havanatopia Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 1 hour ago, Club and Country said: Glad we haven’t gone for him, he’s an absolute crackpot (from someone who has worked closely with him) His name is a bit of a giveaway though in all fairness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RED4LIFE Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 Ffs, we have no games for ages, the players are having a break and we don't appear to be that active in the transfer market yet. If the club feel like they want to take time to decide who our next gaffer is, now would be the time to do it. Whether they make the right decision remains to be seen but I, personally, have no issues with the club taking their time over this. However, if Holden or Macallister get the job after all this I will not be impressed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EstoniaTallinnRed Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 1 minute ago, RED4LIFE said: Ffs, we have no games for ages, the players are having a break and we don't appear to be that active in the transfer market yet. If the club feel like they want to take time to decide who our next gaffer is, now would be the time to do it. Whether they make the right decision remains to be seen but I, personally, have no issues with the club taking their time over this. However, if Holden or Macallister get the job after all this I will not be impressed. Who would! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creg Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 24 minutes ago, RED4LIFE said: Ffs, we have no games for ages, the players are having a break and we don't appear to be that active in the transfer market yet. If the club feel like they want to take time to decide who our next gaffer is, now would be the time to do it. Whether they make the right decision remains to be seen but I, personally, have no issues with the club taking their time over this. However, if Holden or Macallister get the job after all this I will not be impressed. Totally agree with all you’ve said here mate, but it takes almost no effort for the club to issue some kind of comms to reassure everything is ticking along at the expected rate in the background and that the club is taking their time on this. As it stands, the silence is causing all sorts of rumours to spill from both the media and the fans, most notably that we got knocked back by our main target (which is a dreadful look). Some kind of statement to the effect that we’re pressing on with our preferred candidates would go a long way to killing off all the speculation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redrascal2 Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 2 hours ago, Finley_Smith10 said: Birmingham just appointed Karanka as their head coach What is taking City so long as it’ll be 5 weeks since we sacked LJ tomorrow surely a interview process doesn’t take 5 weeks Obviously never applied the Lansdown due diligence approach!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaun Taylor Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 1 hour ago, EstoniaTallinnRed said: I've got a feeling that after all this speculation it will be Holden who's in charge at the beginning of the season. I really hope I am very very wrong, but somehow I still have a certain dread that this might happen. Reminds me of when Lee Power appointed Luke Williams on a five year contract Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChippenhamRed Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 2 hours ago, RED4LIFE said: Ffs, we have no games for ages, the players are having a break and we don't appear to be that active in the transfer market yet. If the club feel like they want to take time to decide who our next gaffer is, now would be the time to do it. Whether they make the right decision remains to be seen but I, personally, have no issues with the club taking their time over this. However, if Holden or Macallister get the job after all this I will not be impressed. When LJ was sacked it was 10 weeks until the new season. An efficient recruitment process - quickly homing in on desirable yet realistic candidates they should already have had in mind - would have given the new man ample time to assess his squad, plan and execute transfers, and implement his philosophy. He may even have had a game or two in which to experiment. Instead we have spent 4 weeks on some mind-bogglingly convaluted recruitment process. The new man will have less time for all of the above and we will be less well prepared for next season than we could have been. There needs to be a damn good reason why it’s taking this long and I’d bloody love to know what it is. In the absence of even a shred of information I’m struggling to conclude anything other than boardroom incompetence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTFABM Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 3 hours ago, Leveller said: You do realise Clotet announced he was leaving Brum about a month before we sacked LJ? Shush that spoils the whole thread. They like to have a reason to feel hard done by Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTFABM Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 1 hour ago, Creg said: Totally agree with all you’ve said here mate, but it takes almost no effort for the club to issue some kind of comms to reassure everything is ticking along at the expected rate in the background and that the club is taking their time on this. As