Top Robin Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 2 hours ago, daored said: Same must be true for Morrell as came back before season officially ended ? Wow if we got Walsh and Morrell back it would be like having a new midfield. It may not work but it's gotta be better than what we've got. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steviestevieneville Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 17 minutes ago, Fordy62 said: In fairness, realistically, what’s the worst that could happen. The midfield couldn’t get any worse than it was against Blackburn. Their hamstrings pop . Seen lots of muscle injuries because players are not up to sped yet. Agree , the midfield can’t get much worse but the seasons gone anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 29 minutes ago, Notbarrymanc said: You’d have to wonder why, if these players are earmarked for first team positions next season, they wouldn’t already be training with the first team - what would they have to lose? How do we know they aren`t? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolman_Stand Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 41 minutes ago, steviestevieneville said: So they haven’t trained at all for months but you want to chuck them straight . Did you miss the first three words of my last post??? 41 minutes ago, steviestevieneville said: So they haven’t trained at all for months but you want to chuck them straight . Did you miss the first three words of my last post??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 Play them in a two and we may have more energy but similar tactical issues- that can be exacerbated by the heat. I also worry like @hodge about their fitness, how sharp they would be and whether they may get injuries brought about from being rushed back in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozo Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 4 minutes ago, Dolman_Stand said: the first three words of my last post??? the first three words of my last post??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steviestevieneville Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 7 minutes ago, Dolman_Stand said: Did you miss the first three words of my last post??? Did you miss the first three words of my last post??? If all fit , you’d play them Sunday . Was your quote. They haven’t trained for months , so how can they be anywhere near fit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolman_Stand Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 52 minutes ago, steviestevieneville said: So they haven’t trained at all for months but you want to chuck them straight . Did you miss the first three words of my last post??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 25 minutes ago, Top Robin said: Wow if we got Walsh and Morrell back it would be like having a new midfield. It may not work but it's gotta be better than what we've got. Give LJ time and he'd soon have them playing like the old midfield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lrrr Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 We're well stocked for players so seems unlikely, Walsh or Morrell may be able to make the bench Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steviestevieneville Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 11 minutes ago, Dolman_Stand said: Did you miss the first three words of my last post??? Yes I’ve already answered you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 Hypothetically though if all were available I'd consider something like: Maenpaa Moore Kalas Benkovic Hunt Walsh Nagy DaSilva Palmer Wells Afobe Perm maybe one out of Wells or Afobe for Weimann if concerns about fitness or energy. Likewise those central areas ot a given- could easily field something like Walsh, Morrell and one of Nagy, Massengo, Smith- or even could Walsh play between the midfield and attack, not quite in the Palmer role but supporting the strike pair? Moore-Kalas-Benkovic is a back 3 that could stylistically bring the ball out more easily and be less easy to exploit for pace on the break- all technically sound to varying degrees so none of e.g. 'Give Baker the ball as he canb't do much' or 'Target Williams as he's quite old and therefore can be got at with pace'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Red Hat Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 1 hour ago, petehinton said: LJ played marinovic ahead of him. Really think he’s in with any shot of playing this season? Probably not, but he's had a great season at Shrews. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted June 25, 2020 Admin Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 1 hour ago, Wade Wilson said: Let’s all calm down a bit, we don’t even know if they’ve trained. We have players who have trained and still weren’t up to full fitness and even if Walsh etc have trained with the reserves or something (Are the reserves/youth even training? No idea) they won’t have any match experience. They’d be weeks, weeks, away from starting. Also we have to assume that he's improved as a player as was deemed surplus before. We must remember he has been playing at a lower level. I'm interested what this refers to..... Availability is based on a limited number of other factors the parent club has to take into account as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lrrr Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 Just now, phantom said: Also we have to assume that he's improved as a player as was deemed surplus before. We must remember he has been playing at a lower level. I'm interested what this refers to..... Availability is based on a limited number of other factors the parent club has to take into account as well. Gregor indicating its things like how many players they have available, eg if Maenpaa hadn't signed a new contract, Gillmartin would go on the bench, if he got injured as well then Max could sit on the bench, at least thats the gist I got Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Dante Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 The rule for GK makes this simplistic, outfield players less so. To expand: GK is specialist. Therefore it’s always been the case that with injuries, outside of windows, you could replace players. No reason to suspect that if (say) Niki and Bents were unavailable, Max could come in on the same basis. Outfield a bit more nuanced. It’s not specialised, so losing (say) Kalas wouldn’t mean we’d have carte Blanche to play Moore, as we could change formation. With that in mind. The logical reading of the rule is that for outfield players, you can add a prior loanee to the squad if your squad is smaller than at the time of the last date of available recall for the loan - and it has to be absent injury. I.e we can recall (play) a loanee if we have lost