The Coronavirus and its impact on sport/Fans Return (Merged)

[Bris Red]

21 minutes ago, Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan said:

This is a certainty.

How much worse it gets largely depends on us. Other countries have shown how strict social distancing measures can reduce and even eliminate the number of new cases. In Britain, for now, we still have d1ckheads sitting in the pub or going on stag/hen dos and then taking everyone else’s germs home to their families. 

Our government HAS to be stronger. Its all well and good saying its the general publics fault but there are millions of absolute idiots in society that cannot and will not follow basic instructions, there really is no point in whinging about it we have to start locking things down now IMO and stop giving people the opportunity/option to sit in a pub or go on a hen do. 

[italian dave]

50 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Sadly, a good example of that.

 

And an even worse example just now on Sky News Mr Wetherspoon, Tim Martin, defending keeping his pubs open , claiming no-one has caught the virus in one of his pubs, intends to keep them open throughout, what a complete and utter moron. 

And, on the ‘bringing politics into it’ debate, I’ve been in two minds, but when you hear that Boris has refused to comment, despite the fact that it’s clearly encouraging people to ignore government advise, and we all know why he won’t criticise Mr Wetherspoon, well I’m beginning to feel he’s the one bringing politics into it. 

[Guest]

17 minutes ago, RedM said:

Another person I spoke to today, a real elderly gentleman said it was worse than the war at the moment as at least in the war you had your rations. A set amount each week and could trade with eachother. Now it just seems like it’s Everyman for himself and people are just greedily grabbing and being selfish. Civilised society we are not.

I have been to numerous supermarkets and haven't seen a single toilet roll on a shelf for 5 days running, I certainly will not be the only one either. But then what happens is you have someone who does see some for the first time in a week or so, and they will just buy as much as they are allowed because "I haven't seen any for ages". Then you have the complete and utter pr1cks who are bulk buying to sell on and exploit the situation - they all should be named and shamed, and then slapped.

On another forum yesterday I read some woman buying the last lot of baby milk powder on the shelf, and was asked to put some back by another shopper, "Why should I, I can double my money on eBay" was the response. Disgusting.

[Mr Popodopolous]

4 hours ago, bcfc01 said:

There are some right nasty buggers about;

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/mar/20/scottish-hotel-sacks-12-staff-over-coronavirus-making-them-homeless

 

Agreed- however the job was likely to come to an end, temporary or otherwise as bookings would've fallen off a cliff. Hospitality is being/has been decimated.

Tied accommodation...surely there will be stories like this up and down the country, in various sectors or similar Layoffs due to no work...tied accommodation, perhaps a proportion of their pay goes on rent- very easy to see how it happens.

I don't pretend to know the answer, but god knows how many jobs will be frozen/lost in the coming weeks.

Edited March 20, 2020 by Mr Popodopolous

[underhanded]

I am certainly taking the current situation seriously, and and under no illusion that this crisis is a once in a lifetime situation that will see at least the following several months being new, extremely hard and ultimately testing times for us all. 

I do however, feel that certain posters on this thread do need to consider some of the things they are saying. Perhaps we have no responsbility to anyones mental health and wellbeing, but there are going to be plenty of people reading this forum who are very scared and anxious, and also see this as a place of comfort, where they've always gone to interact with others and feel some sense of belonging. To begin suggesting we are going to crumble into social disorder, and also suggesting life is going to change immeasurably as we know it for decades to come, when they don't really KNOW what the future holds, is venturing into the area of fear-mongering. 

Let's take this s**t seriously, but let's not turn a football forum into a place that will terrify many, based on worst-case hypothesis

Edited March 20, 2020 by underhanded

[downendcity]

1 hour ago, Fodbarmyarmy said:

Sky showing "experts" who say the govt "social distancing" plans could be for 12 months !.....imagine no large gatherings for 12mths...jeez

That's Weightwatchers b******d then

[LondonBristolian]

57 minutes ago, pillred said:

The bit about lasting for decades, and to a lesser extent the civil disobedience, and what makes me so certain, past experience of this sort of thing remember aids, sars, bird flu, mad cow disease, I could go on, all were going to decimate the world what happened? exactly there seems to be no limit to mans ingenuity a cure for this will be found there are already positive news coming from various places as far as vaccines are concerned, stop swallowing all the doomsday scenario stuff it doesn't help and just fuels more panic his post was sensationalist at best and as I said complete BO***cks at worst. 

With all the infections you list, luck was on our side.

AIDS only spreads via body fluids so could be contained by safe sex and care taken in medical procedures. It has not gone away though.

