SC&T Survey Results: Fans Call for Refunds

[fatchers]

I would rather take up the clubs offer of free to view matches (should the season resume,behind closed doors) than have a refund. I have renewed my season cards for next season and if that means viewing matches free on a device until it's safe to return to the ground then I personally would be happy with that also.

[Lanterne Rouge]

5 minutes ago, fatchers said:

I would rather take up the clubs offer of free to view matches (should the season resume,behind closed doors) than have a refund. I have renewed my season cards for next season and if that means viewing matches free on a device until it's safe to return to the ground then I personally would be happy with that also.

This would be my choice too although a refund has to be an option for those that need it (I suspect the club would have to offer one by law anyway as fans aren`t getting the service they have paid for - watching live football from your seat in Ashton Gate). 

[Rob k]

It’s Funny, if it was any other ‘business’ and we wouldn’t even be thinking of anything else other than a refund would we....

[Bar BS3]

8 minutes ago, The Humble Realist said:

Agree. 

It is very worrying for league one and two clubs in particular for who season tickets will be a massive proportion of their income.

Let's say tranmere as an example , normally they'd have a load of season ticket money in for next year about now. Instead they probably have ZERO and are looking at refunding 5 games worth of season ticket money for this year. Is worrying times 

This is why I simply can't understand any "supporter" - the genuine ones, who are season ticket holders - crying out for refunds for games remaining this season. 

Surely only a tiny percentage of those people actually need, what, £100?? Back, if it puts the very future of the club they support in jeapordy.? 

Next season is a different, far more complex issue, but surely a few quid being returned for this season is just being petty and likely very damaging. 

Would I/we like an extra £100 in our account..? Yeah. 

Do I/we NEED it to survive and get by..? Unlikely. 

I certainly don't want it, if it jeapordises my club. Its long since spent and gone. 

[Bar BS3]

3 minutes ago, Rob k said:

It’s Funny, if it was any other ‘business’ and we wouldn’t even be thinking of anything else other than a refund would we....

Like holiday companies..? Tried getting a refund for a holiday that been cancelled..?! 

[Lanterne Rouge]

The s*gs were bleating about the fact they should have a refund when Bury went bust IIRC...…………………….

[S25loyal]

2 hours ago, Dollymarie said:

The club have been aware of the survey results for some time and have decided not to comment. They’ve had the results for a while and have had time to respond. 

“Puts on super shocked face at the Bristol sport wall of silence”

[S25loyal]

3 hours ago, City Rocker said:

Agree, use of the furlough scheme is surely a good and positive thing to do, and hopefully protects the future job security of staff, particularly for a business that is already operating at a huge loss. Perhaps this point wasn't really understood at the time the survey was raised?

We have an owner who is worth an insane amount of money. 

I personally think any company who are owned by rich people shouldn’t be using tax payers money in order to save their own cash, regardless of its football or not.

[BasSavage88]

7 minutes ago, Bar BS3 said:

This is why I simply can't understand any "supporter" - the genuine ones, who are season ticket holders - crying out for refunds for games remaining this season. 

Surely only a tiny percentage of those people actually need, what, £100?? Back, if it puts the very future of the club they support in jeapordy.? 

Next season is a different, far more complex issue, but surely a few quid being returned for this season is just being petty and likely very damaging. 

Would I/we like an extra £100 in our account..? Yeah. 

Do I/we NEED it to survive and get by..? Unlikely. 

I certainly don't want it, if it jeapordises my club. Its long since spent and gone. 

It's probably because the club has gone through a change from local club to a business with the supporters now being seen as customers where they are more than happy to make changes and ****.over the supporters.

If I had a season ticket I would want my money back. I'm sure the billionaire at the top would survive 

[S25loyal]

9 minutes ago, Bar BS3 said:

Like holiday companies..? Tried getting a refund for a holiday that been cancelled..?! 

Yes multiple companies are offering refunds. 

[Bristol Rob]

3 minutes ago, S25loyal said:

“Puts on super shocked face at the Bristol sport wall of silence”

Hardly a wall of silence - although they could acknowledge receipt - but with so many questions still unanswered, it can't be unexpected that they haven't responded in detail.

I just find the message put out by SCAT a tad aggressive in nature and not one that really keeps with these uncertain times.

