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Because he had two games this season where he has been good and has been relatively poor over the course. Nobody is deriding him, just suggesting that he is perhaps not as ready for the first team as initially thought. 

KP and COD while not everyone's cup of tea, at least will chip in some goals and assists. Massengo has offered next to nothing creatively or defensively this season. This is evident both on the eye and according to the stats.

He is not yet at the level for a playoff chasing squad and should be loaned out to better serve his development IMO. Look what wonders it has done for Walsh and Morrell who have seen their stock improve dramatically over the course of this season. 

 

 

 

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Pure arrogant vanity project in my opinion. Whoever thought he was better in the here and now than Walsh and Morrell needs their heads check. Not helped by all the fans going well overboard in the beginning.

Not yet Champ level but doesnt deserve criticism from the same fans for that fact. Hope he reaches the potential everyone says he has and becomes a superstar.

 

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1 hour ago, RoystonFoote'snephew said:

Why has Massengo suddenly become the object of derision on OTIB, with many (who were no doubt lauding him as a major talent bought under the nose of the PL and singing about his hair) now claiming him to be vastly overrated. He's an18 Yr old FFS who has played many more games than expected in his first year. He may not be in form at present but as a midfielder he's miles in front of COD and he always gives everything on the pitch, which is more than can be said about KP45. Let's get off the kids back and give him support. 

Questioning why Massengo gets criticised, yet you go on to criticise KP who you seem to be claiming doesn’t try, yet he has hardly been given a fair run of consecutive games in the team!? 🤨

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As said above he won’t achieve anything at Ashton Gate ,most of the promising up and coming and even established players doing well elsewhere seem to hide in their shell once our coaching team are  let loose on them.

       

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43 minutes ago, marcofisher said:

Because he had two games this season where he has been good and has been relatively poor over the course. Nobody is deriding him, just suggesting that he is perhaps not as ready for the first team as initially thought. 

KP and COD while not everyone's cup of tea, at least will chip in some goals and assists. Massengo has offered next to nothing creatively or defensively this season. This is evident both on the eye and according to the stats.

He is not yet at the level for a playoff chasing squad and should be loaned out to better serve his development IMO. Look what wonders it has done for Walsh and Morrell who have seen their stock improve dramatically over the course of this season. 

 

 

 

Sorry to pick on your pretty rational post, but one thing that you've got completely wrong there is "Massengo has offered next to nothing creatively or defensively". His work rate in midfield is outstanding. His harrying and chasing is as much a defensive skill as tackling and I think people forget that. He wins fouls in the middle of the park. Shows for passes. His mobility and drive makes him a real asset both going back and going forward.

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4 minutes ago, mozo said:

Sorry to pick on your pretty rational post, but one thing that you've got completely wrong there is "Massengo has offered next to nothing creatively or defensively". His work rate in midfield is outstanding. His harrying and chasing is as much a defensive skill as tackling and I think people forget that. He wins fouls in the middle of the park. Shows for passes. His mobility and drive makes him a real asset both going back and going forward.

Agree 100%. After half time they bossed the midfield completely 

 

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15 minutes ago, archie andrews said:

Walsh and Morrell must be first team squad if not starting every week next season alongside maybe a taller experienced midfielder imo

Walsh didn't do too well at this level with us and was older than HNM at that point. Everyone now claiming he is the answer to our  midfield problems.

We've seen Matty Taylor is a very effective L1 player but wasn't good enough for top half Championship. It is entirely possible we will find the same is true with Walsh. Let's not write off Massengo or build up Walsh as the answer just yet. 

Time and again OTIB slam the players who are currently in the team and build up those who aren't into world beaters. On Friday we were gonna walk the play offs thanks to Afobe coming back. It does my head in. 

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28 minutes ago, archie andrews said:

Walsh and Morrell must be first team squad if not starting every week next season alongside maybe a taller experienced midfielder imo

Then what happens when Morrell and Walsh don’t cut the mustard in the championship, and look out of their depth?

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1 minute ago, robin_unreliant said:

Walsh didn't do too well at this level with us and was older than HNM at that point. Everyone now claiming he is the answer to our  midfield problems.

We've seen Matty Taylor is a very effective L1 player but wasn't good enough for top half Championship. It is entirely possible we will find the same is true with Walsh. Let's not write off Massengo or build up Walsh as the answer just yet. 