SARS was lethal but was detected early and was not as infectious as some other diseases so it could be contained.

Bird Flu was contained with a hell a lot of work.

Mad Cow Disease luckily did not infect as many as initially feared and changes to food practices stamped out the possibility of catching it.

This is less deadly (for most people) than some of those diseases but spreads a lot easier. And the reality is that a whole load of countries - including us - were way too complacent about the risk and failed to put the steps in place that would have kept us safe. (I'm not necessarily blaming the government for that btw - Someone else - I think @Harry - made the point earlier those steps would have been unpalatable at the time. The reality is all of us were way too complacent in our belief it could not and would not happen here.  SARS, AIDs, Bird flu and BSE are irrelevant in terms of past experience as this is so far beyond the scale of risk from those epidemics.

The reality is that a significant proportion of the country are now, if they follow official advice, trapped in their homes without social contact in order to avoid this infection. The whole events and tourism industry is on its knees and many other industries are likely to follow. People will lose businesses they have worked on for years and lose jobs. People are going to have their investments wiped out by the stock market. As it stands, people are struggling to find enough food in the shops to eat.

A vaccine is 14 months away, if that works. There have been medical trials for treatments but so far no cure - just as no cure has been found for AIDS, bird flu, SARS or vCJD - literally all the examples you mention - or indeed the common cold. A year carrying on as things are now will completely shift the fabric of the country and indeed the world. Barring a miracle, the consequences of this will be far reaching and long lasting. Doubtless some will go back to "normal". Others will have lost jobs, businesses, homes or loved ones and the economy is going to take a long time to pick up. @Maesknoll Redis simply stating the obvious in my view and it is terrifying that so many people still don't seem to realise we're already way past a point where things can easily return back to normal without consequences and we're only two weeks into an epidemic that will certainly last for three months and will likely last well into 2021 - IF we find a vaccine then. I note @underhanded's point about being responsible in what we say but I think we need to be honest that this is not something that will pass in three months and all will be fine. 

Edited March 20, 2020 by LondonBristolian

[Maesknoll Red]

30 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

That was sort of my thoughts on my first post on this thread. Huge numbers of companies wouldn't survive 6 months of this: not just your local Dog n' Duck, but national chains. Anyone not working in food retailing or medicine basically.

I'm interested in what the benefit claimant figures will be soon. It was 1.6m before this I think (from memory), but I can see it getting above 10m or more. And with a much smaller tax-base, you wonder where the cash for these benefits is coming from.

A prolonged virus lockdown will break entire national economies.

Maybe it IS time for the experts to factor this in and think if there is a way those of us who aren't over 70 or with underlying health issues can all live as normal while keeping strict isolation for those that are. It'll spread, we'll take our chances, but then it'll peak and eventually those isolating can emerge to a world that might look a bit similar.

It's clear from the large numbers who think they have the disease but haven't been tested (I know of three in Bristol alone) that the genie is out the bottle. Containment has failed. Providing it stays with the healthy and young(ish) population, the NHS may not have to be overwhelmed.

Is this mad? Thoughts?

It's along the line of what I have been saying, for the greater good, we will have to have some normality and accept that there will be some people infected because of this.  What good is saving a few lives if it causes huge suffering to the majority of the population?  That may sound harsh, but sometimes there has to be sacrifices made.  

I am of the same opinion, how can national economies possibly cope, there may be food in warehouses now, but if the world is locked down for an extended period, where will the new supplies come from?

[downendcity]

6 minutes ago, wood_red said:

I have been to numerous supermarkets and haven't seen a single toilet roll on a shelf for 5 days running, I certainly will not be the only one either. But then what happens is you have someone who does see some for the first time in a week or so, and they will just buy as much as they are allowed because "I haven't seen any for ages". Then you have the complete and utter pr1cks who are bulk buying to sell on and exploit the situation - they all should be named and shamed, and then slapped.

On another forum yesterday I read some woman buying the last lot of baby milk powder on the shelf, and was asked to put some back by another shopper, "Why should I, I can double my money on eBay" was the response. Disgusting.

We have a farm shop 300 yds up the road and go in 2 or 3 times a week for veg we need day to day. I've never seen more than2 or 3 other people in there in the 6 years we've shopped there. 

The last 3 times we've visited the shop has been jam packed. The shop manager says the majority of shoppers have never been before and she can spot them because they are the ones using shopping baskets and often use 2.

She had one couple asking for 6 sacks of spuds - she pointed out that unless they had a family of 8, by the time they used the third sack the spuds would be rotten.

Some people need to take a good look at themselves with the way they are acting. 