[cidercity1987]

Very misleading title also. 15% want a refund. 'Fans call for refunds'

[Bristol Rob]

10 minutes ago, cidercity1987 said:

Very misleading title also. 15% want a refund. 'Fans call for refunds'

They probably used a Daily Mail headline generator.

[Dolman Block B]

Personally im not bothered about a refund for the last 5 games of this season, and would not expect the club to offer this.

On the other hand i renewed for 2020/21 back when the early bird ticket sales were on and paid £418.00 in full.

Im not willing to lose this even if the club offered to wacth the games on Robins TV.

No chance at all, no interest at all watching on a computer screen.

[S25loyal]

5 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

Hardly a wall of silence - although they could acknowledge receipt - but with so many questions still unanswered, it can't be unexpected that they haven't responded in detail.

I just find the message put out by SCAT a tad aggressive in nature and not one that really keeps with these uncertain times.

It is though isn’t it,

The cock up regarding the refunds by mistake, then the two days it took to get a statement.

The club must clearly have an idea on what is going on, as above was said if it was a holiday, gym, childcare etc we would be getting refund but as we have some emotional attachment to football no one is.

Everyone is well within their rights to ask for a refund for the games missed, and possibly next season games too. 

There is far too much money in football, why should Derek from Hartcliffe who works 15 hours a day to provide for his family have to feel sorry that players on 20k a week are having to give up their wages for 3 months. 

[NickJ]

6 minutes ago, S25loyal said:

 

There is far too much money in football, why should Derek from Hartcliffe who works 15 hours a day to provide for his family have to feel sorry that players on 20k a week are having to give up their wages for 3 months. 

Can't like that enough, except that apparently it's just a small part, and deferred not given up.

[Bristol Rob]

6 minutes ago, S25loyal said:

It is though isn’t it,

The cock up regarding the refunds by mistake, then the two days it took to get a statement.

The club must clearly have an idea on what is going on, as above was said if it was a holiday, gym, childcare etc we would be getting refund but as we have some emotional attachment to football no one is.

Everyone is well within their rights to ask for a refund for the games missed, and possibly next season games too. 

There is far too much money in football, why should Derek from Hartcliffe who works 15 hours a day to provide for his family have to feel sorry that players on 20k a week are having to give up their wages for 3 months. 

No one is asking Derek to feel sorry for anyone.

As far as I know, the club haven't laid anyone off, they've taken advantage of a tax payer funded benefit that has been offered to tax payers, and players who have continued to work/train in isolation have deferred a percentage of their pay.

Derek doesn't come in to it.

[Chivs]

12 hours ago, Blagdon red said:

Just sent by e-mail to everyone on the SC&T database (around 8,000):

As you know, we recently carried out a survey on a small number of issues relating to the coranavirus crisis. I would now like to share with you the survey results.

Over 2,000 Bristol City supporters took part. One of the key findings was that as a result of changed financial circumstances at least 15% would now welcome a refund of their 2020/21 season card payment.

As you know, Bristol City put season cards on sale for next season some time ago, with a ‘Lose Your Seat Deadline’ of March 16th, one week prior to the March 23rd lockdown.

As a result, many of us paid out substantial sums, which, for example, for a family of four in the South Stand will have totaled nearly £1,000, at a time when the financial impact of the lockdown was not understood.

In our survey we asked you to respond to this statement: ‘Bristol City should offer supporters who have paid for a 20/21 season ticket and are now suffering financial hardship the option of a refund (with their seat reserved for them to buy up until 14 days before the start of the season, whenever that may be)’. 83.8% of respondents either ‘Agreed’ with it or ‘Strongly agreed’.

We then asked: ‘If the Football Club were to offer a refund of your season ticket in this way, would you want to take up the offer?’ The options for the answer were framed to discourage respondents from saying yes, but while 84.5% responded ‘No, personally I’m OK so wouldn’t need this help’, 15.5% answered ‘Yes, that would be a great help given my current situation’.