it stands, the silence is causing all sorts of rumours to spill from both the media and the fans, most notably that we got knocked back by our main target (which is a dreadful look). Some kind of statement to the effect that we’re pressing on with our preferred candidates would go a long way to killing off all the speculation. Can you please find me a statement from any club at any time that has ever issued a statement saying something along the lines of “everything is ticking along at the expected rate in the background and that the club is taking it’s time on this” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 4 hours ago, Club and Country said: Glad we haven’t gone for him, he’s an absolute crackpot (from someone who has worked closely with him) Is he? Do tell, why is he a crackpot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 39 minutes ago, GTFABM said: Can you please find me a statement from any club at any time that has ever issued a statement saying something along the lines of “everything is ticking along at the expected rate in the background and that the club is taking it’s time on this” Spot on! Having worked with the media for over 30 years, organisations will tell the world something when there is something to tell, they won’t speculate and they won’t put out half-arsed statements just to appease impatient and unrealistic football fans, and nor should they .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRock Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 2 hours ago, ChippenhamRed said: When LJ was sacked it was 10 weeks until the new season. An efficient recruitment process - quickly homing in on desirable yet realistic candidates they should already have had in mind - would have given the new man ample time to assess his squad, plan and execute transfers, and implement his philosophy. He may even have had a game or two in which to experiment. Instead we have spent 4 weeks on some mind-bogglingly convaluted recruitment process. The new man will have less time for all of the above and we will be less well prepared for next season than we could have been. There needs to be a damn good reason why it’s taking this long and I’d bloody love to know what it is. In the absence of even a shred of information I’m struggling to conclude anything other than boardroom incompetence. The affliction ‘analysis paralysis’ seems to have spread from the Manager’s Office to the Boardroom regrettably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RED4LIFE Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 2 hours ago, ChippenhamRed said: When LJ was sacked it was 10 weeks until the new season. An efficient recruitment process - quickly homing in on desirable yet realistic candidates they should already have had in mind - would have given the new man ample time to assess his squad, plan and execute transfers, and implement his philosophy. He may even have had a game or two in which to experiment. Instead we have spent 4 weeks on some mind-bogglingly convaluted recruitment process. The new man will have less time for all of the above and we will be less well prepared for next season than we could have been. There needs to be a damn good reason why it’s taking this long and I’d bloody love to know what it is. In the absence of even a shred of information I’m struggling to conclude anything other than boardroom incompetence. CR, I completely understand your concern and I also have the same concerns but my point being was that IF the board wanted to take their time, now is the optimum time to do it. That wasn't me excusing it. Do I think it should take this long? Absolutely not. Do I think we will get the best available manager? Absolutely not. Do I think that there are conflicting opinions within the hiring 'committee' ? Absolutely yes, and it all depends on who has the most clout in this situation. Let's face it, it should never take this long to pick a football manager considering there are very few of them with professional experience. Its not like choosing an accountant, or a delivery driver where there are literally thousands of qualified people (no offence to people in these industries btw). We are talking a couple of hundred people in this country and maybe a few hundred more around the world with the CV and experience required to do the job. A competent board shouldve already known who they wanted within 5-10 options before sacking LJ and would've moved swiftly to try and get one of those within days of the position being open. Not us though, we take our time and try to dress it up as doing it the right way rather than get someone in who couldve spent the last few weeks getting used to the way we work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChippenhamRed Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 5 minutes ago, RED4LIFE said: CR, I completely understand your concern and I also have the same concerns but my point being was that IF the board wanted to take their time, now is the optimum time to do it. That wasn't me excusing it. Do I think it should take this long? Absolutely not. Do I think we will get the best available manager? Absolutely not. Do I think that there are conflicting opinions within the hiring 'committee' ? Absolutely yes, and it all depends on who has the most clout in this situation. Let's face it, it should never take this long to pick a football manager considering there are very few of them with professional experience. Its not like choosing an accountant, or a delivery driver where there are literally thousands of qualified people (no offence to people in these industries btw). We are talking a couple of hundred people in this country and maybe a few hundred more around the world with the CV and experience required to do the job. A competent board shouldve already known who they wanted within 5-10 options before sacking LJ and would've moved swiftly to try and get one of those within days of the position being open. Not us though, we take our time and try to dress it up as doing it the right way rather than get someone in who couldve spent the last few weeks getting used to the way we work. 100% agree! