Red Exile Posted July 19, 2020 Report Share Posted July 19, 2020 7 minutes ago, WayOutWest said: 10 years is a long time. Hopefully many lessons have been learned. LJ was far from failure. He established us as a top half championship that have flirted with play offs. Instead of the new man coming in and steadying the ship and trying to keep us from the trap door, his brief will be to deliver play offs at a minimum. Let that sink in. We are not a club that needs saving, we are a club that needs to push on. I believe that this situation puts the club in a far better position in choosing who will succeed LJ. The right man will take the time it takes. ...no need to let anything 'sink in'. I know where we are as a club, in a healthy position. But a decade ago the situation wasn't so very different, we had, after all got to a play-off final, we almost made the play-off the following season. But I can remember my elation at hearing that Coppell had been appointed...and utter depression that when he walked away Lansdown went for Keith Millen. I hope you are right that SL has learned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweeneys Penalties Posted July 19, 2020 Report Share Posted July 19, 2020 1 hour ago, WayOutWest said: How do you know this? Without being present in any meetings that were held prior to his sacking, and subsequent meetings after, this information is pure guess work on your part. I would guess that a short list of potential candidates have been drawn up Before after does it really matter. The club started to get enquiries from a whole different pool of candidates from all over the world. MA stated that.. so that is fact. These would need further investigation. I don't understand the need to rush. Some people criticise the club for taking to long. Some people would criticise the club for an immediate appointment. They honestly couldn't win. They need to get this right. It will take as much time as it does. I wasnt there, I dont know anything that goes on behind the scenes at AG....and I never claimed at any point I was ITK.....I voiced an opinion....thats what forums are for. Equally....your opinion is errr....guess work. As for what's the rush? We have a transfer window around the corner and the vehicle appears to be idling in neutral. How great would you feel id we miss the summer transfer window, then blame the traditionally awful January transfer window for lack of progress....so any serious rebuilding couldnt happen for another 12 months. Timing is everything.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDOXO Posted July 19, 2020 Report Share Posted July 19, 2020 1 hour ago, red panda said: I think most people not connected with the club, and hopefully some City fans when they develop a sense of perspective, would not judge LJ as a failure. OK he didn't get us into the playoffs, but we are now an established Championship club who have been competing for the playoffs, we had improved each year and until quite recently it looked like that might continue this season. He's laid a foundation and now we need someone else to take us the next step. My fully developed perspective is I can only agree partially. SL laid the foundation with everything at the club as Pointed out in the original post. LJ had one job and that was get us promoted. The Europa League in five years was not just LJs quote it was a high end aim of the BoD and the benefactor but promotion was the realistic aim! Outside of a League cup run our form was patchy, streaky if you will, with the added bonus of dire home performances and football, occasionally mitigated by good away performances. I agree we are now an established Championship club and are mentioned in the same breath as clubs that would have been horrified by the thought of being beaten by us, however with money, facilities, backing and longevity the guy could only deliver excuses and garbled tactics, Afobi on the wing being almost the last straw, LJ had ran his course and his position was untenable. Mark Ashton said football is a results driven game when he fired Lee, and Lee was fired as he didn’t deliver them despite the immense backing and a shed load of multi million buys. Lord I wanted the bloke to succeed as any supporter of 60 odd years would, but despite all the number games he ran out of other poor ideas! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WayOutWest Posted July 19, 2020 Report Share Posted July 19, 2020 23 minutes ago, Sweeneys Penalties said: I never claimed at any point I was ITK.....I voiced an opinion....thats what forums are for. Actually you said "why did we only start looking after LJ left the car park" I interpreted that as a statement of fact. That's cool. I think we are both after the same thing. I am not in any kind of panic. I guess that's where we differ. Anyway, as far as the transfer window is concerned, and this is just my opinion of course, MA will have his transfer targets already identified and the pieces we will move on. I would think that work was done with LJ. It opens on 27th and much can happen before then. Let's face it we tend to do our business late. Cheers mate, love the debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riaz Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 On 18/07/2020 at 18:37, Alan Dicks said: Will us fans be underwhelmed.? End up right back at square one? its the Bristol City way. Or Am i just being negative and should keep my hopes up for an experienced managerial appointment? Anyone else feel the same way? Would'nt alan dicks have been considered the "cheap option" when he was appointed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supercidered Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 1 hour ago, Riaz said: Would'nt alan dicks have been considered the "cheap option" when he was appointed? A lot has changed since those days me babber! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 1 minute ago, JonDolman said: Really would not mind Barnsley manager Struber here. Who would be your top choices Jon? I think yours might be a bit different to the general consensus on here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riaz Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 49 minutes ago, supercidered said: A lot has changed since those days me babber! Maybe so, but one thing that hasnt changed.. every manager has to start somewhere, so we should dismiss someone, just because they dont have a reputation yet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supercidered Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 1 hour ago, Riaz said: Maybe so, but one thing that hasnt changed.. every manager has to start somewhere, so we should dismiss someone, just because they dont have a reputation yet! True but I feel there is a time and a place for untried / potential. For City it is neither the time or the place. Every appointment is a gamble one way or another. However, the time is now for quality and a proven appointment and the place is at Ashton Gate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chappers Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 I prefer the terms “Realistic”, “Affordable” and “Right fit”. Current financial realities may well limit our options. We just have to accept it, and support whoever is appointed. Oh, and stop obsessing about Hughton!