Commenting on this in a press release today, SC&T Vice Chair Miles Hendy said:

“The impact of the lockdown has hit many businesses and individuals hard, and professional football clubs like Bristol City are amongst the most deeply impacted. As a supporters’ group we want to stand up for our club, to rally behind it and to help it bounce back. As representatives of our supporters, we also stand by those fans who, for reasons outside their control, now have severe buyer’s regret, finding that the early commitment they made for their cherished seats at Ashton Gate has unexpectedly left them hardly able to get by.”

In the light of this survey response the Supporters Club & Trust has asked Bristol City to make a refund available to supporters in need. We have also asked for clarity on refunds for the season that should have just ended and where there is now no prospect of being able to watch these matches in the stadium.

Bristol City have not commented.

We call on them again now to please support your most loyal supporters in their time of need, like they have supported you.

Elsewhere in the survey, 83.3% of respondents either ‘Agreed’ or ‘Strongly agreed’ that ‘Bristol City / Ashton Gate Ltd should not take advantage of the taxpayer-funded government furlough scheme whilst higher paid executives and playing staff continue to receive their full salaries’. And 72.8% of respondents either ‘Agreed’ or ‘Strongly agreed’ that ‘Bristol City / Ashton Gate Ltd should continue to pay all casual / match day staff for the remaining games of the current season as though the games were played as scheduled’.

Subsequent to the survey Bristol City announced that they were using the furlough scheme, that staff not furloughed had accepted a temporary salary reduction and that players had deferred a percentage of their wages for three months.

The survey also asked for a view on which of a list of charities the Club & Trust should support at this time and based on the responses a decision was taken to support all four. Initial donations of £500 each have thus been made (in one case spread, at the organisation's request, over 10 months) to Refresh Bedminster, Feed the Homeless Bristol, Victoria Park Baptist Church Foodbank and the Trussel Trust.

Stay safe!

Regards,

Stu Rogers

Bristol City Supporters Club & Trust

I'm really confused by this post.  The vast majority (84%) of people (who responded) said that they didn't need a refund.  Just 15% said they would like a refund but you present it as "Fans call for refunds".

Just how low would the percentage have to be before you said "Fans do not call for refunds"?

 

This whole communication has "agenda" written all over it.

[Blagdon red]

3 minutes ago, Chivs said:

I'm really confused by this post.  The vast majority (84%) of people (who responded) said that they didn't need a refund.  Just 15% said they would like a refund but you present it as "Fans call for refunds".

Just how low would the percentage have to be before you said "Fans do not call for refunds"?

 

This whole communication has "agenda" written all over it.

As the opening post says, 83.8% of fans said that refunds should be offered.

Fortunately for the club, many would waive the right to take one. But it follows from the 83.8% that they still "call" for this to be offered for the benefit of those in greater financial hardship than them.

If we have an agenda for looking out for fans who now find themsleves in dire finanical straits, we make no apology for that.

[Bristol Rob]

13 minutes ago, Blagdon red said:

As the opening post says, 83.8% of fans said that refunds should be offered.

Fortunately for the club, many would waive the right to take one. But it follows from the 83.8% that they still "call" for this to be offered for the benefit of those in greater financial hardship than them.

If we have an agenda for looking out for fans who now find themsleves in dire finanical straits, we make no apology for that.

So a headline that says 'fans call for refunds for people who need them'  then.

Which, the club charter already caters for, on a case by case basis.

[Bar BS3]

1 hour ago, BasSavage88 said:

It's probably because the club has gone through a change from local club to a business with the supporters now being seen as customers where they are more than happy to make changes and ****.over the supporters.

If I had a season ticket I would want my money back. I'm sure the billionaire at the top would survive 

Football is a business. Alway has been in modern times. 

Our owner being a billionaire is irrelevant, in this instance. He put more than enough of his money in. 

For whatever readon, you don't even chip in by buying a season ticket. 

I know who I'm more thankful for having involved with the club. 

[Bar BS3]

1 hour ago, S25loyal said:

Yes multiple companies are offering refunds. 

The ones that haven't had to shell out costs or pre-invrst the monies paid..? 

[S25loyal]

3 minutes ago, Bar BS3 said:

The ones that haven't had to shell out costs or pre-invrst the monies paid..? 

What costs are you referring too? 

I had two holidays booked and have received refunds on both. 

[Bar BS3]

1 hour ago, S25loyal said:

We have an owner who is worth an insane amount of money. 

