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The Coronavirus and its impact on sport/Fans Return (Merged)


Loderingo

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2 hours ago, wood_red said:

A genuine question to you, what should the Government have done or be doing and at what timelines? It seems every post is just a "have a go at the Government", when they are pretty much in a lose lose situation. The situation is changing by the hour so how can they foresee everything? They are basically following what advice the Scientists and experts are advising them to do - they do that and people will have a go, if they don't do that people will have a go.

Maybe we should have just shut the borders 2 months ago, stopped everyone outside the UK coming in which would massively have helped wouldn't it? Everyone would then be moaning that it was over the top and not feasible. It is a crazy situation that will never please everyone with whatever decisions are made.

I’m no expert but I’d simply want them to learn from the countries 5/6 weeks ahead of us.

We had a chance to act earlier, ahead of the curve, yet our experts and government wasted at least 2 weeks on a policy they’ve now totally u-turned on, despite being able to see what was happening elsewhere in the world.

So going back to the failed ‘herd immunity’ disaster policy; the experts said they expected 60% of the country to get the virus with this method, and we know the death rate is around 1% - so basically the experts and government thought it was acceptable to sacrifice up to 400,000 people?

400,000. Fine, still may only be 1% - but you probably won’t say that if you or one of your loved ones are one of the 400,000.

Not a political comment, just simple maths. Unprecedented times, yes, have other countries got it wrong, yes. But there were lessons learned already from other countries so we could at least try and avoid the same mistakes.
 

 

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7 minutes ago, wendyredredrobin said:

1%?  Have you seen the mortality rate in Italy?  Number of deaths is over 8% of number of cases.

On that basis your 400k would equate to 3.2 million.

Not saying we would be as bad, but 3%+ is not unrealistic.

Don't they have the oldest population though?

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44 minutes ago, Dr Balls said:

Sorry but I think you can expect this to continue into next year. Hence my pessimism about any of us seeing a live football game before 2021.

I am just waiting for the IOC to bow to the inevitable that the Tokyo olympics will need to be postponed by at least a year.

 

No new cases reported yesterday in Wuhan and Hubei Province. My one hope is that that fact indicates that perhaps the gloomy general predictions might, just might, be too gloomy.

??

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1 minute ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

No new cases reported yesterday in Wuhan and Hubei Province. My one hope is that that fact indicates that perhaps the gloomy general predictions might, just might, be too gloomy.

??

Only if you place the whole country on lock down for at least 6 weeks. No evidence Boris is willing to do that.

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47 minutes ago, Dr Balls said:

Sorry but I think you can expect this to continue into next year. Hence my pessimism about any of us seeing a live football game before 2021.

I am just waiting for the IOC to bow to the inevitable that the Tokyo olympics will need to be postponed by at least a year.

It seems incredulous that the IOC would think a summer games in Tokyo is viable.

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11 minutes ago, wendyredredrobin said:

1%?  Have you seen the mortality rate in Italy?  Number of deaths is over 8% of number of cases.

On that basis your 400k would equate to 3.2 million.

Not saying we would be as bad, but 3%+ is not unrealistic.

Yes who knows what the exact figures are.

That % may be less than you suggest, given rough predictions that 10’s if not 100’s of thousands of people will have it, not show symptoms, or have mild ones, self isolate and therefore never be recorded as one of the statistics.

Awful to think that we won’t have a true reflection of the figures, because the world’s governments weren’t able, prepared or worse willing to, test everyone.

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4 minutes ago, Alessandro said:

I’m no expert but I’d simply want them to learn from the countries 5/6 weeks ahead of us.

We had a chance to act earlier, ahead of the curve, yet our experts and government wasted at least 2 weeks on a policy they’ve now totally u-turned on, despite being able to see what was happening elsewhere in the world.

So going back to the failed ‘herd immunity’ disaster policy; the experts said they expected 60% of the country to get the virus with this method, and we know the death rate is around 1% - so basically the experts and government thought it was acceptable to sacrifice up to 400,000 people?

400,000. Fine, still may only be 1% - but you probably won’t say that if you or one of your loved ones are one of the 400,000.

Not a political comment, just simple maths. Unprecedented times, yes, have other countries got it wrong, yes. But there were lessons learned already from other countries so we could at least try and avoid the same mistakes.
 

