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The Coronavirus and its impact on sport/Fans Return (Merged)


Loderingo

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15 minutes ago, BS2 Red said:

It’s all very similar to when there’s a mass shooting in America and the likes of Fox News immediately jump to “now’s not the time to talk about gun control!”.

If the government is making mistakes, then now is exactly the time to point it out and hold them to account.

I’ve seen a lot of people on various sites posting that Boris is doing a good job. It’s perfectly reasonable to point out that he’s also made a lot of mistakes. The biggest of which was appointing and listening to a monster like Cummings.

Yeah and to he fair to Johnson, I doubt he makes many decisions. 

If the rumours are true about callous Cummings battling with scientific advice, then a serious review needs to be taken, as it could have cost us dearly. I also accept that we don't know if it is true...yet.

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2 hours ago, Olé said:

Well quite. I made the point on here more than a week ago so I'm not going to labour it, but this continues to baffle me to this day and will for the rest of my life if the country suffers badly this year or I lose friends or family to this disease.

As mentioned before there was literally historical precedent for being able to ground all flights across Europe at the drop of a hat, so why didn't we do so when we saw this developing - even from regions affected would have been a start.

People were flying in from Northern Italy and tweeting their free passage through UK airports unchecked when it was already out of control. Yet try flying into Heathrow from Lisbon if you're not white - they can do it if they want to. ?

I'm amazed the usual newspapers didn't make a fuss. A few dark people in a rubber dinghy off Dover and they all lose their shit, but 1000s of people flying in and out of the country from disease central and no one says a ******* thing. 

I can only guess the government was a) worried about financial hit to airlines, b) inconveniencing Brits skiing in Northern Italy and/or c) simply isn't up to the task of taking back control of borders, other than as a soundbite to win votes.

The double standards are astounding. The country has been consumed for years with the threat of foreigners and whipped into a frenzy to control the border. Given the first practical exercise to do so we do **** all and no one says a thing.

If they had been refugees arriving from Lombardy, this would have played out very differently...

Indeed, and such irony. The blonde blustering buffoon wanted to"get Brexit done" so as to have greater control over our borders. It's laughable if it wasn't such a serious blunder.

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1 hour ago, robin_unreliant said:

Absolutely but mums, dads and grandparents are always dying. Judgements about whether to spend money keeping them alive are taken every day. It's what the NHS has to do as the govt limits its resource so decisions have to be made.

We restrict some treatments so money is targeted to best effect but don't think that people aren't left to die routinely because it costs too much to extend their life. Working out how to deliver the best population health outcome from a set budget happens all the time. I just suspect what's happening now is totally out of step with the way this country has done it for many decades. If this is now the right way to do it let's remember that when it's over and we can't afford to finance the nhs again as the public finances have collapsed. 

Like i said at some point down the line decisions need to be made whether we want to view things emotionally or take a more calculated approach, at the moment it’s a bit of both so nobody’s happy 

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21 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

In terms of your first point, I would usually agree it was a reasonable point that we do not know if they actually have got it. However this is an unusual case as we know the illness is in high circulation and we know the Chief Science Advisor believes 55, 000 people were infected as of the middle of last week but we also know there are not sufficient testing kits and people with mild to moderate symptoms are not being tested. The government advice is that anyone with symptoms of a cough or fever should work from the assumption they do have COVID-19. An assumption is not to go on but, given it is impossible to actually test that assumption at this current time, it is not unreasonable to work from the premise that someone who thinks they have it probably does. We don’t know if people did get it there but, given the number of active cases and the possibility of transmission, we have to treat it as a real possibility. And it is not reasonable to expect proof of this when proof is impossible to acquire. And cases where proof is impossible to acquire, absence of proof should not indicate the infections did not happen. 

In terms of the second point, I think it is clear I am not explicitly saying that people definitely did acquire it there and spread it to communities but rather that there is a significant risk this might have happened.