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riaz Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 31 minutes ago, supercidered said: True but I feel there is a time and a place for untried / potential. For City it is neither the time or the place. Every appointment is a gamble one way or another. However, the time is now for quality and a proven appointment and the place is at Ashton Gate. Proven? if they are proven would they becoming to Bristol City? If they are coming to Bristol City, they are unproven or have failed somewhere Proven Manager = nonsense Cheap option = nonsense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bris Red Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 3 minutes ago, Riaz said: Proven? if they are proven would they becoming to Bristol City? If they are coming to Bristol City, they are unproven or have failed somewhere Proven Manager = nonsense Cheap option = nonsense Your making no sense. A proven manager doesn’t have to mean a world beater. Every manager on this planet barring a very select few have failed somewhere, i think what many fans are asking for is somebody with a promotion out of this division on their CV. Does that guarantee he will get us up? Obviously there are no guarantees in football but for once it would be nice to see us go down that road and know we are in experienced hands so to speak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 Looks like a decent amount of money must have just been put on Ryan Lowe.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lrrr Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 1 hour ago, And Its Smith said: Looks like a decent amount of money must have just been put on Ryan Lowe.... And Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldstandrobin Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 5 hours ago, Riaz said: Would'nt alan dicks have been considered the "cheap option" when he was appointed? No.I was around then, he was recommended by Jimmy Hill as an up and coming Manager, where did we hear that before ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supercidered Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 2 hours ago, Riaz said: Proven? if they are proven would they becoming to Bristol City? If they are coming to Bristol City, they are unproven or have failed somewhere Proven Manager = nonsense Cheap option = nonsense Ok then, I give in. So what do you want? A proven unproven manager who has potential which may have failed before but is not a cheap option but also not an expensive option? Why wouldn't a proven Manager / Coach come to Bristol City? Not sure why we would only attract 'unproved, failed somewhere else' applicants. Come to think of it., nonsense is exactly what your reply above is. There, I've said it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomvick89 Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 Now the euphoria of what we could have had has passed (as usual) because we haven’t moved fast enough and we can now see what we are likely to appoint. I don’t see any improvement on what we had and I have returned to my original opinion that LJ should still be here. At least he is a Bristol City man and worked his ass off. We have no guarantee that we will get either of those from the lower league managers being offered as potential favourites. The fact we thought the big names were possible were down to his work.. LJ would be an easy choice ahead of each Lowe, Neil, Crowley, Cook and Flynn in my eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riaz Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 Just now, supercidered said: Ok then, I give in. So what do you want? A proven unproven manager who has potential which may have failed before but is not a cheap option but also not an expensive option? Why wouldn't a proven Manager / Coach come to Bristol City? Not sure why we would only attract 'unproved, failed somewhere else' applicants. Come to think of it., nonsense is exactly what your reply above is. There, I've said it. Well i think we should forget about this "proven" or "cheap" tag - thats my point i was trying to make. I want someone who has SOME sort of experience and done well for someone. Preferably someone who has taken someone up and kept them up. My top 5 are: 1. Eddie Howe 2. Slavisa jokanovic 3. Nigel Pearson 4. Paul Cook 5. Chris Hughton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SecretSam Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 22 hours ago, red panda said: I think most people not connected with the club, and hopefully some City fans when they develop a sense of perspective, would not judge LJ as a failure. OK he didn't get us into the playoffs, but we are now an established Championship club who have been competing for the playoffs, we had improved each year and until quite recently it looked like that might continue this season. He's laid a foundation and now we need someone else to take us the next step. Agreed, we were all over the shop when he took over, he's steadied the ship and lifted us up the table, plus a couple of mental cup runs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBristolian Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 Sorry if someone has already said this but the cheap option would have been keeping Lee Johnson. We'd have avoided a pay out on his contract, costs of compensation from other club AND the salary of a new manager all at the same time There is literally no chance we can go for the cheap option now. We decided not do it and that ship has now sailed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBristolian Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 8 minutes ago, NlGHTMARE said: To be a Barnsley head coach now, you have embrace the following, attacking at every opportunity, hard working without the ball, quick moving passing football, and never stop running. We recruit players that can play that way, and we recruit a head coach that can develop them into better players. I think this is the key thing that's been missing from a lot of discussions on here. We can't