PNE (h) - Wednesday 19:30 - What Can We Expect?

[Lrrr]

Just now, pnefcok said:

It's not so much 'rotation', just we have no good centre forwards so none of them can hold down their place.

Obviously with so many games in a short space of time there has been some rotation throughout the side but if we had a proper striker, like when we had Hugill, they would be starting every game. I'd probably expect us to play a winger up front tomorrow in Barkhuizen.

From watching the Birmingham highlights I wouldn't be surprised if you played Stockley, we'll play 3 at the back unless Holden changes so could see you play him and have him peel off onto outside CB's (probably Zak Vyner) and knock the ball down or flick on for runners coming off the wings/Johnson through the middle you seemed to like trying that.

[Mr Popodopolous]

4 hours ago, cidercity1987 said:

That is as shit a team as I would expect with your budget and yet you will win tomorrow and finish 6 points above us 

Yes, let's judge on budget shall we...such a decisive metric?

[pnefcok]

11 minutes ago, Lrrr said:

From watching the Birmingham highlights I wouldn't be surprised if you played Stockley, we'll play 3 at the back unless Holden changes so could see you play him and have him peel off onto outside CB's (probably Zak Vyner) and knock the ball down or flick on for runners coming off the wings/Johnson through the middle you seemed to like trying that.

It will depend on how Neil sees the game panning out. If we have most of the ball and your sat deep then he'll probably play Stockley and use him as a target to play off.

If you have most of the ball and we're looking to play on the counter, we'll probably play somebody more mobile than Stockley.

That's generally how Neil determines whether to use Stockley. It was different with Hugill because he was a big man but had the pace too so was the first name on the teamsheet every week.

[Mr Popodopolous]

15 minutes ago, Lrrr said:

From watching the Birmingham highlights I wouldn't be surprised if you played Stockley, we'll play 3 at the back unless Holden changes so could see you play him and have him peel off onto outside CB's (probably Zak Vyner) and knock the ball down or flick on for runners coming off the wings/Johnson through the middle you seemed to like trying that.

Possession at home- let's have a look shall we. Maybe shots for and against and on target too.

@pnefcok

In your opinion, is the slating your style of play tends to get on here altogether fair or no?

[Davefevs]

1 minute ago, pnefcok said:

It will depend on how Neil sees the game panning out. If we have most of the ball and your sat deep then he'll probably play Stockley and use him as a target to play off.
That would’ve been the plan under LJ.

If you have most of the ball and we're looking to play on the counter, we'll probably play somebody more mobile than Stockley.

Under Holden it appears we have a plan to pass it through the thirds, not always possible, but that is the intention.

That's generally how Neil determines whether to use Stockley. It was different with Hugill because he was a big man but had the pace too so was the first name on the teamsheet every week.

 

[pnefcok]

1 hour ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

In your opinion, is the slating your style of play tends to get on here altogether fair or no?

To an extent it is probably a bit unfair. I don't deny that sometimes we can be a tough watch, but we have one of the lowest budgets in the division and we can't splash out on the best strikers or the most technically gifted players, so it's harder for us to be good on the eye.

I'd also say that apart from a small handful of teams, there aren't many sides in this league who play "good football" or attractive football. The Championship is physical and a war of attrition.

As for diving and time-wasting, is it right? No but everyone does it to see out results, especially away from home.

[Lrrr]

2 minutes ago, pnefcok said:

As for diving and time-wasting, is it right? No but everyone does it to see out results, especially away from home.

I think our fans call it out because I don’t remember a time where it’s been accepted to condoned for city players to do it, which is why we get frustrated when others do it. Add Warnock has been a fierce rival of city for over a decade now and his preferred style of play.

[Mr Popodopolous]

5 minutes ago, pnefcok said:

To an extent it is probably a bit unfair. I don't deny that sometimes we can be a tough watch, but we have one of the lowest budgets in the division and we can't splash out on the best strikers or the most technically gifted players, so it's harder for us to be good on the eye.

I'd also say that apart from a small handful of teams, there aren't many sides in this league who play "good football" or attractive football. The Championship is physical and a war of attrition.

As for diving and time-wasting, is it right? No but everyone does it to see out results, especially away from home.

Thanks.

You'll know better than me but you were quite high scoring at home early in the season.

Seem to recall you created some decent numbers of chances/had some possession too- from what I saw anyway, on TV highlights and that.

Your midfield looks quite good- Johnson, Gallagher, Pearson, Barkhuzien- those in and around midfield, strike me as quite good players?

[Peter1450]

18 hours ago, pnefcok said:

We might see one or two changes from the weekend now we can't get into the play-offs. Tom Bayliss might play having hardly played all season. A prospect we bought for £1.5m but deemed not ready by Neil and has found it hard to break into a very strong midfield.