That is my issue with these type of stories being reported on clickbait sites, you have found a story with 3 people on Twitter claiming they got it at the Cheltenham Festival (maybe they have, maybe they haven't). I, personally really don't see the point of posting that on here when it is so obvious those 3 people couldn't give a toss about the disease as they still attended, and because they couldn't give a toss how many other gatherings have they been to in the last couple of weeks?? You posted it up that it was factually correct they got it there, maybe you didn't mean it as that but that is exactly how I read it with the actual wording you used.

 

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4 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

Touching the same tennis balls so distance is irrelevant really. And one game was doubles!

Depends on their relationship to each other. If I went and played tennis with the wife, it’s not really any different to us staying in. Some housemates going to play tennis isn’t any extra risk. As long as they stay away from others of course!

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1 minute ago, BS2 Red said:

Depends on their relationship to each other. If I went and played tennis with the wife, it’s not really any different to us staying in. Some housemates going to play tennis isn’t any extra risk. As long as they stay away from others of course!

Going to be touching stuff there like the net etc. Virus can live for days.  Just stay in innit unless out for good 

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4 hours ago, daored said:

I agree , from my perspective we have a three month old baby who had open heart surgery at six weeks old. I’ve banned my partners parents from visiting, as they’ve continued to visit pubs and socialise and both work in schools as a caretaker and dinner lady. He hasn’t gone done well 

You’re doing the right thing, tough shit to anyone too thick to understand why we ALL need to take drastic measures.

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33 minutes ago, wood_red said:

That is my issue with these type of stories being reported on clickbait sites, you have found a story with 3 people on Twitter claiming they got it at the Cheltenham Festival (maybe they have, maybe they haven't). I, personally really don't see the point of posting that on here when it is so obvious those 3 people couldn't give a toss about the disease as they still attended, and because they couldn't give a toss how many other gatherings have they been to in the last couple of weeks?? You posted it up that it was factually correct they got it there, maybe you didn't mean it as that but that is exactly how I read it with the actual wording you used.

 

It was exactly who you read it because you chose to read it that way, not because of the wording I used. I did not state or even imply that in what I posted. You just chose to interpret it that way.

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17 hours ago, cityloyal473 said:

Nope. Try again. I'll help you out: a precedent is related to historical terms.  Two weeks is not historical. If City won on the 1st of March, drew on the 8th of March, won a midweek game on the 11th,  and lost on the 15th, what is the historical precedence?  I'll not stay up all night waiting for your answer. 

Respectfully, stop with the strawman. 

Fact is we had prior information on this and were slow to act, that's the point. 

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24 minutes ago, BS2 Red said:

 

I think people should stop caring about what’s briefed in the Times or Telegraph. It only serves to distract the public from the bigger picture which is Johnson’s inaction on closing down public spaces and the potential manslaughter of NHS staff from not being supplied with PPE. 

This happened under Theresa May with Grenfell and Windrush where the right-wind press found scapegoats or ways to frame the story in a different way. Although it’s tempting to pile into Cummings after this story everyone should to stop and think whether they're being manipulated. 
 

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8 minutes ago, Odysseus said:

I think people should stop caring about what’s briefed in the Times or Telegraph. It only serves to distract the public from the bigger picture which is Johnson’s inaction on closing down public spaces and the potential manslaughter of NHS staff from not being supplied with PPE. 

This happened under Theresa May with Grenfell and Windrush where the right-wind press found scapegoats or ways to frame the story in a different way. Although it’s tempting to pile into Cummings after this story everyone should to stop and think whether they're being manipulated. 
 

The very reason I posted the full article is because it’s just as critical of Johnson as it is of Cummings. It’s also from The Times, which lends enormous weight as they are not a lefty or anti-Tory paper.

The article does exactly what you request, it highlights Johnson’s failures and inactions with regards to closing public spaces.

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39 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

It was exactly who you read it because you chose to read it that way, not because of the wording I used. I did not state or even imply that in what I posted. You just chose to interpret it that way.