[Super]

14 minutes ago, underhanded said:

I am certainly taking the current situation seriously, and and under no illusion that this crisis is a once in a lifetime situation that will see at least the following several months being new, extremely hard and ultimately testing times for us all. 

I do however, feel that certain posters on this thread do need to consider some of the things they are saying. Perhaps we have no responsbility to anyones mental health and wellbeing, but there are going to be plenty of people reading this forum who are very scared and anxious, and also see this as a place of comfort, where they've always gone to interact with others and feel some sense of belonging. To begin suggesting we are going to crumble into social disorder, and also suggesting life is going to change immeasurably as we know it for decades to come, when they don't really KNOW what the future holds, is venturing into the area of fear-mongering. 

Let's take this s**t seriously, but let's not turn a football forum into a place that will terrify many, based on worst-case hypothesis

Certainly the Press and Media aren't helping one bit. Every hour there seems to be an article from a random Scientist etc. 

[Ska Junkie]

22 minutes ago, wood_red said:

I have been to numerous supermarkets and haven't seen a single toilet roll on a shelf for 5 days running, I certainly will not be the only one either. But then what happens is you have someone who does see some for the first time in a week or so, and they will just buy as much as they are allowed because "I haven't seen any for ages". Then you have the complete and utter pr1cks who are bulk buying to sell on and exploit the situation - they all should be named and shamed, and then slapped.

On another forum yesterday I read some woman buying the last lot of baby milk powder on the shelf, and was asked to put some back by another shopper, "Why should I, I can double my money on eBay" was the response. Disgusting.

Just nipped to Asda in Longwell green woody. it was busy but certainly nowhere near yesterday's panic. The only aisles that were empty were the frozen food aisles. In and out in 15 minutes. 

The last bit of your post is truly shocking behaviour! 

Edited March 20, 2020 by Ska Junkie

[Maesknoll Red]

1 hour ago, downendcity said:

We have a farm shop 300 yds up the road and go in 2 or 3 times a week for veg we need day to day. I've never seen more than2 or 3 other people in there in the 6 years we've shopped there. 

The last 3 times we've visited the shop has been jam packed. The shop manager says the majority of shoppers have never been before and she can spot them because they are the ones using shopping baskets and often use 2.

She had one couple asking for 6 sacks of spuds - she pointed out that unless they had a family of 8, by the time they used the third sack the spuds would be rotten.

Some people need to take a good look at themselves with the way they are acting. 

Absolute c***s, I have nothing more in my fridge than usual.  I saw someone with loads of stuff in a trolley last week and unless they owned a large B&B, I have no idea how they would eat it all before it went rotten - and by the size of them, a few smaller portions wouldn't do their survival chances any harm either.....

[Ronnie Sinclair]

39 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

That was sort of my thoughts on my first post on this thread. Huge numbers of companies wouldn't survive 6 months of this: not just your local Dog n' Duck, but national chains. Anyone not working in food retailing or medicine basically.

I'm interested in what the benefit claimant figures will be soon. It was 1.6m before this I think (from memory), but I can see it getting above 10m or more. And with a much smaller tax-base, you wonder where the cash for these benefits is coming from.

A prolonged virus lockdown will break entire national economies.

Maybe it IS time for the experts to factor this in and think if there is a way those of us who aren't over 70 or with underlying health issues can all live as normal while keeping strict isolation for those that are. It'll spread, we'll take our chances, but then it'll peak and eventually those isolating can emerge to a world that might look a bit similar.

It's clear from the large numbers who think they have the disease but haven't been tested (I know of three in Bristol alone) that the genie is out the bottle. Containment has failed. Providing it stays with the healthy and young(ish) population, the NHS may not have to be overwhelmed.

Is this mad? Thoughts?

This isn't mad in my view either - I was saying something similar to this to the in-laws last weekend.  Despite a history of health anxiety I'm not worried about contracting it myself but worry about the vulnerable.  Might sound draconian to effectively lock them up for months but if it saves lives the hit might have to be taken. 

[bcfc01]

1 minute ago, Ska Junkie said:

Just nipped to Asda in Longwell green woody. it was busy bit certainly nowhere near yesterday's panic. The only aisles that were empty were the frozen food aisles. In and out in 15 minutes. 

The last bit of your post is truly shocking behaviour! 

I was there about two hours ago and there was loads of stuff empty.

No chicken, no bog rolls, virtually no soaps or hand wash, hardly any cleaning stuff or washing powders etc.

They must have had a delivery, bad timing on my part.

[Ska Junkie]

2 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

I was there about two hours ago and there was loads of stuff empty.