Talk of having a strong midfield will not be understood on the otib forum....

[Major Isewater]

On 21/07/2020 at 08:07, Coombsy said:

New manger unveiled 

Away  . 

[Davefevs]

Cmon @Lez this pre-match write-up won’t write itself

[Lez]

1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

Cmon @Lez this pre-match write-up won’t write itself

I will do it tomorrow when I've taken my daughter home.

[Lrrr]

5 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Cmon @Lez this pre-match write-up won’t write itself

 

3 minutes ago, Lez said:

I will do it tomorrow when I've taken my daughter home.

eeerrrrrrrrrrrr 

[City oz]

5 minutes ago, Lez said:

I will do it tomorrow when I've taken my daughter home.

So is Dave fes having a break on this pre match build up as well. The only excuse Dave fes will have is if he’s on a plane to OZ to catch up at tittle creatures 

[Davefevs]

5 minutes ago, Lez said:

I will do it tomorrow when I've taken my daughter home.

Okay, so you’re not doing it then.

@Lrrr do you wanna do the tactical bit, and I’ll add the player bit afterwards?

[Davefevs]

Just now, City oz said:

So is Dave fes having a break on this pre match build up as well. The only excuse Dave fes will have is if he’s on a plane to OZ to catch up at tittle creatures 

No, not taking a break....offered an opportunity to Lez to provide us all with his world leading insight into tonight’s match.  He accepted, now he’s reneged.

[underhanded]

Saw the PNE coaching staff walking around the harbour yesterday evening. There kitman Steve Cowell also ran the park run I occasionally do last season (Ashton Court) - I hear he tries to do one whenever they play away on a Saturday. He clearly likes getting out and about on away days!

[Lez]

Just now, Davefevs said:

No, not taking a break....offered an opportunity to Lez to provide us all with his world leading insight into tonight’s match.  He accepted, now he’s reneged.

Since when are you in charge.

[City oz]

On 21/07/2020 at 14:07, Coombsy said:

New manger unveiled 

Yes and a 3 _ 1 home win. 

[Yank]

I am leading a staff meeting around 2 pm my time (Match starts at 230 pm my time) and I intend to  end as quickly as possible so can get back to my office and watch.  Usually this type of meeting is supposed to take close to an hour but I figure today I will just pretend I have the trots so can end it early

Let's end the season on a high.

COYR

[deadredfred]

33 minutes ago, Yank said:

but I figure today I will just pretend I have the trots so can end it early

Let's end the season on a high.

COYR

Ahh yes, a difficult case of the Beniks 

[Lrrr]

Just had a quick go, watched some of Preston’s games against Birmingham and Brentford, just a few notes on shape and tactical style will leave @Davefevs to look at individual players if he wants.

They play a 4231 which seems to be their preferred choice style, but lately they have also played variations of 343, 451 and 352.

Against Birmingham in possession they played in a shape resembling 2431 seen below their full backs push higher than the centre mids who form a box with the centre backs maintaining balance of numbers. Out of possession at times dropped into a 4141.

Preston played Stockley upfront presenting the opportunity to hit him with long balls where he would either knock the ball down or flick on for one of Preston’s 3 behind him to run onto, if he plays against him he could peel onto one of the outside CB’s (Vyner potentially due to less experience) to try and gain an advantage with space behind our wing backs. This helped Preston where they seemed to try and get behind the defensive line to whip crosses or get cut backs back across the box.

Another characteristic of Preston’s shape is their preference for playing narrow, they stay compact and prefer not to go out to players leaving gaps. For City with wing backs could mean a lot of space for our players to operate in with Wells making runs. We can see the Brentford player has got ahead of his man with space to run into. PNE’s left back can’t move wider or it would leave a chance for Watkins to be played in.

Speaking of places for Ollie Watkins to run into, PNE seemed to have trouble with players drifting and making runs across their back line which lead to Brentford’s goal, Watkins makes a run along the back line with Benrahma slotting a pass. Note the narrowness of PNE’s back line again, lots of space for a RWB to get into an advanced position.

Looking at Preston’s shot map for the season we can see a high density of shots between the penalty spot and into the 6 yard box, relates back to the idea of Preston looking to get in behind and get crosses/cut backs.

Looking at their corners we can see a mixture of inswingers and outswingers from the left corner but from the right we see they tend to stick to outswingers. On their attacking corner tactics in recent games their bunch of players tends to run front post for a ball delivered into the group.

Watch out for Bauer, who loops behind and looks to sweep up behind should the ball make it through the pack and recently resulted in a goal. Also watch out for Hughes (16) blocking markers for Stockley (20) recently had Wickham score after Baker was blocked from staying with his man, Preston could look to repeat that.