I personally think any company who are owned by rich people shouldn’t be using tax payers money in order to save their own cash, regardless of its football or not.

I disagree. 

I agree that companies who earn millions/billions of profit and have the funds in the bank. 

But those that lose money and are supported by someone with money, who make no profit from their backing, should certainly revcieve government help. 

People seem to forget the SL chooses to "throw away" hundreds of millions of ££ to ensure that WE have a sustainable club to support. 

You think that HE should also be footing the bill for having our income streams cut off..? 

[lenred]

6 minutes ago, Bar BS3 said:

The ones that haven't had to shell out costs or pre-invrst the monies paid..? 

Most businesses in entertainment would have up front costs. Most businesses full stop in fact.  If you’re happy not to receive a refund then that’s fantastic and good on you. But many people would appreciate that extra money back and I personally don’t see why a few on here seem to have such an issue with that. 

[Bar BS3]

5 minutes ago, S25loyal said:

What costs are you referring too? 

I had two holidays booked and have received refunds on both. 

I've not had any refund yet,  but then my departure date has not yet passed. 

But holiday companies won't have to pay the hotels and/or flights and so have the funds to reimburse. 

Concert organisers won't have to pay artists,  so can offer refunds, or rearrange. 

Football clubs have already invested season ticket incomes in building squads. The money has been spent and is no longer there to give back. 

[Bar BS3]

3 minutes ago, lenred said:

Most businesses in entertainment would have up front costs. Most businesses full stop in fact.  If you’re happy not to receive a refund then that’s fantastic and good on you. But many people would appreciate that extra money back and I personally don’t see why a few on here seem to have such an issue with that. 

I have an issue with it, because I'd like a club to go back to supporting when this is all over..! 

Not receiving a small refund will make very little/no difference to me,  having paid it out long ago. 

Refunding 15k people £100 each, when there is no income being generated,  could be crippling for our club and most others outside of the Premier league bubble. 

Where do you think the PL are so hell bent on an solution ASAP..? Because if clubs have to refund Sky and supporters, it eould/could be catastrophic, having already spent the money they've received. 

[lenred]

4 minutes ago, Bar BS3 said:

I have an issue with it, because I'd like a club to go back to supporting when this is all over..! 

Not receiving a small refund will make very little/no difference to me,  having paid it out long ago. 

Refunding 15k people £100 each, when there is no income being generated,  could be crippling for our club and most others outside of the Premier league bubble. 

Where do you think the PL are so hell bent on an solution ASAP..? Because if clubs have to refund Sky and supporters, it eould/could be catastrophic, having already spent the money they've received. 

Refunding those who request it will not jeopardise the club in any way at all.  If it does then we are in for one hell of a rocky ride with far far bigger costs to worry about. And I’m sure if the club came out and specifically said that we are in serious trouble then it would change some people’s minds on the matter.  
But as it stands it’s not the case, and many people will need the money far far more than the club. And those people should get a refund (and judging by the recent refund email many of us received its something the club are rightly looking at). 

[Bristol Rob]

4 minutes ago, lenred said:

Refunding those who request it will not jeopardise the club in any way at all.  If it does then we are in for one hell of a rocky ride with far far bigger costs to worry about. And I’m sure if the club came out and specifically said that we are in serious trouble then it would change some people’s minds on the matter.  
But as it stands it’s not the case, and many people will need the money far far more than the club. And those people should get a refund (and judging by the recent refund email many of us received its something the club are rightly looking at). 

Just to pull you up on a small technicality....

I don't imagine any supporter is living a lifestyle that leaves them with a 20mil+ defect a year. So you could well argue* that the club DO need it more.

(*Please don't argue, I wasn't being serious).

[Maesknoll Red]

3 hours ago, Abraham Romanovich said:

Sorry I can't agree with this ,we have a billionaire chairman who is among the 1000 wealthiest individuals on the planet who chooses to reside in Guernsey to minimise tax , to then ask UK taxpayers to pay 80% of ancillary staff wages is morally wrong.

Isn't Jon the Chairman, does he live in Guernsey? 

That aside, at what level of bank balance should any business owner be unable to take advantage of the furlough scheme?  How do you assess that balance?  Cash, shares (taken a hit), property (taking a hit), investments - could go either way....