here on many occasions by myself, @spudski and others…

[Robbored]

8 minutes ago, exAtyeoMax said:

Jack Hunt has mentioned the term 'shackled' on several occasions ("being unshackled", especially after a win), this has been discussed on here on many occasions by myself, @spudski and others…

It’s not just me then Max and now that you mentioned it I do remember Hunt using the term ‘unshackled’ in a post match interview.

Surely if the players feel shackled and restricted then LJ and his assistants should also know.............

It'll be interesting to see with how much freedom City play against Fulham on Saturday especially as its live on Sky.

[spudski]

1 hour ago, Robbored said:

I’ve only read your earlier post Spudski that Dave referred to and it’s well considered as usual.

However my take is slightly different in as much that I often feel that the players are performing with shackles on. Now to me that can only be because they’re trying to replicate LJs instructions and it frequently doesn’t materialise.

I struggle to recall seeing any City player running at the opposition as Murray or Walsh used to.Theres little or no flair and that lack of flair can contribute to a poor atmosphere.

Most of can remember Walsh, Smudger, Murray thrilling the crowd with their pace and skill. It was exciting to watch and that’s been missing at AG for too long.

Elliasson and CoD are both capable of producing that kind of attacking play but we rarely see it - is that because the shackles are on?

 

1 hour ago, exAtyeoMax said:

Jack Hunt has mentioned the term 'shackled' on several occasions ("being unshackled", especially after a win), this has been discussed on here on many occasions by myself, @spudski and others…

Agreed...are the shackles down to fear of making a mistake, getting bollocked and dropped?

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, spudski said:

I agree Dave...but what I can't get my head around is why it's taking so long for players to understand different methods.

Take Eliasson as an example...we all know his qualities, but he's been here long enough now to know that he has to track back and cover the LB. Have you noticed how many teams now are pinpointing the area just behind DaSilva and overload players there. They know it's a weakness.

LJ made a comment about Nagy in a recent game saying how well he did when he came on creating angles.

Isn't that what all our players should be doing naturally...it's a basic if football.

It crossed my mind that LJ had come across some magic formula where playing in straight lines and being static was now the way forward

Regardless of methods and tactics...when struggling to find form you revert to the basics and build from that.

Give and go, create angles, find space, come for the ball etc...basics. Our players don't even do that well. And we know they can, because we've seen it before.

 

My gut instinct tells me certain players are not confident in their own ability and scared. We've even had that alluded to from LJ. 

 

1 hour ago, Robbored said:

I’ve only read your earlier post Spudski that Dave referred to and it’s well considered as usual.

However my take is slightly different in as much that I often feel that the players are performing with shackles on. Now to me that can only be because they’re trying to replicate LJs instructions and it frequently doesn’t materialise.

I struggle to recall seeing any City player running at the opposition as Murray or Walsh used to.Theres little or no flair and that lack of flair can contribute to a poor atmosphere.

Most of can remember Walsh, Smudger, Murray thrilling the crowd with their pace and skill. It was exciting to watch and that’s been missing at AG for too long.

Elliasson and CoD are both capable of producing that kind of attacking play but we rarely see it - is that because the shackles are on?

Pretty much my thoughts too, obviously neither of us know because we aren't at Failand.

But From watching games our players look like they are being restrained, e.g. when the ball is in position x, you must be in position y, ignoring that the opposition player has closed that angle. All of their natural instincts (some ingrained from training admittedly) are removed, it is this naturalness that made them the players they got to this level, yet it feels like we want them to do something rigid. When an opposing team counters this we have no other solution.

Weve heard Lee say about solving their own problems, perhaps not allow the problem to occur in the first place by allowing freedom within the system.  

[RedEyez]

13 hours ago, Redpool said:

One of the worst players in recent history and was absolutely criminal to be a given a new contract. Robs a living.

I bet he's better than you though.

[exAtyeoMax]

8 minutes ago, spudski said:

 

Agreed...are the shackles down to fear of making a mistake, getting bollocked and dropped?

Probably all three… 

[Davefevs]

4 minutes ago, spudski said:

 

Agreed...are the shackles down to fear of making a mistake, getting bollocked and dropped?

The “shackles” are - here is what you must do in this situation!!

Eliasson videos from Sweden (not those sort of videos!!) showed him popping up in  different positions. For City, especially when playing RW, he hugs the line. He never swaps with the right sided CM to create space for example. His movement is just running up and down the line. When he gets the ball it’s a different story, he then becomes imaginative. But teams have worked out how to stop him getting the ball. And it is not always by doubling up (as many suggest), you just need the opposition LW / LM to close Hunts passing lane. 

[Xiled]

I'm afraid we have a first team coach who doesn't see the same game that many of us do. In his first two years I thought he read it very well and made good tactical changes and substutions (even though many people were asking why the team was never setup correctly at the start of the game).

Now we have a coaching team who don't seem to have any answers when it's not going for us. We either start well and hopefully hang-on for the remainder of the game or we struggle for the whole game.

Bentley has been "coached" to throw out to CBs who appear paralysed with fear. Nobody moves to receive a throw-in. Our set pieces are invariably wasted. Passes go to players rather than to space. We pass slowly and without confidence. The team appears more worried about making a mistake than creating a chance. Tomobola teams selections have never worked for any consistently progressing team.