On the defensive side of corners Preston use zonal marking, 4 men line the 6 yard box, one man front of the 6 yard box, leaves the player edge of the box with a big distance to man mid box and a chance to get a run on him as well as the number 3 at the back of the box unmarked as well. Zonal marking presenting the opportunity the flood the part of the box we think they’re weakest.

Thoughts @pnefcok?

[Davefevs]

Line-up:

Last week v Birmingham (h) they went with a 4231 as follows:

 

May we’ll be changes tonight with nothing riding on the game, other than rubbing our noses in it again.

The Players:

 

Declan Rudd - GK - ex-Norwich goalie, who had previously had a loan spell at PNE earlier in career.  Established number 1, and decent keeper at this level.

Joe Rafferty - RB - arrived on a free transfer from Rochdale in 12/13, and can play either fullback.  If he gets into advanced positions in the inside right, he’s gonna be right up Baker’s Street!!

Andrew Hughes - LB - late(ish) arrival to championship football, now 28 having played at Newport and even Mangotsfield Utd.  Steady LB who has been a fairly regular player since arriving from Peterborough

Patrick Bauer - CB - German Centre-Back, arrived on a free from Charlton in the summer.  Can’t believe he wasn’t given the 24 shirt.  Has really improved them against crosses this season. Scored against us in the fixture back in September.

Jordan Storey - CB - former Exeter man who joined last summer for £800k.  Not had much game time due to the solid partnership of Bauer and Davies.

Ryan Ledson - CM - Everton youngster who arrived at Deepdale via Oxford in August 2016.  Limited appearances due to Pearson being the key-man in the DM role.  Good technically.

Paul Gallagher - CM - crafty player (or a 35 with nous?) but very good technically especially at set-pieces.  I will be counting the feigned clash of head injuries tonight.

Daniel Johnson - AM - Good player, silky on the ball with his left foot, but typifies the PNE midfield tactic....if you’re trying to take a free-kick, just stands on the ball, or kicks it away when ref not watching.

In seriousness, Pearson, Johnson and Gallagher are 3 key players in Neil’s side.  Glad Pearson out tonight.

Brad Potts - LF/CF - ex Blackpool and Barnsley man who joined in the winter window last season. One of those players that doesn’t fit a position, but can play along the forward line, preferably wide.  Just 2 goals this season, but puts in a shift, and will stop our WBs getting out.

Josh Harrop - LF - ex-Man Utd youngster who’s back in the first team fold after an ACL injury.  8 goals this season.

Tom Barkhuisen - CF/RF - converted winger who’s played for a few of the NW coastal town clubs.  Good player with eye for a goal.

Others:

Alan Browne - CM / RM - Josh Brownhill ear-a-like who is in and out of the side this season.  Likes a goal from midfield.

Ben Pearson - CM - dirty little shit....but good player.  Expected to be out injured tonight. @GrahamC’s favourite player!

David Nugent - CF - experienced forward and nephew of Emily and brother of Spider.  Famed for his goal on debut for England...just ask Defoe!

Billy Bodin - RF / LF - ex-Gas, son of Paul who played for Bath and Newport.

Sean Maguire - LF/CF - Seany Maguire, Seany Maguire, he drinks the Guinness, he drinks the Murphy’s, his curtain’s are ******’ massive.  Ex-Eastenders and Scott & Bailey actor who is also a Nippy striker with hamstrings made of cheese strings.  Always on the half turn, and tidy finisher

Darnell Fisher - RB - one of those young (albeit now 25) attacking, energetic right backs that we’ve hankered after for years who turn up at clubs and we think why have t we got someone.  In the mould of Christie, Darikwa etc.  I do think you can get at him though.

Ben Davies - CB - highly rated defender, who’s come through the ranks and several loan spells to be one of the most sought after CBS in the division.  Got a good all round game and settled into a good partnership with Bauer.  Injury likely to rule him out tonight.

Scott Sinclair - LW - other half of Corrie’s Helen Flanagan and ex-Gas.
 

How Do We Win:

APPOINT ALEX NEIL

[Carey 6]

11 hours ago, pnefcok said:

To an extent it is probably a bit unfair. I don't deny that sometimes we can be a tough watch, but we have one of the lowest budgets in the division and we can't splash out on the best strikers or the most technically gifted players, so it's harder for us to be good on the eye.

I'd also say that apart from a small handful of teams, there aren't many sides in this league who play "good football" or attractive football. The Championship is physical and a war of attrition.

As for diving and time-wasting, is it right? No but everyone does it to see out results, especially away from home.