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RED4LIFE Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 17 minutes ago, ChippenhamRed said: 100% agree! Concerning this part of your previous post: There needs to be a damn good reason why it’s taking this long and I’d bloody love to know what it is. In the absence of even a shred of information I’m struggling to conclude anything other than boardroom incompetence. The only reason I can see is a financial one. Mainly, we are talking the wrong appointment could cost the club millions in mis-spent money. With the way finances have been reduced for the vast majority of non-Premier League clubs in this current pandemic climate, I have the feeling we DO have finances spare to improve the squad. This would put us in a very small group of clubs in the Championship who do have spending power and could/may put us in a position to make the most of it to give us an advantage that we probably wouldn't have had pre-pandemic. Thus, the managerial appointment becomes even more crucial. I have to caveat that with the fact I would feel very uncomfortable with us spending large sums on transfer fees when we have been making staff redundant. For me, I would give up the chance of promotion in an instant if it meant that those staff members could still pay their mortgages/rent and put food on their tables. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 Right back at the start of this recruitment “process”, I said on Forever Bristol City podcast that I thought it shouldn’t be all give, give, give from the new manager, e.g. accepting budget, structure / reporting etc, and that City might have to flex to get the right man. It can’t be a one way street if the club want to get the best man with the best fit to achieve the future aims of the club. I think this is exactly the roundabout City and the potential managers are on at the mo. They had it easy with Lee, because he was happy to tow the line. I bet he’ll learn from this. City thought they were really attractive, but once they’ve started interviewing, they’ve got to the bit where they say “have you got any questions for us”, and rather than getting inconsequential questions that get asked in normal jobs, like, is there a staff car park, can you work from home, they’ve almost had roles reversed and MA and whoever is interviewing with him are being grilled instead. Its reached a bit of an impasse, where the only one who’s given them the answers they want is Dean Holden, because in some respects he knew the questions up front....but I hope / reckon that the interview team have gone away and thought - “well, none of the top names interviewed as we expected them to, they were very demanding, perhaps we need a bit of time to rethink, do we need to compromise”. You could imagine MA spinning it as “second interview”, but I sense it’s a “shit, we’ve massively underestimated what the right calibre manager demands, another LJ won’t get us promoted, and that’s what Steve wants”. Suddenly, as chief recruiter, MA is in the firing line. He won’t be able to blame and then sack the man he appointed through a rigorous process, because SL didn’t pick this man, like he did with Johnson. Its all got a bit messy. Recoverable? Yes, but not a great start for relationships between the board and new appointment when it is done. (all very speculative from me I appreciate) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superjack Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 I may throw my toys out of the pram if we end up with Holden or someone of similar ilk who doesn't fit the criteria for Lansdown's stated aim of the Premier, but I am prepared to be patient. The day that Johnson was sacked was a day that I had begun to believe would never come. I only need to remind myself that for me it had got to the point where I frankly just wanted anyone else with a bit of positivity and propensity to entertain. As far as I'm concerned, the most important bit has been done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RED4LIFE Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 3 minutes ago, Davefevs said: Right back at the start of this recruitment “process”, I said on Forever Bristol City podcast that I thought it shouldn’t be all give, give, give from the new manager, e.g. accepting budget, structure / reporting etc, and that City might have to flex to get the right man. It can’t be a one way street if the club want to get the best man with the best fit to achieve the future aims of the club. I think this is exactly the roundabout City and the potential managers are on at the mo. They had it easy with Lee, because he was happy to tow the line. I bet he’ll learn from this. City thought they were really attractive, but once they’ve started interviewing, they’ve got to the bit where they say “have you got any questions for us”, and rather than getting inconsequential