Jump to content

Welcome to One Team in Bristol - Bristol City Forums

Welcome to One Team in Bristol - Bristol City Forums, like most online communities you must register to view or post in our community, but don't worry this is a simple free process that requires minimal information for you to signup. Be a part of One Team in Bristol - Bristol City Forums by signing in or creating an account.

  • Start new topics and reply to others
  • Full access to all forums (not all viewable as guest)
  • Subscribe to topics and forums to get email updates
  • Get your own profile page and make new friends
  • Send personal messages to other members.
  • Support OTIB with a premium membership

Is it fair for us to want promotion?


Recommended Posts

It seems to be generally accepted that promotion is the aim - and although I applaud the ambition, is it really fair?

A new manager is going to be judged on this yardstick, even though we haven't graced the top tier for roughly 40 years - that's hardly right for the new guy, is it?

After all, we've only come close to achieving promotion to the top flight once in the whole forty years!

Could it be off putting to some of the names being mentioned - some might respond along the lines of, 'Christ, you want me to do something that no one else has done since 1978?  Sure, I'll just go and turn this glass of water into wine whilst I'm at it.'

I'll be interest to read any thoughts on the subject.

 

  • Like 1
  • Haha 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

I think what's fair is to expect honesty from the board. Far too often they say promotion is the goal, which raises fans' expectations, only to not back it up. The latest example of that is the ongoing managerial debale. If they want the play-offs or simply to stay in this division, they should just be up front about it. They'd get a lot less slack for that, IMO. 

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

It's probably unrealistic to expect it. But get the right manager in and the right improvements to the squad and it's certainly possible.

Yep. Was gonna post almost exactly this. We might not have one of the two best squads, but it is good enough for promotion if the right manager can get them playing greater than the sum of their parts. That was LJ’s issue, we’d often get beaten by lesser players who played as a greater team. 

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

We need to have goals and aims, and a target - so what should we aim for, or target? Finish 9th? Finish above Preston? 

Having managed three consecutive top half finishes, getting in the top six has to be the minimum target. If Millwall can finish 8th twice in three seasons, then a minimum target of 6th and a shot at the play-offs is absolutely fair to my mind.

This is why Johnson was a flop - he had four attempts, and got nowhere near.

Go back to SL's interview in December 2015 and he was saying then: I want us challenging at the other end of the table.

We should be two play-off failures in by now, and building a squad ready to make a serious assault on automatic promotion. 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

A respectable play off push should be classed as a good season for us. One day we might just sneak into the prem. A season where a good group of players gel with a good manager in charge and we could finish top 2 but those seasons are few and far between. 2018 could’ve been that year IMO

Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, reddogkev said:

It seems to be generally accepted that promotion is the aim - and although I applaud the ambition, is it really fair?

A new manager is going to be judged on this yardstick, even though we haven't graced the top tier for roughly 40 years - that's hardly right for the new guy, is it?

After all, we've only come close to achieving promotion to the top flight once in the whole forty years!

Could it be off putting to some of the names being mentioned - some might respond along the lines of, 'Christ, you want me to do something that no one else has done since 1978?  Sure, I'll just go and turn this glass of water into wine whilst I'm at it.'

I'll be interest to read any thoughts on the subject.

 

SL thinks it’s fair. So if he does, I do! 
 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Of course it's all right to want it. The players and management do, so why not the support. It also has to be the target, as it should be with the other 23 teams in the Championship. There's little point in being in a competition if you're not at least goinf to try and win it. 

Whether we should expect it is a different matter. I don't know if I expect to win promotion, but with the facilities and players available to us I do expect to be competitive enough to go close. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
38 minutes ago, reddogkev said:

It seems to be generally accepted that promotion is the aim - and although I applaud the ambition, is it really fair?

A new manager is going to be judged on this yardstick, even though we haven't graced the top tier for roughly 40 years - that's hardly right for the new guy, is it?

After all, we've only come close to achieving promotion to the top flight once in the whole forty years!

Could it be off putting to some of the names being mentioned - some might respond along the lines of, 'Christ, you want me to do something that no one else has done since 1978?  Sure, I'll just go and turn this glass of water into wine whilst I'm at it.'

I'll be interest to read any thoughts on the subject.

 

Why does the history have any relevance? Football and expectations of success have nothing to do with what happened 40 years ago. If the aim is promotion then so be it. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

SL thinks it’s fair. So if he does, I do! 
 

If he thinks it's fair and it's what he wants or even expects, then he has to seriously back it. It cannot be done on the cheap. This is not a dig at SL. He has backed his coaches before but the extra mile may well cost extra cash. We may not get this close again for a while.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

It depends on the difference between ‘expect’ and ‘aspire’. 
it’s a realistic ‘aspiration’ to get to the Prem. As others have pointed out; we have the ground and the setup to achieve it. 
However, it’s unrealistic to ‘expect’ it in one season. Over 3 or 4 seasons maybe but 1 no. 
Don’t get me wrong I’d.be delighted if the new manager took us up, but I think it’s more reasonable to ‘expect’ a top half finish whilst he built the team he wants. 
There are other teams in the league with the same or bigger budgets and a Premiership ‘pedigree’ to them - all will be hoping to get one of those 3 places. We don’t have a ‘divine night’ simply because we’ve got a new ground and a rich owner. 
 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

I’ll always hope for it of course, but I don’t expect it next season. The best managers in the world need a bedding in period. I’d take a solid top half finish this new season with signs of progress and then build on that the year after. Assuming we get a good manager that is..