I was at your season opener when you played Millwall, what a truly terrible match that was, you probably would've got a point if Rudd didn't have quavers for hands!

Honestly though, our football has been just as bad if not worse the past two years. 

I spoke with one of your players yesterday about Neil and he basically said he goes for a solid team which in turn affects the attacking side of the game sometimes. Said he's a very good coach though!

I think I'd take him here. He's been promoted before & to have you up there every season with the budget he gets is a bloody good job.

[LondonBristolian]

12 hours ago, Lrrr said:

I think our fans call it out because I don’t remember a time where it’s been accepted to condoned for city players to do it, which is why we get frustrated when others do it. Add Warnock has been a fierce rival of city for over a decade now and his preferred style of play.

I think the other thing is we're so vulnerable to it. 100% record against Warnock and unbeaten against Preston (so far at least) this season but generally time-wasting and faking injuries to slow play seem to be incredibly effective ways to disrupt us and get a win. If it didn't work, it'd be nowhere near as annoying. 

[Lrrr]

 

One extra piece, Whoscored doesn't really like being copy and pasted but from this average position chart we can get the idea of how high Preston's full backs like to get and the interlinking play of their front 4

[Davefevs]

Just now, Lrrr said:

 

One extra piece, Whoscored doesn't really like being copy and pasted but from this average position chart we can get the idea of how high Preston's full backs like to get and the interlinking play of their front 4

Very one-sided game of Connect 4

[ExiledAjax]

@Lrrr & @Davefevs firstly, I can't imagine anyone could do a better job. Thanks as always.

One question: So how do we beat them?

A tight 4231 suggests to me that we should stick with our 352, with Dasilva and Hunt exploiting the space on the wings to get crosses in. This would be a diversionary tactic, really looking to stretch their formation rather than looking to score from one of those crosses. To create the real scoring chances I'd probably also use Paterson in the centre to try and drag on of their two defensive midfielders out of position. Hopefully that might open up space for Wells to make the kind of runs that @Lrrr highlights Watkins doing.

I'd be tempted to play Eliasson, again as he'd likely have a decent amount of time and space to put in some decent crosses. My concern would be that all those crosses would be heading into a packed out penalty box, and players like Bauer and Rudd would have little trouble dealing with them.

Defensively I suspect we'd see the back three playing wide when in possession, as we did against Swansea. Tighten up when Preston's 3 have the ball and hope that Nagy or Massengo can break up that attacking midfield play up before it breaks on the shores of our defence.

That's my fag-packet tactics. Any ideas?

[GrahamC]

@Davefevs To be fair to Pearson, he has significantly improved his disciplinary record this season with 9 yellows, as opposed to 14 yellows & 3 reds (!) last season & 15 yellows & 1 red the year before.

Lots of rumours that he is off this summer (in the last year of his contract) so maybe his “injury” is as a result of that..

[Lrrr]

2 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

@Lrrr & @Davefevs firstly, I can't imagine anyone could do a better job. Thanks as always.

One question: So how do we beat them?

A tight 4231 suggests to me that we should stick with our 352, with Dasilva and Hunt exploiting the space on the wings to get crosses in. This would be a diversionary tactic, really looking to stretch their formation rather than looking to score from one of those crosses. To create the real scoring chances I'd probably also use Paterson in the centre to try and drag on of their two defensive midfielders out of position. Hopefully that might open up space for Wells to make the kind of runs that @Lrrr highlights Watkins doing.

I'd be tempted to play Eliasson, again as he'd likely have a decent amount of time and space to put in some decent crosses. My concern would be that all those crosses would be heading into a packed out penalty box, and players like Bauer and Rudd would have little trouble dealing with them.

Defensively I suspect we'd see the back three playing wide when in possession, as we did against Swansea. Tighten up when Preston's 3 have the ball and hope that Nagy or Massengo can break up that attacking midfield play up before it breaks on the shores of our defence.

That's my fag-packet tactics. Any ideas?

It may not be many people's choice but I'd be tempted to go with Wells and Weimann upfront. If Dasilva and whoever plays RWB do get that time and space try and have Weimann and Wells making runs between CB and FB to get in behind them, either they stay rigid and we can get balls in behind or someone has to follow the runner and open gaps in their back line. As with the picture of Watkins those horizontal runs across the backline could work if W&W coordinated their runs and could see Pato threading passes. Pato as you say will be key as well. I agree our CB's will split in possession 1 upfront for PNE means we can be patient in possession and see if their 3 in behind stay or come to support the forward. If they stay we would have to try and break them down but if they get drawn out again it will open gaps in their midfield especially with 3 CM's for us. I'd love us to get creative with our corners too.