questions that get asked in normal jobs, like, is there a staff car park, can you work from home, they’ve almost had roles reversed and MA and whoever is interviewing with him are being grilled instead. Its reached a bit of an impasse, where the only one who’s given them the answers they want is Dean Holden, because in some respects he knew the questions up front....but I hope / reckon that the interview team have gone away and thought - “well, none of the top names interviewed as we expected them to, they were very demanding, perhaps we need a bit of time to rethink, do we need to compromise”. You could imagine MA spinning it as “second interview”, but I sense it’s a “shit, we’ve massively underestimated what the right calibre manager demands, another LJ won’t get us promoted, and that’s what Steve wants”. Suddenly, as chief recruiter, MA is in the firing line. He won’t be able to blame and then sack the man he appointed through a rigorous process, because SL didn’t pick this man, like he did with Johnson. Its all got a bit messy. Recoverable? Yes, but not a great start for relationships between the board and new appointment when it is done. (all very speculative from me I appreciate) Without a doubt, there is definitely an element of truth there Dave. Its almost as if they have believed the media hype that we are a well run and financed club and and have convinced themselves that we must not deviate from this path without realising that the best people constantly adapt to changing circumstances. O'Driscoll called it when he was appointed, when he said that managers in the future will benefit from the processes he was implementing at the time. He knew the club was an utter shower of shit and had to be dragged into modern times but it would take years that he wouldn't be given to do that. For me, Its starting to feel like that all over again where the decision makers either won't or can't change from their vision due to blinkered pride. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Balls Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 It may be that with the exception of Dean Holden, who may well be LJ Mark 2 in terms of bending to the requirements of the current structure, plus considerably cheaper than more experienced managers, the others being interviewed know their own worth, and also want reassurances about how things will be set up, especially in regards to hiring their own team of coaching staff and also on how potential transfer targets are identified and ultimately acquired. It may be more of a 2-way negotiation than any of us realise. And just for context of how a successful manager can fail within a structure that doesn’t suit them, just have a quick read about Bielsa’s immediate experience before taking over at Leeds. By the sounds of it, he wouldn’t like the structure developed here, and that might be the sticking point for others. https://www.theguardian.com/football/2017/nov/30/marcelo-bielsas-short-lived-catastrophe-at-lille-is-coming-to-an-end Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RED4LIFE Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 4 hours ago, Creg said: Totally agree with all you’ve said here mate, but it takes almost no effort for the club to issue some kind of comms to reassure everything is ticking along at the expected rate in the background and that the club is taking their time on this. As it stands, the silence is causing all sorts of rumours to spill from both the media and the fans, most notably that we got knocked back by our main target (which is a dreadful look). Some kind of statement to the effect that we’re pressing on with our preferred candidates would go a long way to killing off all the speculation. We've been supporters long enough to know whatever the club say in the media, some fans will twist it to make it seem worse than intended. The most sensible option for the club (any club for that matter) is to say nothing and only say something once contracts have been signed. I actually agree with the media silence from the club until they have something concrete to tell us. Otherwise its just irrelevant platitudes to please the impatient. Surely nobody would be interested in Mark Ashton saying ' we have looked at all the available options, and we know the type of person we, as a club, want to take us forward. We have had many interesting applications which we are going through individually to try and find the right fit for this football club. We need someone with the right passion, knowledge and DNA to synergise with our current staff and the vision we have moving forward. As soon as we have found this person we will make a further statement" Yes, its frustrating but if there's nothing to report whats the point of a statement? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