And then we're told by LJ that the performance against Millwall was outstanding. He can't stop using the word 'identity' despite the fact that nobody has any idea what that is even when we win. And now O'Dowda is trotting out the same drivel.

I'm sorry, I don't buy it. I want us to win every match but we've all invested enough time now and it's abundantly clear that LJ, DH and JMcA peaked a long while ago. The trend is downwards and the answers are no longer from within. By all means be pleased with seventh in the table but I'm sure we'll be lower by May. This season has been a wasted opportunity.

[spudski]

29 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

The “shackles” are - here is what you must do in this situation!!

Eliasson videos from Sweden (not those sort of videos!!) showed him popping up in  different positions. For City, especially when playing RW, he hugs the line. He never swaps with the right sided CM to create space for example. His movement is just running up and down the line. When he gets the ball it’s a different story, he then becomes imaginative. But teams have worked out how to stop him getting the ball. And it is not always by doubling up (as many suggest), you just need the opposition LW / LM to close Hunts passing lane. 

Exactly Dave...both your posts are how I think as well.

It's far too rigid. You move according to what the opposition are doing...not regardless of what they are doing.

Sometimes we take up positions that are non sensical. It's like ' I have to be in this position' regardless of it being occupied by defenders. 

The natural angles and spaces are missed because of it.

[Jerseybean]

Based on this JM is a much better and more honest communicator than LJ.

[mozo]

3 hours ago, spudski said:

 

Give and go, create angles, find space, come for the ball etc...basics. Our players don't even do that well. And we know they can, because we've seen it before.

 

This is a sentence I ponder whenever our players look rubbish. They're good players. This is a strong squad. But you'd be forgiven for thinking otherwise.

Nagy, Palmer and Massengo not getting in the team should be a sign of our strength in depth, but it feels more natural to characterise it as a failure of recruitment.

[ExiledAjax]

4 hours ago, spudski said:

And we know they can, because we've seen it before.

And this is why I still have a glimmer of hope that the Johnson experiment may work out. It's a faint flicker right now but it's enough to stop me becoming a fully paid up member of the Johnson out team.

We may be static, rigid, shot-shy, defensively iffy, over-reliant on our goalkeeper, unimaginative and dull...but we've seen under Johnson that we can be the opposite of all that. We can be dynamic, unpredictable, slick, incisive and decisive...and it wasn't even that long ago that we still saw flashes of that late 2017 team.

 

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, spudski said:

Exactly Dave...both your posts are how I think as well.

It's far too rigid. You move according to what the opposition are doing...not regardless of what they are doing.

Sometimes we take up positions that are non sensical. It's like ' I have to be in this position' regardless of it being occupied by defenders. 

The natural angles and spaces are missed because of it.

In some cases that might be lack of football intelligence but it seems more widespread than just one or two players, hence why I think it’s rigidity. 

[ExiledAjax]

2 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

In some cases that might be lack of football intelligence but it seems more widespread than just one or two players, hence why I think it’s rigidity. 

It demonstrates the same kind of thinking that is shown so clearly by our lack of long shots. We've clearly got players capable of hitting the target from 30 yards - every Championship team has. But we never try it. It has to be a diktat from the coaches "don't shoot from range".  Johnson has spoken before about having players he trusts and players who can make their own decisions - the "self-coaching" he mentions. If it was just Massengo who never shot form range then fine  -you say that's his style, maybe he doesn't have that confidence yet or doesn't yet have the "footballing intelligence" to know that sometimes just belting it a t a dodgy keeper is the best thing you can do.

Thing is it's not just Massengo - no one hits them from range. Even Brownhill rarely did it (blinding winner at Cardiff aside) and he was decent at it - and took the central free kicks when we got them. It's pretty clear that Johnson is simultaneously asking players to think for themselves and also dictating certain situations. How confusing must that be for a player? Surely you should trust a Championship footballer with half a dozen season's experience to know when to shoot from 30 yards, when to try the through ball, or when to square it wide for a cross. That decision should, and in many ways can only, be made in the heat of the moment. To try and create a hard and fast rule seems counter-productive. It doesn't mean you're creating an "identity" or a "system" it means you're creating a pattern. Patterns are predictable, patterns are easy to identify and simple to counter.

[mozo]

40 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

And this is why I still have a glimmer of hope that the Johnson experiment may work out. It's a faint flicker right now but it's enough to stop me becoming a fully paid up member of the Johnson out team.

We may be static, rigid, shot-shy, defensively iffy, over-reliant on our goalkeeper, unimaginative and dull...but we've seen under Johnson that we can be the opposite of all that. We can be dynamic, unpredictable, slick, incisive and decisive...and it wasn't even that long ago that we still saw flashes of that late 2017 team.

 

Great post. And what a goal. That's how good these same players can be!

[bcfc01]

1 hour ago, ExiledAjax said:

And this is why I still have a glimmer of hope that the Johnson experiment may work out. It's a faint flicker right now but it's enough to stop me becoming a fully paid up member of the Johnson out team.