Time and again OTIB slam the players who are currently in the team and build up those who aren't into world beaters. On Friday we were gonna walk the play offs thanks to Afobe coming back. It does my head in. 

Great post. There is a significant gap between Championship and League one level. Who knows if if Toney will go to sit in the Championship.

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He's playing like Korey Smith, but we already have Korey Smith and Korey Smith is better at doing the Korey Smith role than Massengo is.

Now, obviously he's got huge potential, but we're trying to win now, so people are looking at his play now and he's not been good.

You start and you get judged like a starter. Which is why he's an object of derision. Because his performance yesterday deserved to be derided.

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3 minutes ago, Prinny said:

He's playing like Korey Smith, but we already have Korey Smith and Korey Smith is better at doing the Korey Smith role than Massengo is.

Now, obviously he's got huge potential, but we're trying to win now, so people are looking at his play now and he's not been good.

You start and you get judged like a starter. Which is why he's an object of derision. Because his performance yesterday deserved to be derided.

His performance did not deserve to be derided , he was the only one who seemed interested and put himself about . 
He was targeted by the Rover’s and not protected by Bonnie Langford .

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20 minutes ago, kelbcfc said:

Agree 100%. After half time they bossed the midfield completely 

 

Massengo was 3/4 on the way to a red card mostly to bad luck,  He did calm down after the first 15 minutes but why take the risk. If only Johnson could make good subs earlier while the game was still open.

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48 minutes ago, cidercity1987 said:

Pure arrogant vanity project in my opinion. Whoever thought he was better in the here and now than Walsh and Morrell needs their heads check. Not helped by all the fans going well overboard in the beginning.

Not yet Champ level but doesnt deserve criticism from the same fans for that fact. Hope he reaches the potential everyone says he has and becomes a superstar.

 

Massengo is simply not good enough in really if he was anywhere near what some people have been claiming he would not under any circunstances have signed for Bristol City. Bringing him and Nagy in at the expense of Walsh and Morrell was the worst in a catalogue of poor recruitment decisions this season, no benefit in  sign ing players that are not better than what you've already got .

Johnson should not be given any more big money to spend the best academy players should be given an opportunity to play in the first team most of them are in their early 20's if not now when , Bringing in inferior players from abroad is not a recipe for succss

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I would imagine LJ motivated his players before the game. Along the lines of... C'mon lads first 5 mins let them know their in a game. Get stuck in. Tackle hard. Work hard and win your battles....

...  HNM looked to be the only one who took in that talk. Yes he was a bit late for 3 or 4 but that's just youthful exuberance. Instead of being moan and complained at... He should be backed up by fans for being 100%, commited in an otherwise lacklustre performance. 

Much more to come from this lad. Quick feet, wins the ball back, confident ... And only 18 ffs. 

 

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6 minutes ago, Major Isewater said:

His performance did not deserve to be derided , he was the only one who seemed interested and put himself about . 
He was targeted by the Rover’s and not protected by Bonnie Langford .

I just utterly disagree, he was awful yesterday. Yeah he ran around, mainly fouling people, but created nothing, offered nothing.

0 assists 0 goals.

You admit they targeted him, why was that? Because he's weak, and they can see it too.

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Unfortunately this guy was built up to be something very special and at the moment he’s still finding his feet . I see glimpses of a very good player and some absolute bang average play . He’s young and in a foreign country and no worse than any other of what is an extremely poor , lightweight ordinary talentless midfield. Eliasson excused . 

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15 minutes ago, Prinny said:

I just utterly disagree, he was awful yesterday. Yeah he ran around, mainly fouling people, but created nothing, offered nothing.

0 assists 0 goals.

You admit they targeted him, why was that? Because he's weak, and they can see it too.

I suppose because they feel at his age he may be a bit naive but it could also be that the opposition see what he brings to our team and wanted to nullify his effectiveness ( which in fairness along with the whistle happy ref they did. ) 

If the whole team put in the effort that HNM put in there is no way that we would be talking about an abject performance v Blackburn .

 

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2 hours ago, RoystonFoote'snephew said:

Why has Massengo suddenly become the object of derision on OTIB, with many (who were no doubt lauding him as a major talent bought under the nose of the PL and singing about his hair) now claiming him to be vastly overrated. He's an18 Yr old FFS who has played many more games than expected in his first year. He may not be in form at present but as a midfielder he's miles in front of COD and he always gives everything on the pitch, which is more than can be said about KP45. Let's get off the kids back and give him support. 