City oz Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 10 hours ago, Finley_Smith10 said: Birmingham just appointed Karanka as their head coach What is taking City so long as it’ll be 5 weeks since we sacked LJ tomorrow surely a interview process doesn’t take 5 weeks Most on here said Robbie Fowler was going to Brum now for the last 3 or 4 weeks. Robbie is in the UK and it has been floated around that he is negotiating with a championship club. His wife and three young kiddies want to stay in the UK. If its not Birmingham then it could be another championship club starting with B. Bring on the aubergines Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swanker Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 6 hours ago, BS4 on Tour... said: Is he? Do tell, why is he a crackpot? Yeah, I’d like to know as well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harvey54 Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 6 hours ago, RED4LIFE said: Concerning this part of your previous post: There needs to be a damn good reason why it’s taking this long and I’d bloody love to know what it is. In the absence of even a shred of information I’m struggling to conclude anything other than boardroom incompetence. The only reason I can see is a financial one. Mainly, we are talking the wrong appointment could cost the club millions in mis-spent money. With the way finances have been reduced for the vast majority of non-Premier League clubs in this current pandemic climate, I have the feeling we DO have finances spare to improve the squad. This would put us in a very small group of clubs in the Championship who do have spending power and could/may put us in a position to make the most of it to give us an advantage that we probably wouldn't have had pre-pandemic. Thus, the managerial appointment becomes even more crucial. I have to caveat that with the fact I would feel very uncomfortable with us spending large sums on transfer fees when we have been making staff redundant. For me, I would give up the chance of promotion in an instant if it meant that those staff members could still pay their mortgages/rent and put food on their tables. Of course it's dragging on because of finances. Hughton wants the job, Hughton is the best man for the job but.... Hughton is expensive. The board would appear to be hesitating at the risk. Having a long drawn out interview process gives them the chance to appoint a cheaper option whilst justifying it by saying it was due diligence. It's ok saying that you're ambition is Prem football but trying to get there by selling your best assets, sorry, players won't get you there. Same if the club doesn't appoint Hughton. $teve £an$down has done so much for the club but he really needs to show us some ambition with this appointment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red white and red Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 For some reason, and I don’t know why, this thread reminds me of those seasons where we lost 0-3 at home in the first game, and everybody was deflated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
City oz Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 1 hour ago, harvey54 said: Of course it's dragging on because of finances. Hughton wants the job, Hughton is the best man for the job but.... Hughton is expensive. The board would appear to be hesitating at the risk. Having a long drawn out interview process gives them the chance to appoint a cheaper option whilst justifying it by saying it was due diligence. It's ok saying that you're ambition is Prem football but trying to get there by selling your best assets, sorry, players won't get you there. Same if the club doesn't appoint Hughton. $teve £an$down has done so much for the club but he really needs to show us some ambition with this appointment Houghton can I suggest is probably not coming to BS3. His salary would not be the issue but the Lansdown crew micro management would be the issue. even if Houghton was engaged and ended up the top earning manager in the championship at BS3 this can not be compared to what we have spent on some players in recent years, especially when you take in to account original transfer fees, relocation costs, monthly salary, cars etc We need a manager with experience and also some credibility as being a famous player for a premiership club to bring the profile up so we can promote to other clubs in the Championship we mean serious business next season. I think the issue why no one has been appointed or made public yet is not because of money it is because a new manager coming in is hesitant and been advised by his advisors there is a culture within the club at the highest level where the manager maybe when in that roll will not have a free reign on his decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrongagain Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 Takes a hell of a long time to produce a rolls Royce if you only budget for a Ford popular! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harvey54 Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 5 minutes ago, dave36 said: Takes a hell of a long time to produce a rolls Royce if you only budget for a Ford popular! And one that runs on Thatchers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bar BS3 Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 14 hours ago, Monkeh said: I can understand waiting till the end of the season to appoint someone and would defend the club over it, But they are taking the ******* piss now, That depends who we appoint. If we get Hughton, it's not taking the piss. If we appoint Holden, it is. I'd prefer to wait than to have appointed Karanka. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveInSA Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 We’ll announce Gerrard on Monday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedorDead BCFC Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 I heard we are waiting on FA cup day to go for either Mikal Arteta or Frank Lampard. Don’t go out putting bets on I forgot to get the odds fixed at the time I placed my bet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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