No chicken, no bog rolls, virtually no soaps or hand wash, hardly any cleaning stuff or washing powders etc.

They must have had a delivery, bad timing on my part.

Must have 01, got back about 15 minutes ago. Just like a normal Saturday TBH, walked straight up to an empty till too. 

[Super]

Morrisons Fishponds had Bread earlier!

[Red-Robbo]

15 minutes ago, Maesknoll Red said:

It's along the line of what I have been saying, for the greater good, we will have to have some normality and accept that there will be some people infected because of this.  What good is saving a few lives if it causes huge suffering to the majority of the population?  That may sound harsh, but sometimes there has to be sacrifices made.  

I am of the same opinion, how can national economies possibly cope, there may be food in warehouses now, but if the world is locked down for an extended period, where will the new supplies come from?

Might be best avoiding the phrase "for the greater good" though...   

[Ronnie Sinclair]

Wife works in B&M in Brislington (the old Toys 'R' Us unit) - bog roll a plenty in there she said (she bought a couple of packets home, but they are required as now I'm working from home I have to do my toilet duties here and not using office 'resources').

As for panic buyers, is it too much to suggest giving supermarket security guards carte blanche to taser them, in the interests of public decency?

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, Ska Junkie said:

Just nipped to Asda in Longwell green woody. it was busy bit certainly nowhere near yesterday's panic. The only aisles that were empty were the frozen food aisles. In and out in 15 minutes. 

The last bit of your post is truly shocking behaviour! 

I have been there a couple of times and it's been the same empty shelves over the last week, I had to go over by Cribbs earlier to pick some stuff up for my job and came back through downend on the way back, as I had to go to Lloyds bank. Popped in the Sainsburys local and loads empty and mass queue to the the checkout, and the Co-Op had plenty of empty shelves as well. Speaking to someone who works up Staple Hill and they said Iceland had a queue all along the high street before opening this morning (unsure how much exaggeration that was as obviously never seen it myself).

On the plus side surely all of these going crazy will soon have too much stuff won't they and have no need to go again? I'm hoping anyway.

 

[Maesknoll Red]

3 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

Might be best avoiding the phrase "for the greater good" though...   

Sorry, over my head that one, you'll have to explain it.

 

I really should do some work..... 

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, Ronnie Sinclair said:

As for panic buyers, is it too much to suggest giving supermarket security guards carte blanche to taser them, in the interests of public decency?

If only, I would happily go and offer my services for free. Taser the muppets, and help out the vulnerable - and all for free.

[LondonBristolian]

21 minutes ago, Maesknoll Red said:

It's along the line of what I have been saying, for the greater good, we will have to have some normality and accept that there will be some people infected because of this.  What good is saving a few lives if it causes huge suffering to the majority of the population?  That may sound harsh, but sometimes there has to be sacrifices made.  

I am of the same opinion, how can national economies possibly cope, there may be food in warehouses now, but if the world is locked down for an extended period, where will the new supplies come from?

The problem is twofold:

1)  I am sceptical of how you can control infections in a way that the NHS is not overwhelmed. One firth of 20-44 year olds with the disease are being hospitalised and - whilst people who are otherwise healthy only have a mortality rate of something like 0.5% - 30 million cases with a mortality of 0.5 would see 150, 000 extra deaths - way more than we can cope with. Statistically you are a lot safer if you are under 70 with no underlying health conditions but millions of under-70s around the world without health conditions would still end up dead or hospitalised. So I just don't think @Red-Robbo's plan can possibly work.

2) It is easy to talk up a sacrifice you yourself don't expect to make but there are a lot of people with health conditions with jobs, families and young children and full-time jobs.  Locking me and various other people up for our own good obviously isn't very desirable but I honestly don't think it is possible without making a load of people unemployed, taking children away from vulnerable parents and locking parents up if they have children with asthma or other conditions where they may be affected (6% of cases in children are serious).

3) Many of the most vulnerable people have care or support workers and many others will end up in hospitals for non-coronavirus related reasons. Unless the plan is to lock up a group of doctors, nurses and care and support workers then people are still gong to get infected.

There is no doubt that this virus is not going to go away and we need to find a way to co-exist with the virus rather than shut down the economy. But what you, @Red-Robboand @Ronnie Sinclairare talking about is practically unenforceable and would still end up with around 150, 000 extra deaths of young, non-vulnerable patients, millions of ICU beds taken up by young, non-vulnerable patients, the NHS overwhelmed and a massive crisis, only with the added steps of children separated from parents and elderly and disabled people incarcerated in their own homes only to subsequently catch it in hospital.