We may be static, rigid, shot-shy, defensively iffy, over-reliant on our goalkeeper, unimaginative and dull...but we've seen under Johnson that we can be the opposite of all that. We can be dynamic, unpredictable, slick, incisive and decisive...and it wasn't even that long ago that we still saw flashes of that late 2017 team.

 

LJ needs to play these sort of clips to the players to remind them of how they can beat anyone on their day.

What a difference to what we've seen lately.

Saw a small indication of a revival last saturday - hope its built on against Fulham.

[mozo]

Well done Gregor for asking the right questions, and, seemed to me, getting Macca on the back foot.

Comments early on from Callum that we need to do "whatever it takes" and "attacking mentality" suggest that we should see something more positive than the recent trend of sitting back.

Macca mentioned "front foot" and "steal the ball" which suggests to me that we won't drop and defend deep like vs Derby, Leeds and WBA, but will close down from the front and break in numbers. 

Suggests to me that Weimann, Wells and Paterson will start.

[ExiledAjax]

1 hour ago, mozo said:

Great post. And what a goal. That's how good these same players can be!

 

1 hour ago, bcfc01 said:

LJ needs to play these sort of clips to the players to remind them of how they can beat anyone on their day.

What a difference to what we've seen lately.

Saw a small indication of a revival last saturday - hope its built on against Fulham.

The Fulham clip is just one clip from that time. Let's not pretend that we were playing like that in every minute of every game - far from it. Many of the issues currently being discussed were already evident. But yeh, it shows that decent football is possible with these players and this coaching team.

[spudski]

2 hours ago, Davefevs said:

In some cases that might be lack of football intelligence but it seems more widespread than just one or two players, hence why I think it’s rigidity. 

Agreed.

[Roe]

25 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

 

The Fulham clip is just one clip from that time. Let's not pretend that we were playing like that in every minute of every game - far from it. Many of the issues currently being discussed were already evident. But yeh, it shows that decent football is possible with these players and this coaching team.

Also worth noting that the ball could've (and most of the time, would have) been lost at a number of different times during that move.

It worked brilliantly for that goal, but on the whole our passing and movement on the ball has needed improvement all season.

[ExiledAjax]

12 minutes ago, Roe said:

Also worth noting that the ball could've (and most of the time, would have) been lost at a number of different times during that move.

It worked brilliantly for that goal, but on the whole our passing and movement on the ball has needed improvement all season.

Agree completely. Just an example of the luck we've been having all season.

[Davefevs]

2 hours ago, mozo said:

Well done Gregor for asking the right questions, and, seemed to me, getting Macca on the back foot.

Comments early on from Callum that we need to do "whatever it takes" and "attacking mentality" suggest that we should see something more positive than the recent trend of sitting back.

Macca mentioned "front foot" and "steal the ball" which suggests to me that we won't drop and defend deep like vs Derby, Leeds and WBA, but will close down from the front and break in numbers. 

Suggests to me that Weimann, Wells and Paterson will start.

The game at Craven Cottage wasn’t a high press, but a co-ordinated press when their back 4 played it into midfield.  Diedhiou and Weimann were happy to let the CBs have it (unless they took a heavy touch and there was a chance to nip it away).  But once the ball went into Cairney etc, we condensed the space well, and our CBs refused to get dragged deep when Cavaliero did get through early on.

Whether the same tactic is the right approach this Saturday, I don’t know, will depend on both line-ups.

[Davefevs]

20 hours ago, spudski said:

Love Jamie Mac interviews...so easy to read. I reckon he's half Italian

Anyone who's studied body language will understand. Completely relaxed and comfortable when using hand gestures...not so much when scratching nose, ear, head after commenting. Compelling stuff

Only just got round to watching Macca’s....he can be really dour, but I think he was pretty relaxed in this one.

20 hours ago, spudski said:

Love Jamie Mac interviews...so easy to read. I reckon he's half Italian

Anyone who's studied body language will understand. Completely relaxed and comfortable when using hand gestures...not so much when scratching nose, ear, head after commenting. Compelling stuff

Only just got round to watching Macca’s....he can be really dour, but I think he was pretty relaxed in this one.

20 hours ago, spudski said:

Love Jamie Mac interviews...so easy to read. I reckon he's half Italian

Anyone who's studied body language will understand. Completely relaxed and comfortable when using hand gestures...not so much when scratching nose, ear, head after commenting. Compelling stuff

Only just got round to watching Macca’s....he can be really dour, but I think he was pretty relaxed in this one.

[mozo]

42 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

The game at Craven Cottage wasn’t a high press, but a co-ordinated press when their back 4 played it into midfield.  Diedhiou and Weimann were happy to let the CBs have it (unless they took a heavy touch and there was a chance to nip it away).  But once the ball went into Cairney etc, we condensed the space well, and our CBs refused to get dragged deep when Cavaliero did get through early on.

Whether the same tactic is the right approach this Saturday, I don’t know, will depend on both line-ups.

I think you're right. Macca mentioned Fulham's possession game which suggests that we expect to not have the ball a lot but to break, perhaps a la Derby but hopefully not with that scary 20 minutes at the end.