HNM IS A GOOD PLAYER. The frustration is the **** that picks the side. I wouldn’t get to hung up on what people say about HNM. Just read the managers hasn’t got a clue. How we have reached the point where we expect so much of a kid is very much down to what competition does he have. 

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54 minutes ago, mozo said:

Sorry to pick on your pretty rational post, but one thing that you've got completely wrong there is "Massengo has offered next to nothing creatively or defensively". His work rate in midfield is outstanding. His harrying and chasing is as much a defensive skill as tackling and I think people forget that. He wins fouls in the middle of the park. Shows for passes. His mobility and drive makes him a real asset both going back and going forward.

Not strictly true. He runs and harries in a 2 man midfield leaving gaps in the midfield. This leaves us very open at times. This may be more use in a 3 man midfield but he has to understand when it is more suitable to hold position. 

Judging a player solely on his ability to run and harry is the the prerequisite for a player wanting to play for Bristol Rovers. This is Championship level football, you need to offer slightly more than an ability to run and chase. Weimann gets criticised on here for just being a player that harries and chases, yet has 9 goals and 3 assists.

He hasn't shown for passes much at all since the Blackburn and Millwall home games earlier in the season when he got bullied in the centre. Has looked afraid of it since then. 

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1 hour ago, Mr Hankey said:

Questioning why Massengo gets criticised, yet you go on to criticise KP who you seem to be claiming doesn’t try, yet he has hardly been given a fair run of consecutive games in the team!? 🤨

I don't think I was critical of KP unfairly. For me Massengo's effort is unquestionable whereas often KP looks listless. A magical talent on his day but not frequent enough. For me the reason he doesn't start often is that he doesn't perform when he does, and is usually more effective as an impact sub. His languid approach reminds me of JET but without the goal threat. 

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58 minutes ago, archie andrews said:

Walsh and Morrell must be first team squad if not starting every week next season alongside maybe a taller experienced midfielder imo

That would mean 3 in midfield.....LJ doesn’t ever play 3.

I like Massengo.  He’s had more than 2 good games also.  I think he was overhyped on arrival and overly criticised now, he’s been somewhere in between.  How did O’Dowda, Brownhill, Walsh do in their first seasons here, at an older age, let alone a different country?  He’s played more than he would’ve or LJ would’ve expected too, and he’s done ok.  If you consider he’s 18, he’s probably done a little better.  Injuries to Nagy and Smith after selling Pack have put him in the firing line, add in Brownhill’s departure too.

With Henriksen gone, Nagy unknown following LJ’s comments yesterday, we are suddenly looking short of numbers.  I’ll wait and see about Vyner as a DM.

I really like Morrell, think he has the type of game to play in our midfield in the Champ.  I hope Walsh does too.

But if we are gonna launch it from Kalas, Baker, and even Smith, then I don’t think it would matter who you play alongside Smith in CM.  The way we play direct is bordering on pointless with the way we set up.

35 minutes ago, robin_unreliant said:

Walsh didn't do too well at this level with us and was older than HNM at that point. Everyone now claiming he is the answer to our  midfield problems.

We've seen Matty Taylor is a very effective L1 player but wasn't good enough for top half Championship. It is entirely possible we will find the same is true with Walsh. Let's not write off Massengo or build up Walsh as the answer just yet. 

Time and again OTIB slam the players who are currently in the team and build up those who aren't into world beaters. On Friday we were gonna walk the play offs thanks to Afobe coming back. It does my head in. 

Yep, he’s had 45 minutes v Stoke where he did v.well.  The team also played v.well that second half.  We don’t know if it was Walsh making the difference, or him playing well because the team was.  Let’s give him the benefit and say it was down to him.

Next game - Reading (a), poor team performance in a 3-2 defeat.  Couple of nice touches / passes, but we were stretched all game.  That is my biggest worry with him if LJ sticks to a 2 man midfield.

15 minutes ago, sephjnr said:

Massengo was 3/4 on the way to a red card mostly to bad luck,  He did calm down after the first 15 minutes but why take the risk. If only Johnson could make good subs earlier while the game was still open.

Agree, sensible to take him off, but the midfield was worse off with Callum alongside Korey..

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Massengo Palmer and szmodics, neither one of them midfielders have proven to be better than those who they replaced, either that or their skills have been coached out of them by a fourth division coaching  team at Ashton Gate.