 

I'm no expert either but I think the government has it spot on.

Current estimates of those with/had the virus is 35,000 (we don't know the exact numbers, same for most countries) with 103 deaths. Currently way under 1% mortality rate. 

Government expectation is 20k - 50k with possibly closer to/under 20k if everyone follows the advice given (which they won't). 

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10 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

No new cases reported yesterday in Wuhan and Hubei Province. My one hope is that that fact indicates that perhaps the gloomy general predictions might, just might, be too gloomy.

??

Lets hope RR

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2 hours ago, E.G.Red said:

I was in ASDA this morning buying a newspaper. Clear signs saying max of 3 of any one item. A women puts 12 cans of potatoes in her trolley,  I told her limit was 3 of any item but she just ignored me and carried on adding another 4 cans. Everyone was looking at her and her partner/husband was looking slightly embarrassed.  Great when she got to the till and they would only sell her the 3 tins. 

I hope they made her put them back.

It is attitudes like this that will see a lockdown enforced.  If everyone is sensible then sensible measures can be deployed.  But a few idiots spoil it.

 

As for FA announcement, imho spot on.  As long as clubs can be supported, then no rush to complete season.

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16 minutes ago, One Team In Keynsham said:

It seems incredulous that the IOC would think a summer games in Tokyo is viable.

They seem to care more about the money they've spent preparing the country and the financial impact rather than the health impacts.

Yeah you can argue that athletes have trained for years for this moment also being a case for this to go ahead, but in wonder how many of them want to risk their health, or compete in empty venues. 

Why this wasnt postponed / cancelled whilst there are bigger more important things to focus on says a lot about the IOC.

Edited by Loco Rojo
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This is reminiscent of a match day thread..... critical analyses of the governments actions won't provide any meaningful data and conclusions until after the event.  Maybe we'll turn out to have the best figures, maybe the worst,  None of us know, I have no doubt there would be flack the other way if JC and Labour were running the show, but they'd still (I hope) be following their medical officers advice.

A bit of common sense with the information we already know and is becoming available hour by hour would help, I also think some more communication from the government wouldn't go amiss, but they do have to be guarded, as some people don't handle information well - especially if its not what they want to hear.

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2 minutes ago, Maesknoll Red said:

This is reminiscent of a match day thread..... critical analyses of the governments actions won't provide any meaningful data and conclusions until after the event.  Maybe we'll turn out to have the best figures, maybe the worst,  None of us know, I have no doubt there would be flack the other way if JC and Labour were running the show, but they'd still (I hope) be following their medical officers advice.

A bit of common sense with the information we already know and is becoming available hour by hour would help, I also think some more communication from the government wouldn't go amiss, but they do have to be guarded, as some people don't handle information well - especially if its not what they want to hear.

JOHNSON OUT!

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9 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

I'm no expert either but I think the government has it spot on.

Current estimates of those with/had the virus is 35,000 (we don't know the exact numbers, same for most countries) with 103 deaths. Currently way under 1% mortality rate. 

Government expectation is 20k - 50k with possibly closer to/under 20k if everyone follows the advice given (which they won't). 

Personally don’t think they got it ‘spot on’ given the policy U-turn and the contradicting advice at times. But happy to agree to disagree.

I guess only time will tell when the dust settles - but I’ll be astonished, and you can hopefully refer back to this and gladly tell me I was wrong, if the death toll at the end of this is only 200 in the UK. 
 

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2 minutes ago, Loco Rojo said:

They seem to care more about the money they've spent preparing the country and the financial impact rather than the health impacts.

Yeah you can argue that athletes have trained for years for this moment also being an argument for this to go ahead, but in wonder how many of them want to risk their health, or compete in empty venues. 

Why this wasnt postponed / cancelled whilst there are bigger more important things to focus on says a lot about the IOC.

To me that would be a hollow argument when weighed against the obvious risk of sending thousands of athletes, officials, and support staff from across the globe to mingle in 1 confined area. (and not saying for one moment that that is your view Loco)

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17 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

I'm no expert either but I think the government has it spot on.

Current estimates of those with/had the virus is 35,000 (we don't know the exact numbers, same for most countries) with 103 deaths. Currently way under 1% mortality rate. 