I think people really need to move past the idea this is only really a problem for people over 70 and with underlying health conditions because the facts don't bear that out. It affects those groups more, for sure, but still will severely affect a lot of people who are not in those categories - way, way, way too many for the NHS to cope with. 

Edited March 20, 2020 by LondonBristolian

[Red-Robbo]

3 minutes ago, Maesknoll Red said:

Sorry, over my head that one, you'll have to explain it.

 

I really should do some work..... 

It's a still from Hot Fuzz. In the film a shadowy cabal of local worthies act as a vigilante hit squad removing "undesirables" from a West Country town while chanting the mantra "for the Greater Good",

[lenred]

53 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

That was sort of my thoughts on my first post on this thread. Huge numbers of companies wouldn't survive 6 months of this: not just your local Dog n' Duck, but national chains. Anyone not working in food retailing or medicine basically.

I'm interested in what the benefit claimant figures will be soon. It was 1.6m before this I think (from memory), but I can see it getting above 10m or more. And with a much smaller tax-base, you wonder where the cash for these benefits is coming from.

A prolonged virus lockdown will break entire national economies.

Maybe it IS time for the experts to factor this in and think if there is a way those of us who aren't over 70 or with underlying health issues can all live as normal while keeping strict isolation for those that are. It'll spread, we'll take our chances, but then it'll peak and eventually those isolating can emerge to a world that might look a bit similar.

It's clear from the large numbers who think they have the disease but haven't been tested (I know of three in Bristol alone) that the genie is out the bottle. Containment has failed. Providing it stays with the healthy and young(ish) population, the NHS may not have to be overwhelmed.

Is this mad? Thoughts?

Not at all and I think it will be being discussed as a very real possibility once more data becomes available. If the risk is deemed ‘acceptable’ - and I don’t want to get political on that point - it will happen I’d imagine. Just depends what the Tories deem acceptable.  

[Maesknoll Red]

2 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

It's a still from Hot Fuzz. In the film a shadowy cabal of local worthies act as a vigilante hit squad removing "undesirables" from a West Country town while chanting the mantra "for the Greater Good",

Ah, I don't watch filums so thats why.  Last one I saw was, under duress with a young lady, Bridget Jones Diary.  Maybe I'll have to get an interest in them if we get locked down.

[Northern Red]

9 minutes ago, Ronnie Sinclair said:

Wife works in B&M in Brislington (the old Toys 'R' Us unit) - bog roll a plenty in there she said (she bought a couple of packets home, but they are required as now I'm working from home I have to do my toilet duties here and not using office 'resources').

As for panic buyers, is it too much to suggest giving supermarket security guards carte blanche to taser them, in the interests of public decency?

Was in Home Bargains earlier and talking to the girl on the checkout who said the only things they were rationing were bog roll and pasta, and they'd had some left over from last night for the first time in 2 weeks. She said that on Monday evening they'd brought out 4 big trolleys of bog roll that were gone in half an hour, one didn't even make it from the stockroom to the shelf!

[pillred]

1 hour ago, Maesknoll Red said:

I don't think we'll know which way this is going for a while yet, but I really would like to see some end date and plan on getting back to normal and I'd accept that it might have consequences for a few.

You and me both.

[lenred]

36 minutes ago, underhanded said:

I am certainly taking the current situation seriously, and and under no illusion that this crisis is a once in a lifetime situation that will see at least the following several months being new, extremely hard and ultimately testing times for us all. 

I do however, feel that certain posters on this thread do need to consider some of the things they are saying. Perhaps we have no responsbility to anyones mental health and wellbeing, but there are going to be plenty of people reading this forum who are very scared and anxious, and also see this as a place of comfort, where they've always gone to interact with others and feel some sense of belonging. To begin suggesting we are going to crumble into social disorder, and also suggesting life is going to change immeasurably as we know it for decades to come, when they don't really KNOW what the future holds, is venturing into the area of fear-mongering. 

Let's take this s**t seriously, but let's not turn a football forum into a place that will terrify many, based on worst-case hypothesis

This forum has been the worst I have seen regards some of the scaremongering and doomsday scenarios being presented, across all the social media I engage with.  Very surprised tbh but each to their own! 

[lenred]

24 minutes ago, Ska Junkie said:

Just nipped to Asda in Longwell green woody. it was busy but certainly nowhere near yesterday's panic. The only aisles that were empty were the frozen food aisles. In and out in 15 minutes. 

The last bit of your post is truly shocking behaviour! 

People selling it for £100 a tin on the bay apparently. Scum. Pure and utter scum. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-51976075

Government did roll out a big loan facility and some strong, fairly unprecedented measures but more may yet be needed.