Harry Posted July 4, 2020 Report Share Posted July 4, 2020 2 minutes ago, Barry Sheene said: That may be the case but I would point out that they were Lee's choices and he was backed by the club The ones I’m talking about are not Lee’s choices. Some have been at the club for longer than that. I’m talking about the ‘technical’ team, ie analysts etc. They are a laughing stock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Sheene Posted July 4, 2020 Report Share Posted July 4, 2020 Just now, Harry said: The ones I’m talking about are not Lee’s choices. They’ve been at the club for longer than that. Sorry Harry I was talking about Dean Holden And Jamie Mac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Posted July 4, 2020 Report Share Posted July 4, 2020 Just now, Barry Sheene said: Sorry Harry I was talking about Dean Holden And Jamie Mac Sorry. I just edited my reply. I’m talking ‘behind the scenes’ tech staff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted July 4, 2020 Report Share Posted July 4, 2020 1 minute ago, Robert the bruce said: Yes,,,Lee had to go-with our thanks. But this here for me is a genuine concern..... Go yes man,,go cheep & it's not just Lee that'll be cooked. this is always going to be our problem, we can applaud the Lansdown's for the money put in, but they want (probably legitimately seeing the money the put in) too much say in how the footballing side is run... that will always be a massive problem hen it comes to employing and keeping managers. I could point to many faux pas with managerial choices and interference from the owners to back this up, sadly a lepard does not change its spots, so its all aboard the merrygoround again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Fred Posted July 4, 2020 Report Share Posted July 4, 2020 1 hour ago, Harry said: No thanks from me yet until I see the next man. This in a nutshell.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottishRed Posted July 4, 2020 Report Share Posted July 4, 2020 3 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said: Lansdown appointed him. Lansdown fired him. That is an omission of failure every day of the week. I will thank SL if he appoints an experienced manager that wins us promotion to the Premier League. If he appoints Michael Appleton the OP looks absurd (unless he won us promotion I suppose!). I think there is a real risk Appleton will get the job - heaven help us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NcnsBcfc Posted July 4, 2020 Report Share Posted July 4, 2020 3 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said: Sacking the manager is an omission of failure on the part of the club. Why do we have to be thankful for that? I get your point kid. But ultimately, they must have been waiting for LJ to do the honourable thing. When that didnt happen, they had to take action. They backed him on similar runs in the past. But that could have been put down to inexperience; and the need to give him time to develop. 4.5 years later, and he was the longest serving manager in the championship. There was no longer any room to hide. I'm actually quite proud of the fact, that the board aren't knee jerk; and have given him plenty of opportunities that other managers wouldnt have got. I think we're a very attractive proposition for a new manager. Who knows he will be supported on and off the field. I just hope we don't go for the cheap easy option; and go through a number of managers swiftly; like after GJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pillred Posted July 4, 2020 Report Share Posted July 4, 2020 2 hours ago, BS4 on Tour... said: If I was the owner of an ambitious L1 club I’d beg Cotts to be my team manager - that’s his level and he’s superb in that division ... not sure LJ’s list of achievements guarantees him another job anytime soon, he hasn’t won a promotion yet despite managing three clubs in around 400 games ... And having backing most managers could only dream of, will be interesting to see if he can have any sort of success on a budget because in league one and with the current economic climate that is what he will probably have to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kykoliko Posted July 4, 2020 Report Share Posted July 4, 2020 3 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said: Lansdown appointed him. Lansdown fired him. That is an omission of failure every day of the week. I will thank SL if he appoints an experienced manager that wins us promotion to the Premier League. If he appoints Michael Appleton the OP looks absurd (unless he won us promotion I suppose!). Do you mean admission? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red-Robbo Posted July 4, 2020 Report Share Posted July 4, 2020 3 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said: Sacking the manager is an omission of failure on the part of the club. Why do we have to be thankful for that? Rare is the manager who just retires a la Ferguson. Every club sacks managers. There is an arc usually to their tenures, and many of those arcs resemble Lee's, where after bouts of success and failure the ultimate limitations of someone's managerial abilities become clear. So, I don't think getting rid of a manager is a stick to beat this club's decision makers - it happens at 99.9% of football clubs. However to answer the question I think we should be thankful that Lansdown was decisive and took action during the season rather than at the end. This season, in particular, that would've been a big mistake. He will impress me more if he has been discretely sounding out potential managers and will be able to make a decent appointment soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bard Posted July 4, 2020 Report Share Posted July 4, 2020 3 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said: Lansdown appointed him. Lansdown fired him. That is an omission of failure every day of the week. I will thank SL if he appoints an experienced manager that wins us promotion to the Premier League. If he appoints Michael Appleton the OP looks absurd (unless he won us promotion I suppose!). It is. They have had enough time to work out their failures and ensure the new appointment is right. There must have been discussions about the next man over the last 3 months in Guernsey... My main concern is are they self-aware enough to pick someone who will be able to deal with them effectively... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChippenhamRed Posted July 5, 2020 Report Share Posted July 5, 2020 11 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said: You are just proving my point. LJ wasn't good enough. LJ wasn’t good enough to take us to the Premier League. But he arrived with the club under threat of relegation and leaves with the club firmly established in the Championship having flirted with the play offs for three seasons in a row. He has laid the foundations for a successor - perhaps a higher profile one than we might previously have been able to recruit - to take the club to the next level. I think history will show that ultimately his tenure was broadly positive, and that it wasn’t a bad appointment by the board - so I don’t think it’s unreasonable to give them some credit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChippenhamRed Posted July 5, 2020 Report Share Posted July 5, 2020 12 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said: Lansdown appointed him. Lansdown fired him. That is an omission of failure every day of the week. I will thank SL if he appoints an experienced manager that wins us promotion to the Premier League. If he appoints Michael Appleton the OP looks absurd (unless he won us promotion I suppose!). Lansdown appointed him with the primary objective of saving us from relegation and establishing us in the Championship. Promotion was a secondary target at that time. Lansdown fires him having achieved those primary objectives, but when it became apparent he wasn’t going to be able to take us any further. Quite clearly it’s not as black and white as “Lansdown fired him so he’s admitting he failed” and I don’t really understand your insistence on making it so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol Oil Services Posted July 5, 2020 Report Share Posted July 5, 2020 21 minutes ago, ChippenhamRed said: I think history will show that ultimately his tenure was broadly positive, and that it wasn’t a bad appointment by the board - so I don’t think it’s unreasonable to give them some credit. Yes, that is one way of looking at. But there are other perspectives, too. "History" is a bit of a selective subject, a thorny issue, as we are learning in this country right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gert Mare Posted July 5, 2020 Report Share Posted July 5, 2020 I think that SL has proven that he is a man of his word. Although I haven’t always agreed with the appointments that he has made he must surely have some respect within the game for giving a manager the chance to put his stamp on a team and regardless of external knee jerk reactions from supporters allow his manager the chance to achieve the targets that are set. In an interview at the beginning of the season he made it clear that the expectation this year was the playoffs. He allowed LJ to keep his job until that was no longer a possibility, and then he pulled the trigger. The parting of ways with LJ will come as no surprise to LJ. He knew what was expected and he knew that whilst there was still a chance of City getting into the mix that his job was safe. Don’t be surprised if the next appointment is not one that is popular with supporters. Self sustainability is top of the list of requirements, working within the rules off FFP is another and developing academy graduates is there too. Mavericks and those who challenge the boards philosophy need not apply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol Oil Services Posted July 5, 2020 Report Share Posted July 5, 2020 9 hours ago, The Bard said: My main concern is are they self-aware enough to pick someone who will be able to deal with them effectively... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid in the Riot Posted July 5, 2020 Report Share Posted July 5, 2020 12 hours ago, Red-Robbo said: Rare is the manager who just retires a la Ferguson. Every club sacks managers. There is an arc usually to their tenures, and many of those arcs resemble Lee's, where after bouts of success and failure the ultimate limitations of someone's managerial abilities become clear. So, I don't think getting rid of a manager is a stick to beat this club's decision makers - it happens at 99.9% of football clubs. However to answer the question I think we should be thankful that Lansdown was decisive and took action during the season rather than at the end. This season, in particular, that would've been a big mistake. He will impress me more if he has been discretely sounding out potential managers and will be able to make a decent appointment soon. There are other ways a manager can depart a club - they could be poached for example, and go onto bigger and better things. That has never happened in SL's near 20 year reign, which to me appears pretty damning regards his managerial appointments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red-Robbo Posted July 5, 2020 Report Share Posted July 5, 2020 57 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said: There are other ways a manager can depart a club - they could be poached for example, and go onto bigger and better things. That has never happened in SL's near 20 year reign, which to me appears pretty damning regards his managerial appointments. Don't think it happened during Harry Dolman's tenure either. Would you say he was a failure? And if Lansdown had seen lots of successful managers poached, he'd be criticised for not being able to hang on to anyone. Is Wael al-Qadi a successful chairman because he's had his last two managers lured away? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted July 5, 2020 Report Share Posted July 5, 2020 16 hours ago, Harry said: The ones I’m talking about are not Lee’s choices. Some have been at the club for longer than that. I’m talking about the ‘technical’ team, ie analysts etc. They are a laughing stock. I’d really like to know what “football” qualifications / experience our analysts have, not just the recruitment ones, but the match day ones too. You may know more about them (certainly than I do). Of course you need efficient number crunchers, but as @Beni71will tell you, if you don’t know what to crunch, the results you get out can be misleading, or just plain wrong. I can put up my Wyscout charts til I’m blue in the face, but it’s the interpretation that is the skill, or even what to input and focus on in the first place....coupled with what you see with your eyes. Its not baseball, where every pitch has the same same start point, that you can map against 100s of variables. Football is different. There is no magic stat like OBP for the sabre-metrics guys to focus on, where it’s one batter v one pitcher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatchers Posted July 5, 2020 Report Share Posted July 5, 2020 I think the constant chopping and changing of the team contributed most to the teams poor performances, also the streaky runs. Gary O'Neil said how it disrupts and unsettles the team,on Sky before the Cardiff game. LJ also thought he was a tactical genius but unfortunately forgot football is played on the pitch not on paper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted July 10, 2020 Report Share Posted July 10, 2020 On 05/07/2020 at 16:56, fatchers said: I think the constant chopping and changing of the team contributed most to the teams poor performances, also the streaky runs. Gary O'Neil said how it disrupts and unsettles the team,on Sky before the Cardiff game. LJ also thought he was a tactical genius but unfortunately forgot football is played on the pitch not on paper. Did O’Neil say all of that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatchers Posted July 11, 2020 Report Share Posted July 11, 2020 O'Neil said how it disrupts and unsettles the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted July 11, 2020 Report Share Posted July 11, 2020 13 hours ago, Davefevs said: Did O’Neil say all of that? Referring to LJ he certainly said that chopping and changing the team unsettles the players. I didn’t hear the comment about football being played on the grass not paper tho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted July 11, 2020 Report Share Posted July 11, 2020 6 minutes ago, fatchers said: O'Neil said how it disrupts and unsettles the team. Yep....and one of the major criticism on here of LJ was him not knowing his best 11 and consequently tinkering with the team - and the formation and tactics............ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted July 11, 2020 Report Share Posted July 11, 2020 13 minutes ago, Robbored said: Referring to LJ he certainly said that chopping and changing the team unsettles the players. I didn’t hear the comment about football being played on the grass not paper tho. Yep, that was the bit I heard.....ta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatchers Posted July 11, 2020 Report Share Posted July 11, 2020 Perhaps I should have left a gap after the full stop before saying , in my opinion Johnson thought he was a tactical genius but unfortunately forgot football is played on a pitch not on paper. ( can't remember which manager originally said that ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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