When you post a story about the Cheltenham Festival with 3 Twitter users claiming they got the virus there, and you start by saying in your own words "people who got it there" and then added "contract it there", I am unsure how I am meant to interpret it in any other way bar the fact you are saying they got it there!!!

You have now changed to "we don't know if they got it there". 

My initial response was replying to what you actually posted - it maybe worth reading your initial post and try and see how else I, or anyone else, was meant to interpret it.

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19 minutes ago, BS2 Red said:

The very reason I posted the full article is because it’s just as critical of Johnson as it is of Cummings. It’s also from The Times, which lends enormous weight as they are not a lefty or anti-Tory paper.

The article does exactly what you request, it highlights Johnson’s failures and inactions with regards to closing public spaces.

It’s a soft article that paints Johnson as being momentarily misled in testing circumstances but then pulling through with the help of his ministers and advisers. It even says Johnson was uncomfortable about the phrasing of herd immunity. It says little about the real crisis facing the government.

Getting the public fixated on “human drama” is what the Times does best. In this article Cummings comments are paraphrased and we don’t even know what he exactly said. That’s the purpose of lobby journalists. 
 

The government will do what it always does and blame everyone they possibly can before taking blame. They’re now getting ready to blame the public for this disaster and a lot of people here are helping them. 

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6 minutes ago, Odysseus said:

It’s a soft article that paints Johnson as being momentarily misled in testing circumstances but then pulling through with the help of his ministers and advisers. It even says Johnson was uncomfortable about the phrasing of herd immunity. It says little about the real crisis facing the government.

Getting the public fixated on “human drama” is what the Times does best. In this article Cummings comments are paraphrased and we don’t even know what he exactly said. That’s the purpose of lobby journalists. 
 

The government will do what it always does and blame everyone they possibly can before taking blame. They’re now getting ready to blame the public for this disaster and a lot of people here are helping them. 

We cannot have that can we.......

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12 minutes ago, wood_red said:

When you post a story about the Cheltenham Festival with 3 Twitter users claiming they got the virus there, and you start by saying in your own words "people who got it there" and then added "contract it there", I am unsure how I am meant to interpret it in any other way bar the fact you are saying they got it there!!!

You have now changed to "we don't know if they got it there". 

My initial response was replying to what you actually posted - it maybe worth reading your initial post and try and see how else I, or anyone else, was meant to interpret it.

 

You thought I meant one thing. I did not mean that thing and have explained that several times. Yet, rather than accept that you misinterpreted what I meant, you seem to be detemined to tell me you know what I meant better than I did and are taking snippets out of context to try to pretend I said and meant things I very, very clear did not from the context of the post.

If you read what I originally posted, it is very, very clear what I meant. Please stop erroneously telling me what I meant and please stop pretending you know what I meant better than I did. You interpreted what I meant differently to how I meant it. I'd be grateful if you would just accept that and stop trying to incorrectly pretend you know what I was really trying to say. It really is quite odd behaviour. 

2 minutes ago, Fordy62 said:

Christ I’m bored. For the first time ever just experimented with self raising flower in the Yorkshire’s. Rock and Roll we are. 

I'm so bored I'm hoping you post photos of the results!

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2 minutes ago, wood_red said:

We cannot have that can we.......

The Times can do what they like, there’s plenty of propaganda defending the government, that’s understandable. You believe in and support the government, that’s fine. My point is this soft lobby journalism manipulates people who ARE critical of the government into concentrating on largely unimportant gossip.

Fair enough if there’s a real whistleblower who wants to expose the government but with the same journos it’s often a minister trying to change the story or settle a personal dispute with an adviser like Cummings. 

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2 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Strawman. 

Pick the stupidest example and run with it to illustrate your point

It’s hardly a stupid example. The supermarkets are packed and people are panic buying things like toilet paper.

You’re guilty of the false fallacy fallacy. ;) 

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