Government expectation is 20k - 50k with possibly closer to/under 20k if everyone follows the advice given (which they won't). 

Literally nobody is estimating that 35,000 have had the virus as far as I can see. Where you getting that from?  Seems like an incredibly low number 

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7 minutes ago, Alessandro said:

Personally don’t think they got it ‘spot on’ given the policy U-turn and the contradicting advice at times. But happy to agree to disagree.

I guess only time will tell when the dust settles - but I’ll be astonished, and you can hopefully refer back to this and gladly tell me I was wrong, if the death toll at the end of this is only 200 in the UK. 
 

I'll have forgotten about this exchange by then.

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4 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

Literally nobody is estimating that 35,000 have had the virus as far as I can see. Where you getting that from?  Seems like an incredibly low number 

Literally loads.

I didn't say 35k have had the virus.

I said its been estimated that between 20k - 50k have had/have the virus.

That figure was quoted by the CMO and I've heard similar on the radio from others yesterday and today.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51917562

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26 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I hope they made her put them back.

It is attitudes like this that will see a lockdown enforced.  If everyone is sensible then sensible measures can be deployed.  But a few idiots spoil it.

 

As for FA announcement, imho spot on.  As long as clubs can be supported, then no rush to complete season.

I don’t know about Asda but she would have been refused. The check out (if like the one I am aware of ) would flash up a message saying the maximum amount of an item had already been scanned, just like it does when you have to check for age or alcohol or knives etc. That’s if the till operator didn’t notice first. The cashier would then remove all the extra items to be put back on the shelves.

Of course the person *could* go and try to buy them again, but mostly they are shamed and don’t bother. The worse kind are the organised gangs type of shoppers, get friends and family members to each do separate transactions, not a lot the shops can do about that, but it’s happening lots.

The worse thing I saw this morning was two transit type vans who had obviously been into the supermarket nearby and purchased what they could in bulk and set up 100 yards away on the roadside selling it. 

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Radical idea for 20/21 season if it wouldn't start until November/December, you split each division in half top half only play top half, bottom half only play bottom half and essentially become 2 leagues, top half playing for places 1-12, bottom half playing for places 13-24, no doubt you'd get threats of lawsuits from teams in bottom half for no chance of promotion but this way you'd only need to play 22 league games. Prem teams would only need to play 18 so still space for European fixtures as you know those will make it in.

Alternatively you shift to a calendar year season, someone suggested mid summer games be played as late kick offs so you don't have to play in potentially 30 degree heat, you'd only need to move it to 4 or 5 o'clock, police would probably hate it for day drinking so try and get kick offs moved to 12.

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3 minutes ago, RedM said:

Of course the person *could* go and try to buy them again, but mostly they are shamed and don’t bother.

Depending on the item, walk out, walk back in for same item go to different till/self service and its hard to monitor surely, not advocating btw just stating hard to keep track

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13 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

Literally loads.

I didn't say 35k have had the virus.

I said its been estimated that between 20k - 50k have had/have the virus.

That figure was quoted by the CMO and I've heard similar on the radio from others yesterday and today.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51917562

But they're only guessing, because they've never had a proper grip on the situation.

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5 minutes ago, hodge said:

Depending on the item, walk out, walk back in for same item go to different till/self service and its hard to monitor surely, not advocating btw just stating hard to keep track

It is very hard to keep track, and yes people will find loop holes if they are desperate/determined enough. I know some shops try to keep the items off sale to allow just enough time for the person to leave the store, and hopefully someone else will grab the item before they return.

It’s all a game, just not a fun one. 

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3 minutes ago, Roger Red Hat said:

But they're only guessing, because they've never had a proper grip on the situation.

Estimation based on knowledge rather than a guess I would say - a guesstimate maybe.

As soon as they can roll out the testing to find out who has had the virus we'll have a better grip on it.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

Estimation based on knowledge rather than a guess I would say - a guesstimate maybe.

As soon as they can roll out the testing to find out who has had the virus we'll have a better grip on it.

 

 

Seems a naively low figure to me.  To say 0.08% of the population has had it when I personally know 4 people that have had it and a fair few celebs have had it doesn’t seem right. 

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