afford to replace our entire squad and have invested a lot in young players, both buying from other club and developing them ourselves. There is no benefit whatsoever to us going for a manager, no matter how good, who wants to play a style of player that doesn't suit our players. Even with Chris Hughton - he's a very good manager but my impression of him is he tends to like big, physical players and focuses on discipline and tactical shape. I'm not convinced that's the way to get the best out of any of our central midfielders, or defenders lie Dasilva, Kalas, or Moore, or Nakhi Wells, or players like Paterson, Palmer or Weimann. We need to get a manager in who gets the best out of the players we have, not someone who'll try to impose a style of football that won't work. I may be wrong about Hughton, for example, but it is not simply about how good a manager is but whether they are the right person to turn a team containing Dasilva, Kalas, Walsh, Wells and whoever else starts next season into the best possible team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lrrr Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 2 hours ago, Riaz said: Well i think we should forget about this "proven" or "cheap" tag - thats my point i was trying to make. I want someone who has SOME sort of experience and done well for someone. Preferably someone who has taken someone up and kept them up. My top 5 are: 1. Eddie Howe 2. Slavisa jokanovic 3. Nigel Pearson 4. Paul Cook 5. Chris Hughton. I'll be honest I don't see us being able to get Howe and Jokanovic (WBA couldn't afford him), Pearson doesn't fit with who we'd need imo either, also has a short fuse seemingly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riaz Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 47 minutes ago, Lrrr said: I'll be honest I don't see us being able to get Howe and Jokanovic (WBA couldn't afford him), Pearson doesn't fit with who we'd need imo either, also has a short fuse seemingly. Well yes. We may struggle to get those two. Any of the top 5. although i disagree with atheism general consensus that Chris Hughton is by far the best candidate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 2 hours ago, LondonBristolian said: Sorry if someone has already said this but the cheap option would have been keeping Lee Johnson. We'd have avoided a pay out on his contract, costs of compensation from other club AND the salary of a new manager all at the same time There is literally no chance we can go for the cheap option now. We decided not do it and that ship has now sailed. There is an argument that the cheap option you refer to, would cost us dearly in people failing to buy ST's or not turning up for games and spending at the stadium. There's more to making a decision about the goods being put on offer, than the person managing those goods. Consequently, it could have cost a lot more in real cash terms as well as goodwill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 3 hours ago, Riaz said: Well i think we should forget about this "proven" or "cheap" tag - thats my point i was trying to make. I want someone who has SOME sort of experience and done well for someone. Preferably someone who has taken someone up and kept them up. My top 5 are: 1. Eddie Howe 2. Slavisa jokanovic 3. Nigel Pearson 4. Paul Cook 5. Chris Hughton. I'd say only Cook and Hughton are realistic from those names. There's no way we'd bring in Pearson, especially after the rumours of how he left Watford. I doubt Howe would be interested/too expensive and Jokanovic too expensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackbird1 Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 Gerrard or Neil? Both dripping misery, nope not for me, not that I ever though Stevie would ever come here though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBristolian Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 28 minutes ago, Rich said: There is an argument that the cheap option you refer to, would cost us dearly in people failing to buy ST's or not turning up for games and spending at the stadium. There's more to making a decision about the goods being put on offer, than the person managing those goods. Consequently, it could have cost a lot more in real cash terms as well as goodwill. There's the same argument with a supposedly "Cheap option" appointment, which is exactly why I think the whole "we're going to go for the cheap option" argument is a bit daft. Mark Ashton and Steve Lansdown are by no means perfect but they have been around football long enough to know that the so-called "cheap option" doesn't exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 2 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said: There's the same argument with a supposedly "Cheap option" appointment, which is exactly why I think the whole "we're going to go for the cheap option" argument is a bit daft. Mark Ashton and Steve Lansdown are by no means perfect but they have been around football long enough to know that the so-called "cheap option" doesn't exist. Agreed, I think that's why it appears the majority and me included, don't want either cheap option. Rather have someone with a winning mentality and experienced in that process of winning. There are exceptions I know but, the same applies to bringing players in, I'd much rather have players who are used to success, than those used to failing, or not succeeding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcfc01 Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 On 18/07/2020 at 18:37, Alan Dicks said: Will us fans be underwhelmed.? End up right back at square one? its the Bristol City way. Or Am i just being negative and should keep my hopes up for an experienced managerial appointment? Anyone else feel the same way? I have no doubt that the club will not be looking at a "cheap option" and have specific high level candidates in mind. But we may well end up with that option - not so much "cheap" which is a bit disrespectful, but rather someone not near the top of the list. Hopefully not, but it wouldn't surprise me at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riaz Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 3 hours ago, Phileas Fogg said: I'd say only Cook and Hughton are realistic from those names. There's no way we'd bring in Pearson, especially after the rumours of how he left Watford. I doubt Howe would be interested/too expensive and Jokanovic too expensive. You are probably right, i just hope the club are going for these level of managers. If we get rejected, that’s fine. If you don’t ask, you don’t get Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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