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1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

That would mean 3 in midfield.....LJ doesn’t ever play 3.

I like Massengo.  He’s had more than 2 good games also.  I think he was overhyped on arrival and overly criticised now, he’s been somewhere in between.  How did O’Dowda, Brownhill, Walsh do in their first seasons here, at an older age, let alone a different country?  He’s played more than he would’ve or LJ would’ve expected too, and he’s done ok.  If you consider he’s 18, he’s probably done a little better.  Injuries to Nagy and Smith after selling Pack have put him in the firing line, add in Brownhill’s departure too.

With Henriksen gone, Nagy unknown following LJ’s comments yesterday, we are suddenly looking short of numbers.  I’ll wait and see about Vyner as a DM.

I really like Morrell, think he has the type of game to play in our midfield in the Champ.  I hope Walsh does too.

But if we are gonna launch it from Kalas, Baker, and even Smith, then I don’t think it would matter who you play alongside Smith in CM.  The way we play direct is bordering on pointless with the way we set up.

Yep, he’s had 45 minutes v Stoke where he did v.well.  The team also played v.well that second half.  We don’t know if it was Walsh making the difference, or him playing well because the team was.  Let’s give him the benefit and say it was down to him.

Next game - Reading (a), poor team performance in a 3-2 defeat.  Couple of nice touches / passes, but we were stretched all game.  That is my biggest worry with him if LJ sticks to a 2 man midfield.

Agree, sensible to take him off, but the midfield was worse off with Callum alongside Korey..

I think the point is, why was Walsh allowed to stay on loan at Cov where he was doing well and would have clearly been an upgrade on the options we already have? Would have been able to take the mantle of ball carrier from Brownhill.

A big mistake bringing in Henriksen and not looking at options we already had has cost us really.

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27 minutes ago, shelts said:

Unfortunately this guy was built up to be something very special and at the moment he’s still finding his feet . I see glimpses of a very good player and some absolute bang average play . He’s young and in a foreign country and no worse than any other of what is an extremely poor , lightweight ordinary talentless midfield. Eliasson excused . 

We do like to single out one player don’t we?  Abject performances require a scapegoat.  You could argue the score was 1-1 with Han-Noah on the pitch.  I wouldn’t excuse Eliasson in that either.  He contributed for 6 minutes of the game (well the 72 mins he was on).

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Just now, marcofisher said:

I think the point is, why was Walsh allowed to stay on loan at Cov where he was doing well and would have clearly been an upgrade on the options we already have? Would have been able to take the mantle of ball carrier from Brownhill.

A big mistake bringing in Henriksen and not looking at options we already had has cost us really.

Walsh was on a season long loan, I believe.

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5 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

That would mean 3 in midfield.....LJ doesn’t ever play 3.

I like Massengo.  He’s had more than 2 good games also.  I think he was overhyped on arrival and overly criticised now, he’s been somewhere in between.  How did O’Dowda, Brownhill, Walsh do in their first seasons here, at an older age, let alone a different country?  He’s played more than he would’ve or LJ would’ve expected too, and he’s done ok.  If you consider he’s 18, he’s probably done a little better.  Injuries to Nagy and Smith after selling Pack have put him in the firing line, add in Brownhill’s departure too.

With Henriksen gone, Nagy unknown following LJ’s comments yesterday, we are suddenly looking short of numbers.  I’ll wait and see about Vyner as a DM.

I really like Morrell, think he has the type of game to play in our midfield in the Champ.  I hope Walsh does too.

But if we are gonna launch it from Kalas, Baker, and even Smith, then I don’t think it would matter who you play alongside Smith in CM.  The way we play direct is bordering on pointless with the way we set up.

Yep, he’s had 45 minutes v Stoke where he did v.well.  The team also played v.well that second half.  We don’t know if it was Walsh making the difference, or him playing well because the team was.  Let’s give him the benefit and say it was down to him.

Next game - Reading (a), poor team performance in a 3-2 defeat.  Couple of nice touches / passes, but we were stretched all game.  That is my biggest worry with him if LJ sticks to a 2 man midfield.

Agree, sensible to take him off, but the midfield was worse off with Callum alongside Korey..

Where does the talk of Vyner playing midfield come from? I thought he's only played cb and rb for us and on loans? But seen a few mention the dm role for him 

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