Link to post
Share on other sites

Personally I just want to see some decent football hopefully by kids from Bristol that came through the academy.   

If that brings us promotion, that would be a bonus.  

That aside, once the training ground is built, we have everything I'm place off the field to achieve and sustain promotion.  Right manager (and maybe a few signings) and we have as good a chance as any. 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Continuous improvement is what we should be aiming for. Promotion to the Premier league is a future goal but for now we need to make the next step and get into the dreaded Play-offs. 

It does only take a really good season to get promoted but we shouldn't just expect or demand it as long as we continually improve and are fighting for the play offs without losing our structure that is what we should be aiming for. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

In answer to the question, yes it's fair to want promotion. With out this drive, promotion will never happen.

Expectation is a different thing, that's the attitude of entitlement and we are not entitled to promotion, no one is.
What we should expect however is improvement on the previous year under any manager. But how do you measure improvement? 1 place, 2, 3 etc.?
If improvement doesn't happen, then the manager should be feeling pressure of being sacked (and this eventually happened with LJ) - no manager should feel so comfortable that he's not motivated.

It must also be said that players need to be motivated as well because even the most motivated manager can't do his job without motivated players. The problem is, players can't be sacked (other than for brining the club into disrepute) and this makes them untouchable.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The make up of the league this season gives a much better opportunity than most years. Of course clubs with parachute payments are going to have some clout but also a losing habit. - There are going to be no really "big" clubs in our league next season, so we really should be looking at the play offs minimum.

The Norwich Manager said before this past season there was a 95% chance Norwich would go straight back down and look what happened! If we don't have the ambition we are more likely to find ourselves in a relegation scrap. Without Fam we start in my opinion to look quite weak unless some of the young guys like Walsh Morrell etc really kick on or we make some decent late signings or loans. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, reddogkev said:

It seems to be generally accepted that promotion is the aim - and although I applaud the ambition, is it really fair?

A new manager is going to be judged on this yardstick, even though we haven't graced the top tier for roughly 40 years - that's hardly right for the new guy, is it?

After all, we've only come close to achieving promotion to the top flight once in the whole forty years!

Could it be off putting to some of the names being mentioned - some might respond along the lines of, 'Christ, you want me to do something that no one else has done since 1978?  Sure, I'll just go and turn this glass of water into wine whilst I'm at it.'

I'll be interest to read any thoughts on the subject.

 

I don't understand why past performance has any bearing on future?

Expecting promotion is probably not fair because it's not fully within our control, but to challenge for it should be the aim else why are we here?

We're worlds apart from the team I grew up supporting when we were in the same situation but a league below. We'd spent only 4 seasons out of 27 in the 2nd tier when we finally went up, so why was promotion expected every season then? 

We've got a stadium fit for the Prem, we're in a good financial position, we're established in the Championship (11 of the last 13 years at this level) and we have a good footing to push on from here.

I think SL has every right to ask the right man to set his sights on promotion. If its a Hughton, Howe, Neal who have been there and done it then it's only right that our conversation is around promotion.

If we hire Dean Holden, then I don't think promotion is our aim and so in that case maybe it wouldn't be fair.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

I think it all depends on what other clubs do in signing players. The club have already used the word austerity, so we are going to have to sell to buy. If other clubs heavily invest, I think mid-table is realistic.

Link to post
Share on other sites
33 minutes ago, cidercity1987 said:

The historical embarrassment of this football club should be no excuse for failure now. Top 6 attendances next season, top 10 at least budget, why shouldn't we expect a promotion push?

Evidence?

Judging by championship average attendance tables we currently sit 9th Leeds/WBA with higher replaced by Norwich larger and Watford similar but with 30% could see ours higher so really at best we'd move up to 8th best supported.

As for budget reliable accounts on twitter who look at football finances/ffp etc place us as slightly bottom half for wages so our budget isn't top 10

Link to post
Share on other sites

Of course it’s ‘ fair ‘ to say to a prospective new coach that the aim is promotion.

Any decent candidate  is going to be delighted with the prospect knowing that, historically, the owner has backed his man . 
 

The owner of Wycombe would  probably and honestly say to his coach that survival is the first goal , that’s equally honest and realistic as a target.

Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Lrrr said:

Evidence?

Judging by championship average attendance tables we currently sit 9th Leeds/WBA with higher replaced by Norwich larger and Watford similar but with 30% could see ours higher so really at best we'd move up to 8th best supported.

As for budget reliable accounts on twitter who look at football finances/ffp etc place us as slightly bottom half for wages so our budget isn't top 10

Top 6 attendance is obviously a prediction, higher than Watford definitely and guessing Cardiff and Huddersfield as their Premier League glory support disappears.

  • Hmmm 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

No, it isn't fair for us to demand anything like promotion. Let's remember our place in society. We are a small hamlet on the least known of all the River Avon's in England.

98% of our small population are not the least bit interested in any of the major sports. It's sixty two years since one of our players pulled on an England shirt, probably thirty years since a Bristol Rugby player did likewise and when did we ever see a Test Match in Bristol?

Are we the only "major" city in England without a tram system? And of course, the largest English city to have only played four seasons in the First Division since 1911.

We are the eternal bottlers, and many older fans would have life ending heart attacks if we actually did get up to the Premier League.

So let's settle for mid Championship obscurity until our inevitable return to whence we came. Back to being a big fish in a little pond!

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...