players, through non renewal of contract, if they were available to us as at the closure of the Jan window. The players ‘lost’ from that point are Henriksen. Wright and Taylor don’t count as already out on loan so not available. Therefore, I *think* that we have one theoretical squad place post Henriksens last contracted date. Logic tells me we could choose one prior loanee, irrespective of position, to add to the squad post end of June and be both within moral and literal interpretation of rules Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eardun Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 Gregor said one of the requirements is this which isn’t particularly helpful. Presume that means you can only use them if you don’t have enough other players to fill starting 11 plus bench. ‘without including the Player on the Team Sheet, the Transferor Club would be unable to fulfil all available places on the Team Sheet’ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC_Josh Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 Whilst I think Walsh should at least come back into the squad, I worry that LJ won’t want him or Morrell involved too much. Makes the signing of Henriksen and lack of recall for them in January look even worse if they do well. Anybody agree? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledAjax Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 38 minutes ago, hodge said: We're well stocked for players so seems unlikely, Walsh or Morrell may be able to make the bench Gregor sets out the following criteria that must be satisfied before a returning loanee can play. I suspect the one in bold might be tricky to honestly satisfy? - the Player is returning from a curtailed division - the Transferee Club has not qualified to participate in a Play-Off Competition - without including the Player on the Team Sheet, the Transferor Club would be unable to fulfil all available places on the Team Sheet - the Transferor Club gives priority to its under 23 players, Scholars and other Academy Players who have made at least one First Team appearance in a League Match (or a Premier League Match) for the Transferor Club; and - the Player has not been on loan to more than one Club during Season 2019/20. Also, the fourth point is unclear. Does it mean that Walsh, despite presumably qualifying as an U23 player, must be put behind all other "under 23 players, Scholars and other Academy Players who have made at least one First Team appearance in a League Match (or a Premier League Match) for the Transferor Club" or doe s he, as a returning loanee, simply become one of the many "under 23 players...who have made at least one First Team appearance in a League Match (or a Premier League Match) for the Transferor Club." If Gregor has copied out the wording of the rule change then the drafting is ******* terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lrrr Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 3 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said: Gregor sets out the following criteria that must be satisfied before a returning loanee can play. I suspect the one in bold might be tricky to honestly satisfy? - the Player is returning from a curtailed division - the Transferee Club has not qualified to participate in a Play-Off Competition - without including the Player on the Team Sheet, the Transferor Club would be unable to fulfil all available places on the Team Sheet - the Transferor Club gives priority to its under 23 players, Scholars and other Academy Players who have made at least one First Team appearance in a League Match (or a Premier League Match) for the Transferor Club; and - the Player has not been on loan to more than one Club during Season 2019/20. Also, the fourth point is unclear. Does it mean that Walsh, despite presumably qualifying as an U23 player, must be put behind all other "under 23 players, Scholars and other Academy Players who have made at least one First Team appearance in a League Match (or a Premier League Match) for the Transferor Club" or doe s he, as a returning loanee, simply become one of the many "under 23 players...who have made at least one First Team appearance in a League Match (or a Premier League Match) for the Transferor Club." If Gregor has copied out the wording of the rule change then the drafting is ******* terrible. Well none of our 23's have made a 1st team appearance this season so wouldn't apply to us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledAjax Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 8 minutes ago, hodge said: Well none of our 23's have made a 1st team appearance this season so wouldn't apply to us Tbh I don't have a list of all those who have made appearances for us this season. Regardless, it doesn't specify that it has to be this season. The way it is written in Gregor's report suggests it's any first team appearance. The defined term "League Match" doesn't specify that it is for the current season (it refers to a match in the "League competition" and that refers to the "annual League competition". That is unclear as to whether the appearance has to be in 2019/20. To me it reads as a list like so: Priority goes to: under 23 players who have made at least one First Team appearance in a League Match (or a Premier League Match) for the Transferor Club; Scholars who have made at least one First Team appearance in a League Match (or a Premier League Match) for the Transferor Club; other Academy Players who have made at least one First Team appearance in a League Match (or a Premier League Match) for the Transferor Club; and returning loanees. An alternative construction is that priority goes to: under 23 players; Scholars; other Academy Players who have made at least one First Team appearance in a League Match (or a Premier League Match) for the Transferor Club; and returning loanees. Presumably the actual law/regulation is clearer and Gregor just summarised it for the purposes of the Post, but it's a pretty crucial difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lrrr Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 16 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said: Tbh I don't have a list of all those who have made appearances for us this season. Regardless, it doesn't specify that it has to be this season. The way it is written in Gregor's report suggests it's any first team appearance. The defined term "League Match" doesn't specify that it is for the current season (it refers to a match in the "League competition" and that refers to the "annual League competition". That is unclear as to whether the appearance has to be in 2019/20. To me it reads as a list like so: Priority goes to: under 23 players who have made at least one First Team appearance in a League Match (or a Premier League Match) for the Transferor Club; Scholars who have made at least one First Team appearance in a League Match (or a Premier League Match) for the Transferor Club; other Academy Players who have made at least one First Team appearance in a League Match (or a Premier League Match) for the Transferor Club; and returning loanees. An alternative construction is that priority goes to: under 23 players; Scholars; other Academy Players who have made at least one First Team appearance in a League Match (or a Premier League Match) for the Transferor Club; and returning loanees. Presumably the actual law/regulation is clearer and Gregor just summarised it for the purposes of the Post, but it's a pretty crucial difference. In that case then only Freddie Hinds would apply Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledAjax Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 Just now, hodge said: In that case then only Freddie Hinds would apply Get him in the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Dante Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 6 minutes ago, Badger08 said: Would he be able to get 2 promotion medals? Not with us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 6 hours ago, Wade Wilson said: Let’s all calm down a bit, we don’t even know if they’ve trained. any training will be self-training. We have players who have trained and still weren’t up to full fitness and even if Walsh etc have trained with the reserves or something (Are the reserves/youth even training? No idea) no, they have not. They were sent home from Failand very early on in Covid, and have not returned. LJ has previously said he wouldn’t risk transmission by bring the likes of Walsh back into the training group. Of course this might change things. they won’t have any match experience. They’d be weeks, weeks, away from starting. I agree, would need to be desperate, and I know Blackburn was bad, but Sheffield Wednesday is not gonna see any of them. Plus they have to go through testing protocols first before they can join back up. 5 hours ago, ExiledAjax said: One line stood out form that Brum press release: "Availability is based on a limited number of other factors the parent club has to take into account as well." Has anyone found the actual law change? Can't seem to find it by searching. 3 hours ago, ExiledAjax said: Gregor sets out the following criteria that must be satisfied before a returning loanee can play. I suspect the one in bold might be tricky to honestly satisfy? - the Player is returning from a curtailed division - the Transferee Club has not qualified to participate in a Play-Off Competition - without including the Player on the Team Sheet, the Transferor Club would be unable to fulfil all available places on the Team Sheet - the Transferor Club gives priority to its under 23 players, Scholars and other Academy Players who have made at least one First Team appearance in a League Match (or a Premier League Match) for the Transferor Club; and - the Player has not been on loan to more than one Club during Season 2019/20. Also, the fourth point is unclear. Does it mean that Walsh, despite presumably qualifying as an U23 player, must be put behind all other "under 23 players, Scholars and other Academy Players who have made at least one First Team appearance in a League Match (or a Premier League Match) for the Transferor Club" or doe s he, as a returning loanee, simply become one of the many "under 23 players...who have made at least one First Team appearance in a League Match (or a Premier League Match) for the Transferor Club." If Gregor has copied out the wording of the rule change then the drafting is ******* terrible. I think this makes including our loanees very difficult. That bold statement means we are gonna have to have a few injuries before any of the loanees can be considered. I reckon there are 26 players, 25 if James Morton hasn’t been training. 24 if Pedro is injured. 23 if Rene is classed as a coach now. So would still need 4 more to get injured to free-up a space! 3 hours ago, hodge said: Well none of our 23's have made a 1st team appearance this season so wouldn't apply to us Do we know if it’s this season, or ever? Did Hinds ever make a league appearance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledAjax Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 7 minutes ago, Davefevs said: Do we know if it’s this season, or ever? IMO it is ambiguous but leans more towards the "ever" option. This from reading the EFL reg definitions of "League Match" and related. Although this is all caveated by not actually seeing the law change - all we've got is a Brummie press release and Gregor's summary. Could you argue that you don't have to include two goalies on your bench before you can dip into your pool of returning loanees? Suspect there's nothing in the laws about it so you'd be chancing a challenge from the league if you, say, had Maenpaa in the first XI, Bentley on the bench, and then left Wollacott out of the squad in order to play Walsh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 12 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said: IMO it is ambiguous but leans more towards the "ever" option. This from reading the EFL reg definitions of "League Match" and related. Although this is all caveated by not actually seeing the law change - all we've got is a Brummie press release and Gregor's summary. Could you argue that you don't have to include two goalies on your bench before you can dip into your pool of returning loanees? Suspect there's nothing in the laws about it so you'd be chancing a challenge from the league if you, say, had Maenpaa in the first XI, Bentley on the bench, and then left Wollacott out of the squad in order to play Walsh. Yes, you’d expect that to be reasonable....but this is the EFL. Would imagine this has come about for two main reasons: Integrity of league, with clubs unable to retain players on short terms deals who are out of contact weather....unfair if a club cannot name 9 subs due to no1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oh Louie louie Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 If he can play. and isnt in the squad over the next 2 games after the midfields showing on saturday, Then he will never get a game sadly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hampshire reds Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 he wont play walsh or morrell. he will play the same old ones. we are wasting so much talent with this coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View from the Dolman Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 3 minutes ago, Hampshire reds said: he wont play walsh or morrell. he will play the same old ones. we are wasting so much talent with this coach. He can't play Walsh or Morrell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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